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News & Features Discussion  » Star Wars: The Old Republic: Sex & Games & Rolling Dice

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241 posts found
  Distopia2

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/03/11
Posts: 601

"I''ve got a badge, what do you got"

8/25/11 1:57:40 PM#121

I look at it like this, Bioware/EA didn't shy away from this in other games. They were of the single player variety though and original IP's. I can think of a ton of reasons why they may be avoiding it here. First and foremost the subject matter. WHile it may exist in the EU it's not something you hear a whole lot of in Star Wars mythos. They could have just felt it wasn't appropriate or worth the budget to include.

Second reason the online nature of the game, and what that brings with it. They won't even allow the two sides to converse in open chat. They're worried about the maturity factor there, why wouldn't they be worried about that in other areas?

There are more of course, but i think these two causes are the most likley.

To SB fans, please stop making our demographic look bad.Stop invading threads that have nothing to do with sandboxes.

SW:TOR Graphics Evolution and Comparison

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  Ozmodan

Elite Member

Joined: 2/27/07
Posts: 6597

8/25/11 2:06:28 PM#122

Don't want to step on anyone's toes here, but it is a game, either you like their rules and play it, or don't like them and don't play it.  Personally, if you have to have a sexual relationship of any sort in a game, you have greater issues than discussing this silly issue.

And anyone asking why this is inappropriate for kids probably should not be playing this game if you have trouble figuring that out. 

  Hicks2006

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/03/06
Posts: 44

8/25/11 2:12:07 PM#123

you do know not everyone who will look for a relationship in a game has relationship issues in real life. i have a loving boyfriend and both of us look for male partners in game all the time. Whats wrong with it? nothing its merely enhance the individual players gameplay experience. If a game doesnt have homosexual npc relations big woop ill find another player. most likely my boyfriend but if i find another male player whos into homosexual RP by all means ill play along. What a player does with his time in a game should not be important to any of you. What you should worry about is how to make your own gaming experience a great one. To worry about others is just plain stupid. unless they are your real life friends or a close friend in game.

  augustgrace

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/29/06
Posts: 628

8/25/11 2:27:00 PM#124

There are a number of players you might be responsible for this decision-


Bioware- Unlikely given their past support for their gay players 


EA- Possible but then again this is the same company that hired actors to protest Dante's Inferno.  EA hasn't been one to shy away from controversy or raising a rucus to get attention.  On the other hand EA needs a big win.  John Riccitiello the CEO of EA put a lot of eggs in the WAR basket and that didn't turn out well.  Add in some other failures under his tenure, and you have a guy that is on the verge of losing his job.  Riccitiello needs a big win and he might be willing to make a decision that offends a small group of people to please the larger group, might even get some press over the decision.


Lucas- Look at the newer trilogy and The Clone Wars, Lucas is heavily marketing Star Wars to the youth.  He doesn't seem to care much about older fans or giving his own creation justice, he just wants that money.  


Player demographics- Gay players make up a very small portion of the gaming community.  If companies aren't willing to cater specifically to women why would they bother with another minority group?  It's all about pleasing the larger segment which is primarily straight males, thus the continuation of the chain mail bikini in its many forms.


  Shodanas

Elite Member

Joined: 1/05/10
Posts: 646

8/25/11 2:38:30 PM#125
Originally posted by Leoghan
Originally posted by Corehaven
Originally posted by Leoghan
Originally posted by Corehaven 

Good job folks.  By ranting and raving about it not being in TOR, its highly possible you may never see it again in any other game either.  Keep it up. 

Are you for real? This is like saying in the middle of the civil right era that the Black Panthers prove that African Americans can't handle equal rights and so the minority ruined it for everyone... *rolls eyes* 

Im absolutely for real.  I'll say it again since you missed it the first time. 

 

THE OWNER of the IP may or may not allow this sort of thing associated with said IP.  Namely Star Wars.  In order to not have this happen again, Bioware may cut it out all together.  Because its NOT WORTH IT. 

 

Do you understand then in this case that Bioware has no choice not to include it?  Because Lucas Arts will not clear it?  There fore they have to put up with the flak?  Therefore?  Not worth it. 

 

This is happening because in past games that were solely the IP of Bioware, they could do it.  But in future games, they may partner with another IP that does NOT allow it.  So?  Eliminate future precidence so this doesnt happen twice. 

Does that not make sense to you?  Comparing it to a race issue does not relate in any way shape or form.  *rolls eyes* 

Once again... Lucas Arts has approved homosexuals in their IP before 

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Goran_Beviin

 

"Beviin was known as something of a traditionalist, and used old-fashioned equipment, including highly illegalcrushgaunts,[1] and beskar armor that was colored blue.[4] Beviin was homosexual, and settled down with his partner, Medrit Vasur, some time before 24 ABY.[1] The couple went on to adopt a daughter, Dinua Jeban. Beviin was a family man and was welcoming of guests on his farm.[2] Boba Fett thought of Beviin as all heart and courage, and not afraid of the pain of love.[3] He was the closest the anti-social Fett had to a friend.[2] Fett thought that Beviin would make a good Mandalore, but Beviin did not want to lead, and would rather stay on his farm.[5]Beviin held a deep hatred for the Yuuzhan Vong, and advocated killing every one. Beviin also held a dislike for the Jedi, and described Kubariet as "the only Jedi I've ever trusted."[3]"

Having homosexual references in a book is far away from allowing them into an MMO game or a movie accessed by millions of people. Judging from Bioware's approach in ME and DA regarding this matter i am pretty sure that Lucas Arts gave them a red light about homosexual relations in TOR.

  teakbois

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/06/06
Posts: 2190

8/25/11 2:52:48 PM#126

Originally posted by Ozmodan



  Personally, if you have to have a sexual relationship of any sort in a game, you have greater issues than discussing this silly issue.


And anyone asking why this is inappropriate for kids probably should not be playing this game if you have trouble figuring that out. 



 


1.  Were not talking 'sexual relationship'.  Just a relationship.


2.  Relationships involving two people of the same gender are 100% appropriate for kids.  Its not like SWTOR would be their only exposure to it.  Get with the times is the appropriate phrase here.


  SithtiS

Novice Member

Joined: 1/31/05
Posts: 14

I will Survive

8/25/11 3:48:38 PM#127

I can understand Bioware choice


People on the internet can be so mean its crazy


Imagine 2 guy kissing emo and flirting and all... all the homophobe would start picking on them with things like "fucking gays, you like licking shit" blah blah blah and so on... the fight it could result woulb be crazy and Bioware would spend a lots of time dealing with that shit


 


So they are playing safe to keep some nasty mouth from doing their thing and poison the entire game


 


Still i would have love some girl on girl show but meh whatever 


  PTED

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/31/04
Posts: 452

8/25/11 4:00:42 PM#128

Hey look, R&P is back!



Either have both or leave them out entirely.

Only the Sith deal in absolutes...

Honestly though, who gives a damn?

Don't like what's on offer? Don't go through the content.

You were never forced into any sort of relationship in other Bioware games; you needn't think you'll be forced into having one now.

  SlothnChunk

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/17/11
Posts: 440

8/25/11 4:01:19 PM#129

I would leave out all sexuality. I can't name a single MMO where these relationships have added anything of value to the MMO.


  Isawa

Novice Member

Joined: 6/20/08
Posts: 1066

8/25/11 4:18:42 PM#130

Well if I am going to RP / Lore my main Jedi Consular, I am best to avoid these relationships with npcs (sounds like Dark Side temptation points) as well as other characters.


On the other hand, I'll be having an Imperial Agent and the npc aspect could be quite interesting.


Overall, I'm an advocate for if you need relationships in a game, form them with other players like all other mmos. I woulnd't be surprised if Bioware did ask this question years back, and the word came down from George Lucas quite clearly 'No".


MMOs with multiple player options already have species w/ species relationships, as will TOR...that's a significantly differant step in itself.


  mirkrim

Novice Member

Joined: 3/12/04
Posts: 69

8/25/11 4:27:17 PM#131

I agree with the OP's statement that there are "bigger fish to fry".  Honestly, romancing companions is a very tangential part of the game... even space combat is more significant from an overall perspective.


  redpins

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/29/11
Posts: 147

People simply can't create fun for themselves!

8/25/11 4:32:16 PM#132

Why is everyone saying homosexuality is acceptable in games without actual ties in that create value? Make a logical value to being homosexual other than pleasing you with eye candy, and then ship the official document to bioware and tell them to put it in. Even with regular Heterosexuality we clearly see it doesn't add anything other than eye candy to the game. What's cattering 0.05% more to a game with just eye candy going to do? I do not support gay marriage, but I support the people, not their choices. So what? If you gave me a valid reason and system of homosexuality to place in a game other than eye candy, maybe perhaps it would innovate game mechanics or something, I'd consider putting it in. If not, go nerd rage at the wall. :P You can rage on here, but you will just prove even more of how immature you are when the dev team won't ever read your posts. Email it to them, and see if they even resond back after the first acknowledgement email.


I struggle not with life, money, emotions, and world, but against old mindsets and selves to be proven obsolete in a age and time of rapid changes. Go create fun, so you can have fun.

  Laughing-man

Elite Member

Joined: 4/23/09
Posts: 3361

I thought what I'd do is I'd pretend I was one of those Deaf-mutes.

8/25/11 4:34:08 PM#133
Originally posted by SlothnChunk

I would leave out all sexuality. I can't name a single MMO where these relationships have added anything of value to the MMO.

Agreed.

Though I don't see a reason to exlude anyone from anything when its being offered as content... so it hardly seems fair that they are being excluding of the homosexual community, which makes up on average 1 out of every 10 people.  10% of the world population is more people than there are Native Americans, or Central Americans, or Middle Easterners.  To act like these groups mater and yet some how homosexuals don't is just simply outrageous.

Equality for everyone.

edit: upon quick research if you include bi-sexuals the numbers are more like 15-16% of the world popuation, making it about equal with the percentage of white people in the world... hmm...  so If homosexual's aren't allowed an opinion, who should be allowed one?

  GMan3

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/27/10
Posts: 2239

8/25/11 4:38:16 PM#134
Originally posted by Laughing-man
Originally posted by SlothnChunk

I would leave out all sexuality. I can't name a single MMO where these relationships have added anything of value to the MMO.

Agreed.

Though I don't see a reason to exlude anyone from anything when its being offered as content... so it hardly seems fair that they are being excluding of the homosexual community, which makes up on average 1 out of every 10 people.  10% of the world population is more people than there are Native Americans, or Central Americans, or Middle Easterners.  To act like these groups mater and yet some how homosexuals don't is just simply outrageous.

Equality for everyone.

     Which is a good point, though you didn't mean to make it.  Why bother creating something for such a small demographic?  It is a waste of money in the long run.  It would be like going to the trouble of creating a system of "extreme death penalties" that people can opt out of if they want.  Why go to the trouble when so few would use it?

"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"

  dougmysticey

Novice Member

Joined: 6/25/06
Posts: 1182

8/25/11 4:38:22 PM#135
Originally posted by SlothnChunk

I would leave out all sexuality. I can't name a single MMO where these relationships have added anything of value to the MMO.

 That is only because this is the first MMO to feature a story and characters deep enough to form relationships. Its more than reading a wall of quest text, you actually have choices. You choose how you deal with companions and in some cases can end up in a romantic relationship if you choose. Never been able to do that in other traditional AAA MMOs.

They can't add value if they don't exist in the first place.

  Laughing-man

Elite Member

Joined: 4/23/09
Posts: 3361

I thought what I'd do is I'd pretend I was one of those Deaf-mutes.

8/25/11 4:42:47 PM#136
Originally posted by GMan3
Originally posted by Laughing-man
Originally posted by SlothnChunk

I would leave out all sexuality. I can't name a single MMO where these relationships have added anything of value to the MMO.

Agreed.

Though I don't see a reason to exlude anyone from anything when its being offered as content... so it hardly seems fair that they are being excluding of the homosexual community, which makes up on average 1 out of every 10 people.  10% of the world population is more people than there are Native Americans, or Central Americans, or Middle Easterners.  To act like these groups mater and yet some how homosexuals don't is just simply outrageous.

Equality for everyone.

     Which is a good point, though you didn't mean to make it.  Why bother creating something for such a small demographic?  It is a waste of money in the long run.  It would be like going to the trouble of creating a system of "extreme death penalties" that people can opt out of if they want.  Why go to the trouble when so few would use it?

Well considering they bothered to do so in their past games, several times, and many people who are straight enjoy flirting with a male elf from time to time...  I dunno it just seems silly to be exclusive when honestly it wouldn't take much work to include such a thing, as they have proven before...

Ultimately I don't see a point in having sexually related content in a star wars game...

  HighMarshal

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/24/03
Posts: 241

8/25/11 4:50:12 PM#137
As a male MMO player who tends to play mostly female characters, I can say with pride that almost all my female characters are gay!

I would be more worried about someone playing a Human character wanting to romance a Wookie (thats just wrong!) than someone romancing a same sex character.
  Hopscotch73

Tipster

Joined: 8/12/09
Posts: 972

Urgle blurgle geflurgle.
Need more coffee.

8/25/11 5:01:55 PM#138

I think the main issue with this is something that BioWare brought on themselves. When I started gaming relationships between characters in video games were surface-only plot-driving things. Then the concept of romancing characters came in. BioWare were at the frontline on this - in KOTOR there was Juhani for a female Revan to flirt with. In Jade Empire there was a male to male realtionship option. Don't ask me to remember character names, been a long time since I played it.


 


In Mass Effect the romance possibilities for female characters with their female companions was expanded upon, in DA:O there was Zevran for the guys who like guys and the freelove mod to allow women to get it on with Morrigan. DA:2 went a little OTT with Anders flinging himself at the protagonist regardless of their gender, but it had stronger LG options than any game before it.


BioWare earned themselves a very very loyal audience of gay gamers, male, female, transgender, the lot. They are a company that have consistently and loudly shrugged off any homophobic criticism of their game content.


 


For those who still don't "get it" - imagine that everything in the world around you was targetted at gay people, and there was only a small, underfunded, neglected by the mass media section of the arts dedicated to straight people. Imagine you loved playing video games as an escape from the stress of being "different" and had never ever seem a game where males could romance females or vice versa. And then one day this company that make kick-ass, massively selling games include a relationship option that fits you. If you're a teenager at this point the validation that brings is immense.


 


And then you look at their next game, and lo and behold there's more - and they even stand up publically for your right to be represented in games (and thus, by extension validating you still more). And they keep on doing it - wouldn't you just love them? Wouldn't you look forward to their next game?


 


And then they're about to launch their biggest project ever.... and they've forgotten about you. Or maybe they're done with the whole validation thing and just don't want to come out and say that in public. You don't know because they won't say why. In fact, they're not engaging with your community at all despite a firestorm raging on the web.


 


Wouldn't that feel kinda like a kick in the teeth?


 


That's what this is about - the expectations are not built on this being an MMO, they're based on BioWare's track record and the deafening silence from them on an issue they're normally happy to champion. If BioWare are bringing the romance from their SPGs to their MMO, then they should be bringing all romance. And if they aren't (well, we know they're not), then the least they can do is explain why. And they haven't done that.


 


I'm not going to get all drama llama about this, I'm just trying to help people see why this is actually more than a tempest in a teacup to a lot of people who have supported BioWare as BioWare has supported them over the past decade and change.


 


They really need to break their silence on this one.


 

  daeandor

Novice Member

Joined: 7/02/04
Posts: 3004

8/25/11 5:05:50 PM#139
Originally posted by Verterdegete
Originally posted by daeandor

Leave the sexual relationships with computer sprites out of the game.  As it has been said several times before, avoid the controversy completely by not allowing PC sexual relationships at all.  End of Story. 

 

 

Why ??? Why should they remove a feature of the game bacause 1-2% of population isn't satisfied with it ?

If they don't want the controversy, then leave both sides out.  I didn't say it was right, I said that's what they should do.  What I am saying is don't pick a side.  And please, next time, don't exclude the part of my quote which basically says what I just repeated.

  Kalafax

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/05/05
Posts: 500

8/25/11 5:07:31 PM#140

Personal Preference is a conditioned choice, theres no way to argue against it except for the ignorant who refuse to accept logic.

 

I think its rediculous that people feel "they" were left out, just because a company puts out games where they have certain features, doesnt mean all of their games should share those features, no one was ignored, or left out, or any of that stuff, simply a design decision and yet so many people take this stuff personally. If you dont like the choice, dont get the game, we dont need you making topics whining about the injustice of life.

Mess with the best, Die like the rest

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