Originally posted by booheads

" but even Skyrim only is worthy of an 8 at most."

 

 

In your opinion. :|, Skyrim has currently like a 96% average. MMORPG ToR review is spot on, as it has a 86% average.

You seem to have a problem with this thing called opinions. 

 

 

Skyrim is buggy, it was a poorly ported console game, and the UI is horrible for a PC.   Game deserves no more than an 8 at most.   Anyone that gives it more than an 8 is just over inflating it.  Skyrim is a good game, one of the best I have ever played.   But why inflate a score to something the game is not worthy of having if it has flaws.  

Originally posted by pandrax

I think you are so infused with blinding hate for a game you would of never played to begin with that you should just stop talking, right now.  It's not SWG Get over it and move on. There are far more people enjoying SWTOR then who hate it. The ones who don't like it were never going to play it to begin with.

Blinding hate?  I said I would give it an 8/10.  I am playing the game and enjoying at the moment, but unlike some I can make a critical comment about something I enjoy.

[mod edit]

Originally posted by Teala

Originally posted by booheads

" but even Skyrim only is worthy of an 8 at most."

 

 

In your opinion. :|, Skyrim has currently like a 96% average. MMORPG ToR review is spot on, as it has a 86% average.

You seem to have a problem with this thing called opinions. 

 

 

Skyrim is buggy, it was a poorly ported console game, and the UI is horrible for a PC.   Game deserves no more than an 8 at most.   Anyone that gives it more than an 8 is just over inflating it.  Skyrim is a good game, one of the best I have ever played.   But why inflate a score to something the game is not worthy of having if it has flaws.  

Skyrim is also buggy on consoles. I think Bethseda bucks may explain a lot of its high scores. really it is a 7-8 game with major bugs in every version at launch and bugs still in the 2012.

Originally posted by Teala

No I expect them to rate a game honestly based on the game.   Some stuff is not up for opinion.   There are bugs in SWTOR it is not polished as some would have us believe.  Add to that the exploits, two that have been made public, a half-dozen more that have not(and will eventually surface) is enough to warrant an rating of 8 right form the get go.    Add to that the missing features, the poorly implemented UI, and I can go on...and I am not going to.   If this game is an 8.7 - Skyrim is a an 11 and I am sorry, but even Skyrim only is worthy of an 8 at most.   So where does that put SWTOR?   5-or 6 at best.   No more, no less.  

To many of these gaming websites just stopped being critical of games and instead of putting these game developers butts to the fire, they coddle them, tell them their games are pretty much perfect - which is total BS.  

I know, someone is going to say, well then Teala, go start your own website and review games.  You know what - I just might do that.   Because I am so sick of these so called objective reviews that do nothing but promote bad games. 

If a game is worthy of a good score it should earn it.   SWTOR does not deserve a score that says look at me I am almost perfect.   If is so far from perfect it makes Rift look like a 10!

I would agree bugs are always an issue but you are going to be hard pressed to show me a game that didn't have bugs. There are bugs but Ihave yet to come across a huge game breaking "I can't go on" bug.

Exploits are bad but guess what? I couldn't get on yesterday because they were patching one of the exploits.

I can't say what Bioware knows of exploits but I suspect they will take them seriously. Of course time will tell.

We've already talked about the uI. Though I would prefer it to be more cusomizable and scaleable, one can play the game just fine with it. You on the other hand think that's game breaking. Well, you very well might believe this  but that doesn't really support your assertion that people aren't telling the truth or  "being honest'. I think it points to people having different breaking points. you insisting that the UI is game breaking doesn't mean that others are going to think the same thing.

Skyrim's interface is far more atrocious.

I think the game in the short term is a solid 8, warts and all because it is exactly  what they said it would be.

This doesn't mean it has legs to stand up to longer term play or that the type of game play that they created won't tire people but in the short term those that enjoy it will enjoy it.

Some game sites very well might be too lenient but that is easily off set but bitter jaded gamers who immerse themselves in criticism at every little thing.

I suspect the truth might be somewhere in the middle.

But i would be curious to see how you approached a game reviewing site. And if your assesments would truly be unbiased.

I just want to step in as ME and say: If we didn't have to put a number next to each review, because that's what is demanded of us by the very nature of games journalism, we'd not be having this discussion.  Or at least not quite this discussion.

Maybe one day we won't need to score a review, but for now (and I do hate this), it's the world we live in.

Our reviews are based on more of a "Grade Scale" than anything else.  I think SWTOR getting a B+ is pretty much on target, though even I disagree with a few of the scores for each category.  Ultimately, it's Mike's opinion and one I stand by even if I disagree with parts of it.

Originally posted by Teala

Originally posted by booheads

" but even Skyrim only is worthy of an 8 at most."

 

 

In your opinion. :|, Skyrim has currently like a 96% average. MMORPG ToR review is spot on, as it has a 86% average.

You seem to have a problem with this thing called opinions. 

 

 

Skyrim is buggy, it was a poorly ported console game, and the UI is horrible for a PC.   Game deserves no more than an 8 at most.   Anyone that gives it more than an 8 is just over inflating it.  Skyrim is a good game, one of the best I have ever played.   But why inflate a score to something the game is not worthy of having if it has flaws.  

 

   About the UI on Skyrin on the PC i actually though it was a good step forward from Oblivion but in the age of console in mind nowadays i believe most cies think of making it console friendly first and that a shame for PC players like me .

Originally posted by FlawSGI

 Good god the scores don't mirror the commentary at all. @1:23 he says "Overall though  the UI doesn't set the game back to much because aesthetics  still receives a 9" after mentioneing all of the things the UI in the game doesn't have. Then he goes on to say that he thought the misssions were fun at first, but the missions are the same as you progress only on steroids and gives it another 9 because storytelling has never been so fun.  Couldn't watch more after that because I couldn't listen to the drivel any longer. 

Do the review and discuss the pros and cons. If you are going to give such high scores at least have more pros to speak of FFS. 

was thinking the same thing, the comments dont match the scores at all.

Every game has bugs.

What is this. "My bug is bigger than your bug?

TOR is better than most MMOs. Hell go look at the offical bug list of WoW if you don't believe me.

4.3.0 Known Issues List

Think this is a love or hate type game , Im being honest here i bought it two days ago played for 2 hours until lvl 5 taking it slow watching cinematics etc.

I could not bare to log back in , un subbed the next day as in logged in the web site and cancelled my account.

Took my game back to the place i bought it got a new copy and am selling it.

Im sure alot of you enojy it and to each there own , but to me it was very un amusing and just plain not fun . I do not play single player games at all ,

maybe watching the cut scenes are what bored me or standing next to 3 mobs about 4 feet away that just looked at me and didnt aggro me until i was standing on them .

Might have been standing in the open getting shot 225 times from multiple mobs and just launching bombs at them until they died ,

Could have been not having access to certain houses, buildings because of my class ? not sure but it just wasnt for me .

Glad some of you others found some love for it though and hope your game continues on the path you want it to .

Im not here to flame just give my opinion i know i didnt play it long enough for a review so just giving an opinion or my first impression. From what i did play and giving a few reasons why i quit so early.

Thanks for reading and for those of you that enjoy SWTOR keep enjoying your game im not here to knock it!

Worth every penny. I've played them all since UO and I've never been sucked in like this before. Story matters.

you know, I been playing MMO's since Ultima Online: Second Age, pretty much the damn near beginning of when MMO's were starting to become known and develop and I tend to see something in common in regards to the most popular MMO's and the amount of haters, which appear to have a direct correlation especially in forums such as these dedicated to MMOs in general. I think from now on, from my own experiences, its safe to say personally that the more haters an  MMO has, the better it actually is because in the end, haters are going to hate regardless on what it is.  

WoW is extremely popular and still holds many subs and it still has the most haters and I'm seeing it ring true for SWTOR as well so I'll take that as a good measure of the game's health and future potential especially a company as great as Bioware. So, haters can keep hating, its just going to convince me more than I'm right and I think haters are just hating how much attention games like these are receiving. In the end no matter how innovative (or uninnovative) the systems within the game are, it still requires lots of quality and polish to properly provide an MMO and the games with the most tend to be the most successful ala WoW (following Everquest and its model).

Now I'm not saying this fully advocating that this game is the greatest ever. I actually take the perspective that if you aren't a Star Wars fan at all, then you shouldn't play this because in terms of game play, it feels very much like every other traditional MMO with polish and shine to it. The dialogue and emphasis on story was much needed in the MMO community IMO because that pushes the envelope for the next set of games. I really do appreciate not having to experience half-a**ed excuses to go out and kill 10 rats over and over again. Now I feel a lot more involved and yes it is as simple as providing dialogue with options. It also makes it fun when I'm playing with my family because we like to joke and point out all the oddities and fun responses within the game as we do our flashpoints etc. 

I like how alot of the haters point out how its easy to reach end game and this gameplay and that gameplay, but never mentions anything about how it plays out when playing with other people whcih is pretty much the crux of MMO's or else its really a watered down single player game if you're just soloing the content. I would say it definitely fulfills the potential I saw in the game and it was exactly what I thought it was going to be. A very safe game with lots of shine and polish in a Star  Wars environment (which is awesome). If you're playing and you don't like Star Wars, I think you'll be easily disappointed, otherwise I think its been a blast for most Star Wars fans. Not saying I'm entirely content but its definitely a greater start than most.

My overall rating: 6/10.

Subscription cancelled after reaching level 31 and seeing that the level cap was reached after 10 (?) days on my server.

Its a simple casual movie game with MMO elements.

And yes i enjoyed the game for 2 weeks. :)

Now i going back to CoV and DDO.

Originally posted by BillMurphy

I just want to step in as ME and say: If we didn't have to put a number next to each review, because that's what is demanded of us by the very nature of games journalism, we'd not be having this discussion.  Or at least not quite this discussion.

Maybe one day we won't need to score a review, but for now (and I do hate this), it's the world we live in.

Our reviews are based on more of a "Grade Scale" than anything else.  I think SWTOR getting a B+ is pretty much on target, though even I disagree with a few of the scores for each category.  Ultimately, it's Mike's opinion and one I stand by even if I disagree with parts of it.

 

 

B or B+ is fair score I think.  It's not a C and it's not an A...atleast not yet.  I can imagine how difficult it must be to review a game.  You put yourself out there and everyone has an opinion.

I have been playing SWTOR almost every night since release, so while I can see improvements that could be made I am having fun.

No matter I'm Wow lover with reason to be and I love a lot Rift, this game simply rocks. Playing it only since release in EU, but my list is now 1. WOW, 2. SWTOR, 3.RIFT. Swtor is greatest surprise over last years. About score, if I would give to wow 10, then swtor deserves at least 9.5. About social part and 7.5 ... i could not care less for that. MMO does not mean one have to group play ... I find more fun and challenging to try solo. More planning, more fun. And when I'm in group I have tendency just to run through with rest not following at all what is quest about. And I love to read carefully (at least with first alt) story telling and rest. No problem for gruping however for end game. But I'm the person that enjoys trip and not only final destination. So as long I have alts to play through this awesome game .... I do not care not even minimally about end game.

Swtor is incredible game (have all reppublic alts up to 22 only as I'm altholic) and I'm sure is here to stay for loooong. As I hope for wow and Rift. With this 3 I have found my gaming needs are covered for next 10 years at least. :-)) I like to try new games but before Rift and Swtor was always looking for something even close to wow (as for quality of game play, whole game, ....) but now for the first time at my 50 years I'm just looking forward new releases for this trio.

Originally posted by Teala

Originally posted by pandrax

I think you are so infused with blinding hate for a game you would of never played to begin with that you should just stop talking, right now.  It's not SWG Get over it and move on. There are far more people enjoying SWTOR then who hate it. The ones who don't like it were never going to play it to begin with.

Maybe if people would score games honestly, instead of inflating them, people would not be complaining about reviews that give high scores to games that do not deserve it.

    The only problem Teala is that there is absolutely NO way to "score games honestly" since these scores are based on personal opinions which will always be biased by how good/bad your personal experience is.  For every person that disagrees with how high the scores are, you will find at least one other person that feels they are spot on or low. 

im very dissapointed with review for this game, Its just not a 8.7 or a 9 as a matter a fact this game is not even above a 7 every review i have read for this game has had its score buffed up and unsuprisingly every website ive seen that reviewed has had months of add's for the game on their own website's and im sick and tierd of these bloody paid off review's.

Anyone who has played this game honestly its below average with out the story cut scene's its utter middle of the road f2p quality stuff. 

Why cant we get honest reviews these days !

the game is a 7/10 at most.

Originally posted by Geriden

im very dissapointed with review for this game, Its just not a 8.7 or a 9 as a matter a fact this game is not even above a 7 every review i have read for this game has had its score buffed up and unsuprisingly every website ive seen that reviewed has had months of add's for the game on their own website's and im sick and tierd of these bloody paid off review's.

 

Anyone who has played this game honestly its below average with out the story cut scene's its utter middle of the road f2p quality stuff. 

Why cant we get honest reviews these days !

the game is a 7/10 at most.

 

Yeah indeed, IGN gave it a 9 which is inflated too, the penultimate review will be the retention figures after the first month. Myself and 3 friends have already all cancelled.

Originally posted by Sovrath

Originally posted by Teala

Originally posted by pandrax

I think you are so infused with blinding hate for a game you would of never played to begin with that you should just stop talking, right now.  It's not SWG Get over it and move on. There are far more people enjoying SWTOR then who hate it. The ones who don't like it were never going to play it to begin with.

Maybe if people would score games honestly, instead of inflating them, people would not be complaining about reviews that give high scores to games that do not deserve it.

Maybe if some people would realize that a good amount of the complaints are subjective and it is very certain that some things that people are complaing about just aren't issues some people.

And do you think it stands to reason that the people who are giving this game decent marks might be the people this game is made for?

Just like people who make bad remarks about EVE might get you to explain to them that EVE isn't for them do you think that this game might not be for you and those who have the same taste as you?

 

Oh come on, Sov. Please don't tell me you're jumping on that bandwagon.

Numerous people - including some who do like the game regardless - have noted that the scores are in conflict with the body of the review. Criticizing several areas of a certain category, praising one or two... and then giving it a 8.5 anyway is definitely not consistent. Other game reviews I've seen here which had numerous issues cited about a given category were not given almost perfect scores anyway on the strength of 1 or 2 positives. 

Criticizing aspects of the gameplay, but giving it a high score because "story has never been so fun!" - when storyline is typically a separate category from gameplay to begin with - is rather odd.

Citing numerous issues with the visuals of the game, but giving it a solid 9/10 - one point away from perfect - regardless screams "shamelessly biased scoring" to me. The UI issues cited would have brought the score down a point just by themselves, were this most any other game. 

Using an absolute bottom-of-the-barrel example such as "$60 games that only give 10 hours of gameplay" as a basis of comparison for TOR's longevity? Really? Choosing the least favorable example in a different genre of gaming to prop up TOR's longevity score? I gotta say, anyone who can't see right through that little stunt is willfully blind. 

And so on.

The impression I got, along with numerous others, from reading the review, and even watching the video, is that the score was determined before the reviewing process was even started. 

Again, it has nothing to do with someone giving a high score to something they like personally. It has everything to do with someone giving a near perfect score to something, despite a list of rather damning criticisms that would have brought that score down in most any other circumstance.

The review score is inconsistent with the review itself.