I think that SW:TOR will fail because there aren't squeeking pandas in pink armor, fighting with axes of the size of a house. Or running aroun with footman lances. I will play SW:TOR and will enjoy it but I'm not a fanboi (I've been banned couple of times on this site criticizing the game and bashing fanbois in heated arguments hehe) but I cannot see anything new in Asian garbage that failed even in Korea (TERA for example). Or do you call ArceAge rave clubs an innovation?

Only MMO that really promised something was/is World of Darkness but I think that it won't come out in next 2 years if ever. I had my eye on The Secret World too but so far it seems that Funcom hold true to it's traditions that are not acceptable for everyone. 

Teh, waking up humans... nice idea.

SWTOR is the next WOW! The cure for cancer and the coming of Christ! Haven't you heard?!

"Humans rather fall to a big lie than a small one."

- well known German dictator

likeing tor doesnt mean we think any of those things eilkal andi find them insulting to be truthful. I just love the game i had a lot of fun playing in beta 

I didnt find it a wow clone. it had similarites yes but it had enough diffrences that it felt like a game of its own it didnt feel like wow to me. 

thats me though i admith it has similar familar mechanics and i admit there nothing really innovative in there combat or mechanics. in fact i didnt think those were broken in mmos . I just thought some mmos didnt put out a polished product with enough content to keep people playing.

I dont think using tried adn true mechanics and combat is a bad thing. And the story and choices to me made a big diffrence. 

that doesnt mean i think tor will cure cancer is the next wow or any of those things. I just think this game will have a huge launch with all the pre orders they have and the majority will stick past the 6 month mark if bioware puts out new content fast enough. 

its a fun interesting game i wanan take my time playing and enjoying and im gonjna play all the classes to experiance there choices and story. 

u dont have to like tor i coudl care less if u do but i dont think its a wow clone in my opinion it isnt. im allowed to have a diffrent opinion if i want one. i dont expect u or anyone else to agree with me this is just my view. 

Originally posted by Wharg0ul

Originally posted by azmundai

 

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Originally posted by Wharg0ul

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Originally posted by felyx
 
Last but not least, if you want something new, wait for TERA, GW2, or even Archage, at least those games offer something new, but keep in mind I am not trying to say that those games will be better for sure, all I am saying is that those game really showed something different than Wow..

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Your agenda is showing.
 
 

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funny that you think someone thats been here since 08 and has 9 total posts has an agenda .. for or against .. anything. Tinfoil hat much?

Not at all. But when you've seen this exact type of post over and over in this forum, ending with "oh, by the way, this other game is going to be totally different and much better", it doesn't take rocket science to see the ulterior motive.

And most of these people have never even PLAYED SWTOR. They are just spouting the same cries of "OMG WOW CLONE" that they have been reciting since the game was announced.

Calling a spade a spade here. 

not hard to see the gameplay. youtube.com search for SWTOR. I'm just going to say if you want something different than wow, don't buy it.

i watched videos and tested the game as well and i love it and still plan to buy it and alo wil play for years not a month. those dont like it fine but theres still millions who will buy it and really if star wars galaxies can run on life support for over 7 years then i expect this game to be here in 8 years. you dont like swtor i'm sorry it happens but hate posts like these will not sway players and certainly not me. peace out brother.

TC convinced me! yo i am cancelling my TOR pre-order right now! seriously man if you think Themepark games was "going out of style" then how come most played MMOs are themepark? (WoW, LoTR, Rift, Aion,etc). ToR is getting good word from almost everywhere. It even converted many "haters" into "lovers." The game is showing promise and probably will end up being very successful. 

As for you TC find another game to play till one of the games you like comes out? Besides that what else can you do? complain about games that you thought will fit your liking but turned out it wasnt? oh wait you are doing that already.Seriously i love these "the game doesn't meet my criteria so it must be a bad game and everyone will agree with me" ideal. 

Feel the hate haters. Let the hate flow through you. It is the only way to the dark side of the force. 

Graphics can be upgraded before release... beta is beta after all. They still have bugs and fixes to work out.

But the OP still has a point... the systems for the game seem a little bit cloned with a few changes. It just feels like "that other game" to me when I'm playing for more than a few hours... but I'm not here for different. I'm just here for fun and a new MMO to latch onto. The story interaction alone could keep me playing for hours at a time... I immagine the endgame content won't keep me for long, though -- just like "that other game" and its clone.

That said... you won't find me on TOR for weeks or even months once GW2 releases, and that's a fact. SW:TOR is just that filler game I'm using until something else more worthwhile comes around.

Originally posted by dpcollier128

Graphics can be upgraded before release... beta is beta after all. They still have bugs and fixes to work out.

But the OP still has a point... the systems for the game seem a little bit cloaned with a few changes. It just feels like that other game to me when I'm playing for more than a few hours... but I'm not here for different. I'm just here for fun and a new MMO to latch onto.

That said... you won't find me on TOR for weeks or even months once GW2 releases, and that's a fact. SW:TOR is just that filler game I'm using until something else more worthwhile comes around.

To each their own, man.

I'll stick with tride and true, you can have the innovation.

i been playing WoW since 2007 and still love it. i love lotro as well. but what WoW and lotro lack is......i'm star wars fan. star wars and theme park style=pure heaven for me

Hahahah..funny post. A wake up call....errr ok?

Originally posted by Bramickias

SWTOR is pretty much ALL about the story. If you are skipping conversations on your characters becasue you need to kill more stuff, this just isnt the MMO for you. I'm not even sure i'll care about the endgame pve or pvp unless theres quite a lot of personnal story involved. If i wanted to play hit the pinata, i'd still be playing WoW or Rift. I want to care about something else then my latest 2hands sword on my character and for what i've played in last weekend beta, SWTOR delivers.

^Exactly! 

Its funny how many of you dont understand my post. I am not trying to tell you not to play the game, if you enjoy it you should play it. This thread was born because so many ppl deny that SWTOR is pretty much another Wow experience.  Just read this thread, lot of you already acknowledged that it is in fact feels like another wow (or any other themepark mmo before it). I just wanted ppl to admit this so that noone gets their hopes up too high that this game is much different than the rest, because it is not.

doesn't matter if it's WoW clone or not. SWTOR is great themepark mmo. if you love theme park and good story and star wars then this game is for you. but if you hate thempark or skip dialogue you are asking for trouble even trying it. i understand just like everything in life you either hate it or love it pure and simple.

Originally posted by felyx

Its funny how many of you dont understand my post. I am not trying to tell you not to play the game, if you enjoy it you should play it. This thread was born because so many ppl deny that SWTOR is pretty much another Wow experience.  Just read this thread, lot of you already acknowledged that it is in fact feels like another wow (or any other themepark mmo before it). I just wanted ppl to admit this so that noone gets their hopes up too high that this game is much different than the rest, because it is not.

No we understand your post that is why find it funny. Putting 'wake up call' in title as some kind of declaration for those who are waiting for SWTOR and repeating the same old done to death 'it is just  like WOW' argument...jeeez wonder why so many are not taking your post seriously. Here is an idea, beta weekend is coming up and anyone can grab a key and try it and see it for themselves.

Originally posted by Supersoups

Originally posted by felyx

Its funny how many of you dont understand my post. I am not trying to tell you not to play the game, if you enjoy it you should play it. This thread was born because so many ppl deny that SWTOR is pretty much another Wow experience.  Just read this thread, lot of you already acknowledged that it is in fact feels like another wow (or any other themepark mmo before it). I just wanted ppl to admit this so that noone gets their hopes up too high that this game is much different than the rest, because it is not.

No we understand your post that is why find it funny. Putting 'wake up call' in title as some kind of declaration for those who are waiting for SWTOR and repeating the same old done to death 'it is just  like WOW' argument...jeeez wonder why so many are not taking your post seriously. Here is an idea, beta weekend is coming up and anyone can grab a key and try it and see it for themselves.

%100 agreed

Originally posted by felyx

Its funny how many of you dont understand my post. I am not trying to tell you not to play the game, if you enjoy it you should play it. This thread was born because so many ppl deny that SWTOR is pretty much another Wow experience.  Just read this thread, lot of you already acknowledged that it is in fact feels like another wow (or any other themepark mmo before it). I just wanted ppl to admit this so that noone gets their hopes up too high that this game is much different than the rest, because it is not.

It is actually different than the rest, otherwise we'd just be playing "the rest."  That's what you don't seem to understand.  A game can be modeled after another tried and true formula and still be "different."  WoW doesn't deliver a story.  WoW doesn't allow you to make choices on how you complete quests.  WoW doesn't have companions that you can actually gear up like regular player characters, craft for you, send to sell of your vendor trash items, send on missions for you.  WoW doesn't have open world dungeon areas.  WoW doesn't have heroic areas in every zone filled with elites.  WoW doesn't have the feeling of immersion that comes from having massive, sprawling cities with spaceships flying through the air and things happening all over.  WoW doesn't have FFA PvP zones.  WoW doesn't have dungeons and raids with an actual storyline to them, and where the players can affect the way things play out by the decisions they make.  I could go on and on and on.  

That's what you don't seem to understand, and what the "WoW clone" crowd can't seem to get through their heads:  A game can be similar to another game in terms of mechanics, but be completely different in how it's designed.  All those things I pointed out in the above paragraph may seem like small things to you, but all those small things are actually IMPROVEMENTS over the standard themepark formula, even if they are small improvements.  And all those small improvements add up to make a damn good game.  

And btw, when you use the phrase "wake up call" in your title, you ARE attempting to qualify the game in some way and label it. And you most certainly are trying to sway our opinion, or at the very least, de-value it.  

Originally posted by zigmund

 

imo SWTOR and Rift did barely enough to just say their different.

I will play SWTOR for as long as I played Rift - about a month.

As long as players accept this kind of dull unimaginative same old same old - that's what we will continue to get from game developers.

 

And playing the game for a month...is any different? Unless you are planning on playing on someone elses account, are you not still giving money to these terrible game developers?

Originally posted by felyx

I never really post in these forums, usually I just watch you guys discussing games, but not today. First off I really have to tell you I was looking forward to playing SWTOR, I really was. Checked every news, every video avaible and so on. I am sure some of you will flame me for what I am about to say, but please, for one second, put down your fanboy attitude and think about   what I am going to tell you now.

I played a lot of mmos, in the last 10 or 12 years, and I never really had a problem if my currently played mmo was just like the one I played before except maybe graphic quality and so on. I do play Wow for a while now, and I am looking for something different, new, better, more entertaining, because I am bored of it.

When I saw SWTOR for the first time, well to be honest I was expecting a lot more. I am sure the story with voice acting and all is more enjoyable than Wow's but is that enough, for how long? People already skipping through these cutscenes because it does get boring.

The combat system is a bit different but after you get used to it, and I mean used to timing your skills and so on, then it will become just as boring as Wow's.

The biggest dissapointment for me is the graphics. From a game that is released in late 2011, I expect quality like Guild Wars 2, TERA Online, Archage has. Charcter animations, and the overall look of the characters are lame, and I couldnt be more polite. It is bad, very very bad. I saw the world, it looks a bit better than the characters, but most of the time you will look at your character, it is pretty damn important how it looks. But even the world could look a lot better.

Content is better, I agree it has enough to start with, but I do not think it will be enough for more than two-three months of playtime.

PvP... I mean really? I know Wow devs already making a hutball like pvp for the next expansion basically stealing the idea, but you cant blame them more than you can blame SWTOR devs stealing pretty much every good idea from Wow... There are a few new ideas that can entertain you for a couple of weeks, after that it will get boring just like Wow bgs do. That PvP planet or whatnot might be a nice addition but again, I dont think thats enough.

PvE raids, dungeons... all the same, just check the videos about them, the basic concept is just the same as in Wow.

Even the freakin flight masters are copied into the game, the only difference is that your not riding a gryphon but a speeder...

I tried most of the mmos that came after Wow. Warhammer, Age Of Conan, Rift and the list goes on. All of those failed to bring something new, something refreshing to us players that actually holds our interest for a long(er) time. Maybe SWTOR will be more entertaining than Rift, because I put that one down after one and a half week, thats not long I know, but does it matter if it takes 2 weeks or 2 months? It is not enough...

I know lot of you will say I am a wow fanboy but please don't try to call me that just because I compared SWTOR to it. I do not think Wow is better, not even the slightest.. (By the way everyone compares it to wow since its the leading mmo game on the market atm.)

I just cant stand that SWTOR fans trying to convince everyone that SWTOR is the biggest hit since Wow. It is not. I know you hate wow, that is obvious and at some points I do agree, but SWTOr aint no solution for us bored mmo players who actually wants something better, it is pretty much another Wow dressed differently.

Last but not least, if you want something new, wait for TERA, GW2, or even Archage, at least those games offer something new, but keep in mind I am not trying to say that those games will be better for sure, all I am saying is that those game really showed something different than Wow..

i think the op is spot on with this one. the only unique thing this game has to offer is the voice acting and that is enough for about the 1st 20 hours, after that it starts to become tiresome. Other than that this game has nothing new to offer. i will be playing it as all my RL friends are going to it but i dont expect to last longer than the 1st month

Originally posted by Supersoups

No we understand your post that is why find it funny. Putting 'wake up call' in title as some kind of declaration for those who are waiting for SWTOR and repeating the same old done to death 'it is just  like WOW' argument...jeeez wonder why so many are not taking your post seriously. Here is an idea, beta weekend is coming up and anyone can grab a key and try it and see it for themselves.

Do you guys remember the hype about Warhammer, Age of Conan, Rift? A cpuple months ago everyone was like " SWTOR will be the next big mmo", check the forums now, lot of ppl who played beta started to say, "it will be a good filler", "star wars fans will play it because of the sw universe", "its like wow in space". Deja Vu for me. :)

One more thing, im not a hater, never said I hate the game or themepark mmos, in fact I expected a lot from Bioware and EA and this game to be exact, just didnt happen. My problem is still the ppl who will not admit that this game should be a lot more then it turned out to be.

Bah, you're all losing sight of the truth here. I mean, seriously, how can you all fail to see the obvious solution to all of this?

Clearly, what we need is a new MMO. One that utilises an extremely popular movie / literary / previous franchise IP to draw in a wider audience, one that strips away all the flaws of previous games, process this and then pumps out a refined "equation of fun". Then, we need to blanket this product in mystery and hype, during which time we will receive million of preorders and culimate in the ultimate, groundbreaking, event-of-the-millenium release.

People, /storytelling mode.

The current media anomaly present in SW:TOR is extremely similar to that which could be seen during the pre-release times of World of Warcraft. With a few minor exceptions, WoW took the flawed plans of other games and edited and mixed it all into one grand addictive "hamster wheel" formula which was scientifically proven to work (google "Skinner Box" - its a pretty 'interesting' science experiment).

However, I am afraid that it seems this anomaly can only work once. The whole concept of WoW Clone originated due to the fact that other companies, upon seeing WoW's success, not only tried to replicate this profit with smaller budgets and less polish, but basically tried to refine a refinement.

Lets look at Mathematics for our example: once you have reached the simplest form of a fraction (eg. 2/8 to 1/4], you cannot break it down into a simpler whole solution. You can break it down into decimals, but that's another mathematical sector.

The point is, EA and Bioware, despite having massive budgets and advanced technology and personell, are falling for the same catch as others have before them: they are trying to recreate and add their own personal flair to an equation that has already been perfected and used to its end - like a lifeguard trying to give CPR to a guy who's been dead for a month, if you will.

I see tons of people on this website putting this quote in their signatures, wearing it like a badge of dedication and pride -

"And if [new MMO's] break any of the WoW rules, in my book that's pretty dumb"
--Bioware Founder--

How does this make your arguments any more valid, concerning the uniqueness and innovation of TOR? If anything, this quote, coming from Bioware's FOUNDER, simply solidifies the above case: they are putting all their resources towards trying to resurrect a marketing and design strategy which has even begun to fail for the people who created it. (Blizzard itself has stated it is designing Titan to overcome WoW, and believe me, it will. Blizzard has its own legions, Bioware fans).

I also see many people in this article trying to bring the concepts of "Asian ports" and Guild Wars 2 into this discussion. The OP never stated those as the main topics of his post. They were simply comparisions: trying to draw attention away from the main topics does not paint you in a good light, flame generals.

All of you are missing one key fact: many SWTOR promoters consistently state that the opinion of someone is instantly worthless if they have not played as a Beta Tester. This is a fallacy. As stated above, one of the pillars of SWTOR's marketing power is to draw in fans of the Star Wars IP that would not normally invest time and money into MMOs. This will be a major part of TOR's potential playerbase, and ultimately, even if their views may be slightly uninformed...

IF A CUSTOMER DOES NOT LIKE THEIR IMPRESSIONS OR INFORMATION ON A GAME, THEY WILL NOT GENERALLY BOTHER TO INVEST MONEY INTO IT. The videos, news articles and interactive website have all been constructed to try and sell the best possible image to consumers. If a person does not like the look or info of a game, then the gameplay is irrelevant: a person must have interest before they will invest in a product.

Please, my above points are valid: you simply need to look at this from an unbiased view. "The customer is always right", IS not a bulletproof concept, but if the potential customer says a game is bad, this is not a good sign. There are only so many starstruck Beta Testers and investigative gamers in the world: casuals are the key to success, and that is economic fact.

Sincerely,
Zillen