Originally posted by spaceport

Lol yeah because SWTOR quests are different.

 

PL-ease, they are just fedex quests with "bonus" kill 10 space rats, etc.

 

 

Yes, in SWTOR each class has unique story quests, but again... those are only 10 % of the quests required to lvl up to 50.

You can believe me or not, do some research about the game, i really don't care xD.

Only 10% of the quest are different between classes? Can someone confirm this? If so then i get what you guys mean by "rerolling alt is not the main focus of ToR"...wow this is something new to me and here i thought it's all different with maybe 20-30% the same. If this is true then i may be getting too much bs from the bioware PR.

Originally posted by channel84

Originally posted by UrzaElent

Will GW2s.....

Raiding be any better than TOR or any other mmo..... no

Crafting be any better than TOR or any other mmo..... no

PvP be better than than TOR or any other mmo..... for rabid fanboy PvPers  it may will be, yes. Guess thats the only main focus of GW2. Have fun paying $60+ for a glorified MOBA.

Will rerolling a alt be any better than TOR or any other mmo..... not a snowballs chance in hell.

Any while we're pointing out typos, its spelled you're, not ur, and no, I am not but you sure as hell are a GW2 fanboy if you can actively mislead others with what are basically lies with little to no basis just for no other reason than this game isn't GW2.

If you open a thread in gw2 forum i'm happy to debate on how it is better ^^

As of now this is a ToR forum as previous poster have pointed out.

All out nerd rage and chopping on my game of preference does not help you win argument, valid point do.

 

Originally posted by GMan3

    Okay, this post is where I lost respect for you channel84.  I actually don't disagree with you that at aleast PART of the focus for endgame is for you to reroll and try an alt.  The Developer had admitted that several times even going so far as to say that the eight different story lines tie together to paint an even bigger story.  The does not make it THE FOCUS of endgame though.  It makes it an aspect of endgame.  Just as crafting, raiding, flashpoints, PvP, solo questing, and group questing are all aspects of endgame.

    What really killed my respect for your point of view though is how you seem to say that SWTOR lacks CONTENT at endgame.  Something that simply is not true, especially when compared to the content at release of pretty much any other MMO released in the last 10 years.  This game already has more endgame content than even some games that have been for several years.

    I won't bother with talking about GW2 since this IS the SWTOR forum.  But I will say that it is amazing how many of it's fans can't help but try to sleaze around other games forums.  Really immature in my opinion.  I just try to stay away from the forums of games I don't like personally.

Question: What is the main end game focus for ToR in your opinion? (pick from crafting, raiding, flashpoints, PvP, solo questing, and group questing and rerolling alt)

FYI i'm not saying that ToR is lacking in end game content, i'm saying rerolling is a major endgame feature for ToR. Take that or leave it at that.

One guy saying that i said "rerolling is ToR ONLY end game" now another come and say i said "ToR lack endgame content" Get a grip guys sheez.

PS: Lets not make this a personal attack, let's stick with point, fact, argument and opinion

You can also look at it in different way, even if rerolling alt is "major endgame content" they have already finished 1-50 content, so they don't need to focus on it anymore. Now they can focus on other end game content (operations, flashpoints, pvp, level 50 story content, etc).

It's probally be worthless like WoW's endgame, no point to raiding in WoW at all due to no use for the gear anymore (other than raids), if the raid gear could be used in pvp though thats a diff story. IMO mmo's should have a faction vs faction pvp endgame, but also have some raiding stuff for the carebears. A combo of both is best, but judging from the quality of swtor so far. I wouldn't expect much. Game is just a more linear version of world of warcraft at its core, with nothing unique to it really. I wouldn't expect much endgame wise.

Originally posted by spaceport

Originally posted by UrzaElent

Originally posted by spaceport

Originally posted by UrzaElent

Originally posted by spaceport

Originally posted by C1d0s

Originally posted by channel84

Originally posted by jerlot65

TOr has raiding and much other end game content.  The Daniel quote is takien out of context.  He was explaining that the raids will be hard and that it is for seasoned players with fully decked out toons.  If raiding is NOT your cup of tea then you can reroll.

 

Nowhere did they say the focus of endgame was rerolling.  But they did say they encourage it.

Summary of what daniel said minus the PR bs

The raid will not be as difficult/challenging as other mmo but it'll still provide decent challenge. If many player prefer raid as oppose to reroll as end game content we will consider bumping up the difficulty but currently our stand is that only hardcore mmo player like difficult raid.

As for the reroll focus as end game content. I think it's resonable to acknowledge that since they planned out different story for each class and encourage reroll. Comparing the amount of effort put in making raid/pvp to providing alternative experience for reroll is where i base my point.

But i think i've proven myself enough for general mmo forum user to do their own research. Moving on....

PS: if your not rolling alt then you're missing out a major chunk of the content ^^

I don't see what's so wrong about having the opportunity to reroll as a portion of End Game. Sure kicks WoW in the pants, where rerolling is simply picking one of the same classes with a diffrent race, or vise versa. You seem to be focused way too much on the option of making alts, instead of paying attention to the many other alternatives that have been set before you. 

Yes, rerolling alts is what they'd prefer to push, probably because of all the money and press they've spent of emphasising story; that said, I think it is very unfair to say they don't care as much about PVP or Raiding - especially since they ADDED World PVP and a whole new operation ( raid ). They did't always have that, but they knew fans wanted it so they buckled down.

I think that shows they're at least considerate of the demands and expectations of their playerbase.

 

Originally posted by UrzaElent

Originally posted by channel84

Originally posted by jerlot65

TOr has raiding and much other end game content.  The Daniel quote is takien out of context.  He was explaining that the raids will be hard and that it is for seasoned players with fully decked out toons.  If raiding is NOT your cup of tea then you can reroll.

 

Nowhere did they say the focus of endgame was rerolling.  But they did say they encourage it.

Summary of what daniel said minus the PR bs

The raid will not be as difficult/challenging as other mmo but it'll still provide decent challenge. If many player prefer raid as oppose to reroll as end game content we will consider bumping up the difficulty but currently our stand is that only hardcore mmo player like difficult raid.

As for the reroll focus as end game content. I think it's resonable to acknowledge that since they planned out different story for each class and encourage reroll. Comparing the amount of effort put in making raid/pvp to providing alternative experience for reroll is where i base my point.

But i think i've proven myself enough for general mmo forum user to do their own research. Moving on....

PS: if your not rolling alt then you're missing out a major chunk of the content ^^

So basicallly what you're saying is that just because they made rerolling a alt a thousand times better than any mmo to date that just has to be the only endgame focus?

 

Lol nice joke guys!

In WOW i can level up to 4 characters of the same faction without repeating 1 quest, there are many areas for the same levels.

I can't do that in SWTOR, i can't even level up 2 characters of the same faction without repeating about 80% of it's quests.

Saying that SWTOR has better alt replayability is just plain wrong.

lol, are you for real or just trolling? I'm sorry, I played WoW from beta till just 1 month ago and I dont ever recall doing anything other than the same freaking quest with each new ult for about the first 15-20 levels. I also dont recall there being totally different quest lines for each and every single class in the game either and not just the bs 4-5 that almost always have to be done in a instance and that are basically worthless now that you find in WoW.

The only difference in expeirence in WoW when rerolling a alt is if you are killing 15 boars and wolves with swords or with magic fireballs. I loved the game for years but to say otherwise is just a joke.

No im not joking.

I don't why are you repeating the same quests the first 15-20 levels, wow currently has 10 different starting areas (6 at launch)

SWTOR has what... 4? am i right?

In WOW you have like 3 or 4 different areas to level up for 1-10, 10-20, 20-30 etc.

In SWTOR you will be doing exactly the same quests for each character of the same factions.

Yes you have your own personal story but those aren't even 10% of all the quests you will do on your way up to lvl 50.

10 different starting areas but some of which you have to share with multiple races unless you want to spend the first 10 mins of the game running, flying or taking the tram to a different races starting zone. So yea, the way you put it is misleading to say the least.

Yes, there are 3-4 different areas to level up in..... with the same EXACT quest in every zone. Roll a hunter, same quest, roll a warrior, same quest, mage, same, shammy, same, etc etc etc. You can change your class all you want and you will forever and always find the same quest in everyzone that every other class finds. And after 6+ years I've done them all pal and it got boring real fast.

Wrong and I dont know if you just havent tried the game and are going of someone elses lies or are just trolling. EACH and EVERY class in SWTOR has their OWN UNIQUE class quest line. You roll a jedi knight, UNIQUE quest, bounty hunter, UNIQUE quest, trooper, UNIQUE quest, etc etc etc.

Last of all the story quest doesnt end at lvl 10 or 20 in SWTOR. It follows you through out the whole game. Spin it all you want but there is no way you will ever be able to convince any LONG time player of WoW that has played SWTOR that it has better replayability unless they are just blind.

Lol yeah because SWTOR quests are different.

 

PL-ease, they are just fedex quests with "bonus" kill 10 space rats, etc.

 

 

Yes, in SWTOR each class has unique story quests, but again... those are only 10 % of the quests required to lvl up to 50.

You can believe me or not, do some research about the game, i really don't care xD.

Yea, I dont have to do any research cause I'VE PLAYED IT for myself. I just didnt watch a few videos and start running off at the mouth like some of these yahoos do. So your "they are all just fedex quest" line of bullshit is just that, and the fact you even have to the balls to try to play that card after playing WoW just shows you're trolling. WoW DEFINED the fedex quest. 

Yes, alot of quest do have a "bonus" quest added to the quest lines, something else WoW doesnt have.

Yes, SWTOR does have unique story quest, something again that WoW never had or probably never will, thus making SWTOR more replayable.

Listen, I've forgotten more about WoW than most people will ever know. Your whole post here is just nonsense. I wanted to give you the benefit of the doubt and just go with the fact you really didnt know that much about TOR but by this time I have to admit your just talking bs.

Dudes, the blind hate on SWTOR is amazing. WoW fans, GW2 fans, sandbox fans...They're all nerdraging upon the simple fact that SWTOR will be hugely successful. And I tell you, this is good. Hate is always a good sign. 

No one cares about losers, no need to beat a dead horse. Winners are the ones who are, and always will be, hated. 

Originally posted by XAleX360

Dudes, the blind hate on SWTOR is amazing. WoW fans, GW2 fans, sandbox fans...They're all nerdraging upon the simple fact that SWTOR will be hugely successful. And I tell you, this is good. Hate is always a good sign. 

No one cares about losers, no need to beat a dead horse. Winners are the ones who are, and always will be, hated. 

Agreed. I think this will hopefully die down after the game comes out. Actually I won't care I'll be too busy running my guild and having a damn good time. 

When that happens all that will be left in this forum will probably be people going back and forth about how much they hate the game, until GW 2 comes out. 

Well, they always said THEIR endgame would be TOTALLY different, never seen before things! Now its just... the same as everywhere else.

Originally posted by Elikal

Well, they always said THEIR endgame would be TOTALLY different, never seen before things! Now its just... the same as everywhere else.

Got quotes of that? I've never heard that from Bioware. 

Originally posted by dubyahite

Originally posted by Elikal

Well, they always said THEIR endgame would be TOTALLY different, never seen before things! Now its just... the same as everywhere else.

Got quotes of that? I've never heard that from Bioware. 

It was said many times in 2010. Example:

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/238122/star-wars-the-old-republic-end-game-is-brand-new-system/

Also: http://www.darthhater.com/articles/swtor-news/15782-james-ohlen-on-endgame

After what I have seen and tried I felt very comfortable recommending  this game to all my friends that is 40 people who have no interest in raids or hard core we plan on having multiple characters and living the storyline, hell when mass effect came to pc we all talked on teamspeak while playing that game and had months of fun.

Speaking to PC Gamer in its new 'MMO issue', the game's creative director James Olhen said:

"We're looking at classic [endgame] systems, but we're also doing something brand new that hasn't been done in an MMO before. So we're going to mix those two together."

Olhen then got hushed by the game's product manager, but added that Bioware was keen for players to continue questing after hitting maximum.

"We want to make sure the endgame isn't completely different to what you have been doing," he said. "So there will be a natural progression... We want to make sure that when people play ToR they feel like they never run out of content... that it's an epic story."



You're being pretty selective in what you take out of that quote.

Looks like he said it will be mainly the same but we're doing "something" new as well.

Didn't really sound like he said it was coin to revolutionize MMOs or anything. A bit of context is always nice

*sigh*

@Channel. This wasn't about focus, I'm not going into what is more meaningful or anything like that. Thats all subjective and until we actually get to end-game we don't know how much effort was put into that. I don't like talking about stuff like how much focus they did or did not put into end-game until we've actually gotten to it.

I can see your trying to paint me as some kind of blind fanboi of the game (and i'm sad that your trying to do this, cause i thought you were better then this...i guess not) my comment was basically to turn it around and show how you might feel, Didn't get the point across i guess. Whatever.

The question was asked, what did TOR have as end-game. Not what the focus was. So when someone said it was just reroll i correct them, as i did you. There really is no reason to get upset or retailate the way you have about it. Just kind of sad. That why i said you might want to leave this to some people who know more about the game as they can better answer it for the OP. You see i'm trying to keep it clear so the OP just doesn't think it's go through the story, and once you get to end-game thats it. Theres nothing. no raids or anything, which isn't true as there is a good bit.

We do know theres PvP (illum) we do know theres crafting (kinda vague on this one if it's end-game as you can't make the best of all gear as raiders will still get better gear then crafters) , we do know there are raids, we do know all flashpoints can be converted to level 50, we do know theres solo end-game. We do know theres the outlaw's den. We can go back and forth over and over again how we "think" this and that were the focus. The focus is and always has been story. But seeing as that intertwines everything in the game, that doesn't rule anything out.

What I do care about what is in game and providing the facts of said game not how much of an effort they put into it. If you want to go down that road, feel free to pop up a new thread and i'll go back and forth with you over that. The way you see me now you may be surprised as some of my answers.

It's why my title is what it is. As me and Gaou try to bring facts of the game. Not subjective things. I corrected you for the sake of facts. That was all. Anyway i really am done here now i just wanted to state that and i didn't want to do it in a PM because i feel your trying to tarnish my image by painting me as a blind fanboi of the game and refuse to see faults, as my preview of the game clearly and i do mean very clearly shows i do see faults of the game. But that isn't the point of this thread. This thread was what was end-game about. The question was answered, so i feel this thread is done.

@at OP: So good luck OP, hope the answer that were given were to your satisfaction.

Originally posted by dubyahite

Speaking to PC Gamer in its new 'MMO issue', the game's creative director James Olhen said:

"We're looking at classic [endgame] systems, but we're also doing something brand new that hasn't been done in an MMO before. So we're going to mix those two together."

Olhen then got hushed by the game's product manager, but added that Bioware was keen for players to continue questing after hitting maximum.

"We want to make sure the endgame isn't completely different to what you have been doing," he said. "So there will be a natural progression... We want to make sure that when people play ToR they feel like they never run out of content... that it's an epic story."



You're being pretty selective in what you take out of that quote.

Looks like he said it will be mainly the same but we're doing "something" new as well.

Didn't really sound like he said it was coin to revolutionize MMOs or anything. A bit of context is always nice

And "what hasn't been done before"?

Raids? Dungeon gear grind? It was in DOZENS of interviews, but I am not going to find all of them, just because you are planning to defend SWTOR whatever may come.

Originally posted by Elikal

And "what hasn't been done before"?

Raids? Dungeon gear grind? It was in DOZENS of interviews, but I am not going to find all of them, just because you are planning to defend SWTOR whatever may come.

And I doubt anyone is going to find any arguements to fight you with Elikal. You've rabidly poo-poo'd everything repeatedly. Ever get that 238 hour download done?

Originally posted by Digna

Originally posted by Elikal

And "what hasn't been done before"?

Raids? Dungeon gear grind? It was in DOZENS of interviews, but I am not going to find all of them, just because you are planning to defend SWTOR whatever may come.

And I doubt anyone is going to find any arguements to fight you with Elikal. You've rabidly poo-poo'd everything repeatedly. Ever get that 238 hour download done?

I stick to facts, not wishful thinking.

Originally posted by Elikal

Originally posted by Digna

Originally posted by Elikal

And "what hasn't been done before"?

Raids? Dungeon gear grind? It was in DOZENS of interviews, but I am not going to find all of them, just because you are planning to defend SWTOR whatever may come.

And I doubt anyone is going to find any arguements to fight you with Elikal. You've rabidly poo-poo'd everything repeatedly. Ever get that 238 hour download done?

I stick to facts, not wishful thinking.

There was no wishful thinking in the post on end game content. Just that 'they' encouraged questing even at max level. Standard stuff and there 'might' be something new/a twist.

Oh well. GL in the beta if your DL is done.

Originally posted by Digna

Originally posted by Elikal

Originally posted by Digna

Originally posted by Elikal

And "what hasn't been done before"?

Raids? Dungeon gear grind? It was in DOZENS of interviews, but I am not going to find all of them, just because you are planning to defend SWTOR whatever may come.

And I doubt anyone is going to find any arguements to fight you with Elikal. You've rabidly poo-poo'd everything repeatedly. Ever get that 238 hour download done?

I stick to facts, not wishful thinking.

There was no wishful thinking in the post on end game content. Just that 'they' encouraged questing even at max level. Standard stuff and there 'might' be something new/a twist.

Oh well. GL in the beta if your DL is done.

Yes Elikal has professed some dislikes and all that but actually i'm going through the logs trying to find what they were refering to because james did speicifically state that they were going to mix what has been done with something entirely brand new, and i'm at this moment trying (should be easy maybe my search foo is failing) to find what that is.

Maybe it's outlaw's den where your group can fight either side over a rare merchant ala:

Originally posted by dronfwar

http://www.askajedi.com/2011/11/08/fan-site-summit-ilum-open-world-pvp-detailed/

sounds like  world pvp blizzard tried where you have to control towers and you get a buff if you do so. how exciting a buff. Eventually people will just ignore illium unless there is reason to control these 5 points other than some lame buff and crafting resources that are not as good as the stuff gained in raids.

Originally posted by nerovipus32

Originally posted by dronfwar

http://www.askajedi.com/2011/11/08/fan-site-summit-ilum-open-world-pvp-detailed/

sounds like a world pvp blizzard tried where you have to control towers and you get a buff if you do so. how exciting a buff. Eventually people will just ignore illium unless there is reason to control these 5 points other than some lame buff.

I always though poeple did things in a game because there fun to do.

Originally posted by Coman

Originally posted by nerovipus32

Originally posted by dronfwar

http://www.askajedi.com/2011/11/08/fan-site-summit-ilum-open-world-pvp-detailed/

sounds like a world pvp blizzard tried where you have to control towers and you get a buff if you do so. how exciting a buff. Eventually people will just ignore illium unless there is reason to control these 5 points other than some lame buff.

I always though poeple did things in a game because there fun to do.

im not saying its not fun but you know aswell as i do that people will ignore it unless they are rewarded for doing it. im happy just pvp'ing for fun but the masses want shinies. From my experience with warhammer online people will take the fastest route for a reward and if thats battlegrounds then your world pvp is dead already.