I see in Cinematic Conversations ability to restore the RPG to MMORPG games.

But ... some changes are needed.

1. Allow the conversation between the players (moderated mode plus a simple queue mode)
2. Enter the gestures, expressions and poses
3. Enable voice chat
4. Enable the use of props such as: a pint of beer, a torch, fireplace ...
5. Release the game!

Who would of thunk the current evolution of MMO's is story. If you like story I'd recommend trying SWTOR until GW2 hits shelves... that's where i'll be.

I do have a question about the GW2 Cut-Scenes... are they straight dialogue or are they interactive? Is there group interaction? Are these questions anyone actually knows?

You misunderstood me
I'm talking about playing the character in a conversation between the players

* smiles kindly *

Probably too sandboxy for what GW2 is going for, sadly.  Definitely would not see this in a game like SWTOR/WOW

I don't think it's right to equate story with conversation cutscenes. While SWTOR, XIV and GW2 decided to deliver their story that way, it's not the only way, and personally I think it's not a good way at all. MMOs aren't single player RPGs, they work with different dynamics.

Delivering the story as part of the game world, with dynamic events or something even more advanced, is a much better route to take.

Originally posted by Heser

I see in Cinematic Conversations ability to restore the RPG to MMORPG games.

But ... some changes are needed.

1. Allow the conversation between the players (moderated mode plus a simple queue mode)
2. Enter the gestures, expressions and poses
3. Enable voice chat
4. Enable the use of props such as: a pint of beer, a torch, fireplace ...
5. Release the game!

The closest you'll get to your suggestions is SW:TOR, because if ArenaNet were to implement your suggestions (well at least the 1st 4) then GW2 will not see the light of day.

Originally posted by Naqaj

I don't think it's right to equate story with conversation cutscenes. While SWTOR, XIV and GW2 decided to deliver their story that way, it's not the only way, and personally I think it's not a good way at all. MMOs aren't single player RPGs, they work with different dynamics.

Delivering the story as part of the game world, with dynamic events or something even more advanced, is a much better route to take.

And you're right, however conversation cutscenes are a better tool, than dynamic events, for providing players with more in-depth exposition. It's like in the demo for the human starting area. You know by just wondering around that there are bandits messing with farmers and blowing up irrigation pipes, but why? These NPC conversations help provide the why, in a more easy to digest format. Also the game is a themepark MMO and you're really just along for the ride.

People who are suggesting SWTOR: I do not think you understand what the OP is asking for.  Basically he is asking for role-playing tools that would be seen in a role-playing heavy game or a sandbox game.

Originally posted by wormywyrm

People who are suggesting SWTOR: I do not think you understand what the OP is asking for.  Basically he is asking for role-playing tools that would be seen in a role-playing heavy game or a sandbox game.

And there is no reasonable way for ANet to implement such tools into GW2, without scrapping a good portion of what they've done and re-doing it from scratch. Yet the final suggestion says he wants the game to release.

I already said that GW2 would not likely do it either.

Sadly probably the game most likely to do something like this is SWG, and thats gone.  Not sure what other games would...

Originally posted by Master10K

Originally posted by wormywyrm

People who are suggesting SWTOR: I do not think you understand what the OP is asking for.  Basically he is asking for role-playing tools that would be seen in a role-playing heavy game or a sandbox game.

And there is no reasonable way for ANet to implement such tools into GW2, without scrapping a good portion of what they've done and re-doing it from scratch. Yet the final suggestion says he wants the game to release.

I myself a programmer and I see great potential in the programs used by ANet to build a Conversation Link
From my point of view ANet without major difficulties can prepare a set of simple gestures (at the beginning).
They may be reluctant to allow voice communication due to the additional network load (unless they use p2p)

Originally posted by Heser

Originally posted by Master10K

Originally posted by wormywyrm

People who are suggesting SWTOR: I do not think you understand what the OP is asking for.  Basically he is asking for role-playing tools that would be seen in a role-playing heavy game or a sandbox game.

And there is no reasonable way for ANet to implement such tools into GW2, without scrapping a good portion of what they've done and re-doing it from scratch. Yet the final suggestion says he wants the game to release.

I myself a programmer and I see great potential in the programs used by ANet to build a Conversation Link
From my point of view ANet without major difficulties can prepare a set of simple gestures (at the beginning).
They may be reluctant to allow voice communication due to the additional network load (unless they use p2p)

Sadly, your ideas lack any form of mass appeal. People just wouldn't want to feel that have to move their characters body parts during a conversation, when they should be paying a attention to what's being said. And the software ANet uses is a back-end kind of software and would require a properiatary front-end, in order to allow players to manipulate character gestures. Thus extending the release of the game even further and for no good reason. Also what does the game not being P2P have to do with voice communication, when there are a lot of free programs able to do this (vent). Also Anet said they may add it, but not as a cinematic conversation tool.

simple anaysis with the rails still intact... maybe, but i think it would reaquire allot of computation clientside:

you have voice analysis

then under that keyword analysis (simple filtering out of prepositions)

and then under that you would have to filter/interpret the keywords onto the proper 'rails' done by the voice actors.

and then once chosen the voice acting itself(this alone is same level of complexity as STOR)

and all of this would have to be done clientside. or there would be a ton of unnecessary data going to the servers. 

even with this clientside i think it would break allot due to people trying to roleplay their own way and not how the developers have in mind for the class/player. i suspect that would be frustrating.

and to have truely dynamic, alagorithmic voiceacting rather than scripted recordings... i don't think technology is anywhere near that. even with guildwars 2 i think they are just keeping part of the voiceacting files server side to be offloaded later when an event is supposed to happen, and are working it peicemeal so that places and races and the event types can be stitched into what you hear from the quest givers.

if you really want that type of interaction D&D is likely the best place to go. warning though, frame rate is a bitch.

Do not get me wrong

I do not ask about a revolution, just think that a private conversation screen, in the form of Cinematic Conversation would improve significantly the role-playing aspect of the game.

The main reason for my interest in GW2 is Competitive PVP, which promised
but after the fight, fight, fight ...
I would like to chat with my friends, who unfortunately do not live in the neighborhood, and whom I loved to play games like WHRP or UO.

I probably will not succeed because of other players who effectively ruin my experience by running around like ...

so
F1 to bow
F2 for Wave
F3 to smile
enough for me at the beginning

---

Originally posted by Heser
Do not get me wrong
I do not ask about a revolution, just think that a private conversation screen, in the form of Cinematic Conversation would improve significantly the role-playing aspect of the game.

The main reason for my interest in GW2 is Competitive PVP, which promised
but after the fight, fight, fight ...
I would like to chat with my friends, who unfortunately do not live in the neighborhood, and whom I loved to play games like WHRP or UO.
I probably will not succeed because of other players who effectively ruin my experience by running around like ...

so
F1 to bow
F2 for Wave
F3 to smile
enough for me at the beginning

---

This has to be easy to do, and RPers, including myself, would love this.

---

Originally posted by Heser
You misunderstood me
I'm talking about playing the character in a conversation between the players

* smiles kindly *

---

Originally posted by Master10K

Originally posted by Naqaj

I don't think it's right to equate story with conversation cutscenes. While SWTOR, XIV and GW2 decided to deliver their story that way, it's not the only way, and personally I think it's not a good way at all. MMOs aren't single player RPGs, they work with different dynamics.

Delivering the story as part of the game world, with dynamic events or something even more advanced, is a much better route to take.

And you're right, however conversation cutscenes are a better tool, than dynamic events, for providing players with more in-depth exposition. It's like in the demo for the human starting area. You know by just wondering around that there are bandits messing with farmers and blowing up irrigation pipes, but why? These NPC conversations help provide the why, in a more easy to digest format. Also the game is a themepark MMO and you're really just along for the ride.

I need to sort my thoughts and rephrase that. My problem is merely with the presentational aspect of conversation cutscenes, specifically, that you're ripped out of the view you're usually playing in, and lose control of your character. Those "cinematic angles" rarely do improve the experience for me, more often then not they are a reminder that the game industry isn't up there with movies yet.

They could still play that lovely voice-over, and have the character do all those funky animations, while still allowing you to pan and zoom around your character like you always do. Set your own camera angles, interactive medium and all that jazz.

If possible, you should also remain in control of movement. Moments where you lose control and are forced to stand still to listen should be kept to an absolute minimum, reserved only to key story moments. If what that dude is telling me isn't interesting enough to keep me standing still and listening by my own choice, than forcing it upon me by glueing me to the ground certainly isn't going to improve my experience.

I realize this is a rather personal critique though, and it isn't even that high on the list. But since we were on the topic ... 

Originally posted by Naqaj

Originally posted by Master10K

Originally posted by Naqaj

I don't think it's right to equate story with conversation cutscenes. While SWTOR, XIV and GW2 decided to deliver their story that way, it's not the only way, and personally I think it's not a good way at all. MMOs aren't single player RPGs, they work with different dynamics.

Delivering the story as part of the game world, with dynamic events or something even more advanced, is a much better route to take.

And you're right, however conversation cutscenes are a better tool, than dynamic events, for providing players with more in-depth exposition. It's like in the demo for the human starting area. You know by just wondering around that there are bandits messing with farmers and blowing up irrigation pipes, but why? These NPC conversations help provide the why, in a more easy to digest format. Also the game is a themepark MMO and you're really just along for the ride.

I need to sort my thoughts and rephrase that. My problem is merely with the presentational aspect of conversation cutscenes, specifically, that you're ripped out of the view you're usually playing in, and lose control of your character. Those "cinematic angles" rarely do improve the experience for me, more often then not they are a reminder that the game industry isn't up there with movies yet.

They could still play that lovely voice-over, and have the character do all those funky animations, while still allowing you to pan and zoom around your character like you always do. Set your own camera angles, interactive medium and all that jazz.

If possible, you should also remain in control of movement. Moments where you lose control and are forced to stand still to listen should be kept to an absolute minimum, reserved only to key story moments. If what that dude is telling me isn't interesting enough to keep me standing still and listening by my own choice, than forcing it upon me by glueing me to the ground certainly isn't going to improve my experience.

I realize this is a rather personal critique though, and it isn't even that high on the list. But since we were on the topic ... 

Originally posted by Heser

In this regard, I see that Cinematic Conversations may be what I need ( after modifications of course ).

I got that. My post was to say that after experiencing a few games that did elaborate dialogue scenes, my personal conclusion is that they do not have this desired effect, and are rather detrimental to roleplaying. 

I'm very very much in favor of tools to enhance the expression of your character, with animations, moods, and voice, but they should not use a cut-scene mechanic to do it. It seems we have opposite experiences in regard to this topic.

Originally posted by Naqaj

Originally posted by Heser

In this regard, I see that Cinematic Conversations may be what I need ( after modifications of course ).

I got that. My post was to say that after experiencing a few games that did elaborate dialogue scenes, my personal conclusion is that they do not have this desired effect, and are rather detrimental to roleplaying. 

I'm very very much in favor of tools to enhance the expression of your character, with animations, moods, and voice, but they should not use a cut-scene mechanic to do it. It seems we have opposite experiences in regard to this topic.