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News & Features Discussion  » Mortal Online: The Official Review

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191 posts found
  Fdzzaigl

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/22/09
Posts: 2155

12/01/10 4:25:15 PM#61

I honestly don't think a game should be given points for 'potential' at all, unless that 'potential' is absolutely sure to be realised in the very near future.

If you want to check on 'potential' do another review later on and see if it has been realised.

Giving these scores cheapens your rating system, because I honestly don't think you can give many other games less than 6.9 if you give a buggy and unfinished game that score.

Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!

  Lahuzer

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/07/09
Posts: 686

Sit on my face and tell me that you love me...

12/01/10 4:35:28 PM#62
Originally posted by Fdzzaigl

I honestly don't think a game should be given points for 'potential' at all, unless that 'potential' is absolutely sure to be realised in the very near future.

If you want to check on 'potential' do another review later on and see if it has been realised.

Giving these scores cheapens your rating system, because I honestly don't think you can give many other games less than 6.9 if you give a buggy and unfinished game that score.

If you actually read the review, he doesn´t say anywhere that the score influenced by MOs potential... It IS fun to play now even with the bugs. Just imagine how much fun it will be futher down the road. I predict a nice 8.5 score in another 6 months... :P

  Fdzzaigl

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/22/09
Posts: 2155

12/01/10 4:45:01 PM#63
Originally posted by Lahuzer
Originally posted by Fdzzaigl

I honestly don't think a game should be given points for 'potential' at all, unless that 'potential' is absolutely sure to be realised in the very near future.

If you want to check on 'potential' do another review later on and see if it has been realised.

Giving these scores cheapens your rating system, because I honestly don't think you can give many other games less than 6.9 if you give a buggy and unfinished game that score.

If you actually read the review, he doesn´t say anywhere that the score influenced by MOs potential... It IS fun to play now even with the bugs. Just imagine how much fun it will be futher down the road. I predict a nice 8.5 score in another 6 months... :P

I read the review.

"Astounding Potential" is one of the pros, potential gets 1/3 of a page, it influenced the score.

Regardless of what it influenced a game that is buggy as all hell (his words) doesn't get a high grade score, just like you don't get a grade if you deliver a paper full of obvious faults in college.

Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!

  Pagoas

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/05/08
Posts: 96

See no evil...

12/01/10 4:50:16 PM#64

Yeah, I spent about an hour researching races, skills, and attributes and seriously considering blowing 50 bucks to try out this game... until I re-read their "flagging system" for pvp and realized that you can still be ganked even if you're at the "blue" level of innocence. 

 

I thought at first that you could NOT be ganked until you becamed "grey" for "behaving badly."  If they would make pvp a choice then I'd try it out. 

  rhinok

Novice Member

Joined: 2/01/07
Posts: 1813

12/01/10 4:52:59 PM#65

Please note, I have never played Mortal Online and I don't have any bias towards it on way or another.  These comments relate specifically to the quality of the review and it's ultimate score.

This review basically boils down to this (per the reviewer):

Negatives

  • The game feels more like beta quality than launch-ready
  • It's buggy as hell
  • There are a number of questionable design issues  regarding immersion vs. acecssibility
  • Apparently difficult for the sake of being difficult
  • "woefully unfinished"
  • Questionable and sluggish combat mechanics
Positives
  • Has potential
  • Is a sandbox, I really like sandboxes, hooray for sandboxes!
  • It's fun, regardless of the bugs, if you really, really like sandboxes, are a fan of the game and can tolerate a buggy, glitchy  mess
In other words, it was an overwhelmingly negative review tempered with the reviewer's bias towards potential and his general admiration for the genre (regardless of the game's ability to actually realize it's potential).  As such, how is a reasonably high score of 6.9 justifiable?  According to the tooltip description of the mediocre rating, mediocre "has a few stand-out features with few, if any, glaring detractors".  That's the opposite of this review. This review listed several glaring detractors with no real stand-out features other than "it's a sandbox".
 
The score for this review is exactly why mmorpg.com needs to publish and follow scoring standards.  Nowhere in the article does it justify any numeric score.  It seems completely arbitrary.  When players rate a game, they have to assign scores from 1 to 10 in 8 specific categories.   Yes, those categories are still subjective (for example "graphics" means different things to different people), but at least is a baseline for scoring the game.  I'd really like to see something similar implemented for reviewers. Even subjective ratings would be fine if they were justified within the context of the review.  Some great categories, in addition to those 8 used for the user ratings (Graphics, Fun, Sound, Community, Role-playing, Performance/Lag, Value and Service), would be:
 
  • Polish - how polished is the experience from a technical perspective?  Is it relatively bug free or is it buggy as hell? 
  • Execution - how well executed is the overall concept?  Do the game mechanics really "work" or are they complex for the sake of being complex.  As an example,  does it take 5 steps to do something that could otherwise be accomplished in 2 or 3 without being detrimental to the overall design and theme of the game?
  • Target Audience - who is this game designed for and does it successfully meet those design goals?  Is it still accessible and enjoyable for other players? Wizard101 is a great example - it's designed for kids, but is remarkably popular with adults.
~Ripper
  Slapshot1188

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/06/07
Posts: 4190

12/01/10 4:59:10 PM#66

Hey... I disagree with much of what Mr. Tingle said... that's OK though as everyone is allowed their own opinions. 

 

What I have to take exception to however is this closing line:

 if it meant a few hours of entertainment and supporting a company who truly have the communities best interests at heart – hell I’d recommend this game, us old timers need this game to succeed,

 

What? I mean... that is a STUNNING comment to toss out without any support whatsoever.  This is a company that STILL has not shipped their promised replacement DVDs to customers 6 months after launch.. Not only that, but they ignore countless requests for updates on it.

 

Well.. I'm not going to get on a soapbox.  I will simply say: Be VERY... VERY wary of any "review" that claims to know how any company has the "communities best interests at heart".

"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  shakermaker0

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/25/09
Posts: 198

12/01/10 5:05:20 PM#67

Not saying anyone is wrong for taking umbridge to my marks for 'potential' but, I think (in this genre in-particular) that future potential plays a big part in attraction. When playing this game, for myself, a draw is the fact that I can see that this game could improve drastically beyond anything on the market currently. A good example for my justification is the RPG 'The Witcher' that game was broken and unplayable for most, but at the core, man what an experience - would you have dismissed that game as a 5 because of its initial release?

 

Also, you wouldn't play an MMORPG that was uninspired and had nowhere else to take it, the fact that Mortal Online is still playable and enjoyable - then add that the game could be absolutely awesome with a few content patches, I think it deserves a few marks for that. But that's my opinion and I respect anyones grievances with it; so just ignore the score and read the review. I find scores arbitrary and mostly wrong according to my tastes anyway.

  oramio

Novice Member

Joined: 7/12/06
Posts: 122

12/01/10 5:09:04 PM#68
Originally posted by Slapshot1188

Hey... I disagree with much of what Mr. Tingle said... that's OK though as everyone is allowed their own opinions. 

 

What I have to take exception to however is this closing line:

 if it meant a few hours of entertainment and supporting a company who truly have the communities best interests at heart – hell I’d recommend this game, us old timers need this game to succeed,

 

What? I mean... that is a STUNNING comment to toss out without any support whatsoever.  This is a company that STILL has not shipped their promised replacement DVDs to customers 6 months after launch.. Not only that, but they ignore countless requests for updates on it.

 

Well.. I'm not going to get on a soapbox.  I will simply say: Be VERY... VERY wary of any "review" that claims to know how any company has the "communities best interests at heart".

What will you do with the patch DVD's? The game is patched every week. Having the DVD's prepared and sent to customers will take at least a month. So you will be missing 4 patches anyway (the most optimistic scenario)

  Lahuzer

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/07/09
Posts: 686

Sit on my face and tell me that you love me...

12/01/10 5:09:32 PM#69
Originally posted by Fdzzaigl

Originally posted by Lahuzer
Originally posted by Fdzzaigl

I honestly don't think a game should be given points for 'potential' at all, unless that 'potential' is absolutely sure to be realised in the very near future.

If you want to check on 'potential' do another review later on and see if it has been realised.

Giving these scores cheapens your rating system, because I honestly don't think you can give many other games less than 6.9 if you give a buggy and unfinished game that score.

If you actually read the review, he doesn´t say anywhere that the score influenced by MOs potential... It IS fun to play now even with the bugs. Just imagine how much fun it will be futher down the road. I predict a nice 8.5 score in another 6 months... :P

I read the review.

"Astounding Potential" is one of the pros, potential gets 1/3 of a page, it influenced the score.

Regardless of what it influenced a game that is buggy as all hell (his words) doesn't get a high grade score, just like you don't get a grade if you deliver a paper full of obvious faults in college.

 

If you write a story in school, and the story is REALLY good, but you didn´t spell all that well. You usually still get high grades because the story was good and interesting. The same thing goes with for MO. It´s a really good game, but it has alot of bugs. And deserves the score it got. I don´t think it´s to high or to low. I think it is spot on.

But the bugs ain´t so bad that you can´t play the game. I still get tons made in MO without running into any bug. You know what you get when you buy the game. I knew there were bugs in it when I got it. People who read this interview knows it. SOme will see past the bugs and actually enjoy it, some will have no patience and leave it. That´s the way it goes. But more will surely pick it up and stay, then the once that will leave.

  shakermaker0

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/25/09
Posts: 198

12/01/10 5:11:18 PM#70
Originally posted by Slapshot1188


Hey... I disagree with much of what Mr. Tingle said... that's OK though as everyone is allowed their own opinions. 

 

What I have to take exception to however is this closing line:

 if it meant a few hours of entertainment and supporting a company who truly have the communities best interests at heart – hell I’d recommend this game, us old timers need this game to succeed,

 

What? I mean... that is a STUNNING comment to toss out without any support whatsoever.  This is a company that STILL has not shipped their promised replacement DVDs to customers 6 months after launch.. Not only that, but they ignore countless requests for updates on it.

 

Well.. I'm not going to get on a soapbox.  I will simply say: Be VERY... VERY wary of any "review" that claims to know how any company has the "communities best interests at heart".

 

I think the developer does have the communities best interests at heart, at the very most I think they can be somewhat poorly organised but I don't think there scheming or plotting anything untoward. The DVD issues aside, StarVault are trying to create a sandbox MMORPG that many gamers have been crying out for for nearly a decade - in return they get a lot of flack and abuse that makes them out to be Scandinavian na'er-do-wells. 

  Slapshot1188

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/06/07
Posts: 4190

12/01/10 5:15:52 PM#71
Originally posted by shakermaker0

Not saying anyone is wrong for taking umbridge to my marks for 'potential' but, I think (in this genre in-particular) that future potential plays a big part in attraction. When playing this game, for myself, a draw is the fact that I can see that this game could improve drastically beyond anything on the market currently. A good example for my justification is the RPG 'The Witcher' that game was broken and unplayable for most, but at the core, man what an experience - would you have dismissed that game as a 5 because of its initial release?

 

Also, you wouldn't play an MMORPG that was uninspired and had nowhere else to take it, the fact that Mortal Online is still playable and enjoyable - then add that the game could be absolutely awesome with a few content patches, I think it deserves a few marks for that. But that's my opinion and I respect anyones grievances with it; so just ignore the score and read the review. I find scores arbitrary and mostly wrong according to my tastes anyway.

 But.. your review rating actually referrs to "potential".  I suppose we have a difference of opinion about what a review actually is...

To me.. a review must be based on what a game actually delivers.  An article about "potential" is commonly referred to as a Preview.

 

 

Heck.. every game could POTENTIALLY be patched to become a 10 at some point....

"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  choujiofkono

Novice Member

Joined: 9/03/07
Posts: 899

Extreme copy-paste development in FFXIV
------
SE "official player" experiences revealed as fake

12/01/10 5:17:19 PM#72
Originally posted by Jakdstripper
Originally posted by linksalu

I have never, in my life, contacted my credit card company to receive a refund for ANYTHING I've ever purchased. Until MO. I have never seen a company take the credit card information you used to purchase the game and automatically enroll you into a subscription one year later on that same credit card, without your permission. Until MO.  I have never seen a company ship you the equivalent of a blank DVD inside a dented metal case. Until MO. I have never seen a game using a fanmade patcher system. Until MO. I have never seen I have never seen such a glitchfest, where each patch literally breaks the game. Until MO. I have never seen a game where patch notes keep saying 'such and such was fixed' month after month after month after month. Until MO. I've never seen a game with such blatant GM abuse/favouritism. Until MO. Christ, this is the game where people get banned for cheating and then immediately unbanned upon appealing to the CEO, lest he lose one of their few subscriptions.

Honestly, I see this review as a bit of a disservice to the community. Potential does not equal a good game. The ability to roleplay inside your head (which Tingle seems good at) does not equal a good game. And 6.9 is actually a decent score. It's a sneaky way of trying to give a 7.

Based on actual content and current track record, I wouldn't give this game higher than a 4.

 this is no joke, it's true and only the tip of the SV iceberg. there is much more but i'm not gonna get into it. i'v played this game for 4 months and i didn't leave because MO didnt have potential but because SV didn't have a clue on how to develop a vidoe game.

     I once had an interest in trying this game then I read player reviews and looked at the website and the developers practices.  I changed my mind easily.

     Just reading the mmorpg review and then looking at the rating it was given is enough to make me chuckle.  Basically the review boils it down to the game is bad, the state of release was bad, the bugs are bad and the future grim.  But..  because it is "different" and "has potential" the score is decent.  That makes no sense at all.  Review the game on what is reality, not what is a fantasy of what it could turn out to be if several "if's" were to line up like magic. 

    Sugar coating the truth does no one any favors. 

     People are afraid of hurting feelings so they tip-toe around reality.  If people feel hurt because you say the game they play sucks right now and list facts of why it sucks then that is a personal issue of that individual.  The people looking at the review and wondering if it's worth spending money on just want to hear the dirt on it and call it a day. 

   

"I'm not cheap I'm incredibly subconsciously financially optimized"
"The worst part of censorship is ------------------"

  Realbigdeal

Novice Member

Joined: 9/28/08
Posts: 1652

12/01/10 5:20:22 PM#73

Did mortal online get more rating then darkfall? Wow congrats!!!

C:\Users\FF\Desktop\spin move.gif

  Lahuzer

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/07/09
Posts: 686

Sit on my face and tell me that you love me...

12/01/10 5:25:59 PM#74

Key sentences from this review: "Regardless of the bugs and slight unfinished feel, Mortal Online is supremely enjoyable. There are enough developed class-types to keep you occupied while more updates roll out and the game is more than stable enough to play. Sifting through community posts would tell a different story at times but I think people are not really taking the game in the spirit of how it is meant".

Amen.

  mindw0rk

Novice Member

Joined: 8/31/06
Posts: 1367

12/01/10 5:30:32 PM#75

I wonder when journalists stop judging games by "potential". I mean WTF, review it in its current state, not what it could be if developers had some brains.

Mortal Online is one of the worst MMORPGs of all time and a good example of how you can screw EVERYTHING. There is not a single part which is done right. Its so bad that makes Metin 2 look good

  RajCaj

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/11/08
Posts: 684

12/01/10 5:30:52 PM#76

Great article....you do a good job of articulating the GAP that needs to be filled in MMORPG gaming, the challenges of creating a successful sandbox game, and some of the overcompensation in  the recent the Sandbox sub-genere games (Mortal Online, Darkfall Online)

 

I just wish the aformentioned games didn't go so far off the sandbox edge that it did.  Its virutally divided sandbox players into another sub group.....regular sandbox enthusiasts and dogmatic sandbox pureists.  The sandbox sub-genere doesn't need another sub division of players.  Our numbers are far too thin as it is to support any kind of financial backing that is required for releasing a well developed and polished game experience.

 

The no map is a perfect issue (as the OP pointed out).  What is the value in creating a huge expansive 3D environment...ripe for exploring wide expansive landscapes when you find out you've been running for 20 minutes North East when you needed to run 20 minutes North?

No one's calling for waypoint arrows or automated flight paths.  Just a little something that doesn't put you waisting 20 mintues of your play time NOT getting somewhere you thought you were getting to.

There are without a doubt advocates for exactly this kind of game...just recognize (as a sandbox fan) that the smaller the group your game is playing too, the smaller your chances are of financially supporting the game in a way that is needed to refine it past the beta crap state its currently in.  You don't have to sell your soul to the themepark devil the way WOW did....just moderate the hard knocks a bit to where its palatable for the majorty of the sandbox community.

  Slapshot1188

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/06/07
Posts: 4190

12/01/10 5:32:12 PM#77
Originally posted by choujiofkono

         Just reading the mmorpg review and then looking at the rating it was given is enough to make me chuckle.  Basically the review boils it down to the game is bad, the state of release was bad, the bugs are bad and the future grim.  But..  because it is "different" and "has potential" the score is decent.  That makes no sense at all.  Review the game on what is reality, not what is a fantasy of what it could turn out to be if several "if's" were to line up like magic. 

       

 I agree 1000%

 

It's fine for a reviewer to put in a paragraph about what potential they see in a game.  IMHO a review has jumped the shark once it starts to factor in that "potential" as a major element... heck THE major element in a review.  And then to also use that potential when scoring a game just seems far fetched.

 

A review is something that describes how a game exists at the time of the review.  The score should reflect that.  If you feel something in the future might potentially CHANGE that score.. feel free to include some text about that possibility.

 

Otherwise... it's not a review.. it's a preview.

"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  JeroKane

Elite Member

Joined: 2/21/06
Posts: 5342

12/01/10 5:32:19 PM#78

They should remove this review. It makes this website look really bad.

This review is not a review. You either review the game and score accordingly to what the game really is. Or you don't.

Giving the game such a high score is an insult to our intelligence. And more importantly. Hurts the credibility of this site.

You are doing no one here any favours by trying to sugar coat, twist and twist and twist some more, to come up with some kind of excuse of such a high score. All just because it's a poor poor little indie company?  Give me a break!

Starvault had (and still haven't)  no clue about what they were getting into. Or what it involves into making a MMO.

Not to mention that they licensed a very expensive game engine, that's an FPS engine at it's heart. And takes considerable amount of resources and very experienced developers with lots of expertise to mod and adjust for a MMO.

There are plenty of other game engines out there, that are already optimised for MMO games. But no no. Starvault had to do it the hard way and failed miserably!

 

Just have a look at the little indie studio that just released Perpetuum Online.  A very solid game that actually works!  Those guys really deserved to be praised. They actually knew what they were getting into and knew what it takes to make a MMO. And succeeded.

Cheers

  Palebane

Novice Member

Joined: 10/18/04
Posts: 3247

12/01/10 5:36:32 PM#79

Couple comments I'd like to make. First, about not having a map:  I like the idea that they are trying to make the game more free-form and using old-school games as a base. I enjoy a challenge and believe that many new MMO games have lost a lot of what made the older games so great. Having said that, I am absolutely horrible at navigation and direction. I always have been and probably always will be, both in video games and in real life.

 

In EQ I had to print the maps out or have people show me the way. It would take 2-3 trips before I could get somewhere w/o getting lost. I don't need a detailed map with quest markers etc, but a basic layout map (such as EQ implemented around the time of the PoP expasion) is a very handy crutch for someone like me. It would even make sense to be able to "draw" the maps in-game. Not physically, but the the areas you explored would show up for future reference as you discovered them.

 

Also, there was no mention in the review of the races beyond that you get certain benefits depending on which race you choose. I am going to have to go find out for myself what races are available and what they are all about. This information would have been very useful in the review, in my opinion, as race selection is a big factor for me in RPG games.

Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.

  RajCaj

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/11/08
Posts: 684

12/01/10 5:39:44 PM#80
Originally posted by mindw0rk

I wonder when journalists stop judging games by "potential". I mean WTF, review it in its current state, not what it could be if developers had some brains.

Mortal Online is one of the worst MMORPGs of all time and a good example of how you can screw EVERYTHING. There is not a single part which is done right. Its so bad that makes Metin 2 look good

 Your missing the point of the article.  The writer is obviously a sandbox fan that (like the rest of the sandbox MMO audience) has been waiting for SOMEONE to do something other than the same theme park crap thats co-opted the MMORPG genere into nothing more than a glorified single player experience.

As he states in his article.....fans of sandbox MMORPGs should be supporting things like what Adventurine or Star Vault has done.  Supporting doesn't mean you have to buy their product.....or even doesn't mean you cant critisize some of the things you feel its done wrong.  It can mean highlighting the good points, the intent, the spirit of the game and calling out the features and mechanics it failed on......which is exactly what I think the author did.

On paper (aside from the FPV only), Mortal Online is the second coming of UO.....its a different story when you log in.  Much of it has to do with lack of funds to put together a solid graphics engine, resources to work on bugs, glitches, etc.....not game logic.

Games like Darkfall and Mortal Online are in the right direction...they just need to pull the "hardcore" reigns in a bit so that it appeals to more fans in the sandbox genere.

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