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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Why the term WoW clone is not a myth

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108 posts found
  Yamota

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/05/03
Posts: 6510

"I fight so you don't have to."

 
OP  6/14/11 7:03:50 AM#1

Some people on this forum seems to think that the term WoW clone is over-used and some kind of myth but in fact this is what publishers want.

I found this interesting tidbit on the upcoming Zombie MMORG in their FAQ.

"Over the past year we were approached by numerous publishers expressing an interest in partnering with Undead Labs. Not surprisingly, many of them were MMO industry publishers who were drawn to the team’s track record in that industry, and while they were excited to work with our team, most of them wanted us to work on yet another World of Warcraft clone."

So it is not just in our heads, most publishers only want World of Warcraft clones and hence why most MMORPGs are as such and called out as such. It is a fact of the industry.

  Vesavius

Old School

Joined: 3/08/04
Posts: 7206

Players come for the game, but they stay for the people- Most Devs have forgotten this.

6/14/11 7:10:35 AM#2

IMO, the only people that object to the term are those that have it applied to their games while they crow on about how awful WoW is.

They like the illusion that their choice of game is superior to WoW and they are better then those that choose WoW, but really, in truth, it is (and they are) the same.

I think 'WoW clone' is a legitimate description of a game that shares a lot of the same core play systems and philosophies (and yes...I know WoW copied EQ etc  etc etc).

  jpaprocki

Novice Member

Joined: 9/23/09
Posts: 229

6/14/11 7:13:20 AM#3

You could say portions of WoW are clones of MMO's that came before it.  So technically, you could say almost every MMO made since the first one's are clones of those before it.  Yeah, the term is over used.

I'm not an IT Specialist, Game Developer, or Clairvoyant in real life, but like others on here, I play one on the internet.

  Kabaal

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/02/05
Posts: 2957

Haggis Humper

6/14/11 7:15:33 AM#4
Originally posted by Yamota

So it is not just in our heads, most publishers only want World of Warcraft clones and hence why most MMORPGs are as such and called out as such. It is a fact of the industry.

Correction, most of the publishers that approached Undead Labs asked for a WoW clone, not just "most publishers". For all we know it could have been publishers like Frogster Entertainment who deal with cheap wow knock off games like runes of magic who were approaching them.

 

Without details you cannot claim such a sweeping statement.

  Robokapp

Elite Member

Joined: 11/15/09
Posts: 4683

The only luck I had today was to have you as my opponent.

6/14/11 7:16:35 AM#5
Originally posted by jpaprocki

You could say portions of WoW are clones of MMO's that came before it.  So technically, you could say almost every MMO made since the first one's are clones of those before it.  Yeah, the term is over used.

 aaaaand how many people in the industry today have experienced both and see this comparison? Not a lot. how many played wow, now play their 100th guy with sword killing spiders and get reminded of WoW ? many.

  ormstunga

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/22/04
Posts: 752

stupid is as stupid does

6/14/11 7:17:36 AM#6

The term is used, ppl know what is referred to. Its still wrong. SImple.

  Creslin321

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 2/27/09
Posts: 5424

6/14/11 9:01:55 AM#7

I use the term because it's descriptive and everyone knows what I'm talking about when I say it.  It's less than a mouthful than saying "A game that emulates many of the features found in World of Warcraft with a few minor changes."  Still, just because a developer said the word doesn't make it law.  They are just people like you and me.

I think that the problem most people have with "WoW clone" is that it implies that WoW was the game that originated most modern MMORPG concepts.  This simply isn't true.  WoW was heavily influenced by Everquest and it also took ideas from other games like FFXI (auction house).  WoW's major innovation was the quest-leveling paradigm, which helped make the game accessible and give it mass appeal, most other things were borrowed from other games though.

Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?

  Distopia

Drifter

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15628

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

6/14/11 9:24:45 AM#8

Whether it's in our heads or not I couldn't care less. I've been around long enough to know WOW has for the most part done nothing new. Even a lot of their newer additions were aspects they picked up from newer games in development. They put the blizzard coat of paint on it and added it to their game.

I don't use the term simply because of this, I'm still more attune to what WOW was called, an EQ clone. What was EQ? a M59 clone. What were SWG and EVE? 3D UO clones. The one game that really hasn't been cloned is more or less DAOC.

What I don't like the idea of is that the MMO has become a bad design, which is more or less the message with "WOW clone" usage. Then again I haven't burnt myself out by attempting to play each and every one that gets released, even though I really didn't like playing it to begin with.

 

 

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  Creslin321

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 2/27/09
Posts: 5424

6/14/11 9:27:30 AM#9
Originally posted by Malickie

Whether it's in our heads or not I couldn't care less. I've been around long enough to know WOW has for the most part done nothing new. Even a lot of their newer additions were aspects they picked up from newer games in development. They put the blizzard coat of paint on it and added it to their game.

I don't use the term simply because of this, I'm still more attune to what WOW was called, an EQ clone. What was EQ? a M59 clone. What were SWG and EVE? 3D UO clones. The one game that really hasn't been cloned is more or less DAOC.

What I don't like the idea of is that the MMO has become a bad design, which is more or less the message with "WOW clone" usage. Then again I haven't burnt myself out by attempting to play each and every one that gets released, even though I really didn't like playing it to begin with.

 

 

I think you use the word "clone" a bit too liberally.  Almost every game is influenced by games that came before it, but this does not mean it's a "clone."  IMHO a "clone" is a game that heavily emulates another game AND brings nothing significantly new to the table.

I would not call EQ an M59 clone because EQ brought enough new innovations and experiences to the table to be an individual experience.

Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?

  mastersomrat

Novice Member

Joined: 12/17/10
Posts: 368

6/14/11 9:27:53 AM#10

The issue with useing the phrase "WoW close" is that WoW its' self is a Clone.

  Gereth

Novice Member

Joined: 5/17/11
Posts: 20

If it isnt broke dont fix it !

6/14/11 9:32:34 AM#11

The problem with terming everything WoW clone is it isnt a correct term ... Wow it self is a clone of several games that came out befor it.

 

I think the issue everyone has is the enormus group of people that think wow is the begining of the MMO Genre. When it just isnt. Besides the fact most people are tired of hearing about the game. Yes yes we know there are 10million people playing it but its at the end of its life. I was a long time WoW player and stopped one i relized Cata was a joke of an expansion.

 

just 2 more cents put in there.

Honor, Valor, Truth are in the heart of the true and the one.

- Gereth Deepdale

  Elidien

Novice Member

Joined: 11/14/09
Posts: 1080

6/14/11 9:32:46 AM#12

The only people who use the term "WOW clone" are the ones who are too lazy and do not want to think logically about the similarities between games. No, they rather throw out this over-used term to voice their frustration/anger/displeasure.etc.... without knowing what it really means.

Besides, the only association with the term WOW clone is a neagtive one and it is only used in a negative way. That is why when I see the term used, it immediately discredits the post/article/etc.... to me.

  Distopia

Drifter

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15628

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

6/14/11 9:37:57 AM#13
Originally posted by Creslin321
Originally posted by Malickie

Whether it's in our heads or not I couldn't care less. I've been around long enough to know WOW has for the most part done nothing new. Even a lot of their newer additions were aspects they picked up from newer games in development. They put the blizzard coat of paint on it and added it to their game.

I don't use the term simply because of this, I'm still more attune to what WOW was called, an EQ clone. What was EQ? a M59 clone. What were SWG and EVE? 3D UO clones. The one game that really hasn't been cloned is more or less DAOC.

What I don't like the idea of is that the MMO has become a bad design, which is more or less the message with "WOW clone" usage. Then again I haven't burnt myself out by attempting to play each and every one that gets released, even though I really didn't like playing it to begin with.

 

 

I would not call EQ an M59 clone because EQ brought enough new innovations and experiences to the table to be an individual experience.

Couldn't this argument be made for most MMO's though? I mean does a person playing WAR have the same experience in game as a person playing WOW? I didn't. 

What about AOC or LOTRO? Didn't again.

People frequently referred to SWG as a UO clone, yet the experience was hardly identical. WHat I experienced in AOC was hardly Identical to what I experienced in WOW. Yet the term is applied. IMO it's just tunnel vision, burnout or a combination of the two.

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  Marcus-

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/28/06
Posts: 968

6/14/11 9:38:15 AM#14
Originally posted by mastersomrat

The issue with useing the phrase "WoW close" is that WoW its' self is a Clone.

 Sure, but when the developers are making the 50th "WoW clone", they don't want "EQ Clone" money that went with EQ, they want WoW again, and everything that came with it.

 

Which in my opinion, isn't going to happen.

 

but they keep trying thos rascals!

 

So, maybe he's right, its just not gamers calling them WoW clones, but developers too... Its a conspiracy!!1!!1!!!!!

  Vonatar

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/18/10
Posts: 582

6/14/11 9:43:52 AM#15

"WoW clone" is just a lazy form of expression, mainly because WoW is the current point of reference for the industry. But essentially almost every game that comes out is a "clone" of some other game - that's evolution for you.

WoW, as well all know and are tired of hearing, is the evolutionary heir of the generation of MMOs that preceeded it, and now we are looking at the next generation of evolutionary heirs.

The only problem is that WoW became such a sensation that most publishers/developers are scared to stray too far from what they think made WoW so popular and profitable, and in turn games which try to move far from the WoW core seem to fail. All the mainstream MMO makers want to achieve what Blizzard achieved. So I think this next generation is somewhat stunted in development as a result of the behemoth that precedes them.

In my view people should stop using the term because it's meaningless. Raging that games are WoW clones is not really the publisher/developers fault, but rather our fault as consumers for making WoW into such a beast that companies want to emulate. We have to accept that this is the way things will be for a while, until the MMO market diversifies and WoW fades into the past so that new ideas and approaches have a genuine chance to succeed.

  BillyJimBob

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/02/11
Posts: 35

6/14/11 9:44:19 AM#16

I do not think this phrase means what you think it means.

  Distopia

Drifter

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15628

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

6/14/11 9:48:11 AM#17
Originally posted by BillyJimBob

I do not think this phrase means what you think it means.

Well to be honest if this is Jeff Strain speaking, I think it's just more of his pandering to the choir. Because lets be honest he's a game dev, what better way to sell your product but carry the popular gamer line? Studio asks for certain elements, he says studio's asked for a WOW clone. Devs can view forums as easy as we can...

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  AcidDK

Novice Member

Joined: 9/02/10
Posts: 85

6/14/11 10:00:44 AM#18

Whether a game is a WoW clone or not depends on how you define it. There are two ways to define a WoW clone:

 

  1. A game made to achieve the success of WoW by being similar to WoW regarding game design, gameplay, game world, and/or graphics.
  2. A game made to be as similar to (or exactly like) WoW as possible, but is not WoW.
 
Now, as I recall no games are made to be as similar to WoW as possible. A lot of games match the first definition though, so on the one hand we have a definition that matches a lot of games and on the other hand we have a definition that matches no game. This is why people get confused when people use the term 'WoW clone' about a game, since some people refer to the first definition and other people refer to the second definition.
 
Now, who are right? I would say both are, but regardless of who is right people should come to terms with what a certain term means before starting a flame war. So instead of starting a flame war when the term 'WoW clone' appears in a thread, simply figure out what definition one is referring to in the giving context of the topic, and if it is ambiguous then simply ask. A lot of arguments start because one of the involved parts made an assumption.
  Daffid011

Old School

Joined: 1/03/04
Posts: 7652

6/14/11 10:02:51 AM#19

While wow is something of an EQ clone (and other games) it plays very different from those games.  The gameplay experience between the two games is so different most don't feel that they are a clone of each other. 

On the flip side most new games have such similar mechanics and gameplay that it almost immediately feels like playing WoW.  There is almost nothing new that needs to be learned or explained.   In that respect these games do feel like wow clones.  At the same time they feel nothing like EQ, so they are appropriately not called EQ clones (or whatever other game clone).

 

I don't think using the term WoW clone means to imply that WoW was somehow the first to do something or didn't steal inspiration from previous games.   Just that certain games almost completely emulate the gameplay of WoW and not EQ (or some other game). 

 

It is just to bad that there are not some true EQ, UO, DAOC clones to offset topics like this. 

  Marcus-

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/28/06
Posts: 968

6/14/11 10:10:44 AM#20
Originally posted by Daffid011

While wow is something of an EQ clone (and other games) it plays very different from those games.  The gameplay experience between the two games is so different most don't feel that they are a clone of each other. 

On the flip side most new games have such similar mechanics and gameplay that it almost immediately feels like playing WoW.  There is almost nothing new that needs to be learned or explained.   In that respect these games do feel like wow clones.  At the same time they feel nothing like EQ, so they are appropriately not called EQ clones (or whatever other game clone).

 

I don't think using the term WoW clone means to imply that WoW was somehow the first to do something or didn't steal inspiration from previous games.   Just that certain games almost completely emulate the gameplay of WoW and not EQ (or some other game). 

 

It is just to bad that there are not some true EQ, UO, DAOC clones to offset topics like this. 

 I would love for gamers to be able to "insult" my current MMO by calling it a DAOC or UO clone.

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