Many MO devs will mess up whatever they make, that is true.

But someone will eventually get it right and that goes for both types of games.

i think the ones who should be making sandbox mmos are the guys behind sandbox single player games. Bethesda for example. Leave themepark for TP devs. Leave sandbox for SB devs.

Originally posted by rojo6934

i think the ones who should be making sandbox mmos are the guys behind sandbox single player games. Bethesda for example. Leave themepark for TP devs. Leave sandbox for SB devs.

i for one wouldnt want a AAA comp to make a mmorpg...but some get lost in whats AAA and whats not...i mean mostly everyone that is "labled" AAA  has prolly worked with or under a huge company here or there and then blown up saying they are great cuz they worked for this or that AAA company

but as iv said in another post..the begining of last year and this year will be the year EA loads their pocket up with cash as they cash in the "easy money" of mmorpg gaming..look for all their titles being loaded with the same buggy and non-attention of addressing what needs to be fixed just to pump out game after game to make a quick buck..people need to stop paying money to these so called AAA companys / fat cats that seem to think they run the block and let them fall flat on their face and gtfo of mmorpg gaming..leave it up to the people that know what they are doing and be creative and not to be in it just for the quick buck...the whole genra has gone to rubbish.

No devs (AAA or not) will ever make a perfect mmo that pleases everyone. Basically these games need to cater to the lowest common denominator to appeal to the widest possible audience or sub numbers will suffer too much to be profitable and support continued content development. Its funny, in their attempts to please everyone they end up pleasing no one

The games that don't cater to the lowest common denominator don't have the budget to make a compelling polished final product.

Originally posted by odinsrath

i for one wouldnt want a AAA comp to make a mmorpg...but some get lost in whats AAA and whats not...i mean mostly everyone that is "labled" AAA  has prolly worked with or under a huge company here or there and then blown up saying they are great cuz they worked for this or that AAA company

but as iv said in another post..the begining of last year and this year will be the year EA loads their pocket up with cash as they cash in the "easy money" of mmorpg gaming..look for all their titles being loaded with the same buggy and non-attention of addressing what needs to be fixed just to pump out game after game to make a quick buck..people need to stop paying money to these so called AAA companys / fat cats that seem to think they run the block and let them fall flat on their face and gtfo of mmorpg gaming..leave it up to the people that know what they are doing and be creative and not to be in it just for the quick buck...the whole genra has gone to rubbish.

That's not really true. Every AAA company listens to the needs of the community. I think we are the minority of that community that wants overhauls of mmorpgs than just adjustments. The new mmorpg players that are not burned out with the ordinary themepark game are the ones that are milking the cows most, but also the ones that are old gamers and believe that the game is better in a few months and in turn has spent some money on it through the years due to few selection for old gamers.

It's not "we" against "them", it's "us" against "us". We need to tell our buddies what kind of piece of shit they're playing if even they will listen to us, which I doubt they will. So until then, we need to wait for more gamers to grow up so we become a larger community and our voices be heard that can crack windows. 

Sandbox MMOs don't require things like "plot" or "dungeons" or even a balanced combat system, many of the things developers have trouble with when designing a themepark MMO. The main limitation for sandbox titles is hardware based, as it requires a staggering amount of network and server power to update the environment on the fly. I feel like as technology improves developers will start treating 3D sandbox titles as more of an option again, and yes, they will be fairly decent at it.

So tired of themepark WoW-like mmorpg's that I will take sandbox , sandpark anyway.

You know I am NOT playing ANY mmorpg atm cause I am ultimatelly tired and bored of them. 

If they fail doing sandbox - well I don't lose anything. I have status quo - I just still don't play anything :)

If they succedd I have mmorpg's to play :)

But there are good themeparks out there?

WOW? LOTR? Even SWTOR is a 'good' themepark for very casual players who want to be told a story.

I think a good sanbox would need more solid ideas/concepts than money anyway.

But I see no reason why a well thought out sandnbox from a good developer would not work.

It needs a third option, "depends on who the developer is".

But no, I don't have a lot of confidence in these silly MMO companies. You could put monkies in charge and they'd probably do a better job.

Define what you mean by "good".

Many people feel SWTOR is a good MMORPG, I tend to agree with them.   (Not a great MMO mind you, but certainly good)

Many will argue that right now LOTRO, AOC, and some others are good MMORPG's.   They might not have been so at launch, or perhaps along the way they've made changes to spoil the gameplay (a common mistake) but overall, they're pretty solid titles now even if early mistakes ruined their chances at financial greatness.

I doubt anyone will ever build another WOW, which while very popular during its run, and always a good game, was not perfect.

So yes, I think a AAA house could make a good sandbox if they can convince their investors to let them have a bit more creative freedom than is usually permitted in the current development environment.

Remember, while many MMORPG's will be built, only a handfull will ever be considered legendary or groundbreaking over the course of the years.

Originally posted by Kyleran

Define what you mean by "good".

Many people feel SWTOR is a good MMORPG, I tend to agree with them.   (Not a great MMO mind you, but certainly good)

Many will argue that right now LOTRO, AOC, and some others are good MMORPG's.   They might not have been so at launch, or perhaps along the way they've made changes to spoil the gameplay (a common mistake) but overall, they're pretty solid titles now even if early mistakes ruined their chances at financial greatness.

I doubt anyone will ever build another WOW, which while very popular during its run, and always a good game, was not perfect.

So yes, I think a AAA house could make a good sandbox if they can convince their investors to let them have a bit more creative freedom than is usually permitted in the current development environment.

Remember, while many MMORPG's will be built, only a handfull will ever be considered legendary or groundbreaking over the course of the years.

 

I do not believe that any themepark head designers could make a good sandbox.

Possible? Yes. Likely? No.

I like EVE Online's development, even enough to sub now and again. Defititely sandbox.

I don't think any AAA dev is sufficiently in touch with the potential market for sandbox to produce one.  An Indie developed by hardcore sandbox players is more likely to produce something on target with market demand.

Unfortunately, the potential for an Indie to produce a quality game tends to be thwarted by lack of financing, limited existing engines designed to support sandbox play, and dare I say lack of professional management (no insult intended) capable of bringing a solid project to completion.

Will we ever see a solid sandbox?  I think so.  It's just going to take a while for the right team to hit the right formula.

Whether or not the MMORPG playerbase will accept it is another matter.  "Why can't I find my quest hub?"  "This game is total suxors, there's nothing to do"  *sigh*

Eh, ToR was a good themepark.  Not a great one, and it has some flaws (grouping and uninteresting mob abilities,) but certainly a good one.

To embrace world simulation (sandbox) would be to create a game almost nobody wants.  Certainly it wouldn't have fit with Star Wars (as others often state: do you play a Star Wars videogame to be Uncle Owen, or to be one of the main characters?)

It would probably be just as bad, if not worse...

Originally posted by Axehilt

Eh, ToR was a good themepark.  Not a great one, and it has some flaws (grouping and uninteresting mob abilities,) but certainly a good one.

To embrace world simulation (sandbox) would be to create a game almost nobody wants.  Certainly it wouldn't have fit with Star Wars (as others often state: do you play a Star Wars videogame to be Uncle Owen, or to be one of the main characters?)

 

Han was a smuggler, Leia was a diplomat, Luke was a farmer's kid. Say what? Do you mean: "To be one of the main characters within the very short timeframe of the movie after which they went back to more regular business that would bore all of you out of your fucking minds?"