Originally posted by onthestick

Originally posted by caremuchless

 

Highly optimistic much? 

 

Your numbers are absolutely ridiculous.

 

GW2 is a game changer if you are referring to actually doing something new /cough UNLIKE the game we are discussing now.

 

 

So you only have the right to be optimsitic about GW2?  i am very excited about GW2 but even i don't make any assumptions till i get my hands on the game and actually get to play it. SWTOR is also doing some things new but i do not expect biased eyes to see that.

Welcome to the forums, its all assumptions.

Originally posted by demarc01

Originally posted by Z3R01

Once people exhaust the storyline content the game is going to take a massive nose dive.

6-8 months and we will all have our own "TOR simply wasn't a good MMO" Stories.

This is my major concern with the game.

SWToR is building alot of hype on its story. Yes the story is VERY good.

The trouble is storys are finite, they end. SWToR retention will be based, as with all themeparks, directly on how quickly Bioware can release polished additional content and story chapters.

LotRO has a similar issue with its book quests. In general the book quests are very good, however they are VERY slow comming at times.

I hope Bioware can keep the story flowing ... that however remains to be seen.

 

My guesses,

 

It'll be like every other themepark recently released, It'll sell very well lots of servers will open and things will be rosey (Month 1)

By month 3 subs will be down as the hardcore chew through content and get bored. Servers will close and haters will scream *i told you so* (even though its very NORMAL for some people to not stay and servers to close)

By month 6 population either Bioware will be releasing new content and the population will be stable and healthy and the game will be a huge win ... or ... lack of content additions will see more people leaving and the game will be condidered another *rift* ....

 

Time will tell.

My problem with Rift, is that each update was so one dimensional.   Which was closing Rifts, and I guess the game revolves around that fact.  Don't mean it gets freaking borin after closing the 1000th rift with the same conclusion...It's never ending so it feels like the groundhouse movie.

Originally posted by onthestick

Originally posted by AdamTM

 

Seeing as almost every MMORPG of the past went F2P recently, strong words.

Aion stil P2P, Rift still P2P, WAR still P2P... all other mmos went F2P after how many years? there is difference bewteen MMOS like LOTRO, EQ2 etc going F2P recently and SWTOR going F2P in first year.

 Adam if you're basing F2P recently on the likes of games like LOTRO (which released in 2007) and EQ2 (which released in '04) as a sign of the times because these games after respectfully 4 and 7 years of P2P finally went F2P. Then if such is the case, I'm feeling pretty good of ToR having atleast a good 6-8 years of P2P. And I for one can only hope so!

Originally posted by MMO.Maverick

Originally posted by AdamTM

Originally posted by alancode

It will not go FTP lol. 

Seeing as almost every MMORPG of the past went F2P recently, strong words.

Well, none of the AAA MMO's went F2P within a year, so that is counter the state of affairs so far, but no matter, I asked for concrete predictions and you gave one, so that was a good post in my books, thanks.

I think that SWTOR might have a very unique situation in which F2P will come faster than other games to offset the damage. Not as a financial decission but as a marketing-decission.

Im not basing the prediction solely on previous games but rather a rational analysis of the market. And freemium is the currently prefered business model in MMOs.

There are some really good articles about that on Gamasutra.

I think you will see initial sales of close to 3 million.  I would expect the churn to be very high the first 6 months so would not be surprised if the sub count at that time to be close to 3 million but the year numbers I think will show a substantial drop due to all the normal reasons.  I think it will settle around the 500k mark long term but will never see WOW success in terms of boxes sold or subs.  I expect total box/digital sales to hit around 7 or 8 million.

Originally posted by parrotpholk

I think you will see initial sales of close to 3 million.  I would expect the churn to be very high the first 6 months so would not be surprised if the sub count at that time to be close to 3 million but the year numbers I think will show a substantial drop due to all the normal reasons.  I think it will settle around the 500k mark long term but will never see WOW success in terms of boxes sold or subs.  I expect total box/digital sales to hit around 7 or 8 million.

To touch WOW in terms of over all subs and success Bioware will need to release SWTOR in Asia. And i really doubt they have any plans for that.

Originally posted by niceguy3978

Originally posted by SuprGamerX

Heh ,predictions on a game that had ALOT of cancelled pre orders?

 One's thing for sure , SWtor won't have anything near what Skyrim had.   And Skyrim ain't even multiplayer (yet).

So yeah , I'm not expecting SWtor to be sold out on release , or ever in that matter.

For Skyrim I had to wander around a few hours to get myself a copy.

 SWtor , like Diablo 3 , took way to long to release , was announced way to early , hype was lost on these games years ago , people have moved on. Sure people will try them out , but will very likely stop after a month or two. 

 When I view a trailer on any sort of MMO , it's to give me a idea and then I play it , but after 14 years of doing so , I can already know how the game will shape up and be like after a few hours of game play. And besides light sabers and some bobafetts , SWtor doesn't shine in any perticular area out of every other MMO released before it.   IF it were me , I would of made like CCP that will be adding Dust 514 onto EVE-Online , what I mean is that they should of kept Galaxies up and put SWtor ontop of it , NOW that would of been freaking kick ass. But no , narrow headed companies don't think outside the box. At least we still got CCP and thank God for that!!!

Skyrim sold 3.5 million copies in its first 48 hours.  I'm sure that SWTOR won't sell that many copies either, I am pretty sure, however, that if it were to launch on the XBOX 360 and PS3 in addition to the PC it would have sold alot more than that, but since it is a pc only title, I will say that it will sell alot more copies on the PC than Skyrim did.

I am glad its not for console platform. 

Short prediction:

- HUGE Sales (biggest release since WoW imho)

- Average at best retention (people are bored of game that repeat same old once again).

Concluding : short term - big success  average and long-term - succesfull but nowhere near WoW.

They won't be able to keep people subscribed as long as WoW did.

Originally posted by AdamTM

Originally posted by alancode

Originally posted by AdamTM

Originally posted by alancode

Originally posted by AdamTM

 

Prediction

 

Sales:

Launch box/digital-sales in the first week (including pre-orders): ~3-4 Million

 

Subscription retention rates (from initial sales, numbers at the -end- of each month):

1. Month: 80-90%

2. Month: 50-60%

3. Month: 30-40%

4. Month: below 30%

 

Free To Play prediction:

Month 12-14 from launch

 

 

Rofl what kinda games do people on these forums play? Runescape? 

Whats your problem?

It will not go FTP lol. 

Seeing as almost every MMORPG of the past went F2P recently, strong words.

I guess...when an MMO subs range in the 25k-100k number :)  You see that in SWTOR any time soon?  Doubtful, but I think it's just wishful thinking on your part.

Originally posted by onthestick

Originally posted by caremuchless

 

Highly optimistic much? 

 

Your numbers are absolutely ridiculous.

 

GW2 is a game changer if you are referring to actually doing something new /cough UNLIKE the game we are discussing now.

 

 

So you only have the right to be optimsitic about GW2?  i am very excited about GW2 but even i don't make any assumptions till i get my hands on the game and actually get to play it. SWTOR is also doing some things new but i do not expect biased eyes to see that.

The only two 'new' features I have come across for ToR is the companions, which for me and alot of others is a big minus, I cannot think of one single game were AI NPC allies were more of a hinderance than help or just plain useless.  The other being space combat which really isnt something new, but new to MMO's because no developer has been dumb enough to implement a starfox clone as a feature.

So please englighten me with features that arnt copy pasted from everyother themepark with a SW theme slaped on.

EDIT: Forgot predictions!

Massive sales at day 1 and for the first month, meduim exodus after that, major exodus after 3 months, servers dying and merging at the 6 month mark. Sound familiar?

Warhammer, Aion, FF, Rift all followed this timeline allmost exactly.

Originally posted by AdamTM

 

I think that SWTOR might have a very unique situation in which F2P will come faster than other games to offset the damage. Not as a financial decission but as a marketing-decission.

Im not basing the prediction solely on previous games but rather a rational analysis of the market. And freemium is the currently prefered business model in MMOs.

 There are some really good articles about that on Gamasutra.

What damage?  TOR will be in the black on box/digital sales alone by the end of the first week, without even factoring in subscriptions.  Freemium is only currently preferred for two types of MMO; the old, tired ones, and the ones that didn't deserve to be called AAA in the first place.  No game that is capable of sustaining a respectable playerbase (half million plus) with subscriptions chooses to go Freemium.  TOR will easily hit that number.  Worst case scenario, in the long run, is probably leveling out at a million subscribers and holding there.

Originally posted by karmath

Originally posted by onthestick

Originally posted by caremuchless

 

Highly optimistic much? 

 

Your numbers are absolutely ridiculous.

 

GW2 is a game changer if you are referring to actually doing something new /cough UNLIKE the game we are discussing now.

 

 

So you only have the right to be optimsitic about GW2?  i am very excited about GW2 but even i don't make any assumptions till i get my hands on the game and actually get to play it. SWTOR is also doing some things new but i do not expect biased eyes to see that.

 

The only two 'new' features I have come across for ToR is the companions, which for me and alot of others is a big minus, I cannot think of one single game were AI NPC allies were more of a hinderance than help or just plain useless.  The other being space combat which really isnt something new, but new to MMO's because no developer has been dumb enough to implement a starfox clone as a feature.

 

So please englighten me with features that arnt copy pasted from everyother themepark with a SW theme slaped on.

The point here is not whether you like or dislike the new features but that Bioware did add something new or non standard in terms of feature. V.O, companion system, crew skills, modding system..that is four top of my head. Now you can dislike it for all i care but atleast acknowledge that SWTOR does bring something new to MMO genre.

If i use same logic on GW2 or TSW there is nothing new because i would dislike half of the features or because they have been done before in some other MMOS. I give credit where credit is due.

Originally posted by NovaKayne

I predict I will buy it and play it until it is no longer any fun.

 

Best prediction in this thread and the only one guaranteed to be true. I can predict the same for myself.

Alexis

*smiles*

Originally posted by BarryManilow

Originally posted by AdamTM

Originally posted by alancode

Originally posted by AdamTM

Originally posted by alancode

Originally posted by AdamTM

 

Prediction

 

Sales:

Launch box/digital-sales in the first week (including pre-orders): ~3-4 Million

 

Subscription retention rates (from initial sales, numbers at the -end- of each month):

1. Month: 80-90%

2. Month: 50-60%

3. Month: 30-40%

4. Month: below 30%

 

Free To Play prediction:

Month 12-14 from launch

 

 

Rofl what kinda games do people on these forums play? Runescape? 

Whats your problem?

It will not go FTP lol. 

Seeing as almost every MMORPG of the past went F2P recently, strong words.

I guess...when an MMO subs range in the 25k-100k number :)  You see that in SWTOR any time soon?  Doubtful, but I think it's just wishful thinking on your part.

I just see the (properly executed) freemium model as superior to P2P. One just needs to look at successes like LoL, TF2 etc. what F2P can do to your business. I think TF2 quindupled their subscriber-base by going F2P (and its not like it was unsuccessful to begin with). LoL currently features ~30 Million subs and even if only 1% pays real money for the game (lets assume a new champion every two weeks for around 10$) thats 40$*300.000 equaling around 12 Million dollars per month of revenue which is nothing to laugh at. Even if only 0.1% pay for the game, 1.2 Million per month is still very respectful and equaling 100.000 P2P subs for 12$.

And its "just" a MOBA title.

For TOR, If the game really has to have 500.000 subs like previously stated by EA, the monthly cashflow would be 500k*15$ so around 7.5M/Month. I think this can be easily reached with a Freemium model like Turbine has with DDO (pay for story-content).

Actually, it would be absolutely perfect for SWTOR and much more lucrative if you let people buy 2$ tokens to unlock more story quests.

First month 2+ million box sale.

First 6 months 4+ million box sale.

50% retention after first month and 10% retention after 6 months (~400,000 subscribers).

Predictions can be fun, so here's mine. lol

TOR sells 2.50 million copies worldwide by launch.

1st month: TOR gains another 750,000 in sales due to word of mouth and folks seeing what all the fuss is about

2nd month: Population begins to level off at around 3 million. Bioware announces major content patch

3rd month: Population declines slightly to 2.75 million

4th month: Blizzard announces a ftp model for wow, the world explodes

Originally posted by AdamTM

I just see the (properly executed) freemium model as superior to P2P.

For TOR, If the game really has to have 500.000 subs like previously stated by EA, the monthly cashflow would be 500k*15$ so around 7.5M/Month. I think this can be easily reached with a Freemium model like Turbine has with DDO (pay for story-content).

This is slightly offtopic, but it's my opinion as well that a 'paying/gaming a la carte' model, where you can adjust your payment to your gaming needs and activity level and switch between F2P and P2P at will, is better than either F2P or P2P. A hybrid payment model that has enough flexibility. I don't think though that F2P is a switch that the current AAA MMO's like SWTOR will make so soon, especially since I heard BW people mention that it wasn't a model they were thinking of for SWTOR, so that doesn't seem like any implementation like that within a year will be an issue.

Originally posted by caremuchless

Originally posted by Neloth

Launch sales: 2-3 million

3rd month: 3-5 million

6th month: 3-7 million

12+ month too hard to say since it depends on how BW react to patches, expansions and improving the game, but I'd say somewhere around 4-7m

Further I'd say 1-4 million would come from WoW

Almost zero percent chance of going F2P, maybe a P2P/F2P hybrid if a new game changer comes into play (like Titan or some unknown and no that is not GW2) that forces BW to re-evaluate their income model.

Highly optimistic much? 

 

Your numbers are absolutely ridiculous.

 

GW2 is a game changer if you are referring to actually doing something new /cough UNLIKE the game we are discussing

Here we go it was only a matter of time before the Holy Grail MMO was mentioned....

Originally posted by AdamTM

 

Prediction

 

Sales:

Launch box/digital-sales in the first week (including pre-orders): ~3-4 Million

 

Subscription retention rates (from initial sales, numbers at the -end- of each month):

1. Month: 80-90%

2. Month: 50-60%

3. Month: 30-40%

4. Month: below 30%

+6. Month: ~15%

 

Free To Play prediction:

Month 12-14 from launch

So in six months 15% of your 4 million will be playing?  LMAO

Haters will hate.

Originally posted by Airwren

4th month: Blizzard announces a ftp model for wow, the world explodes

Already F2P.