I'll agree, anyone calling Ryzom a sandbox is delusional.  So what if it has "seasons" and "migrating mobs" .  I've played it to death, it is not  a sandbox.  There is ONE sandbox and it is called EVE online.

Edited to fix a slight spelling error, >.>.

Why are all the sandboxes sci-fi?  EVE, SWG, FE...

UO is just too old for me...  I might put up with a sci-fi if the graphics are decent but EVE doesn't even have real graphics (cool spaceships of course) and FE looks like trash, honestly.

I hope it does well, despite calling its graphics trash...

Originally posted by rixk

Originally posted by vlad1500

Originally posted by rixk

Some people automatically draw equation mark(or however it is called in english) between character customization and sandbox. FE has great character customization options, but nothing more.

It was already mentioned here, that you cannot talk about term endgame in the context of a game with open ending. The true sandbox game is, where the game starts from day one, you aren't left out of anything. Of course you are weak and ineffective, so you are encouraged to grow and train, but the "endgame" starts from day one.

In themepark games, you do the mandatory leveling part to experience the prewritten story and then you are stuck with various hamsterwheels, which the developers have put down for you(so called endgame). Until developers throw out next chunk of the story which you can consume.

Say what you want, but FE falls into the latter category. Only thing is, that it also lacks the hamsterwheels, which makes people leave once they get to levelcap.

 

so in your opinion, EVE at day one is already end game content? no leveling? no skill restriction? really? 

 

Don't mix up dev made barriers and the barriers you make yourself. Nothing stops you to get into the action from day one in EVE. You would be on the lower end of the foodchain, but when you think you have to have certain ship or skills, then it is you, who has put up those limitations, not the devs. Skilling and leveling only widens your options.

Same thing I saw in darkfall, where everyone was crying, that they need x amount of skills surging and certain amount of stats to be able to PvP. When I joined the game, I went to a clan, they gave me gear and the action started. Of course, I was far from top and being solo I would've been losing probably to everyone.

Skills and levels in sandboxes don't determine what you can do, but how well you can do it.

 

nothing stops you from doing this in FE as well. So whats your point?

Just here to point out that SWG is closed (that means it's not a sandbox) and FE is a quest grind themepark.  Can UO even be called a sandbox anymore, really?  Also, there is a post a cpl up that states EVE does not have real graphics.  What does that even mean?  It has the best character creation of any mmo, and just got a very large graphical over-haul on the 29th.  I mean, I guess it would be safe to say that it actually does have "real" graphics.  I would even venture to say they are more immersive than most mmorpgs on the market.  If you can't get into spaceships, that's fine, I had issues w/ it at first too.  But, just because you can't get into EVE does not mean it's graphics aren't "real".  Think before you post.

Originally posted by tadams2tone

Just here to point out that SWG is closed (that means it's not a sandbox) and FE is a quest grind themepark.  Can UO even be called a sandbox anymore, really?  Also, there is a post a cpl up that states EVE does not have real graphics.  What does that even mean?  It has the best character creation of any mmo, and just got a very large graphical over-haul on the 29th.  I mean, I guess it would be safe to say that it actually does have "real" graphics.  I would even venture to say they are more immersive than most mmorpgs on the market.  If you can't get into spaceships, that's fine, I had issues w/ it at first too.  But, just because you can't get into EVE does not mean it's graphics aren't "real".  Think before you post.

I stopped reading after that line.

I know, and you know, that you did indeed read my full post.  Pretend if you must, but we both know the truth.  I stand by what I posted, I doubt you could do the same.

I played the game for a couple months at release but I really didn't get the sandbox feel from it at all. I didn't get very far into the game but at the start at least, it's very linear and quest oriented like any other themepark: with the usual quest chains leading to instanced bosses at the end of each zone.

Yeah the economy is player run but the crafting system itself is no better than WoW's (ie: no variable ressources or difference in quality of crafted items).

At the time there was litterally no PvP going on in low level zones so your only 2 options for advancement were questing and crafting...not very sandboxish either.

All this might have changed though or perhaps the sandbox feel stands out more later on in the game.

Originally posted by vlad1500

nothing stops you from doing this in FE as well. So whats your point?

 

Sure, go at level 1 to... well, even sector 2 would do, and tell me what you can do there.. Even when you have higher level friend with you, the hardcoded limits apply to you, you get no exp from mobs, you can't harvest anything, no quests are open for you. And these are all boundaries, that have been put around you by devs. In FE at level 1 you are supposed to be in the beginning of sector one and that's it, there is no way around it.

I played FE for 2 years, and I've always maintained it's not a sandbox.

It is a prime example of a themepark/sandbox hybrid for sure, but 70/30 more than 50/50.

Haven't played in a few months, but when I last played you could make buildings for the progress towns, and that's allegedly the basis for player housing further down the line.

The article is right about the skills system confusing the heck out of new players, and during my time playing there were regular "revamps" of skills, that often left veterans just as confused - unless you goofed around a bit on the PTS before the skills went live.

I loved FE, for all its faults, but I've decided to step back a bit and see how it develops over the next while. Even with a small team behind it, it always seemed to be inching towards its potential, but very slooooowly. I still have all my characters, so I can jump back in whenever I feel like it.

Originally posted by rixk

Originally posted by vlad1500

nothing stops you from doing this in FE as well. So whats your point?

 

Sure, go at level 1 to... well, even sector 2 would do, and tell me what you can do there.. Even when you have higher level friend with you, the hardcoded limits apply to you, you get no exp from mobs, you can't harvest anything, no quests are open for you. And these are all boundaries, that have been put around you by devs. In FE at level 1 you are supposed to be in the beginning of sector one and that's it, there is no way around it.

Incorrect. Same limitations apply to sandbox like EVE too. Granted there are no levels but the moment you log in there are so many things you can not do right off the bat. the limitation of low skills stops you.

FE is definitely more themepark than sandbox. Not that I'm knocking the game, but it is what it is. Hardly can even call it a hybrid, with as little of sandbox elements it actually has. 

I love the fact that it has become F2P, it allows me to venture in and out, and I can overlook the clunky combat(personal opinion).

Zalmon I see your poitn, but it really is not the same between the two games you list which are EVE and FE.  Yes, there are some limitations in EVE, but they are not nearly as constricting as Fallen Earth.  Tell me this, if you logged in Fallen Earth could you be involved in a full out war in minutes?  Nope, you couldn't.  Can you go anywhere on the entire map the second you log into Fallen Earth? Hmm, can you?  Nope, that's right, you can't.  I could go on and on.  Like i said, of couse there are some limitations but it is not anything even NEAR the same.   Think before you post.

Edit to just point out that when I say log in in referance to EVE I mean log in for your first time after character creation.

Originally posted by tadams2tone

Just here to point out that SWG is closed (that means it's not a sandbox) and FE is a quest grind themepark.  Can UO even be called a sandbox anymore, really?  Also, there is a post a cpl up that states EVE does not have real graphics.  What does that even mean?  It has the best character creation of any mmo, and just got a very large graphical over-haul on the 29th.  I mean, I guess it would be safe to say that it actually does have "real" graphics.  I would even venture to say they are more immersive than most mmorpgs on the market.  If you can't get into spaceships, that's fine, I had issues w/ it at first too.  But, just because you can't get into EVE does not mean it's graphics aren't "real".  Think before you post.

 

EVE's graphics is not the issue for me. its the boring gameplay. Everything about eve is boring...

Originally posted by rixk

Originally posted by vlad1500

nothing stops you from doing this in FE as well. So whats your point?

 

Sure, go at level 1 to... well, even sector 2 would do, and tell me what you can do there.. Even when you have higher level friend with you, the hardcoded limits apply to you, you get no exp from mobs, you can't harvest anything, no quests are open for you. And these are all boundaries, that have been put around you by devs. In FE at level 1 you are supposed to be in the beginning of sector one and that's it, there is no way around it.

 

and in eve this limitation is not there? lol...

Originally posted by tadams2tone

Zalmon I see your poitn, but it really is not the same between the two games you list which are EVE and FE.  Yes, there are some limitations in EVE, but they are not nearly as constricting as Fallen Earth.  Tell me this, if you logged in Fallen Earth could you be involved in a full out war in minutes?  Nope, you couldn't.  Can you go anywhere on the entire map the second you log into Fallen Earth? Hmm, can you?  Nope, that's right, you can't.  I could go on and on.  Like i said, of couse there are some limitations but it is not anything even NEAR the same.   Think before you post.

Edit to just point out that when I say log in in referance to EVE I mean log in for your first time after character creation.

The moment you log in FE you can go to FFA pvp zones and start PVP at level 1 guaranteed you won't survive and same goes for EVE. You can go pretty much everywhere in FE nothign is stopping you after character creation but again you have to be careful just like you have to be careful in EVE. Anything else?

1. Go through the tutorial.

2. Work your way to Embry.

3. Head North to Oilville and then into S2.

4. Pick a faction at level 15.

5. Learn PvP via the Gallows.

6. Stand around New Flagstaff.

7. Head to S3.

8. Do all the faction missions in S2 and S3 (yes, there is a grind in this "sandbox")

9. Head to DF.

10. Head to AC.

11. Quit.

Doesn't sound like much of a Sandbox to me and this reviewer is simply on crack. IMHO.

Originally posted by FlaFringe

1. Go through the tutorial.

2. Work your way to Embry.

3. Head North to Oilville and then into S2.

4. Pick a faction at level 15.

5. Learn PvP via the Gallows.

6. Stand around New Flagstaff.

7. Head to S3.

8. Do all the faction missions in S2 and S3 (yes, there is a grind in this "sandbox")

9. Head to DF.

10. Head to AC.

11. Quit.

Doesn't sound like much of a Sandbox to me and this reviewer is simply on crack. IMHO.

 

 

 

OK I guess nobody here knows what "sandbox" truly means! FE is pretty close to sandbox, so shut up! And about the grind - I grinded in Ultima Online too (and grinded a lot), and plz don't tell me UO isnt sandbox too! If u wanna real sandbox - shut down your computers and go out!

Originally posted by vinilla

OK I guess nobody here knows what "sandbox" truly means! FE is pretty close to sandbox, so shut up! And about the grind - I grinded in Ultima Online too (and grinded a lot), and plz don't tell me UO isnt sandbox too! If u wanna real sandbox - shut down your computers and go out!

Problem is that even if FE is a sandbox, which it's not regardless of what you think, it doesn't matter. There's no one to play with and the servers are crap. Period.

Oh, and shutting down the computer and going outside is exactly what I did the day I quit FE. So refreshing.

Originally posted by vlad1500

{mod edit}

Sure am. Just as any FE Vet should be.

If this game is going to beat Eve as the best all-round sandbox game out there.  I need to hear about how the players have shaped the story.  How the battles have been epic.  Don't tell me about the stuff you can do solo, that's not what makes a sandbox great.