Originally posted by osmunda

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boilerplate_(text)

 A  legal boilerplate is  a standard provision in a contract. The wording of contracts needs to be very precise to stand up to legal scrutiny. Because of this some portions of common contracts (terms of service and EULAs for instance),  Such shrinkwrap contracts are seldom read and may be legally unenforcable ( Klocek v. Gateway, Inc,)  

Using the ToS without making the needed changes was lazy and sloppy, but not plagiarism. Plagiarism requires "representation of them as one's own original work".  An original work is one not received from others nor one copied based on the work of others. Standardized contract language is about as far as you can get from "original"

 

A simple google search for  "OR ONE OF ITS AUTHORIZED

REPRESENTATIVES MAY RESULT FROM FAILURE TO ABIDE BY THESE RULES. SUCH TERMINATION WILL NOT

ENTITLE YOU TO A REFUND OF ANY FEES PAID BY YOU FOR THE USE OF THE"  (the section of text between "starvault" and "EVE") pulls up these...

http://www.secondplaces.net/opencms/opencms/virtualWorlds/unifier/SPUTandC.html

http://korrova.com/terms_of_use

http://apps.facebook.com/money_laundry/terms.php

http://www.wearevixen.com/hive/?page_id=215

 

The most egregious of these is Second place, who are "specialists in creating interactive virtual presences for our clients on virtual platforms such as OpenSIM, Unity and Second Life."

 

YOU ACKNOWLEDGE THAT TERMINATION OF YOUR USER ACCOUNT BY SECOND PLACES OR ONE OF ITS AUTHORIZED REPRESENTATIVES MAY RESULT FROM FAILURE TO ABIDE BY THESE RULES. SUCH TERMINATION WILL NOT ENTITLE YOU TO A REFUND OF ANY FEES PAID BY YOU FOR THE USE OF THE SERVICE, SERVERS OR WEB SITE. YOU WILL FORFEIT ANY UNUSED TIME REMAINING AT THE TIME OF TERMINATION.

YOU AGREE THAT THESE RULES WILL APPLY TO ANYONE THAT YOU GRANT PERMISSION TO ACCESS YOUR EVE ONLINE ACCOUNT OR USER INFORMATION. YOU AGREE THAT YOU WILL BE HELD PERSONALLY RESPONSIBLE FOR THE CONSEQUENCES (WHICH CAN INCLUDE ACCOUNT TERMINATION) THAT MAY RESULT IF ANY SUCH PERSON BREAKS THE RULES DESCRIBED HEREIN.

So it's not just SV that has that "Eve Online" language in their TOS, Second Places does as well. Sounds like it's not really SV's fault but whatever lawyer or company that is feeding the contract documentation to both them and Second Places.

This news was major lulz, the thread got irritating with the plagiarism debate but picked up with the bloke who earnestly proposed that the person drafting the TOS was 'thinking about EVE Online at the time' (ROLF)

The icing on the cake was the redraft with the original date.

Originally posted by Xexv

This news was major lulz, the thread got irritating with the plagiarism debate but picked up with the bloke who earnestly proposed that the person drafting the TOS was 'thinking about EVE Online at the time' (ROLF)

The icing on the cake was the redraft with the original date.

I concur!

Less internet lawyer stuff and more lulz!!

Hopefully it's only the EULA they cut and past, dont let them get their hands on CCP employee pay check, SV might soon get new employes on their payroll....

Originally posted by Slapshot1188

The more I think about this... the more things make sense.

 

We all know that there are many instances where "banned" people are back playing again.   We all know that SV is in need of money.   Are we therefore making a false assumption that this was unintended?  I mean... in their world (which has only the faintest resemblance to reality) is it not possible that they thought it was a good idea to ban peoples account in OTHER games?  This would presumably A) Punish the cheater B) Retain revenue for StarVault C) Deprive a competitor of funds...

 

Maybe they sat around and actually congratulated themselves on coming up with a win-win-win scenario....

 

 

 

 

 

I wonder if they've had an office pool running of how long it would take someone to notice it.

Just when you think you had seen it all.

Pretty damn funny.

CCPs response:

CCP Manifest wrote:

We shot them (the company that makes it) this message.

---
Star Vault:

We here at CCP couldn’t help but notice that our expert wordsmithing, legal poetry and cunning turns of phrase have been emulated with sincerest flattery by your technical writing and/or legal staff. In fact, ardent fans of our EULA have surfaced, themselves noticing your homage to our work. See their assessment here: http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/11/09/mortal-online-plagiarizes-eve-onlines-terms-of-service/

EVE Online is a notoriously dangerous universe. So we have to caution you -- in fact, we demand that you don’t follow our footsteps or use our copyrighted work. After all, internet spaceships are serious business, so probably best to keep our internet spaceship business out of your business language. Please stop using our legal agreements, and kindly remove our name from your website.

---
What are people going to copy next... our spreadsheets?!

Originally posted by Jowen

CCPs response:

CCP Manifest wrote:

We shot them (the company that makes it) this message.

---
Star Vault:

We here at CCP couldn’t help but notice that our expert wordsmithing, legal poetry and cunning turns of phrase have been emulated with sincerest flattery by your technical writing and/or legal staff. In fact, ardent fans of our EULA have surfaced, themselves noticing your homage to our work. See their assessment here: http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/11/09/mortal-online-plagiarizes-eve-onlines-terms-of-service/

EVE Online is a notoriously dangerous universe. So we have to caution you -- in fact, we demand that you don’t follow our footsteps or use our copyrighted work. After all, internet spaceships are serious business, so probably best to keep our internet spaceship business out of your business language. Please stop using our legal agreements, and kindly remove our name from your website.

---
What are people going to copy next... our spreadsheets?!

LOLz-

Great response- I guess it WAS copyright infringment...Or is CCP lying as well?

Its like everyone is lying and picking on poor MO BUT the fanboys...They are the only ones telling the truth. The rest of us just are not "hardcore" enough- Even CCP.

Originally posted by Jowen

CCPs response:

CCP Manifest wrote:

We shot them (the company that makes it) this message.

---
Star Vault:

We here at CCP couldn’t help but notice that our expert wordsmithing, legal poetry and cunning turns of phrase have been emulated with sincerest flattery by your technical writing and/or legal staff. In fact, ardent fans of our EULA have surfaced, themselves noticing your homage to our work. See their assessment here: http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/11/09/mortal-online-plagiarizes-eve-onlines-terms-of-service/

EVE Online is a notoriously dangerous universe. So we have to caution you -- in fact, we demand that you don’t follow our footsteps or use our copyrighted work. After all, internet spaceships are serious business, so probably best to keep our internet spaceship business out of your business language. Please stop using our legal agreements, and kindly remove our name from your website.

---
What are people going to copy next... our spreadsheets?!

Lol, it's funny how belittling CCP treats SV, like a gnat on a giant.

Funny to see so many people waste so much time over something so useless as a typo from a company these same people claim is dead/dying. Damn, I even wasted 30 sec of my life on this........see ya.

Originally posted by Domesto

Funny to see so many people waste so much time over something so useless as a typo from a company these same people claim is dead/dying. Damn, I even wasted 30 sec of my life on this........see ya.

typo and copyright infringment are two seperate issues. I would explain the diff. but it would take ANOTHER 30 seconds of my life... And the whole "wasting our valuble time posting this" strategy i s funny as you commented about...Nothing at all but a gripe about what we had been commenting on.

But we are a FORUM, and we discuss MMO's so welcome and feel free to waste your time here with us anytime you want. =D

Originally posted by Jimmac

Originally posted by Picklebeast

<>

I am not going to argue semantics with you.

My definition: Copying something some else wrote and attaching your name. Not to include "ghost writing", lol.

There- I win. =)

You are arguing about mere semantics of which the definition has been given. Personally I dont care what you call it - Its amature, unprofessional, careless and inexcusable. It (like this game) is a joke. The fact they tried to censor this and now its all over MMO news sites is just the icing on the cake and very funny- Couldnt have happened to a better company.

So nobody wants to argue definitions and play internet lawyer. I am a damn Electrician/HVAC tech. I am not a lawyer and dont give a shit about arguing legal terms.

This is all for the Lulz, courtesy of SV.

I won't argue semantics either as I said I wouldn't argue over the definitions of words either. I've said multiple times it just depends on how you define it, and that if plagiarism is simply copying, then of course this is plagiarism. We both know there is more to the word than that though, and whether the real definition of plagiarism applies isn't semantics, but just simple application of a definition to a situation. The word as defined by the dictionaries above doesn't apply here though which is why no one is trying to argue that it does.

In short, this is perfectly normal copying and nothing more, but everyone here wants to use the harsher word "plagiarism" because it makes SV sound like they did worse here than they really did and it's much easier to jump on the hateraid bandwagon than to back down.

Dude... Arguing semantics and the definition of terms is practically all you've been doing in this thread. Who are you trying to kid here?

You see the word "plagiarize" come up and immediately jump to the reply button to "correct" the person using it.

You posted a definition for it in one of your earlier posts.

Post #46 is basically you addressing the thread at large to lecture them on the use of "plagiarize".

You mention there hadn't been mention of the word 'plagiarize' since post 50 (which happened to be one of yours)... and it's funny that you mention that. You hadn't posted anything to the thread since post 50 at all, until the word plagiarize came up again. Then you're back in action - once again - to argue the use of the word.

Use of the word 'plagiarize' is very clearly and quite demonstrably an issue for you, as are the semantics of it. You've repeatedly made that abundantly clear throughout this thread. And that's fine. If you want to correct people on what you perceive as the misuse of a word, more power to ya. Though, for the record, the word is not misused. Plagiarism is taking the work of others and presenting it as your own, which is precisely what SV did here. They took CCP's ToS for Eve, slapped their own name on and presented it as their own.

What you seem to be hung up on is the implications of the word rather than the word itself, which is something you apply to the word yourself. Clearly no one thinks a crime has been comitted and no one's seriously arguing that some kind of serious repercussions should follow. You're the only one who seems to be caught up on the word's implications.

Seeing you now claim that you don't want to argue something that you've been arguing non-stop throughout this thread rings just a tad disingenuous to me.

rofl at CCP's response.

Must have sucked for Henrik to get that email from the people he desperately wants to be. Ya know, actual game developers who made a working FFA PvP MMO game.

Just delicious.

Originally posted by Jowen

CCPs response:

CCP Manifest wrote:

We shot them (the company that makes it) this message.

---
Star Vault:

We here at CCP couldn’t help but notice that our expert wordsmithing, legal poetry and cunning turns of phrase have been emulated with sincerest flattery by your technical writing and/or legal staff. In fact, ardent fans of our EULA have surfaced, themselves noticing your homage to our work. See their assessment here: http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/11/09/mortal-online-plagiarizes-eve-onlines-terms-of-service/

EVE Online is a notoriously dangerous universe. So we have to caution you -- in fact, we demand that you don’t follow our footsteps or use our copyrighted work. After all, internet spaceships are serious business, so probably best to keep our internet spaceship business out of your business language. Please stop using our legal agreements, and kindly remove our name from your website.

---
What are people going to copy next... our spreadsheets?!

No love for Omali.

Stay on topic please.

It's not the first time it has happned in gaming industry. A year ago or so, don't really remember now, there was a simillar issue with other companies copy/pasting ToS/EULA. It seems to be pretty common practice, since the text is usually pretty much the same when it comes to actual legal talk, but shows how often those companies simply forget to at least put their own product name in due to lazyness. 

Makes me wonder tho, why did they choose EVE to be the one they copied from considering how many of those are "availible" on market. 

since there has been at least 3 companies with the exact same tos write up (copying eve) i beleive it likely to be the fault of which ever legal company was hired to write up the tos for them. Otherwise its one hell of a coincidence.