Originally posted by Moirae

Originally posted by hero001

Originally posted by metatronic

they made jtl in 6 months. space in swtor must of taken a month. i personally think there is just an overall lack of talent amd piss poor managers surrounding swtor. like it or not, you give sony 300 million and 6 years they make a 100x better star wars game. They made swg in 3 years with 15 million.

 

JTL was a game that could have almost stood on its own, it had its own feature set missions, quests, rewards, upgrade paths, not to mention unparralled freedom, I rememeber one of the first things I did after installing JTL, was running an role play mission for a friend and his guild, playing the part of space pirate. The controls and systems handled the same as the X-wing vs series. I was able to travel between systems in minutes, find the target, and begin a pvp duel with my friend playing escort, while strafing the special edition transport to provide added atmosphere. I rememeber smiling to myself as the onboard ship computer relayed the message, calcualting the jump to lightspeed in big letters across my screen. Afterwards the folks on the transport said it all felt very real, they could see the fight from the observation deck of the transport, and my strafing runs on their ship they could see and hear. That should tell you that the ground game and space game where far from separate instances. Had the other pilot had enough experience and skill boxes the party could have actually been killed on the transport.

Speaking as a die hard starwars fan, the more I read on SWTOR the more I feel its just missed the boat.

And yes I am a crazy old fool and more than likely I will get you all killed.

Read... you mean you haven't tried it. Which makes that opinion effectively uninformed and meaningless.

Just a suggestion, before you start believing the fear mongering haters, why don't you actually TRY it. 

Maybe you have not been reading the thread it is a rail shooter, something you would see in the 90's.  They would have been far better off just leaving space out than putting in such a poor excuse of game design.  Oh and by the way I tried it and it is NOT fun in any shape or form.  Yep it is optional, but still why even put something like this in a AAA game.

I have said it before and I will say it again, SWTOR is a perfect example of a design staff out of control.  A good team could have spent a third of what they spent and made a better game.

So much for the myth of Bioware, this game will forever tarnish their aura.

Originally posted by Ozmodan

Originally posted by Moirae

 

Maybe you have not been reading the thread it is a rail shooter, something you would see in the 90's.  They would have been far better off just leaving space out than putting in such a poor excuse of game design.  Oh and by the way I tried it and it is NOT fun in any shape or form.  Yep it is optional, but still why even put something like this in a AAA game.

I have said it before and I will say it again, SWTOR is a perfect example of a design staff out of control.  A good team could have spent a third of what they spent and made a better game.

So much for the myth of Bioware, this game will forever tarnish their aura.

I found it fun for what it was, actually.  I ended up doing all of the space missions and getting the bonuses on each one as I progressed,  upgraded my ship.. and while I wasn't really happy with the choices,  I still completed them all and enjoyed my time playing them -- though its not something I would repeat more than a few times until I received the bonuses.

The game overall is very good,  the team built exactly what they needed to -  content - which is where the money went.  You could have spent less and had less development time,  and not tried as much or tested for as long,  but we've ended up with a very polished product.... one of which we haven't seen of this magnitude.... well.... ever.

People seem to complain about how the space combat is a slap in the face and it pretty much is an afterthought and then compare it to SWG JTL.  All I can say is move along, at least it was a thought, SWG came with zero space, ZERO.  At least they gave us somthing, somthing no matter how crappy is still better than nothing, lol.

Originally posted by Ozmodan

Originally posted by Moirae

Originally posted by hero001

Originally posted by metatronic

they made jtl in 6 months. space in swtor must of taken a month. i personally think there is just an overall lack of talent amd piss poor managers surrounding swtor. like it or not, you give sony 300 million and 6 years they make a 100x better star wars game. They made swg in 3 years with 15 million.

 

JTL was a game that could have almost stood on its own, it had its own feature set missions, quests, rewards, upgrade paths, not to mention unparralled freedom, I rememeber one of the first things I did after installing JTL, was running an role play mission for a friend and his guild, playing the part of space pirate. The controls and systems handled the same as the X-wing vs series. I was able to travel between systems in minutes, find the target, and begin a pvp duel with my friend playing escort, while strafing the special edition transport to provide added atmosphere. I rememeber smiling to myself as the onboard ship computer relayed the message, calcualting the jump to lightspeed in big letters across my screen. Afterwards the folks on the transport said it all felt very real, they could see the fight from the observation deck of the transport, and my strafing runs on their ship they could see and hear. That should tell you that the ground game and space game where far from separate instances. Had the other pilot had enough experience and skill boxes the party could have actually been killed on the transport.

Speaking as a die hard starwars fan, the more I read on SWTOR the more I feel its just missed the boat.

And yes I am a crazy old fool and more than likely I will get you all killed.

Read... you mean you haven't tried it. Which makes that opinion effectively uninformed and meaningless.

Just a suggestion, before you start believing the fear mongering haters, why don't you actually TRY it. 

Maybe you have not been reading the thread it is a rail shooter, something you would see in the 90's.  They would have been far better off just leaving space out than putting in such a poor excuse of game design.  Oh and by the way I tried it and it is NOT fun in any shape or form.  Yep it is optional, but still why even put something like this in a AAA game.

I have said it before and I will say it again, SWTOR is a perfect example of a design staff out of control.  A good team could have spent a third of what they spent and made a better game.

So much for the myth of Bioware, this game will forever tarnish their aura.

DOOM, DOOM, I tell you DOOM

just summing up your post for the other people that don't want to read all that.....

Those of you who remember the KOTOR games will also recall that they wern't freeform space either.. and I think Biowares goal was to bring a KOTOR feel to the MMO .. your ship is a story element, not a major side track to the game. You wern't able to freeform fly, decorate, etc in those either.  I think space combat at the moment is intended to be a fun diversion and way to get some interesting rewards (Which are purely social for the most part.. title, costume, etc). I'm certain they will be adding more space content in the future as theres tons of room for it, but I don't expect to see free-form flight in the realm of X-wing vs. Tie ever in the game. It wouldnt even fit. If it makes any showing it will be in some form of space PvP but even then I suspect it will be limited. The game is about stories. So expect a certain degree of story telling. Thats the point of tunnel space combat... not that anyone actually listens to the chatter or objectives. Personally I like the space combat.. wish it was a bit more challenging.. you have to suck pretty bad to lose.. but otherwise its a neat little refresher from the ground game.

well all i can say people complainin about space combat have no reason to complain about it yes it is stale and gets boring even the tor devs admitted to it before they added it thats why guess what its optional so people complain shush deal with it dont like it dont play it simple as that more games out there go annoy them with petty complaints or go make your own games since most of ya know more about game development

Originally posted by NightBandit

 I have to agree with you on this, I feel they missed an opportunity to make this very impressive. But I feel it was thrown in as an after thought and because had they really made a good job of this it would of thrown the release date back at least another 12 months or so and they don't have that option as they bound to be under pressure to make money hence the crap we are left with in space...I'm sure if enough people complain about it then they will be forced to do something with it and the people who have early access need to voice their concerns early with this to get them to either respond or move on it.

I WILL BE BANGING THE DRUM FOR SURE!!

 

Nah, SW:TOR's space combat is this way because Gordon Walton (who worked on SWG's JtL expansion) told Bioware when he worked there that Jump to Lightspeed was a bad idea. Hence we get space on rails. Here's to hoping that enough of us letting Bioware know Walton was full of it can get them to change things post launch.

Originally posted by Ozmodan

Originally posted by Moirae

Originally posted by hero001

Originally posted by metatronic

they made jtl in 6 months. space in swtor must of taken a month. i personally think there is just an overall lack of talent amd piss poor managers surrounding swtor. like it or not, you give sony 300 million and 6 years they make a 100x better star wars game. They made swg in 3 years with 15 million.

 

JTL was a game that could have almost stood on its own, it had its own feature set missions, quests, rewards, upgrade paths, not to mention unparralled freedom, I rememeber one of the first things I did after installing JTL, was running an role play mission for a friend and his guild, playing the part of space pirate. The controls and systems handled the same as the X-wing vs series. I was able to travel between systems in minutes, find the target, and begin a pvp duel with my friend playing escort, while strafing the special edition transport to provide added atmosphere. I rememeber smiling to myself as the onboard ship computer relayed the message, calcualting the jump to lightspeed in big letters across my screen. Afterwards the folks on the transport said it all felt very real, they could see the fight from the observation deck of the transport, and my strafing runs on their ship they could see and hear. That should tell you that the ground game and space game where far from separate instances. Had the other pilot had enough experience and skill boxes the party could have actually been killed on the transport.

Speaking as a die hard starwars fan, the more I read on SWTOR the more I feel its just missed the boat.

And yes I am a crazy old fool and more than likely I will get you all killed.

Read... you mean you haven't tried it. Which makes that opinion effectively uninformed and meaningless.

Just a suggestion, before you start believing the fear mongering haters, why don't you actually TRY it. 

Maybe you have not been reading the thread it is a rail shooter, something you would see in the 90's.  They would have been far better off just leaving space out than putting in such a poor excuse of game design.  Oh and by the way I tried it and it is NOT fun in any shape or form.  Yep it is optional, but still why even put something like this in a AAA game.

I have said it before and I will say it again, SWTOR is a perfect example of a design staff out of control.  A good team could have spent a third of what they spent and made a better game.

So much for the myth of Bioware, this game will forever tarnish their aura.

You know what's funny?  Everyone I talked to in game, or in real life (including people I let use my account to try it out) pretty much all thought the space combat was pretty cool.  It seems only on forums you can find people raging out and complaining about it.

Apparently they already have plans to expand the space part of the game, according to James Ohlen anyway-

"I can say that we do have a special project going on right now in regards to the space game that will expand the space game in a significant way, but that's not something that's coming right away. "

From this interview yesterday http://uk.pc.ign.com/articles/121/1214438p1.html

It's fun, at least...

to put things in perspective, if you ever did one of those bombing runs in world of warcraft, that is what swtors space combat is like.

so if you enjoyed that, youll enjoy space combat

I kind of liked it, it's a bit old school but it's a nice getaway from the normal MMO play.  I'm sure though that they will come out with a expansion that will be space orientated.  I'd be shocked if they didn't.  Although as someone else pointed out it would be nice to be able to explore space and to travel to other systems/planets.  But one can only hope and keep fingers crossed that it will be addressed in a future expansion!

Originally posted by precious328

I personally think that their space experience is a big slap in the face. I'd rather nothing at all than this.

Something is always better than nothing. 

Originally posted by precious328

I personally think that their space experience is a big slap in the face. I'd rather nothing at all than this.

 

have people really gotten to the point where they are complaining about TOO MUCH content in an MMO? REALLY?!?

how is it bad, in any way, to have more stuff to do in a game..... whether you do it or not. stop being a fucking idiot.

I AM SOO OFFENDED THEY ADDED THIS CONTENT IN GAME! NO MATTER IF SOME MAY LIKE IT AND NO MATTER THAT DOING IT IS 100% OPTIONAL!!!! IT'S STILL OUTRAGEOUS SLAP IN THE FACE!!!

*Goes back to cutting himself*

Originally posted by kishe

I AM SOO OFFENDED THEY ADDED THIS CONTENT IN GAME! NO MATTER IF SOME MAY LIKE IT AND NO MATTER THAT DOING IT IS 100% OPTIONAL!!!! IT'S STILL OUTRAGEOUS SLAP IN THE FACE!!!

 

*Goes back to cutting himself*

I would like to nominate this post for dumbist post of the week.  its there I dont have to do it some people love it however its a slap in your face?  Wtf are you smoking as you said YOU DONT need to do it if you hate it and I personaly really enjoy it infact I am going cybertech as a craft so I can craft the best ship items its that fun.  Daily quests for decent exp starfox type fighting its a hell of a mini game within a giant mmorpg and I think its a great starting point and I expect to see space grow as the game grows in future content, but for a starting spot I think they did a great job with what it is.. an optional mini game

Originally posted by precious328

I personally think that their space experience is a big slap in the face. I'd rather nothing at all than this.

You have been getting a lot of big slaps from Bioware lately. This might help ease the pain.

Even a large developer like Bioware has a limit to how much they can push out at once.  I think people need to just stop the endless screaming and wailing and learn to be a little more realistic.  I know that isn't likely to happen, but a guy can dream.

Maybe down the line for the first expansion they will be able to expand the space thing, but for now I think it is a good place holder and an interesting side game.

To be honest I prefer the ground game over the space one.  Give Bioware a chance to get one aspect out.  Otherwise we will have to wait another 2 years for them to release since we are waiting for a fully fleshed out space game.

Originally posted by Mr.Wizard

Originally posted by Jarazar

Bioware needs to grab the SWG space team while they can. Even NGE haters will tell you that the space content in SWG is some of the best, if not the best, in the business.

 

I felt that space in SWG was boring after a while. It was fun at the start, getting quests, gaining xp, buying a new ship and components but unless you actually had some friends/guildies coming along, it was pretty much a singleplayer experience and became a boring grind pretty fast for only a stronger ship to fly. In all the years I've played (joined shortly after that *** NGE hit) I've never seen any pvp in space. BioWare will have to (and hopefully can) do it better to keep it interesting for me but until then I'll go with what they made right now.

The servers I played on (Tarquinas and Starsider) had very active space events. And...I was talking about the overall look and feel of SWG's space content. With that team and Bioware's writers working together, it would be pretty amazing I would think.