Originally posted by Malevil

Originally posted by Robokapp

Originally posted by Sagasaint

Originally posted by Furor

and how is guild wars 2 help cripple world of warcraft when :

1) wow  11.4 million subscribers X $15 per month.

a clue

you have none

 answer his question.

I will answer it.

If any game convices WoW subscribers there is better alternative and even better it doesnt have sub cost, you can be sure 11.4 milion subs will be number of past.

I know that even Anet says gw2 doesnt compete WoW becouse gw2 is B2P game, but this is true only from gw2 point of view. For players who will stay to play WoW this is true - they will occasionaly log to gw2 becouse its free but WoW will be their game of choice. For players who will choose to gw2 as their game of choice question will arise - is wow still worth to sub if they would play it only occasionaly ?

I know only few ppl who play 2 or more mmos at the same time and problem is not money - problem is time. I dare to say that majority of current WoW players who will play gw2 as their new game of choice, will cancel their subs to WoW.

If I can expand on your answer, GW2 doesn't even need to cripple WoW.  With gamers willing to pay for a P2P game, it's probably a zero sum situation since the majority of players won't pay two subs.  For every sub taken by another game, that's one that WoW is going to lose.  With a B2P game though, players can just decide to buy it because it's a fraction of the cost of what they'd invest in a P2P game.  A game like SWTOR could split WoW's subscriptions 50/50, and yet GW2 could take 50% of them as well.

That's just throwing numbers out there, but suppose that 6 million people do all decide to try GW2.  Not unreasonable considering the sales of GW1 (probably 1.5-2 million accounts and that was a CORPG).  That would be a gross revenue of 360 million dollars right there.  And it gets better, since a majority of those players will be predisposed to buying expansions that come out (if the game and expansions are both good) and a percentage of them also willing to pay for vanity items in the cash shop.  ArenaNet doesn't even have to care who wins the P2P war or to steal a sub from anybody.

It's also possible that GW2 could be a game changer.  Back when Everquest was bringing in 500k subs, I'm sure people thought that was the extent of the market.  Now that WoW hit 12 million, is that the extent of the market?  80 million people play FarmVille.  I'm sure GW2 won't touch those numbers because FV is free and not about killing things, but it is the first B2P AAA MMO in a world of P2P.  That might bring a lot of people in who balked at a subscription.

B2P can make as much as P2P depending on how often expansions are released.

Take WoW for example.

Each person pays 15 * 12 = 180 a year for a subscription, and a new expansion comes out every 2 years for about $40.

On that model A person pays 180 * 2 + 40 = $400 every two years if they are subbed for that whole duration.

If guild wars comes out with an XPac every  8 months, thats 3 expansions in 2 years = $180 in 2 years if a player buys them all.

Now say that player also spends $20 in the in game store over that same period you have around $200 in 2 years.

That being said, Guild Wars is about 50% cheaper than WoW, and thus makes about 50% less revenue.

B2P is not immune to criticism, but a 50% discount for a superior game sounds awesome to me, and if they are smart with their money, they will be developing tons of great new content even if the revenue is lower.  Just think about how much of WoW sub money goes to making SC2, Diablo 3, and TItan?   Probably more than 50%.

Originally posted by zymurgeist

B2P is very susceptible to the only criticism that counts, people not buying the games. They are in fact even more in fear of it than a subscrption or micropay game because they're betting everything on the initial launch.

But as we know. Hype sells Boxes, for any MMO, even P2P mmo which require subs. So if the MMO community is willing to pay for a P2P box, than clearly they wont have trouble getting a B2P Box.

also word spread. A lot of misinfomation for Guild Wars 1, similar to how sites like MMORPG.com are hyping up NWN as a MMO, which clearly the Developers said it isnt,

Now imagine how many people trust sites like this. Now they go off and buy the game because they believe something a trusted MMORPG review site said about it, only to be fooled.

But wait there is more.
Since you already have the account,,, you just added ++ to the Developers's Box Sell Numbers which they will brag to the world about, in replacement of Sub numbers and Population numbers.

We seen this before my Anet as well, and its fans that defended GW1 against criticism.

Before the GW2, hype, look at GW1 population. Opps you cant, but it sure was empty. But wait WoW has 5Mill Western Subs,,,,, thats nothing,,,, GW1 has 6 milling box sells.... see what I did there?

this will happen again with GW2. I got that feeling. GW2 is very hyped right now.

People will buy the box. But what if it doesnt love up to the hype?

Oh well,,, the fanboys will still use the growing box sells numbers as a way to sweet talk new comers into joining and adding to that number.

The Pay model, doesnt change the quality of the game. The game itself does that. But GW2 being B2P, I am sure they will use their Box Sells numbers to avoid any criticism if it were to not live up to the hype, and flow in numbers like GW1 did.

Originally posted by MMOExposed

 

But as we know. Hype sells Boxes, for any MMO, even P2P mmo which require subs. So if the MMO community is willing to pay for a P2P box, than clearly they wont have trouble getting a B2P Box.

also word spread. A lot of misinfomation for Guild Wars 1, similar to how sites like MMORPG.com are hyping up NWN as a MMO, which clearly the Developers said it isnt,

Now imagine how many people trust sites like this. Now they go off and buy the game because they believe something a trusted MMORPG review site said about it, only to be fooled.

But wait there is more.
Since you already have the account,,, you just added ++ to the Developers's Box Sell Numbers which they will brag to the world about, in replacement of Sub numbers and Population numbers.

We seen this before my Anet as well, and its fans that defended GW1 against criticism.

Before the GW2, hype, look at GW1 population. Opps you cant, but it sure was empty. But wait WoW has 5Mill Western Subs,,,,, thats nothing,,,, GW1 has 6 milling box sells.... see what I did there?

 

this will happen again with GW2. I got that feeling. GW2 is very hyped right now.

People will buy the box. But what if it doesnt love up to the hype?

Oh well,,, the fanboys will still use the growing box sells numbers as a way to sweet talk new comers into joining and adding to that number.

The Pay model, doesnt change the quality of the game. The game itself does that. But GW2 being B2P, I am sure they will use their Box Sells numbers to avoid any criticism if it were to not live up to the hype, and flow in numbers like GW1 did.