Originally posted by MikeB

Originally posted by Grizzkhit

Seems the author forgot that you choose an advanced class in Swtor at level 10, so you basically just have to choose another path on your mirror class to get a completely different playstyle.

 

These are identical to their mirror's counterparts as well. Vanguard (Trooper) == Powertech (Bounty Hunter).

They might be mirrored in terms of skills, but the look and feel of those skills is completely different, add different Class Story, Faction background, differente weapons, different armour look and you do get a much more interesting way of mirroring a class than say Blood Elf Paladin vs Human Paladin in WoW.

i disagree with the author and think they are just trying to pick the game apart the classes have more diferences than similarities even the abilities have diferent names and effects and a differnet story and enviroment to fight in. i think if you dont like it dont play it. it wont hurt my feelings and im sure there are going to be enough other people that like it to keep the game going.

I really don't have a problem with class mirroring.  The animations and everything was enough to keep it different.   I rather have mirrored classes and PVP balance and developer attention focused more on developing new content and such.    The stories are what set the classes apart.  Now if they all had the same story then I would feel different.  But from my time playing each class I felt that they were unique enough in style to feel just that "unique".   Do I care if a Sage's throw does the same damage as a lightning attack from an Inquistor?  Nope not as long as their stories are different and the animations are different.     I really don't see the big deal here.   I have a bigger issue with the lack of non-humaniod PCs than I do class mirroring.  

Man, this site is starting to become a parody of sorts. Yet another morning and another dumbass swipe on TOR.

Like a few mentioned. They set up the class's for a true balance purpose. There's 3 different tree's you can put points into that will let your character play a little different than your opposite from the other faction.

When i hear people bitching and moaning about this stuff, all i really hear is how i can't be leet enough in pvp. I'm sorry, that in the beta some of you got butt hurt because everything from the start of a pvp session was fair, boo-hoo.

Bioware did it's homework and understands that if you give to much of a variety for each class, it becomes a nightmare to balance. This leads to having to rework the whole class system and all you have to do is go to the RIFT/WOW forums and read all the threads about class nerfs and balance issue's.

I swear, some of you want to just bitch. I would bet my the world that if Bioware would have done their class's like the other two games i mentioned, you guys would be moaning about unbalance issue's and other things.

For the people that get it with TOR, we understand, some of you don't like the game. It's kinda funny that all the negative crap that keep's getting posted is from the same people, that has been doing this from the first day they announced the game was being made.

I too agree with you. Some have replied about interplantary quest which I agree also. I find the game not interesting at all for my 60 bucks. Yes its a nice looking world but again as in most mmo quest line is mundane at best like with other mmo's. One would think that dumbing down these games is acceptable maybe they realize that our education system has been dumbing dn the kids to a point that they have too. just saying its the trend in MMO's today and personally Im sick of it! This player wont be making any purchases from Bioware either.

I do not mind so much that they are identical.  Obviously a best case scenario is that they are different and unique, but I would rather start with balance and work towards uniqueness, than the have something unique but imbalanced (like WAR).

I would have to say that the major contributing factor to the enjoyment even though there are mirrored classes is exactly what is mentioned:  The storyline, quests and alignment are different (and companions!).  This alone is enough to satiate the side of me that needs something "different" and that gets bored easily.

I am impressed with the amount of time Bioware has taken with the voice acting and story to make it feel as if I am the center of this univserse, which is I think what alot of casual gamers seek in their particular escapes  :)

I simply don't understand this article. Class mirroring IS the only and the best solution to get a balanced and fair competiton between the two side in pvp or pve.  e-sport is based on balance.

Bioware made a great game, with ample difference beween class and still simple to hand over. The side choice don't have to be made based on skill of effectiveness but on the STORY and your feeling with your char. Keep in mind that this story and the atmosphere of the class must be the hightes consideration in this game.

blame PvP.stupid balance act

Originally posted by elocke

Originally posted by DeserttFoxx

Those of you who are against mirriored classes, are the minority, plain and simple.  Mirrored classes,e specailly from the pvp side is a good thing, it means people can choose to play waht they want to play.

So every class is unique, i guess i can only play one faction,  i hope my friends are playing that faction, i hope my guild wants to play that faction.

I dont get all this sudden hate on mirriored classes, since when is it a bad thing? Name one mmo, just one, that doesnt have mirrored classes.

Vanguard

Lotro

WoW

I'm sure there are others but these 3 stand out to me as having diverse classes.

This just silly, vanguard no factions opposing each other, Lotro, hmm same thing, WoW 1 class different for each side till they caved because of balance and gave them to both.

Originally posted by mnenos

I simply don't understand this article. Class mirroring IS the only and the best solution to get a balanced and fair competiton between the two side in pvp or pve.  e-sport is based on balance.

Bioware made a great game, with ample difference beween class and still simple to hand over. The side choice don't have to be made based on skill of effectiveness but on the STORY and your feeling with your char. Keep in mind that this story and the atmosphere of the class must be the hightes consideration in this game.

Why do you think mmorpg is e-sport?

Besides that's not important. Mirrored classes is hurting game and limiting it + it just plain BORING.

Screw balance. It usually means just countless buffs and nerfs caused by whiners on forums.

Game has to be interesting and best if classes are very diffrent.

Balancing = unification, boredom and it ends homogenizing whole game and changing it into dps race.

Imho balanced pvp = FPS games

Mmmorpg's don't need and never needed balance. Of course if sanity is kept.

Theres only four classes, only one race human with different color and horns in SWTOR gj bioware , wonder where they have spent half billion dollar oh wait voice over. dead static world,  no UI customisation, quests are horrible only kill and fetch quest , you hardly use items or interact with any mounted artillery or shapeshift etc, farmville type crafting.........

I disagree. You can still have a completely unique experience playing your mirrored class based on the advance class you take.

Both the Smuggler and the Imperial Agent have two builds. A Healer and a DPS Role.

I plan to have my smuggler as a Healer and my Agent as a DPS. That means that while thier starting abilities are going to be the same, after level 10 they are going to have very different playstyles.

Advanced Classes are also mirrored?

Shock!!

    Sorry Mr. MikeB, but I have to think you are way off here.  I see absolutely NO problem with mirrored classes.  My reasoning is pretty simple.  First, the gear looks different.  That may not be a huge deal, but it adds a little different flavor to the classes.  Second, the weapons are different.  Again, not a huge deal but the flavor thing kicks in.  Third, the animations are different.  This one IS a huge deal since the flavor of the classes are dramatically different.  Lastly, the STORY is different.  That whole "4th Pillar" that BioWare built this game on makes a GIGANTIC difference in the flavor of your characters even if the "Stats" are the same.  Having played several of the "Mirrors" now, I can tell you that HOW they played felt much different thanks to the above changes I described.

    So while the classes ARE mirrored, the differences that BioWare built in make them completely different.

My impression is the mirrored classes was less for balancing and more ro avoid people complaining that they have to play one side or the other in order to play the style of character they want.

I do think they could have done a much better job at hiding the fact that they're mirrored but all in all this is fairly low down my list of complaints.

I don't see the problem. Most people i know only play one character anyway. I usually play a lot of alts and this will shorten the games lifespan for me. This is not going to affect my enjoyment of the game, only how long i play it.

Originally posted by Khaine007

I'd rather the classes weren't mirrored completely as far as skills go, but I imagine most people will be playing the classes they choose more for the flavor of the armor, weapons and story.  So while one play experience in one class may be "similar" to it's mirror, it really won't be that similar at all.  Because once again, you'll have different weapons, armor graphics, and entirely different stories.

Yes, I wish there were some differences, and yes, it's completely due to developer laziness, but you just gotta keep on keeping on.

This.

By standard MMO terms, the skill "mirroring" is undeniable. 

But to say that playing the Soldier experience is just like the Bounty Hunter experience is... just intellectually dishonest.

Different weapons

Different companions

Different stories

I've played as both the Soldier and BH.  They are entirely different.  As a soldier, you are pretty much married and dedicated to the Republic.  As a Bounty Hunter, it's all about self-interest.

To anyone that just dismisses the two as identical, I can't help but wonder why you play an RPG in the first place.

This game sounds worse every day. I need diversity. 4 classes (or 8 if you will) won't cut it for me. My hope lies with TSW. Luckily I've got plenty of great single player - er, well, I mean *offline* singleplayer - games to play. Maybe some day a good MMO will come along.

I played BH more than trooper.  It's kinda funny that I liked BH more but I think it was the story I liked best.  Story for me is what set them apart not abilities.   But that is the whole point of this game anyway right, story?

Maybe it's the lazy way to do it, but on the other hand I've seen how much class imbalance can destroy a game's fun.  So while it may not be the ideal solution, it is a solution.

I like mirrored classes, and you pretty much said it yourself Mike,  WAR was extremely unbalanced at launch.  The PvP was a lot of fun until you started noticing these imbalances,  then it became tiresome knowing the outcome when you saw a particular class.  

Everyone seems to complain when things aren't balanced...  and then when they make mirrors so teams are perfectly balanced, now they want individuality.

Yet, mirrored classes have been going on in arena based games, FPS's, fighting games, action games... and so on for a very long time, and its all in the name of balance.    

Now, the advanced classes do allow some difference in play for mirrored classes, for those that want to take a different route on playability,  but if you want to play the same mirrored class with the same kind of advanced class,  I don't think you should have something different.... I think the point would be, that you want to play the same class.  If you want to be a scoundrel,  but want to heal on your IA too,  I don't think you're looking for a difference in gameplay.