I think it's interesting how they really are shooting for combining every one of the MMO genre's popular features found in other MMOs but never before all in one. You have the public questing, harvesting collectables, cross server LFGs, PVP battlegrounds, PVP Rifting, pretty typical races and class selection, just all mixed in to a talent-tree/multiclass/dual spec combination. They're doing good work. It's becoming a real hybrid MMO although it hasn't grown particularly good at my favorite features yet. Maybe I'll give it another shot after a couple more content/feature updates like this latest one.

I hope they add something like the unlockable power sets in CoX or DKs in WoW after reaching a certain level, or oldschool SWG when you had to reach some crazy list of achievements to play as a Jedi. Maybe even make one or two classes or modes with permadeath for the hardcore achiever. That would give a few more things to do beyond or aside from endgame that were/are popular in other MMOs.

Originally posted by ormstunga

I think they are doing pretty much what every MMO wouldve done in hindsight had they the money and resources for it. Instead of just leaning back satisfied with what they got, they are working hard to get everyone playing the game. Preemptive is better than too late realising your game has slowly died/stagnated. There is no second coming, once a game firmly sets itself at say 100-200k it wont get any more chances.

 QFMFT

Originally posted by popinjay

 

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Originally posted by Lostcog

 

WoW has had free trials since forever and almost every game out there sends out a free trial to old players after releasing new content. I am still getting them from AoC and I got one from WoW recently. It is all about trying to bring in subscription revenue.
If you want to read something into it then have at it, but this is not uncommon for any game whether it is doing well or poorly.

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Did WoW have a free week for people to come back after four months after launching coupled with almost 50% off sales on SUBSCRIPTIONS, not box prices?

 

 

I'm asking because you seem to be pretty familiar with WoW since 'forever'.

Wow did not need to because it did not have the same competition that RIFT does.  It's brilliant for Trion to offer this to those who may have burned out after the first couple months.

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Originally posted by MMOtoGO

Wow did not need to because it did not have the same competition that RIFT does.  

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Wiki:

WoW release date: The game was released on November 23, 2004, on the 10th anniversary of the Warcraft franchise.

Everquest II release date:

EverQuest II (EQ2), based upon the popular EverQuest, is a 3D fantasy massively multiplayer online role-playing game (MMORPG) developed by Sony Online Entertainment (SOE) and shipped on 8 November 2004.

Final Fantasy 11 release date: The PC version was released in North America on October 28, 2003, and the PlayStation 2 version on March 23, 2004.

DAOC: The game was released in October 2001.

EvE release date: Eve Online was first released in North America and Europe in May 2003.

City of Heroes release date: The game was launched in North America on April 27, 2004 and in Europe (by NCsoft Europe) on February 4, 2005 with English, German and French language servers.

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At this point, I'm not sure if some of you are just repeating what you've read someplace before in error, saying it because it sounds good made up in defense, or flat out lying.. but whatever it is, it really has to stop.

I understand this is the internet and all, but even that has some limits when things are easily checked.

Reality needs to meet modern day discussions at some point.

Originally posted by popinjay

 

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Originally posted by MMOtoGO

 

Wow did not need to because it did not have the same competition that RIFT does.  

---

 

 

---

Wiki:

 

WoW release date: The game was released on November 23, 2004, on the 10th anniversary of the Warcraft franchise.

 

Everquest II release date:

EverQuest II (EQ2), based upon the popular EverQuest, is a 3D fantasy massively multiplayer online role-playing game (MMORPG) developed by Sony Online Entertainment (SOE) and shipped on 8 November 2004.

Final Fantasy 11 release date: The PC version was released in North America on October 28, 2003, and the PlayStation 2 version on March 23, 2004.

DAOC: The game was released in October 2001.

 

EvE release date: Eve Online was first released in North America and Europe in May 2003.

City of Heroes release date: The game was launched in North America on April 27, 2004 and in Europe (by NCsoft Europe) on February 4, 2005 with English, German and French language servers.

 

---

 

At this point, I'm not sure if some of you are just repeating what you've read someplace before in error, saying it because it sounds good made up in defense, or flat out lying.. but whatever it is, it really has to stop.

 

 

I understand this is the internet and all, but even that has some limits when things are easily checked.

 

 

Reality needs to meet modern day discussions at some point.

 Well the reality that you are ignoring is that the list for Rift includes all of those games still operating PLUS about eleventy billion other mmo's.*

This being the internet and all I assume you have the capability to move your mouse over to the list of mmo games on this very website yet you chose not to for some unknown reason.

*yes eleventy billion is an exaggeration, so is saying that WoW had the same level of competition at release as Rift.

Originally posted by IrishChai

Originally posted by Aluvius

Originally posted by popinjay

 

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Originally posted by Lostcog

 

WoW has had free trials since forever and almost every game out there sends out a free trial to old players after releasing new content. I am still getting them from AoC and I got one from WoW recently. It is all about trying to bring in subscription revenue.
If you want to read something into it then have at it, but this is not uncommon for any game whether it is doing well or poorly.

---

Did WoW have a free week for people to come back after four months after launching coupled with almost 50% off sales on SUBSCRIPTIONS, not box prices?

 

 

I'm asking because you seem to be pretty familiar with WoW since 'forever'.

 Some day all that hate's gonna burn you up kid.

 

I don't see any hate in his message. He's just pointing out the truth. WoW didn't jump on having big sales and inviting previous purchasers to return this fast. They didn't need to. I don't remember WoW ever on sale actually. In fact I haven't seen any MMO jump on these price drops, free trial program, and free weeks/weekends to prior players this soon after release. It proves they must be seeing a large drop in subscribers because what would they have to benefit from this program if there were only a small number of prior unsubscribed players?

 

I still hope players are enjoying it and that it does well for Trion. I'm not going to ignore the obvious though. It could be doing better then it is, and they know it. I didn't care for it, but I like the fact they released a very smooth build and are focusing a lot on frequent content patches. That's a good model for the whole genre to think about.

 

Edit: Apparently Aluvius deleted the message I was responding to.

 Actually I guess a mod deleted it, I'm proud of my snark :)

I stand by my statement though, there are many folks on this forum struck with Rift Derangement Syndrome.  Its an irrational hatred for one of the genre's better releases in the last few years.  Personally I reserve my hateration for titles that actually deserved it such as FFXIV.

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Originally posted by Aluvius

 Well the reality that you are ignoring is that the list for Rift includes all of those games still operating PLUS about eleventy billion other mmo's.*
This being the internet and all I assume you have the capability to move your mouse over to the list of mmo games on this very website yet you chose not to for some unknown reason.
 
*yes eleventy billion is an exaggeration, so is saying that WoW had the same level of competition at release as Rift.

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Rift is the 'next gen' MMO with everything you'd expect in a world class AAA mmo. Those games aren't.

Rift is fully polished with all the content you'd expect.

Rift has.. rifts!

Rift isn't competing vs all those older games. It's only competing against one now (WoW) as evidenced by it's advertising (We aren't in Az.. well you get the picture. If not, turn on your television) and three in the future... SWTOR, GW2 and TSW.

Since those aren't out yet, there's only one it's competing against, WoW. But they only have themselves to fault for that.. WoW didn't pick the fight.

Originally posted by popinjay

 

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Originally posted by Aluvius

 

 Well the reality that you are ignoring is that the list for Rift includes all of those games still operating PLUS about eleventy billion other mmo's.*
This being the internet and all I assume you have the capability to move your mouse over to the list of mmo games on this very website yet you chose not to for some unknown reason.
 
*yes eleventy billion is an exaggeration, so is saying that WoW had the same level of competition at release as Rift.

---

Not really.

 

Rift is the 'next gen' MMO with everything you'd expect in a world class AAA mmo. Those games aren't.

Rift is fully polished with all the content you'd expect.

Rift has.. rifts!

 

 

Rift isn't competing vs all those older games. It's only competing against one now (WoW) as evidenced by it's advertising (We aren't in Az.. well you get the picture. If not, turn on your television) and three in the future... SWTOR, GW2 and TSW.

 

 

Since those aren't out yet, there's only one it's competing against, WoW. But they only have themselves to fault for that.. WoW didn't pick the fight.

 

well, im not sure about the next generation bit.. tbh.. to me it just seems like more of the same, the Rifts themselves are a decent enough mechanic - that unfortunately can be annoying as often as it is entertaining... i don't think however that the game is really a competitor for WoW, but Rift is a AAA title, something that is lacking from most of the other Fantasy MMO's..  how well it will cope when games like SW:TOR, GW2 and The Secret World, comes out.. remains to be seen, i don't think its in any danger of failing.. but.. must admit.. The Secret World is one game that might tempt me away from Rifts.. for a while at least .. and thats the issue.. Plenty of WoW players play other games from time to time, but they return to WoW, inevitably.. will Rifts have the same kind of dedication.. we'll see..  i'm optimistic.. but.. what happens when those 3 games hit the market..  its anybodies guess....

I realized how disenfranchised I am with the whole "themepark MMO" thing after getting one of these invites. At first I thought, "Awesome!" After some more thought, I got angry at the idea of logging into a game and doing almost exactly what I was doing before I left. I really just can't enjoy killing dragons and players in an instance to get shiny gear anymore.

Originally posted by popinjay

Did WoW have a free week for people to come back after four months after launching coupled with almost 50% off sales on SUBSCRIPTIONS, not box prices?

I'm asking because you seem to be pretty familiar with WoW since 'forever'.

1.) I played WoW since launch an only quit this past March.

2.) I never said WoW offered a free week for people to come back. I said they have offered free trials. Which they have for a very long time. I also never said they reduced box prices.

3.) I did recieve an email after the 4.1 update to come back and try the game.

Originally posted by popinjay

 

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Originally posted by Aluvius

 

 Well the reality that you are ignoring is that the list for Rift includes all of those games still operating PLUS about eleventy billion other mmo's.*
This being the internet and all I assume you have the capability to move your mouse over to the list of mmo games on this very website yet you chose not to for some unknown reason.
 
*yes eleventy billion is an exaggeration, so is saying that WoW had the same level of competition at release as Rift.

---

Not really.

 

Rift is the 'next gen' MMO with everything you'd expect in a world class AAA mmo. Those games aren't.

Rift is fully polished with all the content you'd expect.

Rift has.. rifts!

 

 

Rift isn't competing vs all those older games. It's only competing against one now (WoW) as evidenced by it's advertising (We aren't in Az.. well you get the picture. If not, turn on your television) and three in the future... SWTOR, GW2 and TSW.

 

 

Since those aren't out yet, there's only one it's competing against, WoW. But they only have themselves to fault for that.. WoW didn't pick the fight.

 

You're honestly saying that WoW had more mmo competition in 2004 than Rift in 2011?  I mean come on, I know as you said this is the internets and all .. but .. but .. that's an insane position to stake out.  You do realize that more mmo's have been released since 1999-2004, right?  Again I point you to the top or left margins of this very web page where you can see entire lists of currently existing mmo's.

For bonus points in the same breath that you discount any of the games that you listed operating in 2004, you then say that Rift's only competitor is WoW .. which also released in 2004.

Really?  Doesn't that sound silly?  That's even crazier than asserting that WoW had more competition in 2004.  You've distilled the entire mmo genre down to only Rift and WoW.

There's no reality based way to defend your statement.

Originally posted by popinjay

 

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Originally posted by Aluvius
  Personally I reserve my hateration for titles that actually deserved it such as FFXIV.

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So it's okay for YOU to hate a game that you think 'deserve it' even though people like it, but it's not okay for someone else to do that if they felt it?

 

 

As a member of the Rift community... you're making us look bad with that entitlement "better than thou" attitude of criticizing someone else game but not taking it the same way yourself.

 

 

In other words, you can dish it out but you can't take it.

Errr, I'm now confused.  So are you actually defending Rift but I just misunderstood your posts?

To be clear I was poking fun at your posts because I thought they displayed an irrational hatred toward Rift.   If that wasn't the case then I apologize to you and the 328 people who liked FFXIV.

p.s.  No I don't really apologize, FFXIV is a horrible, horrible game ... its hard to have half price sub promotions when your product is so horrible you couldn't even charge money for it in the first place hehe.

the average game maker would make more money if they pooled their game together then try to own market like wow

imagine you pay say 15 $ month but the pool of game is say rift,mortal, etcimagine they get their share etc

make it like a stack of 4 each so for 15$ a month you choose the 4 you like and just pay the monthly +the buying cost of the game you play of cuarse.each game maker would make less per game but i bet they would make more in the end cuase more player would be there!soe does it .if it was bad i bet they wouldnt do it!

now all we need is a system a la cable channel but for gaming (a la carte)you pay this amount for say this this and that etc!

ummm open world pvp....yummy :-)

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Originally posted by Aluvius

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Originally posted by popinjay
 

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Originally posted by Aluvius
 
 Well the reality that you are ignoring is that the list for Rift includes all of those games still operating PLUS about eleventy billion other mmo's.*
This being the internet and all I assume you have the capability to move your mouse over to the list of mmo games on this very website yet you chose not to for some unknown reason.
 
*yes eleventy billion is an exaggeration, so is saying that WoW had the same level of competition at release as Rift.

---

Not really.
 

Rift is the 'next gen' MMO with everything you'd expect in a world class AAA mmo. Those games aren't.
Rift is fully polished with all the content you'd expect.

Rift has.. rifts!
 
 

Rift isn't competing vs all those older games. It's only competing against one now (WoW) as evidenced by it's advertising (We aren't in Az.. well you get the picture. If not, turn on your television) and three in the future... SWTOR, GW2 and TSW.
 
 
Since those aren't out yet, there's only one it's competing against, WoW. But they only have themselves to fault for that.. WoW didn't pick the fight.
 

---

You're honestly saying that WoW had more mmo competition in 2004 than Rift in 2011?  I mean come on, I know as you said this is the internets and all .. but .. but .. that's an insane position to stake out.  You do realize that more mmo's have been released since 1999-2004, right?  Again I point you to the top or left margins of this very web page where you can see entire lists of currently existing mmo's.
 
For bonus points in the same breath that you discount any of the games that you listed operating in 2004, you then say that Rift's only competitor is WoW .. which also released in 2004.
 
Really?  Doesn't that sound silly?  That's even crazier than asserting that WoW had more competition in 2004.  You've distilled the entire mmo genre down to only Rift and WoW.
 
There's no reality based way to defend your statement.

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Every other game out is old and dated that is worth playing. Name a game in the last three years that was actually competition to RIFT AND was fun to play with good sub numbers?

Look at those dates I listed (which you obviously didn't). WoW launched right in the THICK of all the games that were brand new. All the games you are talking about WoW went head to head with them all from the word GO.

Seriously, RIFT has no competition now, but in less than 6 months or so, we are going to see exactly how well RIFT can stand up to true competition with brand new games coming.

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Originally posted by Aluvius

Errr, I'm now confused.  So are you actually defending Rift but I just misunderstood your posts?
 
To be clear I was poking fun at your posts because I thought they displayed an irrational hatred toward Rift.   If that wasn't the case then I apologize to you and the 328 people who liked FFXIV.
 
 
p.s.  No I don't really apologize, FFXIV is a horrible, horrible game ... its hard to have half price sub promotions when your product is so horrible you couldn't even charge money for it in the first place hehe.

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I'm not defending OR advocating RIFT which is what you don't understand. I don't tell people to 'buy it' or 'don't buy it'. I figure if they are paying the sub, then they are adult enough to read reviews and take a trial.

See, in your world everything seems to be black and white. You either hate RIFT or you love it. You are either defending it or attacking it. There is no grey zone as often the case for fanbois. You have the George Bush mentality of "If you're not with us, you're with the terrorists" type of nonsense logic.

Being critical and pointing out a game's faults, shortcomings, failures and goofs isn't about partisan viewing. It's about telling the truth as a person sees it. This is the same way to someone who points out a game's strengths, triumphs, achievements and worth. You don't have to be saying all good things because this is a RIFT forum so you can 'fit in'.

That's just too high school of a mentality and most adults have long gotten past that.

I loved FFXI very much. It's the longest game I ever played and based on the fun and community I experienced there, I bought FFXIV and figured it would be better. I was shocked when it wasn't even close.

FFXIV was a game with no soul, no core, and no direction. Things were broken, buggy and incoherent. The schemes they put in place made no sense (fatigue) and the grind wasn't enjoyable like the grind in FFXI. They did so many things wrong that the only thing I can say they did right was update the graphics and scenery.. and most of that was copypasta. FFXIV was stillborn.. and I'm a fan of the series and can say that.

So, if I can say that about that, I sure as hell can point out things in RIFT as well because I'm not here to appeal to your sense of fairplay or be in the same 'gang' as you kissing a company's butt.

I'm a customer with a six month subscription, and I'll say what I damn well please.

Rift is already having a welcome back week.. that doesn't sound good.. but w/e

hm maybe i'll try it.. see what it's about... downloading now >.> why not.

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Originally posted by natuxatu
Rift is already having a welcome back week.. that doesn't sound good.. but w/e
 
hm maybe i'll try it.. see what it's about... downloading now >.> why not.

---

Right now though, the style is kind of flat and mundane. So anyone resubbing the game after playing for awhile is pretty much paying for potential of what they say is coming out. Anyone brand new could pretty much play now and take two months to do most of RIFT and be ready when Hammerknell hits with new stuff.

People in-game are kind of bopping around right now and crying about two things:

1) The new PvP limit raises to R7-8 will absolutely crush anyone starting Pvp when it starts in kind of a Warhammer endgame fashion and..

2) The cross server shard system coming is going to 'wreck the community' because people will start ninjalooting.

I think the cross shard whiners are crybabies actually or some kind of elite purists poopsockers, but I think the PvPer CERTAINLY have a valid point about R6's now hitting R8 and smashing everyone else under R6.

I saw that thing in Warhammer plain as day with Renown... new players simply could not compete and basically had to 'die' their way up the ranks.

Originally posted by popinjay

 

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Originally posted by natuxatu
Rift is already having a welcome back week.. that doesn't sound good.. but w/e
 
hm maybe i'll try it.. see what it's about... downloading now >.> why not.

---

They have some interesting changes proposed. If they don't end up like SOE and can't deliver because of one thing or another, they could have a pretty good game by the time it's all said and done.

 

 

Right now though, the style is kind of flat and mundane. So anyone resubbing the game after playing for awhile is pretty much paying for potential of what they say is coming out. Anyone brand new could pretty much play now and take two months to do most of RIFT and be ready when Hammerknell hits with new stuff.

 

 

People in-game are kind of bopping around right now and crying about two things:

1) The new PvP limit raises to R7-8 will absolutely crush anyone starting Pvp when it starts in kind of a Warhammer endgame fashion and..

2) The cross server shard system coming is going to 'wreck the community' because people will start ninjalooting.

 

 

I think the cross shard whiners are crybabies actually or some kind of elite purists poopsockers, but I think the PvPer CERTAINLY have a valid point about R6's now hitting R8 and smashing everyone else under R6.

 

 

I saw that thing in Warhammer plain as day with Renown... new players simply could not compete and basically had to 'die' their way up the ranks.

This is a problem I've highlighted before that with the way that Rift is designed it will find it difficult to expand its content horizontally to give leveling a much more expansive feel. Trion have missed the point to an MMO where the vast majority of players enjoy the leveling part of the genre, games like WOW. EQ2, LotRO have multiple leveling paths with distinct lore to make you feel like your on a completely different story than before, if Trion started adding in different leveling paths they would have to rewrite the entire early game as its so linear in its direction. So they can only add content vertically with more tiers of PvP and gear, this is why I say its a very poorly executed design, Trion have misjudged what MMO players want from an MMO and as you say Popinjay by the time they start adding extra things to do in Rift the competition in P2P games will be out and I'm afraid it goodbye Rift or Freemium.

What? Already?

I don't see the point, the game can't changed that much since launch. They really should have waited until a year after launch at least.