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Alganon

Alganon 

General Discussion  » Alganon - seems to be moving in the right direction

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107 posts found
  rhinok

Novice Member

Joined: 2/01/07
Posts: 1813

 
OP  12/16/10 12:09:09 AM#1
I'm pretty impressed with how things seem to be shaping up:
  • The team is cranking out patches and adding new PvP content
  • QO is removing chat restrictions for free players - critical, IMO.  That negates one of my concerns with the revenue model and is, frankly, the one that's most obvious so new players.
  • Derek's starting to market the game through interviews and advertising
  • The community, albeit small is nice and seems dedicated
While I'm critical of Alganon (I believe constructively), it should be obvious from my posts that I like the game.  I just think it needs work and I have some issues with the revenue model.  That being said, I've never thought it wasn't being worked on.  It's obvious the team is dedicated and passionate about what they do.  That's a great thing.
 
I really do hope Quest Online and the game succeed!
 
-Ripper
  Elmarolly

Novice Member

Joined: 2/23/10
Posts: 63

12/16/10 2:52:11 AM#2

 

"The community, albeit small is nice and seems dedicated"

 

Yeah small is not the word. Most days and nights there is maybe 10 players online at once. What I find real funny is Smrt is saying

"Despite what you might read elsewhere, make no mistake, our numbers are growing rapidly and we expect to hit the 100K active user milestone very soon if the current metrics continue to track as they have been."

100k active users soon?. Where and when are even 1000 active users. Not sure when that "soon" is but it must be years down the road. You would think with even lets say 50k users there would be more then 30 users online at one time between both servers. ////////////////////////////

Keep the faith, maybe it might work out for QOL.

  dsmart

Novice Member

Joined: 3/25/10
Posts: 201

12/16/10 6:01:57 AM#3

Obviously just because we are approaching the 100K active accounts mark, doesn't mean that they are all online at the same time. You either believe it or not, but yeah we're going to be hitting the number pretty soon.

And these are not numbers of created accounts. We have detailed metrics which track created accounts, activated accounts, accounts that have entered and played the game, accounts that have bought something, when, how etc.

I didn't want to, but I specifically revealed those numbers to make a point. The game is growing because of all the work that we've done on it, the marketing effort being put behind it and the fact that it is a good game. It's not for everyone and we don't profess that to be the case, but there it is.

Dissenting opinions are all well and good, but it is pointless to voice dissent just for the hell of it and because you don't like the game. We get it, you don't like it, you want thousands of people online at the same time. Whatever.

Game developers are just human beings who happen to make games for a living.
If you want to hold us up to higher standards of conduct, then go ahead
...but don't be surprised if we don't uphold them.

  terroni

Novice Member

Joined: 4/03/10
Posts: 941

12/16/10 8:18:15 AM#4

How does one come to the near 100,000 number?

Actively played in X amount of time? Played to X level?

A MMO is nothing without an active community.

Drop the next-gen marketing and people will argue if the game itself has merit.

  MadDemon64

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/19/08
Posts: 1091

Why is it that fantasy trolls are vulnerable to fire, but internet trolls thrive on flame wars?

12/16/10 12:58:20 PM#5

Moving in the right direction or not, I have small expectations for Alganon, especially given the less than warm welcome I recieved on the forums when I posted my opinion of the game, and when I responded to someone's post asking for reviews with links to the only reviews that I could find (all of which had nothing good to say about the game).  Lets face facts: Alganon's community is indeed dedicated and initially friendly, but if you show that you have an opinion regarding the game that is different from the others, they turn on you faster than a pack of blue sharks turning on an injured comrade.  I do not want to be a part of any game with that kind of community.  If Alganon is going to win back my trust, they are going to have to make their community open to criticism, and thats just for starters.

Since when is Tuesday a direction?

  Elmarolly

Novice Member

Joined: 2/23/10
Posts: 63

12/16/10 3:50:04 PM#6

 

Alganon did have a great community and almost all knew what was wrong with the game and voiced their views on how to improve the game. But alas almost all of those gamers have moved on. Their views were snuffed out or were told that their were trolling by the Cyber Bully.  Not much left of the once great community that wrote well thought out comments or would help with in game problems.

 

@Smart

Funny, but if the game has almost 100k active users. I would love to see more then 20 online at one time. So no I am not asking for thousands of players. But to have 20 to 30 online on one server to adventure with would be grand. 

[Mod Edit]

  DLangley

Novice Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 1430

12/16/10 3:57:52 PM#7

Let's cut out any snide remarks you may feel like putting in your posts guys. It does nothing but insult other users. Keep the discussion on topic and civil. Argue the topic, not with the other user.

  Emeraq

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/07/06
Posts: 932

12/16/10 9:53:31 PM#8
Originally posted by Elmarolly

 

"The community, albeit small is nice and seems dedicated"

 

Yeah small is not the word. Most days and nights there is maybe 10 players online at once. What I find real funny is Smrt is saying

 I have to agree with you. I tried playing this game for a couple of weeks before thanksgiving (like the first two weeks of November), and it was much better than I remember during beta and the game does have some nice features. The problem was I never saw more than 7 players on, at any given time, including weekends, and that was on both servers. Most days I never saw more than 2 or 3 players on. So it became pointless to even continue playing.

You can use the time zone argument if you want, but as I mentioned I tried at various times and got the same results.

With that said, I don't hate the game, there are some nice things about the game. The studying feature, as an example, is a nice touch, but in my opinion it is implemented all wrong. It makes little sense to me to be studying magic, or crafting, etc while your smashing creatures skulls in. I feel a better way to have implented that is if you are studying something like alchemy, (just an example) you shouldn't be able to do it while fighting, or smithing etc. Studying would be better suited while you are offline, and what you do is plant your character in a laboratory with enough ingredients/containers to get through a study session. You set your character to study and then you are safe to log off.

  FrodoFragins

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/29/10
Posts: 2784

12/20/10 7:27:29 PM#9

I'm curious how he defines active account.  Is that how many people have created an account since the games inception?  If that number includes players that haven't logged in in months, then the use of the word "active" is misleading.

 

Regardless, what's important is how many people play the game at any given time.  And until they address that issue, they will likely have major retention issues and problems getting people to pay to unlock the "free trial".

  dsmart

Novice Member

Joined: 3/25/10
Posts: 201

12/21/10 8:49:25 AM#10

Active accounts are players who created an account AND are playing the game. Not dupes, total number of accounts or whatever.

Not sure why I even needed to explain that since it is pretty standard terminology. Plus we also track daily player metrics from which we derive our ARPU and ARPPU metrics.

There is no trial in the game. It is a pure F2P game; so I'm not sure what you're going on about there.

Since you're not playing the game, you need not concern yourself about player retention - that's our problem (much like with every MMO game).

Game developers are just human beings who happen to make games for a living.
If you want to hold us up to higher standards of conduct, then go ahead
...but don't be surprised if we don't uphold them.

  lizardbones

Elite Member

Joined: 6/11/08
Posts: 10942

I think with my heart and move with my head.-Kongos

12/21/10 9:04:24 AM#11

How does a player see the number of people who are online at any given time? For instance, in Perpetuum, the chat tab tells you how many people are in a particular chat channel. This gives you a good idea of how many people are on at any given time. The other end of the spectrum, WoW won't tell you how many people are on...the /who feature limits the results returned, etc. Your estimates of people online would be based on a visual count only which would vary wildly depending on where you are.

I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  alkarionlog

Elite Member

Joined: 3/19/09
Posts: 1072

12/21/10 9:14:18 AM#12

hey op misleading title you put, when you said they start to do the right thing I was thinking they fire someone, if they did it it would have a nice start, but when a certain BM still working there I think.

but still no one answered me when I asked this last time, so I will ask again, is alganon using neural network on it too?

FOR HONOR, FOR FREEDOM.... and for some money.

  Elmarolly

Novice Member

Joined: 2/23/10
Posts: 63

12/21/10 1:05:31 PM#13

There is a "social" button that you can hit to see all the players on either the "aliance" or "horde" side.  Oh, sorry either The Asharr or The Kujix.

Just log a char on to either race and hit the "social`` button and you will be amazed at the number of players online.

  lizardbones

Elite Member

Joined: 6/11/08
Posts: 10942

I think with my heart and move with my head.-Kongos

12/21/10 1:11:06 PM#14


Originally posted by Elmarolly
There is a "social" button that you can hit to see all the players on either the "aliance" or "horde" side.  Oh, sorry either The Asharr or The Kujix.
Just log a char on to either race and hit the "social`` button and you will be amazed at the number of players online.

I wouldn't be all that amazed unless there were like 450 million people playing. I don't have a frame of reference for the game so I don't know what's "good" and what's "bad". My definition of good is enough people paying money to pay the bills and develop more stuff for the game.

I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  Krematory

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/15/08
Posts: 539

MMOHOLIC

12/21/10 2:03:21 PM#15
Originally posted by Elmarolly

There is a "social" button that you can hit to see all the players on either the "aliance" or "horde" side.  Oh, sorry either The Asharr or The Kujix.

Just log a char on to either race and hit the "social`` button and you will be amazed at the number of players online.

I'm already amazed by the fact that there's people actually playing this game.

"EVE is likely the best MMORPG that you've never really understood or played" - Kyleran

  Elmarolly

Novice Member

Joined: 2/23/10
Posts: 63

12/21/10 2:47:39 PM#16

Well so far the investors for QOL are still dumping money into the game for how long, who knows. Not a lot of content has been added for players since beta. They have added quests that were lacking from level  40 to 50.

Sad thing is now those quests are just plain stupid. Spend a few hours and and you can gain those levels without a problem. And then there is nothing to do. I mean come on do 4 quests gain a level all in a matter of 10 minutes. No challenge anymore to gain a level in the game. Even then it was nothing more then  a grind fest from 40 to 50.  Now most of the quests that were added are go here and fetch a item for me or go talk to that NPC. But then most quests are like that in current mmo`s. Nothing original or jaw dropping.

Oh sure if and that is a HUGE if you can find enough players that are level 46+ to enter the few instances that are there. But once those are done. Nothing to do. Not much for a PVP  system. The current PVP system is a freaking joke. Even this so called great PVP event going on now is nothing more then a Duel system. But then again, if you are level 40+ there is no one to duel with. The low level duels are just plain sad and not very fun. 

Like I said no new content to explore has been added since beta. One can not count the few instances added. Those should have been done once the game went live for release. 

But try the game you might like it. If you like or liked WoW then you might like this clone.  Although it is more of a single player MMO then anything. Maybe if the number of players increase. Then at best it would be a very small player base.

Those 100k ``active`` player base, well........ if  there is truly almost 100k active players and from my playing time and others from the UK and North America are only getting between 3 to 50 players from both servers combined on at various time.  You have to wonder is that a made up number...... Doesn`t sound like a very 100Kish ``active`` player base to me.

 

Good: 25 players online when you are playing but most times it wil be 3 to 10

Bad: 2 players online when you are playing and 1 of those are GM`s. Mind you the GM is great to talk to.

Take care and have fun

 

`Bully, Bully, Bully``

  MugHug

Novice Member

Joined: 12/26/09
Posts: 54

12/31/10 3:52:13 PM#17
Originally posted by dsmart

Obviously just because we are approaching the 100K active accounts mark, doesn[object Window]t mean that they are all online at the same time. You either believe it or not, but yeah we[object Window]re going to be hitting the number pretty soon.

And these are not numbers of created accounts. We have detailed metrics which track created accounts, activated accounts, accounts that have entered and played the game, accounts that have bought something, when, how etc.

I didn[object Window]t want to, but I specifically revealed those numbers to make a point. The game is growing because of all the work that we[object Window]ve done on it, the marketing effort being put behind it and the fact that it is a good game. It[object Window]s not for everyone and we don[object Window]t profess that to be the case, but there it is.

Dissenting opinions are all well and good, but it is pointless to voice dissent just for the hell of it and because you don[object Window]t like the game. We get it, you don[object Window]t like it, you want thousands of people online at the same time. Whatever.

[object Window]

I have not posted here for quite a while, but after reading the above, today I felt a need to!!

Derek, before you shout me down, take on board I have been with Alganon (off and on) since Beta. That means the lows and the higns from a players perspective. I have seen people come and people go. Seen guilds form and disband. Seen a heck of a lot more in that time, in-game and out of game.  I have enough time and money invested in your product to voice my feelings. Hopefully, you may allow me such.

Before I get to my main point I will let you and everyone here know that in my view Alganon has matured in a postive manner and while not being the WOW beater many expected it to be, it can stand proud for being a decent and fun MMO.

As far as all the free MMOs out there with a cash shop, I consider Alganon to be the best. It may not excel in certain points or have certain features found in other MMOs, but for me it just feels right and I am a fussy one when it comes to MMOs. 

The reason for my post was based on my initial reaction to yours. I am not usually off the track compared to other forum uses and therefore suspect that others feel the same or similar.

Now onto your post.... Over time, I have logged onto Alganon any day of the week, any time of the day. I even log on to just see the numbers and names of players playing. Being in my 50s and having really played  most MMOs, I have gained a fairly good idea of server populations trends and performance, from a players point of view, and what I see does not match up to your statement.

I am not trying to pick an argument with you but trying to highlight to you that such statements which may make sense to you, can and are viewed in a different light by us the players. The potential fallout can have a harmful effect on all the positive work you and the team have done over the last few months.

Many different views of the server population can be stated and everyone will have a different view to match.....

Therefore to keep it simple....If we are to accept your figures at face value and if each of the active accounts logged into the game just one day out of the whole year, we would be looking at over 250 unique play sessions a day by unique players. That is if all the players just played Alganon for just one day each year.

In all the time (Including very long sessions) I have played Alganon, I have never seen this and I am sure that I am not the only one that starts to ask questions.

Even the Auction House is seen with not one single item on auction and with close to 100K active players, I find that amazing.

When simple observations like these are compared to your statement, many of us start to ask questions.

My simple request is......How about making the detailed metrics available for all to see? For one and for all, settle the issue of server populations.

Regardless of how you feel, the issue of server populations can affect the decision of potential players and how they view a MMO. Just ask people here (some of your potential customers).

Being one of the players that wishes to see Alganon grow, I do feel that the kind of statement you made here have the potential to harm all the good work that you and your team has done over the last few months and push potential players away from Alganon.

As I see it.....Alganon is a much better MMO then before, it is one of the better free MMOs using the cash shop model. It has really great promise for the future if the active population really grows. Looking at Alganon now compared to its early days is really like comparing day and night to quote one re-review. You and your team have done wonders.

Bottom line........Excellent little gem of a MMO that finally deserves and needs a good population in the real virtual world and just not on paper. Just not sure why more people are not coming and staying on board.

I am pleased that Alganon is in your competant hands and believe in most of what you do, but that still does not mean you get every single thing right. Hopefully you can see my post as it is meant and not as an attack or threat.

Regards

  japo

Novice Member

Joined: 11/18/05
Posts: 311

Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday.

12/31/10 4:22:01 PM#18

We don't need the "Detailed Metrics" for player numbers.  Auction house items, forum posts, and fans in other forums can give us a general idea of how many people are playing.

So can running around an empty world.

DS is pulling numbers out if his ass...who knows why.

I was a fan of Alganon and played for a few months....but it went nowhere.  It's not getting any better and the active player base is not 100K.  Why DS feels the need to lie about active subs is beyond my comprehension. 

  dsmart

Novice Member

Joined: 3/25/10
Posts: 201

1/01/11 10:20:52 AM#19

I don't particularly care what anyone else thinks or believes.

Fact is that there are over 16 people who own this company and have put millions of dollars into it. They have the same metrics that I do.

There are over 28 people who are either still working on or have worked on this game. They have the same metrics that I do.

Since I am a third-party contractor, not a QOL employee, I have no incentive to make stuff up - especially in public - as that will only get me sued down the road if something goes wrong.

Apart from that, throughout my entire history, I am one of the most vocal and honest developers when it comes to stuff like this. My work ethics have never been a point of contention nor question because, as my involvement with Alganon has once again proven, I know my stuff. And that comes from years of hands on experience. So it is no surprise (at least not to those who know me or have worked with/for me) where Alganon is today under my leadership.

Just because you don't see 250 people running around when you log on, doesn't mean squat. And the method you used to come up with your math metrics is flawed on so many levels, that I'm not even going to bother with that.

There is no conspiracy theory here, there is nothing being made up and certainly no reward or incentive for doing so. So, I stand by my statements as they were originally written. So take it for what it's worth. In fact, I'll just defer to Massively's latest comment in their The Top Indie And Free-To-Play Stories of 2010 article which pretty much sums it up I think.

Alganon returns: Despite much of the controversy of Alganon's obvious initial "WoW-clone" status, the game was taken over and relaunched. No matter what you think of development's resident loudmouth Derek Smart, all it takes is a few sessions in the world of Alganon to see that the game was polished, put on the treadmill, tightened up and made into its own experience. Next, the decision was made to make the game free with some restrictions, opening it up to even more players. According to Smart, the game is "nearing 100,000 active accounts." I can see why.

Game developers are just human beings who happen to make games for a living.
If you want to hold us up to higher standards of conduct, then go ahead
...but don't be surprised if we don't uphold them.

  parrotpholk

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/20/05
Posts: 3317

1/01/11 10:26:46 AM#20
Originally posted by dsmart


Just because you don[object Window]t see 250 people running around when you log on, doesn[object Window]t mean squat. And the method you used to come up with your math metrics is flawed on so many levels, that I[object Window]m not even going to bother with that.

So the players are there but no one can see them? IF you have 100k accounts you should easily see 400 or so at minimum running around cities and chat should be very active with many conversations going on at once.  Especially only having 2 realms.  100k is not an active number.  If you said 100k downloads or people who have logged in once then you might have a case but the game is still empty.  Add to that your whopping 5777 member forums.  Most folks may not post on forums but they at least sign up for updates and the occasional visit.  Lets say only 10 percent signed up then your still only at about 58k accounts.  So in your case you have around 5 percent.

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