I'm really getting tired of the people running around screaming WoW clone, it really shows these people are not even bothering to research the game before they come out to yell that.  ToR has, companions who you send of missions that they complete while your offline, dark, light, and gray alignment + equipment that is alignment specific. Real time crafting, active cover, social points, cut scenes that show off the victors at the end of your warzones, unreal tourny style capture the objective pvp, branching path instances that change based on dialog choices, comendations for pvp, long distance interaction with quest npcs for the party, personal story quests with long term consequences, as well a codex with exploration rewards. WoW's got pretty much none of that, it is also an auto attack game, without story.

The game has come a long way since it was announced years ago, I suggest anyone thinking of playing ToR sign up for the Beta or preorder it for the beta when that comes around. If you don't like it then don't buy it, no one is putting a gun to your head to make you do it.  Post DA2 I was pretty much going there is no way I am getting ToR, but after seeing what they have done I have changed my mind, I look forward to the game.

I don't see the staff as TOR haters at all.  I think the entire staff is quite open and enjoy different things.  They want to play fun games like anyone else.  Cautious Optimism applies to EVERYGAME.  TOR/TSW/GW2/Archage all have HUGE promises.  The staff is willing to give all of them a chance.  It seems some people are not willing to do the same for unbaised reasons.  "GW2 isn't an MMO", "TOR is Mainstream", "Archage is a sandbox themepark, ew!" etc.

I do think most of the staff at LEAST gives things a fair view. They don't judge a game because it's indie, or Bioware, or Blizzard, or minecraft.  If they enjoy it or not, they let it be known with PERSONAL reasons as well as pros/cons of the game unrelated to opinion.

But, outside of that, the posters on this forum, many of them have hate for TOR.  They already "know" the game is bad.  Yet they praise their game, with a tiny amount of players, or a different game that is not out yet.  It's quite silly at times.

I think its a good article, overall we should all be excited for TOR as it could usher in a new era and style of MMOs. On the other hand I've played far to many games that have let me down so in my mind its always a good thing to go in cautious. So my hopes go with TOR and I'm very excited to see the game get released, Bioware has a lot of great upcoming products, TOR and ME3 both look great and if they live up to their promises because if they do their future will be bright.

hopefully TOR will be the one to dethrone wow... then the industry can move on and we can all quit this clone bs... >_<

I just wish that TOR had an offline version, as the personal stories and the setting are really the only things that draw me to this game.

i personally find it refreshing to see a company such as mmorpg speaking their minds and being honest about it all.. their are too many people in the gameing industry that walk round with their eyes shut telling their selves lies..

for instance take a look at all the wow fans, you knock on wow in a forum for so long and they all come out of the woodwork trying to find ways to say wow is the best mmo ever developped!!

how the hell do these guys know, most of them have only ever played wow or maybe at a push 4-5 mmorpg's in their entire lives.  the answer is blind devoation, they are lieing to them selves based of information fed to them and the only experience they have of an mmo game..

its kinda sad really that people go to these lengths to support the things they personally like which is only because they havnt experienced anything more or better so they stick with what they know. its a common human flaw!.

i strongly recomend that every person playing mmo's tries all diffrent genres and types of play.. rather than just loving the first thing they see..

truth is, those that have patience find more fullfilment from a deep content filled game where they are incontrol than they do from games such as wow.

i dont hate wow i despise it, wow is the sole reason for all these half hearted games we see today, wow set the industry standard for proffits and sales so naturally the way they have done things is very appealing to smaller companies and larger companies alike, the result is every one c ashing in that particular style of game creation. and the result is a market flooded with lots of the same products with slightly diffrent variations.. this means all the good games get covered over and hid away under the rubble of this wow crap and its clones.

and swtor looks and sounds and unfolds just the same as wow!! its not new its not diffrent its the same exact thing we have been getting for the past 6-7 years. mundane hand held game play that ends..

eve doesnt end darkfall doesnt mortal online doesnt end.....  they are propper mmo's they give the player power and control they allow you to fully explore the potential of an unrestricted fantasy world..  thats what an mmo is supposed to be.

i guess people today are so lacking in imagination that they are simply incapable of thinking for them selves and makeing their own decisions.  and the developers of wow lotro rift and all those other clones know this.

I do not care if its a MMO "enabled" version of the DragonAge2/ME3, it will be fun.  After I am done going through a few of the strories, and notice there is no "elder game" I am fine with that.  If I quit an MMO or did not atleast try it because of something trival, like space combat or innovative pvp,  I would never play another MMO again.  The only competiton for my buck against this game thats not ME3, Diablo 3, or Skyrim is GW2, and GW2 does not look as innovative as it would have you believe. 

I really suspect that SWTOR might just fail miserably.  They (Bioware / EA) are being far too secretive about their game.  And they are, by their own admission, "worried" about the "competition.  So they are holding off, second guessing themselves, and finding reasons to delay the release... Until there is some competition.  At which point they will fail, just like they thought they would.  Because people will be tired of their hype, and other games like Diablo 3 and Guild Wars 2 will syphon off enough of the market for them to come in far below their initial expectations.  And when that happens EA will mandate changes that will wreck most of the "community" that try to stick it out.

See, what they've done is lost their "vision" for what SWTOR should be.  And without that vision its inevitable that they will fail.  Because nothing great has ever been accomplished without vision and the will to see it made reality.

"Cautious Optimism" is perfect for staying in neutral territory and not making any predictions good or bad.

Now what is your opinion today if this game turns out to be just ok or decent but nothing groundbreaking? Would the review say well it will improve over time (pay to play beta mode like some games are released). I hope not but what are the chances for that scenario happening? 

All I got to say is Outfit Tab and some more alien'ish races. other than that the games looking good imo.

I actually like the art style they chose. Not really cartoony but not to real either.

Originally posted by Cannyone

I really suspect that SWTOR might just fail miserably.  They (Bioware / EA) are being far too secretive about their game.  And they are, by their own admission, "worried" about the "competition.  So they are holding off, second guessing themselves, and finding reasons to delay the release... Until there is some competition.  At which point they will fail, just like they thought they would.  Because people will be tired of their hype, and other games like Diablo 3 and Guild Wars 2 will syphon off enough of the market for them to come in far below their initial expectations.  And when that happens EA will mandate changes that will wreck most of the "community" that try to stick it out.

See, what they've done is lost their "vision" for what SWTOR should be.  And without that vision its inevitable that they will fail.  Because nothing great has ever been accomplished without vision and the will to see it made reality.

Did you just criticize Bioware for prolonged hype and mention Diablo 3 in the same paragraph? On second glance you did.... Wow... just wow.

How can you say they lost their vision? WIthout actually seeing the end result?

Bioware has always been known to delay as much as possible, just as Blizzard does, that's what separates studios such as them from the rest..uhg why bother...

Alot of people compare this to Dragon Age and Mass Effect because of how choices are done but tell me how many actually played those games more than twice before moving onto another game ?  Besides it being in the Star Wars universe, I don't know what is so exciting about it ? As a kid I grew up loving Star Wars to pieces but somehow the way Bioware is making it doesn't get gamer inside me pumped up for this as much as I want to be. We'll see how it goes.

Originally posted by SaintViktor

Alot of people compare this to Dragon Age and Mass Effect because of how choices are done but tell me how many actually played those games more than twice before moving onto another game ?  Besides it being in the Star Wars universe, I don't know what is so exciting about it ? As a kid I grew up loving Star Wars to pieces but somehow the way Bioware is making it doesn't get gamer inside me pumped up for this as much as I want to be. We'll see how it goes.

 

Since SoE is down I have become very familar with ME/ME2/DA/DA2, having beaten them all many times.  If ToR has half the quality and polish of those its worth the initial buy.

Originally posted by zaylin

All I got to say is Outfit Tab and some more alien'ish races. other than that the games looking good imo.

I actually like the art style they chose. Not really cartoony but not to real either.

 

Gotta say I agree with ya on the races and tab ideas.

Originally posted by SaintViktor

Alot of people compare this to Dragon Age and Mass Effect because of how choices are done but tell me how many actually played those games more than twice before moving onto another game ?  Besides it being in the Star Wars universe, I don't know what is so exciting about it ? As a kid I grew up loving Star Wars to pieces but somehow the way Bioware is making it doesn't get gamer inside me pumped up for this as much as I want to be. We'll see how it goes.

I understand your point, but think about this. Why do people play through them twice? Is it not because they want to catch things they missed before and see other angles? Especially when you take KOTOR into account. As it had two sides to play from. Now consider this game will have 8 different Stories to play through four to each side, each having multiple branching paths.

If the typical player plays through a normal Bioware game twice, which can take hundreds of hours depending on a players pacing. How long would it take to do so in TOR, also considering there are other stories to see outside of these main quests. Each indvidual class story is estimated to clock in at over 100 hours.

Play through all once that's 800 hours of gameplay, twice 1600. That's a crap ton of content, and that's just launch content. Now consider there are other things to do, like crafting, grouping/guilding and pvping.

Now consider they do add a steady flow of new story content. The amount of content available at launch , is bound to keep those enjoying themselves busy for quite a while, which buys them an ample amount of time to add new things to the mix.

Originally posted by Malickie

Originally posted by SaintViktor

Alot of people compare this to Dragon Age and Mass Effect because of how choices are done but tell me how many actually played those games more than twice before moving onto another game ?  Besides it being in the Star Wars universe, I don't know what is so exciting about it ? As a kid I grew up loving Star Wars to pieces but somehow the way Bioware is making it doesn't get gamer inside me pumped up for this as much as I want to be. We'll see how it goes.

I understand your point, but think about this. Why do people play through them twice? Is it not because they want to catch things they missed before and see other angles? Especially when you take KOTOR into account. As it had two sides to play from. Now consider this game will have 8 different Stories to play through four to each side, each having multiple branching paths.

If the typical player plays through a normal Bioware game twice, which can take hundreds of hours depending on a players pacing. How long would it take to do so in TOR, also considering there are other stories to see outside of these main quests. Each indvidual class story is estimated to clock in at over 100 hours.

Play through all once that's 800 hours of gameplay, twice 1600. That's a crap ton of content, and that's just launch content. Now consider there are other things to do, like crafting, grouping/guilding and pvping.

Now consider they do add a steady flow of new story content. The amount of content available at launch , is bound to keep those enjoying themselves busy for quite a while, which buys them an ample amount of time to add new things to the mix.

I know I read some where recently, maybe MMORPG, that the average time it would take to max lvl is 200hours.  Now I do not know if that means your story will be over or if it will still be in progress.  So 1600 before even rerolling for a second run is possible.

Originally posted by Malickie

Originally posted by SaintViktor

Alot of people compare this to Dragon Age and Mass Effect because of how choices are done but tell me how many actually played those games more than twice before moving onto another game ?  Besides it being in the Star Wars universe, I don't know what is so exciting about it ? As a kid I grew up loving Star Wars to pieces but somehow the way Bioware is making it doesn't get gamer inside me pumped up for this as much as I want to be. We'll see how it goes.

I understand your point, but think about this. Why do people play through them twice? Is it not because they want to catch things they missed before and see other angles? Especially when you take KOTOR into account. As it had two sides to play from. Now consider this game will have 8 different Stories to play through four to each side, each having multiple branching paths.

If the typical player plays through a normal Bioware game twice, which can take hundreds of hours depending on a players pacing. How long would it take to do so in TOR, also considering there are other stories to see outside of these main quests. Each indvidual class story is estimated to clock in at over 100 hours.

Play through all once that's 800 hours of gameplay, twice 1600. That's a crap ton of content, and that's just launch content. Now consider there are other things to do, like crafting, grouping/guilding and pvping.

Now consider they do add a steady flow of new story content. The amount of content available at launch , is bound to keep those enjoying themselves busy for quite a while, which buys them an ample amount of time to add new things to the mix.

 I belive the devs and such have stated more like up wards of 300ish hours for each class :P.  but im not really trying to correct you,more so agree that there will be a shit ton to do when TOR launches and enough to give them time for content updates..imo. Hell Ive put 247 hours on rift (with one class) since a week after launch playing semi casual.  

Originally posted by ashfallen

Originally posted by Malickie

Originally posted by SaintViktor

Alot of people compare this to Dragon Age and Mass Effect because of how choices are done but tell me how many actually played those games more than twice before moving onto another game ?  Besides it being in the Star Wars universe, I don't know what is so exciting about it ? As a kid I grew up loving Star Wars to pieces but somehow the way Bioware is making it doesn't get gamer inside me pumped up for this as much as I want to be. We'll see how it goes.

I understand your point, but think about this. Why do people play through them twice? Is it not because they want to catch things they missed before and see other angles? Especially when you take KOTOR into account. As it had two sides to play from. Now consider this game will have 8 different Stories to play through four to each side, each having multiple branching paths.

If the typical player plays through a normal Bioware game twice, which can take hundreds of hours depending on a players pacing. How long would it take to do so in TOR, also considering there are other stories to see outside of these main quests. Each indvidual class story is estimated to clock in at over 100 hours.

Play through all once that's 800 hours of gameplay, twice 1600. That's a crap ton of content, and that's just launch content. Now consider there are other things to do, like crafting, grouping/guilding and pvping.

Now consider they do add a steady flow of new story content. The amount of content available at launch , is bound to keep those enjoying themselves busy for quite a while, which buys them an ample amount of time to add new things to the mix.

I know I read some where recently, maybe MMORPG, that the average time it would take to max lvl is 200hours.  Now I do not know if that means your story will be over or if it will still be in progress.  So 1600 before even rerolling for a second run is possible.

Yeah that's Bioware's official word on their estimated playthrough time. I was attempting to down-play that to calculate in the typical MMO gamer and their rush to endgame.

 He said she said Bullshtuff is what I say. They have issues with what you write about? So?

What it sounds to me is these artists who are called developers can't take any criticism what so ever when dealing with opinions toward their product.

You actually care how they think of your reviews of their products? Are they paying you? Does their overall taste or view of you effect your job? Well I guess when it comes to ads it does huh. Oh well. Glad I don't have that pressure.

I'm not really picking I just think it's kind of funny that you actually keep up with that bunch of crap. Take a breather stop going to those sites. It's just an idea.

Stick to your true nature. Your unbiased for the most part. More so than most, but I understand that's why your sensitive to warped views about what you write. Like making calls at a big game. You want to be true, but the fans of their own teams whine about stuff instead of treating it as a game. 

It's ok. People are people and it always hits close to home when they judge something you enjoy doing.

On TOR: I think the game could be interesting and Bioware so far has done pretty good with their games. Until it comes out though I don't judge cause I am not buying into it before I see a trial and actually see myself enjoying it past the first 30 minutes.

On Rift: I tried it, and I'm sure it appeals to many of the demographic they were aiming for. Myself I didn't favor it.

@ Ebil_Piwat - Midichlorians. I don't normally hate things, but that concept I hated. Why couldn't it have just stayed the Force? =P

Originally posted by Jumdor

 He said she said Bullshtuff is what I say. They have issues with what you write about? So?

What it sounds to me is these artists who are called developers can't take any criticism what so ever when dealing with opinions toward their product.

You actually care how they think of your reviews of their products? Are they paying you? Does their overall taste or view of you effect your job? Well I guess when it comes to ads it does huh. Oh well. Glad I don't have that pressure.

I'm not really picking I just think it's kind of funny that you actually keep up with that bunch of crap. Take a breather stop going to those sites. It's just an idea.

Stick to your true nature. Your unbiased for the most part. More so than most, but I understand that's why your sensitive to warped views about what you write. Like making calls at a big game. You want to be true, but the fans of their own teams whine about stuff instead of treating it as a game. 

It's ok. People are people and it always hits close to home when they judge something you enjoy doing.

On TOR: I think the game could be interesting and Bioware so far has done pretty good with their games. Until it comes out though I don't judge cause I am not buying into it before I see a trial and actually see myself enjoying it past the first 30 minutes.

On Rift: I tried it, and I'm sure it appeals to many of the demographic they were aiming for. Myself I didn't favor it.

@ Ebil_Piwat - Midichlorians. I don't normally hate things, but that concept I hated. Why couldn't it have just stayed the Force? =P

 

 

its late so maybe im misreading you, and sorry if i am.  but he wasn't saying that the devs at bioware were saying the people here hate on the game.  He was saying that people on the TOR official forum were saying that.  unless the devs were using second secret accounts of course. ;)