Originally posted by DerWotan

Originally posted by LisXia

Originally posted by DerWotan

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Why is titan stupid?  What do we know about titan?  Is it a game about titans?

I failed to see why we need to hope titan to fail.  Who gains from a failed mega project?  We as gamers lose, that I am sure, as we have one less choice.

 

I know about it:

- made by Activision-Blizzard  = nickel and dime  every $ they can get

- wider audience than wow so basically even more braindead gameplay

- tons of hype and pr

so yes if mega projects like that are going to fail its good for the industry as a whole. No need for another behemoth.

Every company nikel and dime every cent they can, and few can get far, Blizzard can.  In a competitive world, this means they are offering better services to more.  Enough of the satisfied customers to let them exercise their magic.

Wider audience means a wider appeal.  If you believe that being sidelined = being special, enjoy your solitude.

Hypes and PR, only goes so far, AoC, WAR, FF14, they died soon enough, but Blizzard games never die, never once.  If I have to place my bet on you or Blizz, I have no hesitation which side to trust.  The one that never failed ever, or the one who seems only able to vent frustration.

Every mega project failed = one less choice for all of us.  If you enjoy mega project failure, it shows how poor your attitude is.  Hundreds will go unemployed, banks will have to write off loans.  No, I wish everyone a happier day tomorrow.  I wish no one doom.

Good day.

The crazy thing is that it's pretty much becoming a given that the "typical" subscription MMORPG will have less and less content built in at launch, and faster and faster leveling / advancement. The games which should be trying to keep their players longer (those dependant on subscription revenue) are providing shorter and shorter experiences, and the most lame and shallow of repetitive mechanics and game play at end game to try and keep players around. Saying that 120 hours /played is "enough" and all you were expecting flies in the face of logic. If you rely on players paying you monthly, only desiring one month worth of subscription fees is just silly.

Meanwhile, GW2, a game that doesn't rely on the longevity of individual subscriptions (at least not directly for their revenue stream) is building in a tremendous amount of depth, replayability, and flexibility to allow and encourage players to play for a longer time. Add that to all the social aspects which are built in and the nature of the various PvP rule sets...and you have a game that's likely to keep a very large (and perhaps consistently growing) population of players for a long time.

It shouldn't come as any shock, due to the above and a lot of other reasons, that GW2 is likely to be wildly successful financially, and successful in terms of the size and long-term loyalty of their player base.

Agree with the list.  I'm planning on trying both SWToR and GW2, but think GW2 will have the better gameplay in the long run.  I didn't care much for GW, but what GW2 is showing so far - looks great.  I'm surprised they're releasing it as a no sub game, honestly.

As for the others on the list:

Rift is a fun game, but they need to up the variety of things to do.  The world feels small and if it turns into an endgame grind-fest it will lose alot of subs that have done the leveling play through.  The Rifts are fun, but after awhile, meh.  It was a great game at release, but it feels almost like an PC RPG, I've played it, enjoyed it, ready for something different.

WoW is WoW, it won't be going anywhere any time soon.  If you can avoid the 'tards and trade chat, there is still things to do in game if that's your choice.

LoTRO. Just resubbed and actually enjoying this game (third time trying it).  I don't think it's for everyone as it's a bit more complicated than the average easy mode game.

AoC. I'm glad to see it's still on the list.  I do feel they screwed this up at release and have been trying to play catch up ever since, sadly.

Secret World. If they can pull this off that will be awesome.

EVE still waiting to play that. It's been sitting on the PC for ....years?

All in all, I'm glad as an MMO gamer to have the variety and options we have now.   They aren't all WoW clones, but thank goodness WoW hit when it did and is big as it is, it mainstreamed gaming, bringing in lots of $$$ so developers can make more games for us to enjoy.

How can unreleased games be on top without ppl even seeing them lol!

Originally posted by DEXA88

How can unreleased games be on top without ppl even seeing them lol!

 

Because this is more about promotion in the face of a declining industry.

Nice article, and great comments too... seemed to be more constructive discussion and less flaming than most articles.

WoW will fall from #1 next year if GW2 and TOR both have solid launches. They will steal subs from WoW... and perhaps each other... so that no one game will end up with 11 millions subs. WoW will still be making plenty of money, and maybe they'll take a few risks to test out ideas for their next MMO. But since WoW is now a cash cow, I don't expect too much risk-taking from them.

I really want TSW to be a good game.  It sounds great and promises a lot, but that's like most failed MMOs before it.  Still, if Funcom can actually launch a game in good condition, then this could be a sleeper hit as others have called it.  Still, I get the feeling that the game is going to be cramped and over-instanced or segmented and not really feel like a world.   I hope I'm wrong.

Rift: It is a good game.  It brought a few new ideas to the table but it also played it safe.  Solid game for anyone who didn't like WoW's graphics / cartoony style but were interested in the gameplay.  Rifts in the game ended up feeling less inspiring that WAR's public quests (my opinion) but region-wide events were fun even if they included closing rifts.  I believe Rift will be hurt more by GW2 and TOR than WoW, but that won't mean it will fold (WoW may lose more total subs than Rift, but it will probably still have a higher sub count than Rift).

I am looking forward to TOR for the Bioware experience and story, but I expect the most out of GW2.  I hope GW2 doesn't fail even if I personally end up not liking the game because at least they are trying new ideas.  I love the idea of no pure healer (will it really work or will a specific class build be wedged into its place?), and the dynamic quests that aren't just kill 10 of X should be fun (but will they become repetitive like closing rifts for example?)

If somehow, some way, these new games find a way to fail, I'll fall back on LotRO and maybe a month or two of Rift.  Until then, I hope the upcoming releases don't fail.  I'm ready for something new and it sounds like many of you are as well.

Hmmm not a bad list but I would have dropped maybe Aion and AoC to put in ArcheAge and Diablo 3. 2012 is going to be a good year for gaming!

To those who are concerned about WoW's #1 spot: Don't worry, Blizzard will find a way to again tweak their "subscriptions" -and will find their believers as well.

My list for the top 5 and the bottom 5 for 2012

GW2 <-----MMO changer, it's almost by itself.

SWTOR - Fully Voiced/Bioware/StarWars ( glossy eyes)

TSW - Funcom can make a great singleplayer game, but two misses on two MMO's, could  three time's a charm make this a winner for Funcom???  From what I've seen in this game so far, it looks pretty amazing, it almost feels like another studio is working on it.

WOW - a few new patches with new instances and a few character changes will keep people happy and subbing away.

Tera - more challanging approach on how you play an MMO, could be a good thing or a bad thing.

-------------------------------------------

ArcheAge - Gameplay Animation is still pretty broken and could hurt this game when it launches in NA / Europe, building system looks pretty exciting and fresh. 

RIFT -  It's like you told someone to give you some cheeto's and they give you every dried cheese snack instead and now you just have too much to work with.  Rift is okay, until you play it, that's when you realize your spending to much time thinking about your character, then actually playing it.

AOC - F2P is very limited, the game is still broken and should just be shot.  Only thing I love about this game, is the music....seriously that's it.

Aion - Bot spamming and grinding killed it for me with this game, everything else this game was pretty awesome.  I just don't really see it going higher and beating out the best of the best, but it will still do well.

LOTRO -  The game is great F2P or Sub, but doing deeds can be very boring and time consuming.  I can see veterans of the game pretty excited about the new expansion.  The game has a lot to do and maybe just too much to do.

Originally posted by VoIgore

To those who are concerned about WoW's #1 spot: Don't worry, Blizzard will find a way to again tweak their "subscriptions" -and will find their believers as well.

They define clearly their counting rules and provide official sub numbers, along with revenue and other audited statistics.  IF that is called tweaking, we can pretty much dismiss all numbers on all websites and start talking about emotions.

I think Tribes Universe is gonna make a big impact also. Kinda interested to see how that one turns out as an mmo.

While most of the games deserve to be on the list, don't expect such a big change in just 1 year.

I agree that WoW is on the decline, but its so far ahead of everyone else that it wil take more than a year or two before it losses it;s #1 slot. While GW2 may have the potential to get in the top 3, I can't see it happening next year. Things seldom change that fast.

While Secret World may get in the top 10, it won't be in the top 5. Its a niche game like Eve and I'd be surprised if it even catches up with Eve, which has seen steady growth.

While LOTRO isn't for PvP players, its a good solid MMORPG that still has a lot of life left. I'd put it around #5. I'm surprised EQ2 wasn't included as #10. Its on the decline, but still has a decent following.

STO has shown that hype alone won't sell a game. If its not a good solid game, it will just be a blip on the sales charts.

I think putting 2 games ahead of WoW is just writing an article to get attention as opposed to any kind of analytical skills.

People are shocked at the numbers it lost.  But it didnt even lose 1/10th of its population, even after a horribly received (by the player base) expansion.  And its Q2 portion of that loss was less than 3%.  Judging by population trends that show Rifts servers at high or medium population slightly less and less each week, its probably safe to say even Rift lost more than 3%.  probably the only game on this list that didnt was AoC (which is why its on this list)

So really, after a somewhat alarming q1 loss, the Q2 loss was much less severe.  This is just the first time in over 6 years WoW has had any decline.  And Blizzard is responding.  They are putting in features players have asked for, and ending Cataclysm and getting the new expansion out faster.  Now if its cataclysmesque then yes, Blizzard could be in trouble, but I am betting they are smarter than that.

But even if it is cataclysmesque, you REALLY think 2/3 of Blizzards customers will quit over it?  Because neither SWTOR or GW2 is doing 4 million.

SWTOR first.  It has a very widespread reputation of being WoW in space.  Deserved or not, the reputation is there.  Early feedback has also been mixed.  People have faith in Bioware and like the IP, but for a MMO to get 4 million out of the box its going to need major positivity from beta testers and reviews.  And it just doesnt look like its going to get that right now.  Not saying it will flop, but it needs to have reviews the likes we have never seen to get that many people to try a perceived 'WoW' clone'

GW2 has even less chance to reach that mark.  Its the one of the two games that I would more interested in, as would a lot of the MMORPG readers, but this site doesnt represent the average MMORPG gamer.  It is HEAVILY skewed towards sandbox gamers (you would think SWG was a glowing success pre-NGE if you only knew this site) and games that take risks.  But the general MMORPG population just isnt that in tune with what arenanet is doing.

Now if GW2 delivers I predict it could become the next real grower (like eq1, WoW and EvE were on different levels).  It could eventually become the #1, but it will likely take several years of positive word of mouth.

I made a list of my own a few weeks ago off the other list.  i think it was

1. WoW

2. SWToR

3. GW2

4. EVE

5. Rift

big drop off

6. AoC

7. TSW

8. EQ2

9. LOTRO

10. AION

I might move TSW up to 6th based on recent feedback on it.  I was *not* counting f2p players so LOTRO ended up low.  And it was for western subs so Aion is low.  6-10 all 150k or under I was thinking, but TSW could build up some steam.  Dont think it will get to the 300k to match where I think Rift will be, but its possible.

Tera will flop. 

Originally posted by LisXia

Originally posted by VoIgore

To those who are concerned about WoW's #1 spot: Don't worry, Blizzard will find a way to again tweak their "subscriptions" -and will find their believers as well.

They define clearly their counting rules and provide official sub numbers, along with revenue and other audited statistics.  IF that is called tweaking, we can pretty much dismiss all numbers on all websites and start talking about emotions.

Except that their definition of the term "subscriber" is so lose that everyone who logged in once in an internet cafe in Asia can be called a subscriber.  Next they'll include everyone who walks past the game's box in a store shelf.

1. SWTOR

2. Wildstar

3. Rift

4. WoW

5. GW2

6. LotRo

7. EVE

8. EQ2

9. AoC

10. Tera

Thats the order I would put it from what I have played to what I want to play most over the next year.

i love how the description about tow sounded mnmore like bashing and supporting gw2... mmorpg.com obiously dont like swtor allot  or at least is more towards gw2 :P imo both are great and im gonna buy and play both

Originally posted by Nanfoodle

1. SWTOR

2. Wildstar

3. Rift

4. WoW

5. GW2

6. LotRo

7. EVE

8. EQ2

9. AoC

10. Tera

 

Thats the order I would put it from what I have played to what I want to play most over the next year.

You must have had a damn good first impression, because there's hardly anything known about this game other than what was covered at Gamescom.

2. Wildstar

5. GW2

...this guy is soooo bad at first impressions..totally got his statistics wrong :D

Originally posted by timeraider

2. Wildstar

5. GW2

 

...this guy is soooo bad at first impressions..totally got his statistics wrong :D

 

No just sick to death of fantasy MMOs. I need a break for wizards and warriors. Been playing the same classes for 12 years. I really want to play some solid Sci-Fi MMOs.

Originally posted by Serelisk

Originally posted by Nanfoodle

1. SWTOR

2. Wildstar

3. Rift

4. WoW

5. GW2

6. LotRo

7. EVE

8. EQ2

9. AoC

10. Tera

 

Thats the order I would put it from what I have played to what I want to play most over the next year.

You must have had a damn good first impression, because there's hardly anything known about this game other than what was covered at Gamescom.