Originally posted by theyalllie

 Probably more correct, or at least in my Dads case was, that swimming a couple miles, up to a Jap shore, in the middle of the night, and reconning them in his underwear with only a knife, then swimming back out again, to paddle away another ten miles, was preferable to the life he had waiting for him back in the US.

And make no mistake, he was scared to a degree. But as a member of UDT 1, Pearl had been their home before it was bombed. They were already at sea when that happened. And they were fucking mad. Very fucking Mad. So Altuistic? No. More like on a vendetta. But Im sure that was a very limited experience.

 I met a man a couple of years ago who did that job too. Mad old boys. I asked him if he had been testing the beaches for sand consistency (enough to take tanks), he said no, he had been mapping the coral mostly.

My father speaks the same way as your veteran friends. Their motives had nothing to do with saving the Jews or the world or ending fascism and the nazi's, some fuckers had bombed them and they all wanted revenge. Payback.

i don't think that was a very limited experience at all. I think that is the norm.

If I think back to my own experiences right after 9/11, i used to get a shit load of chain emails from American's calling for me to kill muslims and pass on the letter. Forums like these were full with the need for revenge. Some guys here still are. Even after all this time. And we aren't even discussing New Yorkers or relatives of the dead.

It's hatred that fuels wars. Not love.

Originally posted by baff

Originally posted by theyalllie

 Probably more correct, or at least in my Dads case was, that swimming a couple miles, up to a Jap shore, in the middle of the night, and reconning them in his underwear with only a knife, then swimming back out again, to paddle away another ten miles, was preferable to the life he had waiting for him back in the US.

And make no mistake, he was scared to a degree. But as a member of UDT 1, Pearl had been their home before it was bombed. They were already at sea when that happened. And they were fucking mad. Very fucking Mad. So Altuistic? No. More like on a vendetta. But Im sure that was a very limited experience.

 I met a man a couple of years ago who did that job too. Mad old boys. I asked him if he had been testing the beaches for sand consistency (enough to take tanks), he said no, he had been mapping the coral mostly.

 

My father speaks the same way as your veteran friends. Their motives had nothing to do with saving the Jews or the world or ending fascism and the nazi's, some fuckers had bombed them and they all wanted revenge. Payback.

i don't think that was a very limited experience at all. I think that is the norm.

 

If I think back to my own experiences right after 9/11, i used to get a shit load of chain emails from American's calling for me to kill muslims and pass on the letter. Forums like these were full with the need for revenge. Some guys here still are. Even after all this time. And we aren't even discussing New Yorkers or relatives of the dead.

It's hatred that fuels wars. Not love.

He mined and de-mined harbors, inventoried weapons , ammo, troop strength. He was real tight lipped about all of it, hell it took me 32 years just to gleen these bits off him, before he died. I got one story I have to share.

When I was 6 we lived on Ohau, in Aiea, now at this time he was about 42 or 44 yrs old. One day we are over on the North Shore. I'll back up for a sec.

He had been working for Hughes Aircraft Corp since then end of Korea, so he hadn't been doing much physical stuff.

Ok anyway, Dad dives into the surf and starts heading out, I swim a ways with him and he sends me back, so I go back in and sit around on the bech for about an hour or two. At which time he comes in through the surf with a Coconut.

Wow cool, where did you get that Coconut dad? From that Island out there son, not the first one the one further out .

Two little islands off the north shore where we were, anyway, he takes me to work with him at Hickam, and puts me to work sanding the two halves down, and we make a couple asshtrays that we kept for years.

Well some years later I saw one of them ash trays and said, something like remember when we made these, blah blah blah.

Yeah he says, you know during training, which he never said what training, they made us swim out and get two of them and come back. How did you swim back with this anyway, I asked? Between my knee's, pretty easy with one, not so easy with two.  (footnote) the closest island did have tree's but no coconuts, and the guys that swam to it had to then go to the second lsland then come back, as I recall to swim straight to the first one you had to fight current, so they were real real tired.

They were tuff people yes, but life for alot of them, in America, during the depression was tougher. He actually fed his mom sister and brother many times, with meat he poached, from age ten on.

Originally posted by Zindaihas

Gee, I don't know, maybe we Americans love our freedom a bit more than socialist loving Europeans.  Why is Europe about to crash and burn because of its big government programs that their countries can no longer afford?

Why is America, against all sound wisdom, trending in the same direction, when it is quite clear that these socialist spending programs cannot be maintained?

Because the risk taking from banks had nothing to do with the current economic crisis.

Originally posted by Gameloading

Originally posted by Zindaihas

Gee, I don't know, maybe we Americans love our freedom a bit more than socialist loving Europeans.  Why is Europe about to crash and burn because of its big government programs that their countries can no longer afford?

Why is America, against all sound wisdom, trending in the same direction, when it is quite clear that these socialist spending programs cannot be maintained?

Because the risk taking from banks had nothing to do with the current economic crisis.

Which was forced on them by the govt.

Originally posted by Gameloading

Originally posted by Zindaihas

Gee, I don't know, maybe we Americans love our freedom a bit more than socialist loving Europeans.  Why is Europe about to crash and burn because of its big government programs that their countries can no longer afford?

Why is America, against all sound wisdom, trending in the same direction, when it is quite clear that these socialist spending programs cannot be maintained?

Because the risk taking from banks had nothing to do with the current economic crisis.

  Wait...didnt you leave and say you werent coming back?

Originally posted by baff

Originally posted by Ihmotepp

 

I would, however, not find that as evidence that alll of the UK or all of Europe also feels that way.

 The next european who posted in the thread agreed with me.

So now you have your evidence. The opinion of not just 1 European, but 2. When offering my opinions wherever possible, I endeavour to differentiate between what I think and what I think other people I meet think.

My friends hold all manner of poltical sensibilities and persuasions. I don't gravitate toward my friends based on our common poltical views. It's not a subject I often raise socially. It's the things we have in common that make us friends.

 

And yes it is my opinion that  Europeans consider America to be an evil empire. you have requested that I show you this as a poll, here are very many polls.

http://www.google.co.uk/#sclient=psy&hl=en&source=hp&q=european+poll++america+is+evil&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=9c2bc29a81f1a1a2&biw=1062&bih=712

Please stop asking me to provide you with nonsense that you are perfectly able to find out for yourself.

Whatever evidence "you will accept" is up to you to find for yourself.

I'm not here to prove anything to you. I'm not looking for your acceptance.

 

Anecdotal evidence is the best kind. It's firsthand experience. that's why it holds up in court above all other kinds of evidence.

Either you respect people with experience, or you do not, if you do not, probably you aren't very old.

If you ever had any anecdotal evidence to offer at all on any of the subjects you raise, you would be someone I could learn from instead of just some argumentative student with nothing much to offer a discussion.

 

That is a google result for "poll Europeans find america evil" or something like that.

There are links.

However, I did not see any actual poll results. There are articles, but I didnt' find any actual reputable polls.

I can only think that you didn't post an actual poll, but rather just the search, becaues you aslo did not find actual polls.

Age has nothing to do with the definition of anecdotal evidence.

The expression anecdotal evidence refers both to evidence that is factually unreliable, as well as evidence that may be true but cherry-picked or otherwise unrepresentative of typical cases.[1

Anecdotal evidence is unreliable whether I am 5 or 95.

You have obviously confused the term anecdotal evidence with eye witness evidence. They are not the same thing.

Eyewitness testimony is allowed in a court of law. Anecdotal evidence is not.

Eyewitness testimony:

 A red haired man entered the house at 5 pm. "how do you know?" I always walk my dog at 5 pm, and I went to walk my dog and I saw the red haired man enter the house.

This supports the face that a red haired man entered the house at 5 pm.

Anecdotal evidence:

Red haired men are assholes. "how do you know?" Every red haired man I've ever spoken to is an asshole. That's experience talking, the best evidence there is!

This does not support the fact that all red haired men are assholes. This supports the fact that the speaker has met red haired men that are assholes, but does not support the conclusion that therefore ALL red haired men are assholes.

Originally posted by Gameloading

Because the risk taking from banks had nothing to do with the current economic crisis.

Its Gameloading. omg

Originally posted by Scubie67

Originally posted by Gameloading

Originally posted by Zindaihas

Gee, I don't know, maybe we Americans love our freedom a bit more than socialist loving Europeans.  Why is Europe about to crash and burn because of its big government programs that their countries can no longer afford?

Why is America, against all sound wisdom, trending in the same direction, when it is quite clear that these socialist spending programs cannot be maintained?

Because the risk taking from banks had nothing to do with the current economic crisis.

  Wait...didnt you leave and say you werent coming back?

 Woot!  I'm going to take credit for drawing him out of hibernation seeing as he responded to one of my posts.

Originally posted by Precusor

Originally posted by Gameloading

Because the risk taking from banks had nothing to do with the current economic crisis.

Its Gameloading. omg

That's it. These forums have really become a ghetto. I quit and I'm not coming back.

Originally posted by Precusor

Originally posted by Gameloading

Because the risk taking from banks had nothing to do with the current economic crisis.

Its Gameloading. omg

Consoles<PC!