All over these forums I see people saying different P2P MMOs 'aren't worth the sub'.  Subs are $15 a month.

A decent job will make you $15 in one hour.

Even if you play the game for only five hours in that entire month, I'd say it was money well spent. 

Now, I understand MMOs also have an initial box fee.  $50 is standard when the game first comes out.  I completely understand $50 is a lot of money to drop on something you might not play long.

But no one ever complains about the initial box fee.

I get that some kids dont have jobs, but honestly, I bet you could go up to your parents or neighbors and say I'll hand wash your car for $15 and they'd say ok.  $15 for a hand car wash is about average.

So, why is $15 so much?  Shouldn't people be complaining about the box fee?  How come no one rages when they buy a console game for $60 that only entertains them for ten hours?

IMO, as long as you play the game a few hours in a month, MMOs are good deals.  But maybe I'm in the minority.

When they say they it's not worth the sub, they are also implying it isn't worth the box fee.  Don't take things too literally.

Generally speaking, I don't tend to see people stating the monthly fee is to high and leaving it at that. The monthly fee is usually thrown in with a laundry list of complains. Now, if someone has a list of complaints, then they likely aren't fully enjoying the time they spend in game which would mean it isn't worth $15/month to them. That's just my take on it though...

Internet, cable, phone (cell, too) consoles and console games, gaming rig and PC games, etc.

Entertainment and electronic essentials is expensive as is. $15/month for ACCESS to a game doesn't help too much. — But that's not a problem for the children that have parents with decent jobs. It's different for young adults still trying to figure out what they want to do for the rest of their life. Money is tight.

On top of what the others have said, there is also relative value. It isn't just that game x is $15/mo, but many/most other P2Ps are in that range, too.

So when a game is seriously lacking, content or quality wise (STO or FFXIV for instance) AND they are charging the same as other games that do not suck as bad, that gives players a feeling that they are not getting a good value.

And/or when developers take that $15/mo and continue to not fix bugs, improve rough spots, etc. etc., that also makes the player ask "Is this worth $15, if the devs don't care enough to fix the broken stuff?"

So it is several factors....

It's a global recession!

Some people have the choice between 15$ for a month of gaming, or a week's worth of food.

(yes, via the 99cent store it is totally possible)

@OP

A "decent" job is NOT something that everyone has. Unemployment is at an all time high, and the vast majority of jobs are minimum wage, which in my state (where it's one of the *highest* there is) you'll only take home about 6$ an hour after taxes. Compund that the average housing costs are between 1100 and 1300 a month, and things are NOT that pretty right now.

15$ for a great game is nothing 15$ for a piece of shit game is alot. It all depends on what you compare it to. Nobody is complaining about 15$ per say but rather of the value you get from those 15$ when you compare it to other titles. 

People who complain about the monthly fee are either:

1) Kids who don't have jobs/parents won't let them use their credit cards

2) People who have crappy, low paying jobs and can't/shouldn't be spending money on online games

3) Cheap people who don't like to spend money, though this isn't usually the case as much as 1 & 2

And then there's category X, and if anyone's going to debate me, then they're category X.

As in unkown.

Because I'm not omniscient.

My advice to those who don't want to pay: Then go look elsewhere. If you want a premium experience, you're going to have to pay. Why? Because it costs money to keep an online game going.

$15 a month can be rough if you DON'T get that much hourly...AND you have LOTS of other bills.

I don't get $15 an hour...shit I wish I did but I don't so thats that...

I DO live on my own (well with my gf anyway...which she does not work because she is finishing college)...so I DO have a shit load of bills and other shit to pay.

If I am going to spend 15 a month on a game...it better DAMN WELL be worth MY time and money.

Originally posted by DanMcC

Internet, cable, phone (cell, too) consoles and console games, gaming rig and PC games, etc.

Entertainment and electronic essentials is expensive as is. $15/month for ACCESS to a game doesn't help too much. — But that's not a problem for the children that have parents with decent jobs. It's different for young adults still trying to figure out what they want to do for the rest of their life. Money is tight.

I guess it's how you define "Children" but when I read this complaint I think the poster is one of or both of these two things.

1. Not full time employed

2. Came to the Genre from Maple Story or some other FTP web based game.

To the OP - You are right, it's not that much money. It only seems like a lot to the teenager who is too lazy to find a way to earn some money. All this talk about the bad economy? Well I get served lunch by teenagers several times a week when I pass through drive throughs or pick up my lunch to go. And yes there are the odd jobs too. You can do chores, cut grass, shovel snow or shovel shit (yes my younger brother got paid to shovel horse shit a while back). 

The bottom line is that unless you have ill prepared yourself for life, anyone should be able to cough up $15 a month for a sub. If you are a broke college student just roll the measily pittance into your loans... $180 a year is nothing compared to your current loan balance right? Hell you can sub WoW yearly and get it down to $12 a month. People need to stop making excuses and start subscribing!

Now if the game in question sucks and it's a matter of value instead of funds then that's a different story... no crappy game is worth $5 let alone $15 a month.

Originally posted by DanMcCBut that's not a problem for the children that have parents with decent jobs. It's different for young adults still trying to figure out what they want to do for the rest of their life. Money is tight.

For me this agument is quite poor since that only depend of the priority of this young adult. How many peoples will complaint about the price of a game but still buy a pack of ciggarette each day for 8$? They pay to throw away they health and that ok but hey paying for a game is outrageaous. I dont say money isnt tight for some but in majority people just throw away money in lots worse than a bad game.

Now to stay on topic i think peole just like complaining about mmo in general. If it not the price, its the gameplay or whatever reason.

You obviously haven't been looking for work recently, you'll find destitute people between the ages of 18 and 40 going to job fairs for Starbucks. Not everyone is a teenager that can afford games like this because he lives at home with mommy and doesn't have to pay any overhead. In fact, I think most people with this jaded view on the current situations ARE probably those teenagers living with mommy with no overhead.

S**t is rough right now out there in the *real world*.

I'll take a different tact on this. $15 a month is too much when you want to play multiple games. There was a time a few years ago when I had more time and  money that I had five different MMO accounts. That IS a lot of money. It was my choice at the time, so I'm not complaining.

However, with the emerging f2p models gaining strength, I can play my X number of games again, and only pay for the content I use. I can jump on LOTRO, DDO, Wizard 101, etc and access the game any time. I can budget $20 per month to buy content rather than the $75 in subscription fees, and still play the same amount of time I used to if I want.

When they say it's not worth the sub they're implying that the quality is lacking and isn't worth spending money on.  What they're basically saying is the game is crap and I won't pay for it.

They are NOT saying the game is too expensive.

$15 bucks a month is completely reasonable. I find it fair and studios can make a decent profit if they make a decent game. Hopefully, F2P will be a short lived phenomenon as I don't believe it is healthy for the genre in the long run. Maybe this is a sign of things to come.

Originally posted by Silok

Originally posted by DanMcCBut that's not a problem for the children that have parents with decent jobs. It's different for young adults still trying to figure out what they want to do for the rest of their life. Money is tight.

For me this agument is quite poor since that only depend of the priority of this young adult. How many peoples will complaint about the price of a game but still buy a pack of ciggarette each day for 8$? They pay to throw away they health and that ok but hey paying for a game is outrageaous. I dont say money isnt tight for some but in majority people just throw away money in lots worse than a bad game.

Now to stay on topic i think peole just like complaining about mmo in general. If it not the price, its the gameplay or whatever reason.

Haha. I guess it depends which one you're more addicted to: cigarettes or MMORPGs?

I've always seen it as more of a slam against the game they're referring to than it is a generic feeling that the $15 within itself is too much.

So in other words regardless if it was $30, $15, or $5 in their opinion the game is so bad it isn't worth spending a dime or their time playing it.

op iI know what you mean ,but some title arent qworth the sub,ctake for exemple ff14,to enjoy it you need ssd or you ll be load ing till you die .aim sorry but if  pocket legend become better then ff14 and its on my epic 4g then ff14 has an issue.and lets face it wow keep raising the bar in tterm of look and quality ,people playing wow expect that now a day if they dont get it they move om.iI play wow dx11 activated,at max setting 1layer,ans iI get 40fps,grapic quality is very nice .people want their moneys worth espacially with the economy dying in the coming days ,some city in amerivca are in such bad shape you d think that you r in third world coutry,nope you are still in usa,people just cannot afford it,they can barly put food on the tABLE GEES

Originally posted by Wickedjelly

I've always seen it as more of a slam against the game they're referring to than it is a generic feeling that the $15 within itself is too much.

So in other words regardless if it was $30, $15, or $5 in their opinion the game is so bad it isn't worth spending a dime or their time playing it.

This. I could probably find $15 worth of change scattered around the bottom of my extremely messy car, but I'd rather toss it in the rainy day fund than spend it on a sub-par game.