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News & Features Discussion  » Rift: Scott Hartsman Talks v1.1

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58 posts found
  GenreNinja

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/19/07
Posts: 159

Live a Life Less Ordinary, Even if it isn't your own! Support the RPG Community!

4/26/11 8:44:14 PM#41

I think it's disheartening that we're looking at "the beginning of 2012" and its not even halfway through 2011...


It is apparent to me there is some sort of disconnect from Developers, Players, and Quality Experiences.


We've lost track about the EXPERIENCE we want a PLAYER to have. Not their character, not the raid boss, Not the NPCs, the PLAYER needs an experience. When the player is playing the game they should be engaged... I havn't been engaged in years and it's not for lack of trying.


---

Live a life less ordinary.

  Ashreal

Novice Member

Joined: 3/19/04
Posts: 42

4/26/11 8:58:39 PM#42
Originally posted by dreamer05
1) They are not looking to do cross server dungeons, just single server dungeons.  Research please.
 
2) The servers even during week day off prime time still all maintain a medium population health.
 
3) If you seriously use the world grind when referring to Rift OR Wow then you must be delusional.  Neither of those games are grinds.  WoW has the fastest leveling progression I have ever heard of and Rift isn't far behind.  You people using the word grind to describe either of these games need to go back in time and play old school EQ or DAoC, you don't know what grind is.

/agreed

I love Rift!  And for those people who are WoW fanatics, leave Rift if you don't like it it's really that simple. :)

Ashreal D'Synn - Shadowlover & Death's handmaiden

  Nitth

Elite Member

Joined: 7/29/10
Posts: 3494

Magic Propels my Rolly Chair.

4/26/11 9:00:40 PM#43
Originally posted by dreamer05
1) They are not looking to do cross server dungeons, just single server dungeons.  Research please.
 
2) The servers even during week day off prime time still all maintain a medium population health.
 
3) If you seriously use the world grind when referring to Rift OR Wow then you must be delusional.  Neither of those games are grinds.  WoW has the fastest leveling progression I have ever heard of and Rift isn't far behind.  You people using the word grind to describe either of these games need to go back in time and play old school EQ or DAoC, you don't know what grind is.

 

Internally they must be thinking about implimenting xrealm lfg.

Puting down a framework for a shard lfg system is just a prelude for a server wide one. there not going to invest in something that cannot be expanded.

 

Edit:

In regards to world of warcraft, They implimented the lfg tool in 3 major stages over a peroid of time:

1. was the basic gui that would advertise for parties

2. lfg tool forms your party for you, from the pool on your realm.

3.lfg tool assembles your party, from a xrealm pool, and your teleported right to your instance.

 

imo rift is at the 1.5 stage


TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development

  dreamer05

Novice Member

Joined: 7/18/05
Posts: 546

4/26/11 9:02:59 PM#44
Originally posted by Duster505

Originally posted by dreamer05



1) They are not looking to do cross server dungeons, just single server dungeons.  Research please.


 


2) The servers even during week day off prime time still all maintain a medium population health.


 


3) If you seriously use the world grind when referring to Rift OR Wow then you must be delusional.  Neither of those games are grinds.  WoW has the fastest leveling progression I have ever heard of and Rift isn't far behind.  You people using the word grind to describe either of these games need to go back in time and play old school EQ or DAoC, you don't know what grind is.


 

2)  Yes... what do you think medium stands for 100 ppl online ?  1000 ppl ?


Get a clue that medium is a fixed number that TRION desides upon to make it look like servers are active.

Right... Because they really have already proven to be an uncaring, money hungry, manipulative, and tyrannical game company who only cares about selling copies.  Wrong.  Medium means exactly what it means.  And since neither of us can prove exactly how many medium is, I'm going to trust the company since their actions have been completely trust-worthy since day one.

"God, please help us sinful children of Ivalice.."

  dreamer05

Novice Member

Joined: 7/18/05
Posts: 546

4/26/11 9:04:21 PM#45
Originally posted by Mellkor
Originally posted by dreamer05
1) They are not looking to do cross server dungeons, just single server dungeons.  Research please.
 
2) The servers even during week day off prime time still all maintain a medium population health.
 
3) If you seriously use the world grind when referring to Rift OR Wow then you must be delusional.  Neither of those games are grinds.  WoW has the fastest leveling progression I have ever heard of and Rift isn't far behind.  You people using the word grind to describe either of these games need to go back in time and play old school EQ or DAoC, you don't know what grind is.

 

Internally they must be thinking about implimenting xrealm lfg.

Puting down a framework for a shard lfg system is just a prelude for a server wide one. there not going to invest in something that cannot be expanded.

And that is complete and utter speculation from someone who has absolutely no fact given by anyone on the development team.

"God, please help us sinful children of Ivalice.."

  Nitth

Elite Member

Joined: 7/29/10
Posts: 3494

Magic Propels my Rolly Chair.

4/26/11 9:07:06 PM#46
Originally posted by dreamer05
Originally posted by Mellkor
Originally posted by dreamer05
1) They are not looking to do cross server dungeons, just single server dungeons.  Research please.
 
2) The servers even during week day off prime time still all maintain a medium population health.
 
3) If you seriously use the world grind when referring to Rift OR Wow then you must be delusional.  Neither of those games are grinds.  WoW has the fastest leveling progression I have ever heard of and Rift isn't far behind.  You people using the word grind to describe either of these games need to go back in time and play old school EQ or DAoC, you don't know what grind is.

 

Internally they must be thinking about implimenting xrealm lfg.

Puting down a framework for a shard lfg system is just a prelude for a server wide one. there not going to invest in something that cannot be expanded.

And that is complete and utter speculation from someone who has absolutely no fact given by anyone on the development team.

Yes, it is speculation, but so is the guy saying rift has no plans at all for a xrealm lfg? we just dont know what goes on behind those internal meetings.

 

Read my edit, for past trends in lfg development


TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development

  Cik_Asalin

Novice Member

Joined: 8/29/04
Posts: 3091

4/26/11 9:37:00 PM#47

Isn't Scott Hartsman the reason why EQ2 tanked?  Wait....I came here looking for a fashionable pair of shoes.

  Solude

Novice Member

Joined: 5/23/08
Posts: 697

4/27/11 8:13:26 AM#48

Scott's awesome.  He just gets it.  And no that doesn't mean he gets the whiny vocal minority.  WoW is Rift Lite, not the other way around.  X-Server LFG might be in the plans... who cares other than the 5 people who think I actually give a crap about you and my server "community".  Hasn't been server communities since guilds were introduced oh way back in long bloody time ago.  Reacting to your customers is how you survive.  When you play the whole EQ1 vision thing... well you get entire webcomics dedicated to your silliness.  Trion has said and delivered that they will try things and if they go off... great, if they fail... they get pulled.  They aren't going to force feed the paying community what Trion wants but what the investers err players want.  Who da thunk giving people what they ask for would make them happy, crazy.


As to SW:TOR and GW2?  They have been on the hype train for a long long time.  TOR is pretty much guaranteed to not meet its numbers given dev comments lately... cough swimming cough... see FF XIV cough.  GW2 looks great, reads a little odd and demos like its just going to be a MOB grind.  It handles buffs in an interesting way but interesting can become annoying real fast.  Classes are more hybrids but the trinity is still present and accounted for, just more solo friendly for those typically support classes.


  User Deleted
4/27/11 8:34:31 AM#49
Originally posted by Elidien
Originally posted by Hyperbeam
 

Yeah, I was a major Rift fan for a while. However, after getting a character on both sides to the mid 20s, I started to remove my rose colored glasses and see some long term issues.

First and foremost, there are only two leveling paths, one per side. So if you ever level an alt, it will be the same stuff again and again.

"Oh, you can play all classes (souls) and do not need alts"...so you say and that brings in issues number 2.

Since one character can have multiple souls and roles, there is little need for alts. This is true. However, the downside is that for new or returning players, this empties out the low level zones and then negates (for the most part) Rifts and makes invasions almost pointless or worthless to participate in unless you want to die repeatedly and never get anything accomplished. it is almost as bad as what the /level 20 command did to DAOC.

See that's the thing that separates those who will blindly praise anything a game (Rift or otherwise) does or has, from those who look at everything objectively: Perspective and Experience.

I had the same concerns as you when I read about the systems that Rift uses, Elidien and it's part of what kept me away. The other part is it just feels too much like something I've already played before... several times. No, Rifts and Invasions are not enough to make it "a unique game experience". It's still the same game underneath.

Time will ultimately tell how it plays out, but I'm with you when you say that it's going to have a negative affect on lower level players as the first group of established players move on through the ranks and new players come in to find fewer and fewer other players at the low end.

Aside from the issues you mention, Rift's world design caters to that as well, and it goes back to the discussion of world-driven game design versus game-driven world design. Rift is definitely the latter. If the game world consists of a series of chronologically arranged quest hubs that players are funneled through, like a game of connect the dots, and none of those areas ever have any value or purpose beyond that... It almost guarantees that the game will become top heavy and newer players will find an emptier game world in the lower level areas. Every other MMO to follow that setup has turned out the same.

And, in every one of those other MMOs, there has been a group of players who insist that same fate won't befall their game, because it's "different" for "x", "y" and "z" reasons. Invariably... somewhere down the line, exactly what they insisted wouldn't happen, happens anyway.

When your game is designed like an assembly line with a one-way conveyor belt and very few side routes, there are very few other ways it can go.

 

 

  vampiyan

Novice Member

Joined: 11/23/10
Posts: 7

4/27/11 2:35:27 PM#50

Originally posted by wizlmtz




Originally posted by vampiyan





The guy is an excellent BSer... this game is WoW without arena and a diverse race selection. Level grind, crafting grind, dungeon grind, heroic grind, battleground grind, raid grind. Rinse and repeat with the occasional new content.








Gameplay is slow paced. Makes the redundant grind become very boring very quickly.








If you were like me and quit WoW to play... WoW lite... don't bother.








Not my cup of tea. It's 2011 and the MMO community is still doing the samething we were doing a decade ago but with upgraded graphics.







 




I couldnt agree more. I have to ask though, what have you quit rift to go play? 



 


 Sadly I am only playing console games. I love MMO's but there are none out that appeal to me. Even games on the horizon that look to have potential are korean made. So that is iffy. I guess I'll play GW2. I dno.


  vampiyan

Novice Member

Joined: 11/23/10
Posts: 7

4/27/11 2:39:17 PM#51

Originally posted by mackdawg19




Originally posted by vampiyan





The guy is an excellent BSer... this game is WoW without arena and a diverse race selection. Level grind, crafting grind, dungeon grind, heroic grind, battleground grind, raid grind. Rinse and repeat with the occasional new content.








Gameplay is slow paced. Makes the redundant grind become very boring very quickly.








If you were like me and quit WoW to play... WoW lite... don't bother.








Not my cup of tea. It's 2011 and the MMO community is still doing the samething we were doing a decade ago but with upgraded graphics.







 




This is exactly what has ruined it for me, no I'm not talking about RIFT, I'm talking about forums. Quit putting in your 2 cents telling people to not play a game, it's not needed. Just state your reasons and move on. Man oh man what I would give to go back to the days when forums were actually useful and debates were actually meaningful and something came out of it. Anyways, someone will quote me so I will end here. It's just sad, really sad .........



 


 Uhmm... read above the quote you highlighted? I listed several reasons why I did not enjoy my time in Rift. It was hardly a blanket statement.


It's cool if people are enjoying the game. I still have friends who play and have fun. It just wasn't for me. I'm not hating.


  Channce

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/22/04
Posts: 583

4/27/11 4:24:53 PM#52
Originally posted by vampiyan

The guy is an excellent BSer... this game is WoW without arena and a diverse race selection. Level grind, crafting grind, dungeon grind, heroic grind, battleground grind, raid grind. Rinse and repeat with the occasional new content.


Gameplay is slow paced. Makes the redundant grind become very boring very quickly.


If you were like me and quit WoW to play... WoW lite... don't bother.


Not my cup of tea. It's 2011 and the MMO community is still doing the samething we were doing a decade ago but with upgraded graphics.

 When you call anything after WoW a clone, lite version, whatever; it tells the rest of the MMO community that your first MMO was WoW and you are not to be taken seriously when discussing MMO's.

When I said i had "time", i meant virtual time, i got no RL "time" for you.

  mackdawg19

Tipster

Joined: 5/28/07
Posts: 868

"If men were created equal, then what happened to game developers?"

4/27/11 4:37:29 PM#53
Originally posted by vampiyan

Originally posted by mackdawg19




Originally posted by vampiyan





The guy is an excellent BSer... this game is WoW without arena and a diverse race selection. Level grind, crafting grind, dungeon grind, heroic grind, battleground grind, raid grind. Rinse and repeat with the occasional new content.








Gameplay is slow paced. Makes the redundant grind become very boring very quickly.








If you were like me and quit WoW to play... WoW lite... don't bother.








Not my cup of tea. It's 2011 and the MMO community is still doing the samething we were doing a decade ago but with upgraded graphics.







 



This is exactly what has ruined it for me, no I'm not talking about RIFT, I'm talking about forums. Quit putting in your 2 cents telling people to not play a game, it's not needed. Just state your reasons and move on. Man oh man what I would give to go back to the days when forums were actually useful and debates were actually meaningful and something came out of it. Anyways, someone will quote me so I will end here. It's just sad, really sad .........



 

 Uhmm... read above the quote you highlighted? I listed several reasons why I did not enjoy my time in Rift. It was hardly a blanket statement.


It's cool if people are enjoying the game. I still have friends who play and have fun. It just wasn't for me. I'm not hating.

You must of not read what I posted, so go ahead I will give you some time.

"If you were like me and quit WoW to play... WoW lite... don't bother."

It's the red highlight that had nothing to do about your time in RIFT. It had to do with you telling people NOT to play a game because you didn't like it. No offense, but you may want to read a post before you comment on it.

  vampiyan

Novice Member

Joined: 11/23/10
Posts: 7

4/27/11 4:56:35 PM#54

It is an opinion. It reminded me of WoW... only a lighter version... not as much content. Same gameplay, same classes, same progression, same grind. Hence if someone is tired of WoW and looking for a new MMO then Rift probably isn't your answer because it is more of the same. Derp. That was so hard to comprehend? Give it time. It'll come to you.


Funny. Many more people agreed with me than didnt.


And no... my first MMO wasn't WoW. It's nice to finally meet the person who speaks for the entire MMO community though. Sign my sig? Since you know so much... what MMO does Rift remind you of? Wait... does it start with a W? No way!

  Solude

Novice Member

Joined: 5/23/08
Posts: 697

4/28/11 8:39:36 AM#55

WoW has 32 classes now?  Cool I should totally come back =P


Most people who liked WoW but are tired of it has nothing to do with gameplay and everything to do with they've played the game.  Frankly I find it kind of retarded for people to play the same content month after month let alone year after year when something similar is available that is completely new.


Now that'll go for Rift too if in a year we're all still running the same dungeons every day.  But given WoW is on 4-6 month cycles and Rift is on 4-6 weeks... oh and do enjoy the completely broken 4.1 =P  Should be nice hold over until they bring class skills down to 4 like GC talks about /facepalm


The joke... WoW is number 2 easy and miles ahead of number 3.


  DANYDEMON

Novice Member

Joined: 9/16/06
Posts: 1

4/30/11 8:50:31 PM#56

Lets face it people Rift is ok the same as WoW is, no good, no bad just in between, Rift is traying to apeal to the older players, in the mean time WoW is aiming for Parents walets, WoW has been wattering down with every update, Rift on the other hand has a matture feel but will eventually go the same way if we wana talk about serius MMORPG gaming then the only one ever made to give you a sence of accomplishment and also drive you crazy was the first 3 builds of Ultima Online, if an MMo is release with the same fetures, skill system and updated graphics to back it up i belive it can probably take down WoW and any competitor, well ill keep my hopes up.


By the way in case any one asks the futures im talking about are:


1-Small amount of quest the way to get skills is walk out of town c a monster kill it if u can, this gives exploration a big meaning.


2-Skills no LVLs but your skill proficiency increases with use god i remember how long it took me to become a Grand Master Blacksmith lol fun times


3-Houses, Castles, Boats, Diferent mounts so amazing to own your own castle. and put it were you like so that enione exploring the world will come across.


this are the things i belive MMOs are laking now a days but thats my opinion.


  unzubaru

Novice Member

Joined: 8/11/06
Posts: 8

5/01/11 7:18:52 PM#57

Omfg, listen to all you whiners on here.


 


There's always some douche who get's the whole point of these comments OT.


 


What I loved about this interview is the fact that Scott said they're focusing on W-PvP, one of the main complaints on the RIFT forums. And I also love it that you guys are whining that he listens to players suggestions LOLOLOLOL!! You're all such fickle bastards (Yes "bro" I'm fking mad), if any of you played Aion, or for that matter an NCSoft game, SHAME ON YOU!!! The main concern all you QQ-tards had was that they never listen to there customers, and now that we have someone who actually DOES, you all call him a liar and a bullshitter!


 


Look, his track record may not be amazing, but then who's is (Peter Molyneaux you hyping bastard).


 


You guys fail to understand that this game is in its early stages, being run by a new studio. The launch was excellently smooth and after having several MMO companies being bitched at about there lack of ears for their players, these guys really listen to the community.


 


Will the MMO community ever be satisfied with ANY type of customer support?


  draconis666

Novice Member

Joined: 9/11/08
Posts: 4

5/03/11 1:46:27 PM#58

Originally posted by gatheris



i love this game




maybe it is because i did not play WOW beyond its first three months since from what i have read those who left WOW to play Rift don't seem to be impressed




 




the important thing is i'm having fun - so all the arguments on either side mean nothing to me




looking forward to what Trion comes up with for this game



 


I agree. Rift hits the stuff I like to do in a game. I like having alts and having different builds to play with. This game makes it easy for me. I have Soulful with all of my alts by lvl 15.


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