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News & Features Discussion  » Mortal Online: The Official Review

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191 posts found
  Qunitillian

Novice Member

Joined: 11/09/05
Posts: 104

12/02/10 6:36:58 AM#141

Yeah, wmada2k I guess YOU would say that.

  Dredphyre

Novice Member

Joined: 9/11/10
Posts: 609

fanboi of truth

12/02/10 6:57:15 AM#142

"Now I must state that I do not like to judge an MMORPG on its launch and by how bug-ridden it is at any point. The very advantage of this beautiful genre is that the developer toils and slaves over their projects like none of their game studio peers; we pay a subscription fee and we, eventually, get a polished product – sometimes it just takes a little time."

 

I stopped reading after this little innane quip.  It's this sort of enabling attitude that causes studios to deliver us craptastic games. Nobody gives a fly's ass how much work the devs put in, or how much they're 'slaving' over their projects. When you go to a movie, and it's gawd awful, do you give it a pass because the producer ran out of money in post-production, or that the directer couldn't get the actors he really wanted so had to settle for a bunch of commercial has-beens.

Yeah, I thought not...

  Slapshot1188

Elite Member

Joined: 5/06/07
Posts: 3991

12/02/10 6:59:42 AM#143
Originally posted by deathshroud

K let me make it clear to everyone about these dvds. Since some are trying to use that as a way to discredit the devs so here are the facts.

1. There were originally no boxed copies planned for mo or special edition. However to to the constant requests from the fan base at large who were wanting to pay extra to help support the devs and their game they decided to offer a boxed copy. Also 999 limited editions copies which were practically non profitable.

2. Part of the deal with these boxed copies was that future versions of the game would be sent out on discs throughout the life of MO. Probably after major expansions etc (which are free to all)

3.On release a large portion of the community were demanding there dvd discs. Esentially wanting them regardless of the fact the release was a mess and the disc would be outdated extrmeely quickly afterall patches were every 2 weeks and large in size. Discs were sent and recieved.

4.After first few weeks the game could no longer be installed from the discs becasue suprisingly the version wasnt the same and the whole patching process had changed.

5.A few weeks later the game can now be installed using the original discs. All this time those who owned the discs were still able to download the game through the site so they could still play fine. But now the discs work with the patches all is good.

6.New discs will likely be sent out when some major changes and conant have been added. wanting a new disc every few months isnt what the devs were planning. Think of it like this you buy eve. Then recieve a new disc for each major expansion like tyrannis and not for each patch.

 

So people please stop going on about these discs they work you can insdtall the game, it was shitty you couldnt use the discs for the first month but you could still paly by downloading it through the site.

 Sorry but once again you have basic FACTS wrong.

1. True (Well.. except for the last part as I have no evidence to support or deny that the Loot Bags were "practically non-profitable")

2. Incorrect.  The game advertised "all pre-launch updates freely shipped on DVD".  All post launch updates and expansions as you describe were to be freely available in DIGITAL form. Here is the exact description from their website which proves this.

EUR 43.95
(incl. VAT EUR 0.00)
  • Embossed Metal Box
  • All pre-launch updates freely shipped on DVD
  • Digital Download
  • Free future digital updates and expansions
  • Includes one month's game time
  • Includes shipping fee

3. Not fully true.  The discs were originally sent out in January.  They did not work and were unable to be patched when received because SV changed their engine.  SV's patcher will now recognize the disc and automatically do a full digital download (which defeats the purpose of a DVD).  At the time.. customers were PROMISED by SV that they would receive updated DVDs AT LAUNCH.  Here is the very announcement from the CM http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/45492-boxed-version-mo-rewards.html     Which was later confirmed in a PM posted here http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/51203-opt-patch-dvd-any-updates.html#post1056127

4. Again incorrect.. the DVDs never installed, as described above.  They were received in January (game didn't release until June!) and did not work the very day they were received.  Since then they made it so that the old DVD would do a full and complete digital download of the game.  To the best of my knowledge, at no time has anyone actually received a DVD that installed a client... which was promised by the CM to be delivered AT RELEASE... which was 6 months ago.
 
5. See above
 
6. Misleading statement. Noone wants new discs every 6 months.  People simple wanted what they paid for and was advertised (and STILL is).. and that was "All pre-launch updates freely shipped on DVD".  Which clearly did not happen.
 
So those are the FACTS.. all verifiable via their website and/or forum.  This isn't a matter of why people want or need DVDs in this day and age when you can download a game.  It's the idea that a company promised something, charged you extra for it, didn't deliver, and ignored requests for updates.   Other than the PM linked.. as far as I know SV has not made a single public statement since launch about the DVDs that were promised to be sent at launch.  It's now 6 months late... no DVD.. and no word form the company.
 
Anyhow.. this isn't a DVD thread it's a review thread.  The DVD stuff was just tossed out there as one objection to the reviewer's statement that the developers had the community's best interests at heart.

"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  Yamota

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/05/03
Posts: 6387

There's a beast within every man that stirs when you put a sword in his hand

12/02/10 7:08:06 AM#144

I am an old-school MMORPG player but I dont see why I must feel obliged to support it. It is a bug ridden, unstable, amaterusticly created mess with complete lack of content (no, sandbox does not equal zero content). And now 6 months after release those issues are still there.

Also what has forced FPS style combat have anything to do with old school MMORPGs? UO did not have it, nor did EQ or Asherons Call. I for one hate it as it makes combat like a poorly made Quake mod.

So no, I am a fanatic supporter of old school MMORPGs but that does not mean that I will support whatever crap is thrown at us. It should not need to be said but we want well done, stable MMORPGs with content supported by a team that has the expertise to develop it. And after 6 months I dont feel Mortal Online and  StarVault fits into that. So I dont recommend this game to anyone, old school or not.

However I do think Darkfall, as it is now, is an OK game if you like old school MMORPGs. Maybe Mortal Online will be at that stage some day, but today it is clearly not.

  Toferio

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/26/09
Posts: 1449

12/02/10 7:11:08 AM#145
Originally posted by oramio
-snip-

Shrug.. I can't really claim I am unbiased either to behonest, since I do dislike SV and the way they handle their community and the design of the game. With that being said, I don't really have anything MO as the game and believe my attitude to it is neutral enough to discuss it. It can be good fun and it's not that bad of a game if you are ready to ignore the bugs, bad patches, and slow paces content. But majority of the players are used to a kind of "standard" when it comes to MMOs, and MO is way below it. There is no need to call me out on what a standard is, since it is a rather vague term, but I believe we both know what I mean by it.

But I think that such bugs as players being teleported to a lake when their horse dies being detected by QA is a part of a sandard for a released game.

As for my attitude.. Well, sorry that the manner I post in makes you think of me as a hater, but that's the way I type. I don't want to put SV in positive light when I write about them (since as I stated above, I dislike the company), which probably reflects on me chosing to write a bit more negative rather then writing something positive I didn't intend to. We can argue a lot about my english, but I used "even" to put emphasis on that they didn't sort the most basic stuff such as working DVD.

  wmada2k

Novice Member

Joined: 12/02/10
Posts: 196

12/02/10 7:14:47 AM#146
Originally posted by Qunitillian

Yeah, wmada2k I guess YOU would say that.

Yes, why wouldn't I?

  Toferio

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/26/09
Posts: 1449

12/02/10 7:22:09 AM#147
Originally posted by wmada2k

Great review, spot on imo!

Been around since beta, havent played at all since then and tried my 7 free days, and what a change! The visuals were truly great in comparison, and it all seems to work right now. Some glitches, but nothing that was bothering me at all!

Keep up the good work! You got me subbing again!

So you being ported to a lake when your horse dies is not a bother? I would then question your standards when it comes to games.. Some people seems to be able to take a lot of crap just to play a game with FPV and no target. I dont question that the game might be fun, but stating taht "all seems to be working right, nothing taht bothers me" is ridiculous.

I guess this sums it up:

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/55869-glad-see-reasons-i-left-got-fixed.html

  mukin

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/10/08
Posts: 79

12/02/10 7:46:33 AM#148

I think we need another review (preferably from the same reviewer) in 6 months.

  osmunda

Novice Member

Joined: 5/24/09
Posts: 1127

12/02/10 8:15:32 AM#149
Originally posted by linksalu


I have never, in my life, contacted my credit card company to receive a refund for ANYTHING I've ever purchased. Until MO. I have never seen a company take the credit card information you used to purchase the game and automatically enroll you into a subscription one year later on that same credit card, without your permission. 

 

I take it you didn't read the e-mail they sent out telling everyone that had purchased the game that it was about to go live, and how to cancel the subscription.

  rhinok

Novice Member

Joined: 2/01/07
Posts: 1813

12/02/10 8:25:05 AM#150
Originally posted by Xuljester

I think the score is rightly deserved. Any who argue that it should've gotten a much lower score likely aren't scoring each aspect as it should be. The game's models look great, therefore it scores high. The game's world is vast and populated, therefore it scores well. The combat, albeit slow and not quite complete, is immersive and entertaining, warranting a decent score. The bugs are what drags the score down, the incomplete nature of the game, and so on and so forth.

I look at 6.9 and think it a fair score; the game isn't broken, but it isn't fully functional. However, what IS there is mostly entertaining, and in such a manner that very few games have--or do--provide. To give it a score such as 1.9 would be to deny the fact that it is indeed fun when it plays as it should. 1.9 says that it's a terrible game that has absolutely no good or redeeming qualities and that barely anyone actually likes the game. MO does still have a player-base and players who enjoy the game, so this cannot be true.

Anyhow, I think potential a good thing; any game without potential, regardless of how good, shows that it has hit its peak. The game likely cannot--and will not--improve any more, and this is not something an MMO should be, it is not something a game should be. Sure, potential shouldn't factor in to the score, but it certainly shouldn't go without mention; we watch trailers and videos of gameplay and think "This game has potential. I may potentially enjoy this game". Should not a review point out that the game in question has such a potential? Mind you, it is different to say that the game HAD potential, meaning all hope for improvement is gone, which is not the case of Mortal Online.

Rightly deserved based on what? Aren't scoring each aspect of what?  That's my point - mmorpg.com reviews don't follow any published standard for choosing their scores. There's nothing in the article that states each aspect was scored X resulting in the averaged overall score of 6.9.  All we have to go by is written word, which is extremely harsh of the game--as it exists today--but glows with admiration for future potential (something that shouldn't factor into the overall rating, unless it's a specific metric published alongside X other scoring meters).

"I look at 6.9 and think it a fair score; the game isn't broken, but it isn't fully functional" - the problem with that statement is that it isn't what 6.9 means, according to mmorpg.com.  A "mediocre" score of 6.9 means  a game "has a few stand-out features with few, if any, glaring detractors".  That's what it says when you mouse over the score.  The problem is that the score and it's definition are contrary to the authors own review, in which he states the game is: "woefully unfinished", "Star Vault's creation is riddled with bugs, glitches, errors, misjudgements and everything in-between", "riddled to the core with bugs", "buggy as hell", "the game falls flat in many directions", and  "this game is nearer to state of closed-beta than retail release".  I would consider all of those to be glaring detractors to the game's quality.  As such, the score doesn't match the review.  Potential and bias towards the genre clearly skewed the score higher regardless of the harsh criticism.  I'd be perfectly happy if it didn't have any score attached to it.  The problem I have is with the score itself.  It just doesn't match the review.

~Ripper

  osmunda

Novice Member

Joined: 5/24/09
Posts: 1127

12/02/10 8:30:55 AM#151
Originally posted by Benthon


Look out. Giving Mortal Online anything less than an 8 will result in SV contacting you for "vandalizing" their game. You'll be recieving their bully attempts soon.

 

Incorrect, sir.  There was no such commentary on the review by Seraohina over at massively http://massively.joystiq.com/2010/09/02/anti-aliased-i-can-finally-stop-playing-mortal-online-now/. From your use of the word "vandalizing" I take it you are commenting on the wiki article in which case I will point out that "vandalism" was in fact wrong, but the comments were taken out for being biased and unsourced as well as the account adding that being banned http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Mortal_Online&action=history

  Briansho

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/05/06
Posts: 4780

Functionless Art is Simply Tolerated Vandalism...We Are The Vandals.

12/02/10 9:00:31 AM#152

From the looks of it the game looks amazing. At least the developers are attempting to do something with it. On a positive note, all the people who bought the game and are "playing" are helping to fix the game and make it better. I'll check it out again in 6 months, maybe they will have a trial island or something.

Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!

  lizardbones

Elite Member

Joined: 6/11/08
Posts: 9953

I've become dependent upon spell check. My apologies for stupid grammatical errors.

12/02/10 9:02:33 AM#153


Originally posted by Briansho
From the looks of it the game looks amazing. At least the developers are attempting to do something with it. On a positive note, all the people who bought the game and are "playing" are helping to fix the game and make it better. I'll check it out again in 6 months, maybe they will have a trial island or something.

They are charging full price for a game that is in a closed beta state. Why would they give a free trial area for a game that is actually in a release state?

For every large, complex problem, there is a simple, clear solution that also happens to be absolutely wrong.

  Darth_Osor

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/17/09
Posts: 1102

Just because you are unique does not mean you are special

12/02/10 9:07:48 AM#154

I have no interest in this game other than the entertainment the forums here provide me, but WOW remind me to never, ever take a review from this author seriously.  Clearly, he is so desperate for a sandbox game, that he'll eat a turd sandwich and ask for seconds.  How does "nearer to the state of close-beta than retail release" translate into a 6.9?

Listing potential as a pro?  Seriously?!?  What game would potential NOT be a pro?

"Now I must state that I do not like to judge an MMORPG on its launch and how bug-ridden it is at any point".  LOL what?  How bug ridden it is should be a major factor in judging any piece of software.

"we pay a subscription fee and we, eventually, get a polished product - sometimes it just takes a little more time".  This attitude is exactly why we get beta state MMOs inflicted upon us.

"...perhaps this is something that will be remedied in future updates?  We can surely hope."  "...feeling of excitement and the desire for this game to succeed."  Biased review is biased.  I get the feeling he only grudgingly acknowledges negatives because the editors insisted.  Protip to MMORPG com:  don't let gushing fanboys write reviews.  Why did this game get the benefit of being released for 6 months before seeing a review?

  Briansho

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/05/06
Posts: 4780

Functionless Art is Simply Tolerated Vandalism...We Are The Vandals.

12/02/10 9:10:11 AM#155
Originally posted by lizardbones

 


Originally posted by Briansho
From the looks of it the game looks amazing. At least the developers are attempting to do something with it. On a positive note, all the people who bought the game and are "playing" are helping to fix the game and make it better. I'll check it out again in 6 months, maybe they will have a trial island or something.


They are charging full price for a game that is in a closed beta state. Why would they give a free trial area for a game that is actually in a release state?

Who knows, stranger things have happened. As long as people keep buying the game and subbing the developers will continue to try to fix it.

Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!

  rhinok

Novice Member

Joined: 2/01/07
Posts: 1813

12/02/10 9:46:08 AM#156
Originally posted by Briansho

...all the people who bought the game and are "playing" are helping to fix the game and make it better...

That's not a player's job in a released game, especially for which he or she pays a subscription. That's the role of a beta player.  That's not to say that players for released games can't test content on a public test server, provide feedback, etc.., but that's not their primary role.  As a customer, their role is to consume the product and be entertained.

~Ripper

  oramio

Novice Member

Joined: 7/12/06
Posts: 122

12/02/10 9:52:10 AM#157
Originally posted by Darth_Osor

I have no interest in this game other than the entertainment the forums here provide me, but WOW remind me to never, ever take a review from this author seriously.  Clearly, he is so desperate for a sandbox game, that he'll eat a turd sandwich and ask for seconds.  How does "nearer to the state of close-beta than retail release" translate into a 6.9?

The score doesn't show how bug free the game is. It also does not mean that you create a checklist, start ticking items one by one saying that nah, this is not implemented completely, it is only complete once this particular part is added or not.

Listing potential as a pro?  Seriously?!?  What game would potential NOT be a pro?

This can only be answered in an objective manner IMO. Call it the vision from the company about the game, the impression you get after playing a week or so, etc. I don't think that there's a global objective agreement on what defines a potential about a MMORPG game. It is sum of what you experience and see after playing a bit, comparing the game with the ones you have played, check what has been promised and what's there already, what are the missing part and what is the explanation about those missing parts, what's the global vision about the game and how the company is promising to further develop the game etc.

"Now I must state that I do not like to judge an MMORPG on its launch and how bug-ridden it is at any point".  LOL what?  How bug ridden it is should be a major factor in judging any piece of software.

I don't agree. What is most important for me is CTD (crash to desktop) issues. Having critical bugs causing you to die instantly (time to time you have these bugs in MO, one is patched recently for example). Some may say that how polished a UI is a major factor. Why should the author and I have to agree with you there?

"we pay a subscription fee and we, eventually, get a polished product - sometimes it just takes a little more time".  This attitude is exactly why we get beta state MMOs inflicted upon us.

I think you're true and wrong there. If the author was trying to hide the fact that there are problems and bugs in MO, I would agree with you that MMORPG is trying to guide his community buying this game blindfolded. That's not the case. If you are following the official forums and what SV announces as features, you see that they are not very far away from what they are announcing. But I also agree that there are lots of things still missing from the game pulling the game being far from perfect.

"...perhaps this is something that will be remedied in future updates?  We can surely hope."  "...feeling of excitement and the desire for this game to succeed."  Biased review is biased.  I get the feeling he only grudgingly acknowledges negatives because the editors insisted.  Protip to MMORPG com:  don't let gushing fanboys write reviews.  

Having a reviewer feeling sympathy for one type of style doesn't make him a fanboy. It is very obvious that the reviewer is an UO style player and he's looking for similar brand new games to enter the market. Do you think it would be a good idea to have a WoW playing style author will have good time reviewing the game and can find his way out on MO world?

Why did this game get the benefit of being released for 6 months before seeing a review?

You find it a benefit for not being beaten and smashed on release for a game? Why? The game was in a much more primitive state 6 months ago, and it is much better now. It shows the company is making progress on the game. 

Writing all of these, don't think that I find the game great or perfect, it still has lots of things missing when I think about what features can be added to the game (taverns, why aren't there taverns? But the good think is that they are saying that they'll add it at least, or call it butchery, call it improvement on housing systems, eating, heat system blah blah). I know that it is easy to promise and hard to do, so everyone should think carefully before ordering the game, check what it is there, and what is missing, get informed before spending your money on it. Just as you do before buying a gaming console, a house, a car etc.

On the other hand, I don't understand the reason for people bashing the author for him giving a score higher than you expect because his priorities are not the same as yours, or you think the game is not that good. I would easily understand if you say that this is missing, that's not available, there are bugs like this and that, but everyone is focused on smashing something or blaming someone. Or we can discuss as much as we want here, you say what you think is true, I do the same, and we go on. Let each individual make their own decisions, I simply don't understand why everyone is fighting so hard to have their ideas being accepted by using colorful statements and remarks 

  rhinok

Novice Member

Joined: 2/01/07
Posts: 1813

12/02/10 10:08:34 AM#158
Originally posted by oramio

..

On the other hand, I don't understand the reason for people bashing the author for him giving a score higher than you expect because his priorities are not the same as yours..

That's not why people are bashing him.  It's because his score and it's definition, per mmorpg.com, does not match what he wrote.  I think his written review is fine.  A score should be based on the game the reviewer experienced, not potential it may or may not realize in the future.  Based on his written review, the game--while fun for him--is a mess.  His score should reflect that, but it doesn't.

~Ripper

  shakermaker0

Novice Member

Joined: 5/25/09
Posts: 189

12/02/10 10:17:09 AM#159

In the grand scheme of things, is the score really that important that a debate should rage for this long?

  Torgrim

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 12/15/05
Posts: 2099

12/02/10 10:34:15 AM#160
Originally posted by Jakdstripper

to all those talking about "potential".....

yes i also belive this game has potential, but that in itself will not save the game. it takes an idea with potential AND a competent company to make a succesfull game ( like EvE). unfortunately wile MO has potential SV does not have competence. that simple.

 

CCP didn't had compenence back when EVE got launched 2003 either, they worked for free for months just to get the game stable, EVE was riddle with bugs.

EVE fanboys like myself stayed despite how crappy EVE was but we saw the potentials in the game so we stayed, look what EVE is today.

I'm not saying it will happen to SV but you have the trial and error period as a fresh developer with little experience when i'ts thier first game very much like CCP, So the fat lady haven't sung yet, I still have hopes for MO to crawl out of it's crib and stand on it's two feets and smell the roses.

btw did you know how CCP got thier money to start developing EVE?, they made boardgames ;)

 

If it's not broken, you are not innovating.

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