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News & Features Discussion  » General: Five Things to Hate About Playing Solo

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  ScribZ

Novice Member

Joined: 11/05/10
Posts: 444

Don't let your passion get in the way of your passion.

10/12/11 2:01:40 PM#21
Originally posted by Telondariel

I grouped almost exclusively in EQ1 as a wizard, until I hit the glass ceiling where the holy trinity was the most desired and wizards were only really called on for raids.  At that point I learned to solo, then I found I really enjoyed soloing.  No more waiting endlessly for groups, no more having to put up with people being dicks about loot, etc.  Sure, grouping IS fun.  I still do it from time to time.  I'd much rather dungeon crawl and explore/quest on my own time at my own pace.


None of the points pertains to me at all.  I could give a rats butt about guild fluff and when I feel chatty I chat in the open channels.  "End game" is not all about raiding for me.  I've done raids, but really, I have better things to do with my time that play the waiting game and grind and the hope that something that I could use not only drops, but I get the roll for it. 


I'm never lonely, I get to do my own thing, ..aaaaand.. I am still social, PLUS I don't have to deal with guild politics or obligations.  Win Win.


 

^^ This!

 

Been there done that, all too often, and in the end you come to realize that the game can and is fun whether or not you conform to the raiding/end game mentality. The game becomes about playing, enjoying your time in the world, socializing with your friends..not because you have to, or because they are in your guild, or on you raid team, but because you like your friends and want to socialize with them.

The "prestige'" or "perks" that comes from the conformity really isn't worth the negativety that comes along with it. Some of us do know that you can group up while your a solo player, the issue is that few on the flip side seem to understand or agree with it. To them, you can't be a soloer if your a group player, makes you wonder why they see it that way? Part of the click, or your not part of the click?

Lets look at the list of 5 shall we...

5) A perk given to people for being forced to play with others. "If you dont join a guild, you can't wear a cape." It's a nice way to design a game isnt' it? Can't get people to get together and be socialable, toss out a carrot on a stick to entice them to do it 'on thier own'.

4) A misguided belief that in order to have social interaction, people must be pushed into social groupings. THIS does however have the opposite effect more often than not. Sure, the members of a click (which is what they become), tend to eventually segregate themselves, communicating only within thier formed social groups. Ever ask someone in an MMO guild who they chat with on a regular day? Ever hear them give names of people not in thier guild? How about even 50%...30%...10%...2% of the people they chat with each day being outside thier guild? Is this because people outside guilds dont chat with anyone, or becaue the people inside the guilds never bother to TRY and communicate to anyone NOT in thier guild? Think about it...when was the last time you talked to someone outside your guild that wasn't on a Global chat channel making some stupid comment that just begged for a stupid comment in return? How about the last time you met someone out on the hunt, took a few seconds to just say hello, tell them you liked thier shoes...ANYTHING!

3) Being a lifer on LoTRO I can say I like the kin house....but I also like my own personal house as well. DO I gain much from the kin house? Really? Sure I get to place a few trophies up for my kinsmen/women to see and ask about, drop some junk I dont personally need in the kin chests for them to grab. But you know, after your a level 10 kin for several years, the house is just a cash catcher, no matter how active your kin still is, it eventually becomes a collection of old trophies gathered years ago by people who are no longer playing. Want to help you kinnies out, drop some good loot on the AH for just your kin to purchase dirt cheap (cost), do a few inspects on your kinsmen, see if they need anything crafted - craft it, and just give it to them without them even asking for it. Do you need the house 'perk'...as an officer in three level 10 kinships for over 2 years each, I can tell you without hesitation, you can definately live without the 'cool' house and still make your kinship a great group of peopel to play with. Its just another carrot on a stick. People dont join (and STAY) in a kinship just for the perks, they join and stay because of the people they play with that are in them.

2) Guild banks... this really is a nicety for guilds. But, as you mentioned LoTRO already in item number 3, you should also note that its not in that game at all, and it works perfect without it. Ok, ok, you could say the extra 1 chest in the kinship house is a form of a guild bank. BUT, I can add permissions for anyone I like to have access to the chests in my personal house the same way. If I have extra mats I want my friends to have access to, I dont need to be in a guild/kinship just to be able to do this. The point you should be making about this 'perk' is not that its a nice thing to have, but rather why the game designers wouldn't just give you the ability to do it being outside a guild/kinship like LoTRO does. Why, again, do they have to force you into social groups just to be able to do something you should be able to do anyway? People should really stop accepting that these forced social engineering tools are the way it should be, and start expecting the game designers to just give you the ability to do them without playing the game the way THEY want you to play it! Why can't I have a personal house, with a personal storage chest in it, that I have the ability to designate WHO I want to allow access to it? I mean seriously, I could to that back in DAoC, its NOT a new concept. What the new concept is, is that for some reason, you now have to be in a guild, to be able to do it??!?! Am I the only one who is wondering why?

1) Forced grouping...oh I'm sorry..I mean 'End Game Content'. Every MMORPG out there past UO has had some form of forced grouping in it. Originally it started out as a way to give those people who had mastered the rest of the games challenges, something harder to occupy thier time. Sometime after that, the game designes decided that it took less effort to program just this harder content than the entire games content. When this happened, the journey to the 'end' became a treadmill with a single objective of reaching the 'end game content'. This mythical content, really is just the game, the rest is nothing but a filler now in 95% of all MMORPGs on the market. The biggest difference though, is that this 'game' we have now is all grouped content.

I remember playing my characters in several older games where it took me months just to gain a single level. It wasn't grind either as so many like to refer to it now, it was the game. There was plenty to do along the way, and when you did reach the end, it was just more of the same content up there as it was a year earlier. Here is where it all went wrong. There is one game out there that understood this and just took the road less travelled when the change happened, Guild Wars. Thier game was built around the end game concept, but instead of forcing you to play the filler, the grind, up through endless worthless, meaningless, repetative quests to reach the REAL GAME, they just gave you the option to reach the end game and play right then. And why are they the only ones to do this you ask?? Because they were a buy to play on thier customer model. They didnt make thier money off of dragging you along for months and months and months, they made it up front on the boxes of the game and each expansion. The point here is this. this 'end game', 'forced grouping', whatever you want to call it, is the cheap and easy way for game designers to get the game out there. If they wanted a full game, they would creat a game like it used to be, with content 100% of the way up, from level 1 to infinity. RIght now they only have content at the end, the rest is a five minute hack job on the programming side, just enough to get you through to the next zone on your journey to the end.

Again though, I beg the question of why so many except this as the way it SHOULD be? Why do we, the players accept the 'easy to program' model as the way we want our games made? We have conformed to the play style they gave us. We look at the way they present the content, and then chose to push ourselves into forced social groups just to be able to play the packets of content these lazzy game designers gave us. And this acrticle here, re-efnorces these behaviors. Instead of asking why we can only have these things unless we are socially grouped...the author presended the case that we shouldn't ask why, but rather why would you not want to be forced into a social group?

Just some food for thought on the flip side here.

 

 

 

  Draeghor

Novice Member

Joined: 8/02/04
Posts: 50

10/12/11 2:05:33 PM#22

So your list basically breaks down to ... a) your not in a guild and b) you do not raid with a guild.


These are both completely false for people that do like to solo.  I can be in a guild but do my own thing. I can usually find horrific PUGs when I want to, and do not have to miss out on any of the content in any of the games I have played.  So I fail to see the relevance of the comparison of being in a Guild and Playing Solo being at opposite ends of the spectrum.  You can do both, or neither and still cover the points listed here 


  SBFord

Associate Editor - News Manager

Joined: 6/28/10
Posts: 16018

 
OP  10/12/11 2:48:38 PM#23

Actually, my article boils down to: 1) I'm not in a guild by choice though there are some obvious, though small, advantages. 2) I still solo 99.9% of the time. 3) I still don't raid or do dungeons, again by choice.


But I felt I had to come up with something for the anti-soloing crowd. :P


j/k Everyone! :D


Associate Editor: MMORPG.com
Follow me on Twitter: @MMORPGMom

  someforumguy

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/25/07
Posts: 3588

10/12/11 2:55:04 PM#24

Odd list. The only thing I usually encounter on an unguilded toon is the lack of guild storage. All the other points are heavily depending on what MMO I play. 


Also I usually get to know the game before joining a guild. By then I already have made some new contacts to group up with that have a similar playstyle as me.(I dont like random PUGs). Also a guild doesnt guarantee that. After joining them, you still have to get to know them and it can turn out that they dont really share your playstyle.


In some games I prefer to solo most of the time, especially if I like the exploring or crafting in that game. But guilded or unguilded, I always build a friendslist and those are the ppl I play with most of the time.


  Rinna

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/25/04
Posts: 390

10/12/11 3:08:34 PM#25

I like playing solo because of the freedom.  Nobody is waiting on me if I decide I need to go grab a drink, pee or just zone out and watch something that caught my eye on TV.  I have the most fun, however, in a group of close friends.  People that I've gamed with for 6 years now that I get together with and we just do a variety of things together, in vent, and have fun.  

Guilds for the most part, are a huge pain in the ass unless they are small.  There's always at least one loot whoring greedy motherplucker, one epeen swinging, no real life having, social misfit who won't shut up in vent and one guild drama attention slurping pig that needs to tell everyone in guild how terrible her relationship with her husband or boyfriend is, singing all of the guildgeeks into a hormone spewing crescendo of a witchhunt where they all want her significant others head on a pike.

By not doing dungeons or raids, you do miss out on some pretty neat game content.  I'm happy that Rift found a creative alternative to let solo players see some of the additional content without making them group up with 25 people.

 

No bitchers.

  Gravarg

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 8/24/06
Posts: 3336

10/12/11 3:12:00 PM#26

I don't get how people can play MMOs solo.  It's boring as heck.  I am almost never solo in any game I play, and I tend to play with friends that I've played other games with, so we know each other well.  You can take just about any horrible game, add a friend grouping with you and it's at least 10x better.  I don't know how soloers do it.


  Madimorga

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/26/10
Posts: 2022

10/12/11 3:55:38 PM#27

Wading into this topic is like walking under a bridge covered in billygoat blood and calling, "Here, troll troll troll!"  There is definitely a war going on between the soloer and the social crowd.  I have too much fun picking on the 'sociopathic butterflies' sometimes myself.


Although I doubt most of us are as antisocial as we come off in this thread.  I like MMOs because I like the random chatter of general chat (ok, sometimes), I like to run dungeons with other people (just not the same dungeon, over and over), and I like pvp (including interacting with my own side).  In fact, I like MMOs, not single player games.  It's just hard for me (and maybe for a lot of us) to find that middle ground where we don't feel harassed into socializing but where we also have lots of opportunity to be social when we want to be so we can avoid talking to ourselves! 


 


 


I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.

~Albert Einstein

  ScribZ

Novice Member

Joined: 11/05/10
Posts: 444

Don't let your passion get in the way of your passion.

10/12/11 4:15:07 PM#28
Originally posted by Madimorga

Wading into this topic is like walking under a bridge covered in billygoat blood and calling, "Here, troll troll troll!"  There is definitely a war going on between the soloer and the social crowd.  I have too much fun picking on the 'sociopathic butterflies' sometimes myself.


Although I doubt most of us are as antisocial as we come off in this thread.  I like MMOs because I like the random chatter of general chat (ok, sometimes), I like to run dungeons with other people (just not the same dungeon, over and over), and I like pvp (including interacting with my own side).  In fact, I like MMOs, not single player games.  It's just hard for me (and maybe for a lot of us) to find that middle ground where we don't feel harassed into socializing but where we also have lots of opportunity to be social when we want to be so we can avoid talking to ourselves! 


 


 

I dont know as if I would go so far as to say soloers are antisocial. Not saying anything bad about those who prefer the social aspect of MMORPGs either.

Here, do this, read SBFord's OP here and the one she made a couple weeks ago on the flip of the same topic. And tell me that all 10 points dont fall under the personal concern for social acceptance or the fear of feeling socially inept.

The differencse most of us commenting here are pointing out aren't because we are antisocial, its that most of us have no need for social acceptance, and very little fear of being seen as socially inept. You take those two things away, and both articles become more an 'umm what?!?!' than an 'oh yeah, I see what your saying'.

The error is in the belief that those who prefer to solo are those who are antsocial, which isnt true. Understand that, and you break down so many walls regarding the conversation of group/solo play.

  Icewhite

Made History

Joined: 7/11/11
Posts: 6496

Pink, it's like red but not quite.

10/12/11 4:33:02 PM#29
Originally posted by ScribZ
The error is in the belief that those who prefer to solo are those who are antsocial, which isnt true. Understand that, and you break down so many walls regarding the conversation of group/solo play.

Well, that's pretty difficult to state either; human personalities rarely remain stable indefinitely.

I've been known to log on feeling...er, growly, grumpy, mean as a snake...and spend a day, a week, a month avoiding other people as completely as possible, level a fresh alt or something.  Then I'll cycle back to the social side and look for ways to engage others, level with a bud, do some raiding, just hang out.

I couldn't see doing either to the full exclusion of the other.  Even when I was raiding very seriously, I'd find some sanity time (usually on the stealth-alt) to just solo a bit.

 

I can tell you my purely unscientific, empirical conclusion from watching a lot of message boards over a lot of years--

Soloers burn out on new games faster.

Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  Madimorga

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/26/10
Posts: 2022

10/12/11 4:34:23 PM#30

Originally posted by ScribZ


Originally posted by Madimorga


Wading into this topic is like walking under a bridge covered in billygoat blood and calling, "Here, troll troll troll!"  There is definitely a war going on between the soloer and the social crowd.  I have too much fun picking on the 'sociopathic butterflies' sometimes myself.




Although I doubt most of us are as antisocial as we come off in this thread.  I like MMOs because I like the random chatter of general chat (ok, sometimes), I like to run dungeons with other people (just not the same dungeon, over and over), and I like pvp (including interacting with my own side).  In fact, I like MMOs, not single player games.  It's just hard for me (and maybe for a lot of us) to find that middle ground where we don't feel harassed into socializing but where we also have lots of opportunity to be social when we want to be so we can avoid talking to ourselves! 




 




 



I dont know as if I would go so far as to say soloers are antisocial. Not saying anything bad about those who prefer the social aspect of MMORPGs either.


Here, do this, read SBFord's OP here and the one she made a couple weeks ago on the flip of the same topic. And tell me that all 10 points dont fall under the personal concern for social acceptance or the fear of feeling socially inept.


The differencse most of us commenting here are pointing out aren't because we are antisocial, its that most of us have no need for social acceptance, and very little fear of being seen as socially inept. You take those two things away, and both articles become more an 'umm what?!?!' than an 'oh yeah, I see what your saying'.


The error is in the belief that those who prefer to solo are those who are antsocial, which isnt true. Understand that, and you break down so many walls regarding the conversation of group/solo play.



 


Oh I'm not nearly as wound up about it as I must have come off in that post.  I just know the whole subject tends to get people snipping at each other a little bit.  But that just means it matters to us, and articles on what matters to us are a good thing. 


 


I read both articles, too.  To me, the first one speaks a lot about freedom, when to play, how long to play, what to do in game, and of course convenience.  Not having to share the loot or make smalltalk when you really don't feel like it is convenient, you gotta admit.  The second one lists a lot of avoidable woes, too.  Why do developers put so many restrictions on solo players when it comes to inventory, end game content, housing, and even appearance?  Even though I'll take a dig at social butterflies who gripe about soloers sometimes, the people I'm really pissed at aren't the players, they're the ones making the games.  I'm stubborn anyway, and anyone who tries to get me to do what I don't want to do better be paying me, and not the other way around.


I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.

~Albert Einstein

  elocke

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/15/04
Posts: 4221

10/12/11 4:47:58 PM#31
Originally posted by Gravarg

I don't get how people can play MMOs solo.  It's boring as heck.  I am almost never solo in any game I play, and I tend to play with friends that I've played other games with, so we know each other well.  You can take just about any horrible game, add a friend grouping with you and it's at least 10x better.  I don't know how soloers do it.

The same way you read a book by yourself or watch a movie/tv.  The same way you drive your car or ride a bike by yourself.  That's how.  As with the things I mentioned, they can be done with others too, just like MMORPGs.  So just because we say we are solo players, doesn't mean we don't group at all or ever.  We just prefer to drive the car listening to our music singing at the top of our lungs because no one is in the car with me to get all wierd about it. 

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  opposedcrow

Novice Member

Joined: 9/26/11
Posts: 55

10/12/11 5:20:18 PM#32

Eh...Having a cape in GW isn't really a big deal for me, I actually find it kind of odd when guilds advertise the popular "gold trim" of their capes (some sort of status symbol for guilds, I have no idea how one goes about getting it) when they're recruiting.


I roleplay a lot so not having anyone to talk to isn't really an issue either and the only MMO I've ever played that had guild housing was LoTRO and even then it was just a slightly bigger version of the house I bought for myself. Guild storage is, again, something I've never really used frequently so again not an issue.


The only MMO's I've ever made it to endgame in are WoW and Guild Wars and really the only activity that's been mostly closed off for me was raiding but with the new raid finder in WoW's 4.3 patch that won't be an issue anymore.


But hey, different strokes for different folks I guess.


  VoxTrooper

Novice Member

Joined: 5/12/11
Posts: 92

10/12/11 5:49:55 PM#33

 90% of the time i played solo from my guild. Only got together so i could tank dungeons or raids; i was in a guild but played solo. Most MMOs content is anti-party oriented. I prefer to keep my XP to good levels and be accompanied by music than lose XP just so some random dick from my guild can slow me down.



 

It is best for the industry the MMO throne remains an dusty empty seat never to be filled.

  fallenlords

Novice Member

Joined: 5/16/10
Posts: 700

10/12/11 6:41:31 PM#34

If the game has anything about it overall then it will place people together through circumstance.   That is where good game design comes into play.  


 


If you have to think about grouping or send out messages in global chat for people to group. Then to my mind a multiplayer game has already failed.  In essence you shouldn't be soloing an MMO.   If you are, then why waste your time and money? Buy a single player game with lots of additional content.  It makes next to no sense to play an MMO as a single player.


  DrSpanky

Novice Member

Joined: 5/26/07
Posts: 346

"my favorite thing is a Gyro"--Malibu Dan

10/12/11 9:56:51 PM#35

Was going to comment on the "inane chat" part in your previous piece that was linked...then I realized it was a month old. So I guess I'll do it here.

I like to play solo, but I do like to have guild chat full of folks chatting away. Sometimes I pay attention to it, some times I don't, but it makes me feel like I'm not alone in the world...even though I play mostly that way. Weird, I guess.

It's a proven historical fact that beer saved humankind.

  DrSpanky

Novice Member

Joined: 5/26/07
Posts: 346

"my favorite thing is a Gyro"--Malibu Dan

10/12/11 10:16:21 PM#36
Originally posted by elocke
Originally posted by Gravarg

I don't get how people can play MMOs solo.  It's boring as heck.  I am almost never solo in any game I play, and I tend to play with friends that I've played other games with, so we know each other well.  You can take just about any horrible game, add a friend grouping with you and it's at least 10x better.  I don't know how soloers do it.

The same way you read a book by yourself or watch a movie/tv.  The same way you drive your car or ride a bike by yourself.  That's how.  As with the things I mentioned, they can be done with others too, just like MMORPGs.  So just because we say we are solo players, doesn't mean we don't group at all or ever.  We just prefer to drive the car listening to our music singing at the top of our lungs because no one is in the car with me to get all wierd about it. 

hehe...well said. Completely agree.

It's a proven historical fact that beer saved humankind.

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 18395

10/12/11 10:18:00 PM#37
Originally posted by elocke
Originally posted by Gravarg

I don't get how people can play MMOs solo.  It's boring as heck.  I am almost never solo in any game I play, and I tend to play with friends that I've played other games with, so we know each other well.  You can take just about any horrible game, add a friend grouping with you and it's at least 10x better.  I don't know how soloers do it.

The same way you read a book by yourself or watch a movie/tv.  The same way you drive your car or ride a bike by yourself.  That's how.  As with the things I mentioned, they can be done with others too, just like MMORPGs.  So just because we say we are solo players, doesn't mean we don't group at all or ever.  We just prefer to drive the car listening to our music singing at the top of our lungs because no one is in the car with me to get all wierd about it. 

Pretty much this.

  Fishmitts

Novice Member

Joined: 12/17/09
Posts: 239

10/13/11 1:07:22 AM#38















 






















 










 




 

  Scot

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/10/03
Posts: 5698

10/13/11 4:00:34 AM#39

If you play solo you will be one of the first to arrive and one of the first to leave. Soloers are hot on the next best thing but have a very limited understanding of the concept that playing with your mates is better than playing for a month and then moving on to the next best thing (again).

  User Deleted
10/13/11 9:14:49 AM#40

Originally posted by Scot

If you play solo you will be one of the first to arrive and one of the first to leave. Soloers are hot on the next best thing but have a very limited understanding of the concept that playing with your mates is better than playing for a month and then moving on to the next best thing (again).



 


Phew!  Next time you decide to pull something out of your butt, don't.


There are a peppering of highly uninformed opinions in this thread regarding who a soloer is and what they do.  I find the ones that are way out in left field about this playstyle are just trolling, while others simply refuse to listen or understand what they are being told by the soloers themselves. 


Most importantly, and sadly, is the strongly negative attitude toward soloers by these people.  Its like its a personal affront to something deeply personal, like the whole "If your a Mormon you're a..cultist.. (spits in disgust) " thing floating around in American politics right now.  Some people don't understand, while others refuse to understand and get up in arms to defend their playstyle. 


The level of defensive, blind ignorance is appalling. 




  • Yes we are social


  • No, we'd rather not play a single player console/PC game.  We like being in a multi-player environment


  • Yes, we contribute to the economy through AH sales, crafting for the community, etc


  • Being guilded does not guarantee a playstyle of always grouping up or soloing.  It is simply a sub-community within the game made up of the same people out in the wider gaming world


  • Although there are some "pure" soloists, most people who solo will group occasionally


  • People who solo tend to have more real life demands that can take them away from the computer at a moments notice.  Its more a point of consideration to a potential group to not sign up for a 3 hour dungeon crawl/xp run and then have to AFK all the time


Just because our playstyle differs from yours doesn't mean its wrong.


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