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News & Features Discussion  » Star Wars: The Old Republic: Do You Really Want a Beta Invite?

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136 posts found
  DarkPony

Steed of Tardcore

Joined: 8/29/08
Posts: 5637

Confident, cocky, lazy, dead.

7/04/11 5:43:56 AM#121
Originally posted by Amathe
Originally posted by MacAllen
Playing is not testing. If that were the case, then the devs could do it easily. 4-5 folks playing the game is enough testing if playing is testing.

Beta testing is *NOT* playing, not if you're doing it right. Beta testing is breaking the game deliberately. It's going places you wouldn't normally go because some idiot might go there. It's trying to create dupe bugs deliberately.

Saying "playing is testing" is like saying "walking in your front door is security testing". A beta is trying to climb in your window, or your crawl place, things normal people would not do but random folks might.

There's a huge difference.

 

BioWare disagrees with you.  From a July 2, 2011 Dev post:

 (which mirrors what I said btw)

To the 'I have a lot of experience in MMO testing but BioWare invites my lousy friend instead who doesn't care' crowd:

A) We don't have any way to validate such claims.

B) Tests have several axes: Player feedback, automated metrics, and bugs. They are all valuable. Even a player that just plays and never fills out their surveys or gives any feedback is valuable to us in some form because of the playtest metrics they generate. We see what they do, where they get stuck, what classes they play, how they use their abilities, etc. If you add enough random players, these metrics become very powerful feedback by themselves.
If you want to answer questions like 'where will people likely quit' the hardcore fan tester often isn't cutting it, because their tolerance for bad things is almost endless.

C) Testers that give exceptional feedback are, of course, very useful. In those cases, we do take steps to retain them.

 

Hehe, good to read. They have quite a realistic view on the matter :)

  RoosterNash

Novice Member

Joined: 9/11/09
Posts: 285

Revolution through Destruction!

7/04/11 11:11:15 AM#122

I've tested quite a few games, and genuinely enjoy helping a developer create something awesome. With some games though, I've had the privilege *sarcasm* of watching something go from "good" to "god, what were they thinking?" Champions Online and SWG are two games that come to mind right off the top. More noteably, Champions.


Please, SW:TOR, don't do that. The end.


THE Rooster Nash

  Khalathwyr

Tipster

Joined: 6/02/04
Posts: 3151

Google is your friend.

7/04/11 3:32:58 PM#123
Originally posted by vctrs1

rofl i love all you guys who dont like starwars or swtor but feel the need to comment anyway...


we will be glad to have you playing your generic fantasy game while were in our nice new sci fi star wars universe. you will not be missed.


I infact hope games like gw2 and archage release around the same time as swtor..it will suck all the dorks out who are just there cause its the newest mmorpg out and leave us actual starwars fans who will enjoy the game...


all in all the release of gw2 shall be a nice cleansing of swtor. this plus swtor being PTP should make for a good community


 


as for the beta....id give it a test for them..id tryn and avoid story line tho.

Why wouldn't we comment? In case your super keen senses missed it this thread is in the News area for everyone to give feedback on, not just TOR fanboys. Secodnly, he asked a Yes or No question, not a yes only question.

 

If the majority of TOR fans missed things such as that on a forum and sport a like attitude toward others just because they don't like a computer game, then I too will be glad that you are all corraled in that game. Which, by the way, liking or disliking of TOR in no way determines whether one is an "actual star wars fan".

"Many nights, my friend... Many nights I've put a blade to your throat while you were sleeping. Glad I never killed you, Steve. You're alright..."

Kickstarter 1 / Naysayers 0

  Aerig

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/28/04
Posts: 16

7/05/11 11:07:51 AM#124

So far the reviews I have read are basically non-commital and as per "its nice, its has flaws,but is it fair to judge at this stage?".

BioWare though have a ground rep for writing nicely immersive games, so I'd be pretty keen to make this my fifth major mmo beta test.

I do agree with an earlier comment that noted how few beta testers actually provided feedback, though its not unfair to say that mere presence and activity in a beta tends to help devs deal with baseline issues like server load tweaking and lag issues.

But, if someone from BioWare reads this ...

Give the testers an semi-automated bug report system that automatically registers area, location, current target, relevant aspects of character status, ping, local and general server population at the time etc

Put an easy to use interface on that with a streamlined categorisation selector emphasing or restricting reports to your current development criteria and a limited space for textual description.

Have the devs rate each submission they read so that you are reading the content from reliable testers first.

Make that bug report panel prominently accessible and have its data constantly populated with last known good state so that testers can hit auto submit the minute they think they have a problem (cooldown on that function) or, at least, the minute the client thinks it has a problem.

Only two games I have tested have had anything so intelligent AoC and EQ which still uses this same basic mechanism after I suggested it 3 months prior to the LoY expansion.

 

One of the main problems with submitting data during a beta test is that you do actually get caught up in the game and you dont want to tab out to the forums. So you can have 10 useful and relevant thoughts that get lost in the heat of the action.

"Dammit, if I die now its going to take me an hour to work my way back to this point"

so I would say that at least half of the salient contributions I could have made in games have been lost because I wanted to continue the experience in the hope of finding something more useful than that annoying niggle which, at the end of the day, can be the annoying niggle that prevents players from playing at release.

So bug report = temporary character invulnerability, freeze client, log relevant ingame and client state variables and player comment, unfreeze game on submission = exploitable but its a beta test and the info is more valuable than the idiot that wants to avoid a pvp kill or whatever

  just1opinion

Smart-Alek

Joined: 8/14/07
Posts: 4933

7/05/11 11:11:55 AM#125
Originally posted by Aerig

So far the reviews I have read are basically non-commital and as per "its nice, its has flaws,but is it fair to judge at this stage?".

BioWare though have a ground rep for writing nicely immersive games, so I'd be pretty keen to make this my fifth major mmo beta test.

I do agree with an earlier comment that noted how few beta testers actually provided feedback, though its not unfair to say that mere presence and activity in a beta tends to help devs deal with baseline issues like server load tweaking and lag issues.

But, if someone from BioWare reads this ...

Give the testers an semi-automated bug report system that automatically registers area, location, current target, relevant aspects of character status, ping, local and general server population at the time etc

Put an easy to use interface on that with a streamlined categorisation selector emphasing or restricting reports to your current development criteria and a limited space for textual description.

Have the devs rate each submission they read so that you are reading the content from reliable testers first.

Make that bug report panel prominently accessible and have its data constantly populated with last known good state so that testers can hit auto submit the minute they think they have a problem (cooldown on that function) or, at least, the minute the client thinks it has a problem.

Only two games I have tested have had anything so intelligent AoC and EQ which still uses this same basic mechanism after I suggested it 3 months prior to the LoY expansion.

 

One of the main problems with submitting data during a beta test is that you do actually get caught up in the game and you dont want to tab out to the forums. So you can have 10 useful and relevant thoughts that get lost in the heat of the action.

"Dammit, if I die now its going to take me an hour to work my way back to this point"

so I would say that at least half of the salient contributions I could have made in games have been lost because I wanted to continue the experience in the hope of finding something more useful than that annoying niggle which, at the end of the day, can be the annoying niggle that prevents players from playing at release.

So bug report = temporary character invulnerability, freeze client, log relevant ingame and client state variables and player comment, unfreeze game on submission = exploitable but its a beta test and the info is more valuable than the idiot that wants to avoid a pvp kill or whatever

 

I WISH they would listen to you.  And I'm not referring to any specific dev house, but rather all of them.

President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club

  herennow

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/20/05
Posts: 69

7/05/11 12:22:43 PM#126

Interesting points. I did remember how frustrated I was in the Rift beta with all the WoW/not WoW conversations people kept repeating. That said a lot of beta testers are pretty hardcore. i like to give feedback in betas to ensure the older more casual player's views are represented and available for devs to consider if they wish.

There is a particular fascination for me with this game as going to see the original star wars movies as a child provides some of my earliest fantastic memories and aside from the above I selfishly want to see if the game captures that magic. So a selfish motive but I would tell the developers where it falls short in my view so even this could be potentially useful. however considering the level of oversubscription I stongly suspect I'll be waiting for release before I touch this game.

  IrishChai

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/31/11
Posts: 506

7/05/11 12:38:00 PM#127

I know I don't want a beta invite, but I couldn't ignore it if an invite ended up in my inbox either. I just know I wouldn't take it seriously enough to improve the state of the game over just goofing around and seeing how it's turning out. That's no reason to beta test it and I know I'll enjoy the game more when they deem it ready for release, but patience is just a bitch sometimes lol

  TygerBlueEye

Novice Member

Joined: 7/26/04
Posts: 6

7/06/11 12:18:59 AM#128

Wow! I been through a lot of bad betas! I been through some not so bad beta too. Oh, and I been through very nice betas (oh how rare they are). I have been spent many of hours waiting for servers to come back just for them to crash again in the first five mins.  I have spent months in betas and had the game tank not to long after release.


I was lucky. I was able to get into SWG beta early(phase 2 I think) when there was only few systems and I played all the way to NGE.


After all the ups and downs; I can say I'm more than ready to jump right into Old Republic beta today.

  Mordeo

Novice Member

Joined: 5/22/03
Posts: 9

7/06/11 3:33:58 AM#129

Yes yes, I'm sure you're all very diligent testers and shining examples of humanity's finest and brightest.


 


Personally, I would only enter the beta to satisfy my curiosity and see if it lives up to the hype. And offer feedback on stuff I stumbled across while just playing the game of course, since I am a meddlesome elitist bastard convinced that my opinion is the most important at any given time and on any given subject, but still - I'm in it for my own selfish reasons. I'm in it to have fun.


And I'm not afraid to admit it.

- Do as I say, don't do as I do.

  krea

Novice Member

Joined: 6/30/09
Posts: 184

7/06/11 8:51:17 AM#130

Realy looking forward to release of old republic , and if i should get invited i will try to stick with my least prefered class to help for beta stuff. In general i dont tend to overplay betas since i want that fresh feel of a mmo at launch .


  Vendethiel

Novice Member

Joined: 7/14/10
Posts: 9

7/09/11 1:51:49 AM#131

I have signed up for the BETA, but sadly got no invite.   I have worked in the gaming industry and understand what it takes to assist the development team.  It is fun to do in my opinion and actually like it.  I agree though, that most people think it is just sign up for it and play a bit to see if they like it.


When I was in the industry myself, I even found the ALPHA tests fun... Character floating around the screen as there were no leg or arm animations, then walking through walls etc... It was fun to see the development from where it was to where it ended up.


  skeaser

Hard Core Member

Joined: 6/13/07
Posts: 3685

Don't die mad, just die.

7/09/11 2:03:30 AM#132

Yes, I really do.

I've beta tested games before and have even volunteered to work as a guide for a couple of MMOs. I'm just that kind of guy that likes to be a "fixer".


A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.
-Friedrich Nietzsche

  Kenafen

Novice Member

Joined: 1/19/10
Posts: 4

7/16/11 7:44:48 PM#133

  My reasons for wanting into a beta are generally my own but it all boils down to one thing. I do not like bugs, flaws, or errant issues in my games. Lately most people like you have said just run around in a Beta and do not even bother reporting anything through the proper channels. most people just run around in world local chat complainging about the bugs like it will do anything to help them.


 


   I have personally had the pleasure of working in alpha process testing, F&F beta, and closed beta. I have also had to help fix IT problems on one game in particular because they blackholed the internal IP for the world server during closed beta. I know a closed beta is usually not a place to help craft the actual game but assist in the dev teams vision of what the game should be... 


 


  So to answer your first question. Yes, Yes i would like to work on SW:ToR Closed Beta am I holding my breath no. Simply put you guys have a giant pool of people who would like to get in. Whether or not those people have the dedication discipline and understanding of what they are expected to do is another question to be asked. 


  pcgate

Novice Member

Joined: 1/17/08
Posts: 1

8/06/11 11:56:03 AM#134

I have a beta invite for sale.  I've not even logged into, can provide whatever proof you like.  email: tor@fieryperil.com


  Devvholic

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/18/10
Posts: 69

8/06/11 11:57:29 AM#135

I would really really REALLY love a beta invite por favor :D 

  Elikal

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 2/09/06
Posts: 8067

“No path is darker then when your eyes are shut.” -Flemeth

8/06/11 1:44:59 PM#136

YES!

YES!

A forum is a place where people can discuss about different opinions. So what I don't get is, how people react offended when they come to a forum and then find... well different opinions. If a different opinion offends you, what are you even doing here?

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