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MMORPG.com Discussion Forums

Star Wars: The Old Republic

Star Wars: The Old Republic 

General Discussion  » TOR looks rather boring... [video]

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369 posts found
  nezbel

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/20/08
Posts: 46

8/18/11 4:17:30 PM#221

@Cyberdeck7 - You indeed roll to dodge out of the way of attacks. You still select your target for single target and fire but once it is not hard locked onto the character and can be dodged to escape all damage.

  Cyberdeck7

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/14/11
Posts: 241

8/18/11 4:22:08 PM#222
Originally posted by Elikal

I mean, what did you play in the last 10 years of UO, EQ, DAoC and yes WOW, which ALL have the SAME combat, give or take? Why was that alright and now TOR suddenly is super boring? 

because, in the last 10 years of UO, EQ, DAoC and yes WOW, they ALL have the SAME combat, give or take.

  Distopia2

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/03/11
Posts: 601

"I''ve got a badge, what do you got"

8/18/11 4:24:00 PM#223
Originally posted by Cyberdeck7
Originally posted by Elikal

I mean, what did you play in the last 10 years of UO, EQ, DAoC and yes WOW, which ALL have the SAME combat, give or take? Why was that alright and now TOR suddenly is super boring? 

because, in the last 10 years of UO, EQ, DAoC and yes WOW, they ALL have the SAME combat, give or take.

Using that logic, action based combat, or FPS based combat should be just as stale....

To SB fans, please stop making our demographic look bad.Stop invading threads that have nothing to do with sandboxes.

SW:TOR Graphics Evolution and Comparison

SW:TOR Compare MMO Quests, Combat and More...

  Metentso

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 8/14/10
Posts: 1457

8/18/11 4:27:56 PM#224
Originally posted by Pigozz
Originally posted by Cyberdeck7

 Thank you for pointing that out.  There isnt one (except the 20 gw2 fanbois that are about to reply with their mind blowing videos).. /sarcasm 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lP17RfcWmFw

yeah, I just did that :P

+both low lvl content to be fair;)

Wow - now that video is a converter. I am officially excited to play this.

Do you aim your arrows? Can you do a roll dodge and create a miss, or is it still a dice roll?

Im not sure if you're sarcastic;).. but Yes, you can dodge/outrun arrows/spells/bullets or stand in the front of hurt friend to be hit instead oh fim

U dont aim tho (except AoE/Cone spells etc)

Its kinda offtopic so visit GW2 sticky for info

Why that video doesn't look boring, at least to me and at least a few more here, and the TOR vide looks boring?

I will risk a ban and say my opinion, with total honesty. I'd say that the TOR combat looks *exactly* like WOW and we are all bored of it, while the GW2 video, looks *a bit* different from WOW, and i can't exactly say why, in either case. Must be an uncunscious thing, that i hope more clever forumers can spot.

  Thorkune

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 9/28/06
Posts: 1775

Dyslexics of the world...UNTIE!

8/18/11 4:28:42 PM#225
Originally posted by Pigozz
Originally posted by Cyberdeck7

 Thank you for pointing that out.  There isnt one (except the 20 gw2 fanbois that are about to reply with their mind blowing videos).. /sarcasm 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lP17RfcWmFw

yeah, I just did that :P

+both low lvl content to be fair;)

Wow - now that video is a converter. I am officially excited to play this.

Do you aim your arrows? Can you do a roll dodge and create a miss, or is it still a dice roll?

Im not sure if you're sarcastic;).. but Yes, you can dodge/outrun arrows/spells/bullets or stand in the front of hurt friend to be hit instead oh fim

U dont aim tho (except AoE/Cone spells etc)

Its kinda offtopic so visit GW2 sticky for info

The "GW2 is nothing like I thought it would be, so I am going back to WoW" thread will be epic.

  Distopia2

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/03/11
Posts: 601

"I''ve got a badge, what do you got"

8/18/11 4:31:47 PM#226
Originally posted by Metentso
 

Why that video doesn't look boring, at least to me and at least a few more here, and the TOR vide looks boring?

I will risk a ban and say my opinion, with total honesty. I'd say that the TOR combat looks *exactly* like WOW and we are all bored of it, while the GW2 video, looks *a bit* different from WOW, and i can't exactly say why, in either case. Must be an uncunscious thing, that i hope more clever forumers can spot.

I wasn't aware that I was bored of it.

To SB fans, please stop making our demographic look bad.Stop invading threads that have nothing to do with sandboxes.

SW:TOR Graphics Evolution and Comparison

SW:TOR Compare MMO Quests, Combat and More...

  Cik_Asalin

Novice Member

Joined: 8/29/04
Posts: 3091

8/18/11 4:44:15 PM#227
I start with the requisite “I’m anticipating SW:TOR and already pre-ordered. I know I’ll enjoy the ‘journey’”
 
 
Followed by keeping expectations in-check. . .and as it relates to SW:TOR, keep that expectation in check to the tenth-power.
 
 
Regarding this video and the very apparent lack of game-play combat animations, my biggest concern, since combat and conflict consist of the majority of game-play, is just that; combat might not appear as polished in an mmo evolutionary sense, beyond its’ rudimentary animation state.  Combat animations, I would have hoped, would be more environmentally believable and animated, but appear more arcade-ish.  I can see how someone might come away with the impression that it looks static, stale, uninspiring, non-immersive and bland.
 
 
These 2 videos I watched today might reinforce that.  Whilst the player is in a conflict of battle against a foe, that players’ character is a stationary brick wall without micro animation, swinging, and then getting pelted with blows and gunfire, and there is absolutely no slight ‘character reaction’ or ‘micro physical animations’ to the characters involvement in a violent act, other than standing there like a fence-post. 
 
 
Now maybe I’m more sensitive today than I was 5 or 10 years ago about the rudimentary nature of themepark combative animations.  Maybe it’s because the character I’ve seen in these videos don’t have enough layered clothing or equipment to help enhance the illusion of their combative involvement.  Maybe combative animations and reactive response animations, those micro-animations that reflect the violent and very active state your avatar is in, might be present at higher levels; but I wouldn’t understand the rationale there.
 
 
I don’t know, but boy-oh-boy.  Okay…just taking it all in.
  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 16651

8/18/11 4:48:23 PM#228
Originally posted by Cyberdeck7
Originally posted by Elikal

I mean, what did you play in the last 10 years of UO, EQ, DAoC and yes WOW, which ALL have the SAME combat, give or take? Why was that alright and now TOR suddenly is super boring? 

because, in the last 10 years of UO, EQ, DAoC and yes WOW, they ALL have the SAME combat, give or take.

Have movies changed so much in the last 10 years?  Books certainly haven't. Same stories being told over and over and over again.

 

Music? Same key signatures, same time signatures same same same same. Honestly don't know how people can still listen to half the stuff they do. It's all the same!

  Cyberdeck7

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/14/11
Posts: 241

8/18/11 4:49:45 PM#229
Originally posted by Pigozz
 

Im not sure if you're sarcastic;).. 

not at all - I'm kind of burnt out on big promises and didn't look into it as much as I did Star Wars and I didn't care care for GW1 much at all. I'm off to the sticky to look into collision mechanics and the size of the world. Combat-wise it looks like it's getting closer to what I'm looking forward to for the future at least. Not going to preorder, but I'll be watching the forums from day 1.

I enjoy reading and writing on the forums all the time, but it seems to me the only time you get real info on performance, quality, entertainment, etc is if on release day you go to the longest, bitchiest, whiniest forum about bugs that you can find and search for Nvidia OR Radeon. Everyone will be on the same side and you'll get hits on people talking about their specs. That means they're troubleshooting and issues with your specific hardware means step back and check in a week. Then search for Timeout and follow that thread. You'll quickly find info about a game you're excited about immediately. Do the same thing at an interval and you'll know if/when you should download it.

  DLangley

Novice Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 1430

8/18/11 4:53:03 PM#230

Let's refrain from personal attacks on other users.

  MMO.Maverick

Inquisitor

Joined: 3/05/10
Posts: 7792

The middle road is the place to be!

8/18/11 4:53:50 PM#231
Originally posted by Cik_Asalin

  Regarding this video and the very apparent lack of game-play combat animations, my biggest concern, since combat and conflict consist of the majority of game-play, is just that; (snips)
 
Now maybe I’m more sensitive today than I was 5 or 10 years ago about the rudimentary nature of themepark combative animations.  Maybe it’s because the character I’ve seen in these videos don’t have enough layered clothing or equipment to help enhance the illusion of their combative involvement.  Maybe combative animations and reactive response animations, those micro-animations that reflect the violent and very active state your avatar is in, might be present at higher levels; but I wouldn’t understand the rationale there.
 

Maybe it's me, but I can't recall player characters be that reactive and responsive in other MMO's or even multiplayer shooters as well, only when you die. It could be my memory playing tricks though. In any case, I have seen reactive animations in SWTOR footage, from reacting to getting hit to blocking fire.

I still think that there's some extra fluidity lacking which I for example do see in Aion character animation (which I personally found to have the best character animation in MMO's currently around), but regarding reactive response animations, that's definitely ingame and was visible in quite some former video footage already.

The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's

The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."

  Naral

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/07/10
Posts: 735

8/18/11 5:00:05 PM#232
Originally posted by Cyberdeck7
Originally posted by Elikal

I mean, what did you play in the last 10 years of UO, EQ, DAoC and yes WOW, which ALL have the SAME combat, give or take? Why was that alright and now TOR suddenly is super boring? 

because, in the last 10 years of UO, EQ, DAoC and yes WOW, they ALL have the SAME combat, give or take.

I think your problem is personal burnout on the genre. This wont change, anymore than first person shooter mechanics will change. New features maybe added, but MMORPGs are what they are...if they fail to appeal, you might want a new genre to explore.

  Cik_Asalin

Novice Member

Joined: 8/29/04
Posts: 3091

8/18/11 5:03:31 PM#233
Originally posted by MMO.Maverick
Originally posted by Cik_Asalin

  Regarding this video and the very apparent lack of game-play combat animations, my biggest concern, since combat and conflict consist of the majority of game-play, is just that; (snips)
 
Now maybe I’m more sensitive today than I was 5 or 10 years ago about the rudimentary nature of themepark combative animations.  Maybe it’s because the character I’ve seen in these videos don’t have enough layered clothing or equipment to help enhance the illusion of their combative involvement.  Maybe combative animations and reactive response animations, those micro-animations that reflect the violent and very active state your avatar is in, might be present at higher levels; but I wouldn’t understand the rationale there.
 

Maybe it's me, but I can't recall player characters be that reactive and responsive in other MMO's or even multiplayer shooters as well, only when you die. It could be my memory playing tricks though. In any case, I have seen reactive animations in SWTOR footage, from reacting to getting hit to blocking fire.

I still think that there's some extra fluidity lacking which I for example do see in Aion character animation (which I personally found to have the best character animation in MMO's currently around), but regarding reactive response animations, that's definitely ingame and was visible in quite some former video footage already.

I think your right.  I'm not gonna get caught-up in all this.  I intend to enjoy the game from the onset, and look forward to seeing more of that fluidity and reactive animations that help me feel as though I'm getting pulled into the role of my avatar.

  Cyberdeck7

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/14/11
Posts: 241

8/18/11 5:34:12 PM#234
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by Cyberdeck7
Originally posted by Elikal

I mean, what did you play in the last 10 years of UO, EQ, DAoC and yes WOW, which ALL have the SAME combat, give or take? Why was that alright and now TOR suddenly is super boring? 

because, in the last 10 years of UO, EQ, DAoC and yes WOW, they ALL have the SAME combat, give or take.

Have movies changed so much in the last 10 years?

Do the computer animated movies like Cars, Shreck and The 'oops we crossed uncanny valley' Polar Express count?

Books certainly haven't.

Kindle, Nook, iOS, Android. You can carry several thousand reference books everywhere, whatever your job.

>>>>>>>>>>>Same stories being told over and over and over again.

Psychology and the understanding of the human condition have changed dramatically. Of course books have changed in the past ten years, books are a form of art. Art is a reflection of society or offers a perspective on society. In the past ten years they've reflected changing attitudes on things from "I have two Mommies" to the flood of big pharma injected into our culture. There isn't anything about art that isn't affected by a changing society - it's human expression.

>>>>>>>>>> Music? Same key signatures, same time signatures same same same same.

Absolutely wrong. The acceptability of dissonance to the human ear has changed dramatically from the time of Beethovan to the reign of Jimi Hendrix. It's still changing. As with books, music is art and is affected by the society we live in. Off the top of my head in the past ten years we've gone from stations changing Petty's "roll another joint" to "hit another joint" (ROFLMAO) through to really sexually graphic songs on mainstream pop stations. Technology has introduced brand new guitar sounds, new ways to learn music and a delivery system that allows us to hear many many more voices without the filtering of recording subsidiaries of news corporations.

>>>>>>>>> Honestly don't know how people can still play half the stuff they do. It's all the same!  FIFY

  bleed0range

Novice Member

Joined: 9/15/09
Posts: 110

8/18/11 5:36:37 PM#235

You know what, I'm getting really tired of everyone comparing this game to WOW.  Or every freaking game on this site to WOW.  It's not my fault you all played WOW for so long that you have become incredibly disgusted and off-put by it's design.  It's not my fault that you once obviously liked WOW enough to play it long enough to become sick of it.

Not all of us have played WOW.  I never did really, so I don't feel like comparing every game to it.  It has a lot of players, that doesn't make it the best game to compare it to.  It's not the worst game either, because so many people have played it and enjoyed it at least for awhile... so stop acting like it is.

It's just vomit inducing to see time and time again the WOW debate.  I'm sorry, I'm ranting... I'll go now haha. 

 

  Isawa

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/20/08
Posts: 1065

8/18/11 5:36:43 PM#236

Does anyone remember the fan response video here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUYACSSHCLY

and how that first guy said "maybe a little more quest help"...that led me to believe that there were not yellow lines directing you across the maps and to enemy zones. Is this a recently added feature, or is it observable in other videos? I don't recall, as this time it was actually discussed.

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 16651

8/18/11 5:55:35 PM#237
Originally posted by Cyberdeck7
Originally posted by Sovrath

because, in the last 10 years of UO, EQ, DAoC and yes WOW, they ALL have the SAME combat, give or take.

Have movies changed so much in the last 10 years?

Do the computer animated movies like Cars, Shreck and The 'oops we crossed uncanny valley' Polar Express count?

Books certainly haven't.

Kindle, Nook, iOS, Android. You can carry several thousand reference books everywhere, whatever your job.

>>>>>>>>>>>Same stories being told over and over and over again.

Psychology and the understanding of the human condition have changed dramatically. Of course books have changed in the past ten years, books are a form of art. Art is a reflection of society or offers a perpective on society. In the past ten years they've reflected changing attitudes on things from "I have two Mommies" to the flood of big pharma injected into our culture. There isn't anything about art that isn't affected by a changing society - it's human expression.

>>>>>>>>>> Music? Same key signatures, same time signatures same same same same.

Absolutely wrong. The acceptability of dissonance to the human ear has changed dramatically from the time of Bethovan to the reign of Jimi Hendrix. It's still changing. As with books, music is art and is affected by the society we live in. Off the top of my head in the past ten years we've gone from stations changing Petty's "roll another joint" to "hit another joint" (ROFLMAO) through to really sexually graphic songs on mainstream pop stations. Technology has introduced brand new guitar sounds, new ways to learn music and a delivery system that allows us to hear many many more voices without the filtering of recording subsidiaries of news corporations.

>>>>>>>>> Honestly don't know how people can still play half the stuff they do. It's all the same!

Really, you are trying to say that since a kindle is being used instead of a paper book then the story content is different? So if I project a hologram of a book on a table with all the words in 3d then that constitutes a change in the content of stories? Same stories are being told. Same themes. Same ideas just different wrappers. the look of movies might have changed, the technology as well but it's all the same stories dealing with the same stuff.

As far as music, "wrong". Dissonance was very much accepted in the rennaissance thank you very much. Gesualdo, Vincentino to name two. I seem to recall some pretty thorny Beethoven quartets, Grosse Fugue for one. Heck, there are some Bach pieces that get pretty thorny as well.

if anything the harmony has been dumbed down over the years once the second Viennese school made its presence known. Also, I don't see a lot of new popular music using augmented 6th chords and if they actually modulate farther than the dominant I would be shocked. Take the harmonic movement and the dissonance of Wagner and tell me that it hasn't become more simple? And if you'd like to play the 12 tone or total serialsim card then by all means please do. Other than some academics toiling away I don't really recall a lot of that on the radio these days. Changing an instrument to an electric guitar might change the color but tonic - dominant - tonic still screams out.

You are saying I can take a hendrix score and something written 20 years before it and not find the same time signautres, the same "C major" or "D Major" being used? And his use of the Tri-tone is really rather simplistic over what has gone before. Purple Haze is a great song but there's nothing in it that hasn't been done before by another composer. I gather I could look at the harmonic motion and find it in many songs/'pieces that have gone before. Heck it seems we've even standardized quarter = 120 as I hear so many pieces that use that or a similar tempi. Imagine my surprise when I heard a Tool piece that rocked from 5/8 to 7/8 to 6/8! I thought I must have been in a dream so inundated have I been with 4/4 in today's music. So now that we've said that...

 

SWToR is like any other medium. It tells its story, it plays out in familiar ways. however, it's the voice of its creator that is different.

It's the same stories of hate or love or small man against the big man but told in a voice that is Bioware. I'm sure the themes that are explored in SWToR are going to be found in many books that go far, far back.

The combat is familiar but different. I really dont' think this whole "aiming" thing over tab targetting is any more inventive as we've seen that for years in other games.

My thougth is that some games require fps, fast combat and some are about something else. I look at video games like I do any media: it is all in the same wrapper but we are struggling to find new ways to tell the same things, new ways to resonate with today's players. But it's always going to be firmly grounded in the familiar.

  Vhaln

Novice Member

Joined: 7/07/05
Posts: 3167

8/18/11 6:22:18 PM#238
Originally posted by Metentso

Why that video doesn't look boring, at least to me and at least a few more here, and the TOR vide looks boring?

I will risk a ban and say my opinion, with total honesty. I'd say that the TOR combat looks *exactly* like WOW and we are all bored of it, while the GW2 video, looks *a bit* different from WOW, and i can't exactly say why, in either case. Must be an uncunscious thing, that i hope more clever forumers can spot.

 

Not sure why you think you'd get banned for saying it, but yeah, I think that's exactly what the problem is.  Lot of people want more from MMOs these days than they used to.  I think it's because the MMO concept has a hook that loses its novelty after we get used to it.  Playing with others, in a persistant environment, chasing levels - the very nature of it carries the genre for players that are new to it, but once that novelty wears off, its common for players to want more out of it.

 

It's not a new issue, just one that's been gradually growing for the past ten years.  If you look at upcoming games, some of them do seem to be trying to bring something new to the table.  GW2 and Tera, both.  I'd like to say ArcheAge, too, but who knows if we'll see that in the US anytime soon.  And I'm curious as to where The Secret World will fit into all of this - I was surprised to read how soon that's releasing, given that they've shown so little of it.

 

TOR does look like its sticking very close to the basics, and depending on story to make up for it.  I'm a little concerned that the story may actually make it even worse for a lot of players, rather than better though.  The way all that dialogue changes the pacing may not work well for everyone in an MMO.

When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.

  User Deleted
8/18/11 6:29:40 PM#239
Originally posted by Naral
Originally posted by Cyberdeck7
Originally posted by Elikal

I mean, what did you play in the last 10 years of UO, EQ, DAoC and yes WOW, which ALL have the SAME combat, give or take? Why was that alright and now TOR suddenly is super boring? 

because, in the last 10 years of UO, EQ, DAoC and yes WOW, they ALL have the SAME combat, give or take.

I think your problem is personal burnout on the genre. This wont change, anymore than first person shooter mechanics will change. New features maybe added, but MMORPGs are what they are...if they fail to appeal, you might want a new genre to explore.

Not bournout on the genre but rather the combat. Im in the same place as cyber i have playd that combat activly for 10 years so im pretty much filled up and then some.

But i do enjoy some of the few action mmorpg out there, more and more of em are comming luckly. They do lack some in the general area of mmo but for now its a trade i will need to take. Maybe in a few years we can get a few action mmorpg that has the depth that some of the older mmorpg games have.

As for this Tor movie its limited how much action they can place on a level 1 toon, most of the rpg's i enjoy starts slow but becomes better and better for each level as you get more toys to play around with.

  User Deleted
8/18/11 6:43:59 PM#240

The video actually makes it look more like a single player game than an MMO. Starting area combat can't be expected to be super complicated, you're learning the basic skills, so combat is pretty basic. *shrug*

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