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Lord of the Rings Online

Lord of the Rings Online 

General Discussion  » A warning to European players planning to join this game for Free 2 Play

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62 posts found
  User Deleted
10/19/10 6:55:31 AM#41

If you can tolerate a company that discriminates against Europe and only cares about its US population then go ahead  and play on their servers. What is currently happening to the EU version is not acceptable and Turbine are not innocent. They are the developers so they should do something about it. They don't really care about Europe. Well I don't care about their game.

  User Deleted
10/19/10 9:25:55 AM#42
Originally posted by Zilverrug
Originally posted by SgtFrog

I don’t think code masters labelling it as the official RP server is any different to Landroval which is the unofficial player made RP server.

On Laurelin there is actual enforcement on things like character names and guild names, which have to be more or less lore-correct instead of just inoffensive. I guess this enforcement is the main difference.

oh yeah, that is something that I wish would happen on Landroval...I hate seeing names like Iwillstabyou, wugwugwug and omnomnomnom..Those type of names have gone up since F2P.

  sadeyx

Novice Member

Joined: 11/22/06
Posts: 1570

10/20/10 3:31:36 AM#43
Originally posted by anieli

 What is currently happening to the EU version is not acceptable and Turbine are not innocent. They are the developers so they should do something about it. They don't really care about Europe. Well I don't care about their game.

You really have let your speculation and presumtion control your emotions then havnt you?

A recent letter from Codemasters states that the entire delay has been "contractual"  which means it could be codemasters to fault, could be turbine... could be any number of third parties.

So to make a wild conclusion that its turbine leading you to stubbornly refuse to indulge in their product then really, its your loss.

After all, if turbine really hated europe they could so easily have placed an IP block.  They could even have made it so that EU Credits cards dont work.   But they have paid every courtesy to the EU community and their site even seems to hint at supporting EU languages.

 

I love Turbine, even if this delay is their blame... I think its great, its about time they did something to shaft Codemasters who offer such a poor quality service in comparrison.

  User Deleted
10/20/10 6:40:36 AM#44
Originally posted by sadeyx
Originally posted by anieli

 What is currently happening to the EU version is not acceptable and Turbine are not innocent. They are the developers so they should do something about it. They don't really care about Europe. Well I don't care about their game.

I love Turbine, even if this delay is their blame... I think its great, its about time they did something to shaft Codemasters who offer such a poor quality service in comparrison.

 That's why I am pissed off. They should get rid of Codemasters and find a replacement or merge the servers or offer the service themselves.

  User Deleted
10/20/10 6:45:59 AM#45
Originally posted by anieli
Originally posted by sadeyx
Originally posted by anieli

 What is currently happening to the EU version is not acceptable and Turbine are not innocent. They are the developers so they should do something about it. They don't really care about Europe. Well I don't care about their game.

I love Turbine, even if this delay is their blame... I think its great, its about time they did something to shaft Codemasters who offer such a poor quality service in comparrison.

 That's why I am pissed off. They should get rid of Codemasters and find a replacement or merge the servers or offer the service themselves.

1) Moving the EU servers to NA will be bad for many EU players...high ping.
2) Turbine opening a branch in the EU will cost millions and will probably not be worth it in the long run.
3)Code masters may be bad but that is always the case with third party publishers.
  Rocketeer

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/07/04
Posts: 1310

10/20/10 7:09:56 AM#46

Actually CM isn't bad at all. People tend to forget that we had 3 years of near perfect service from them, especially considering they have to do the localization on their own. Imho you can blame CM for neither the DDO debacle or the recent LotRO trouble, both times there where clearly exterior circumstances involved beyond their control. What CM did for us:

 

1. Offer LTAs a whole lot longer, infact they are still offering them. LTA = Good.

2. Offer us RP servers, this is more work, extra GMs and just to please a relatively small part of their customers. RP server = Good. Landroval in the US isn't really the same, you won't even know its the unofficial RP server unless you dig into the forums. A [RP] tag in the serverlist really goes a long way to consolidate the RPs.

3. Do not censor their forums as much as Turbine. I always found it ironic that the US are so adamant and vocal about free speech(the spirit, not the law), yet their forums often choose to kick it while its down. Just because you have the right to do something doesn't mean you have to do it ...

4. Remember the adventurer pack? It cost less than half in Europe, i bought it on both services and paid like 15 or 20$ in the US and got it for less than 8 in europe. Same for moria box, its currently about half the price on amazon than the US version.

 

Strangely enough all these delays only happen when Turbine is involved somehow, be it contractual issues like F2P launch or the new mylotro site and lorebook. Also i remember a tweed from patience i think, where he was asked why Turbine couldn't comment on the launch issues in Europe, he said they could comment, but choose not too. So they slapped a NDA on CM, forced them to take blame for the delay, and then didn't even have the decency to tell people that they where in contractual negotiations with CM who after all couldn't speak for themselves.

Besides how much of what we see is Turbine, and how much is WB? I mean we blame CM for the delay right? But who did announce F2P for the 10.09. in europe without any contracts set? It was WB, not CM.

  User Deleted
10/20/10 7:15:01 AM#47
Originally posted by Rocketeer

Actually CM isn't bad at all. People tend to forget that we had 3 years of near perfect service from them, especially considering they have to do the localization on their own. Imho you can blame CM for neither the DDO debacle or the recent LotRO trouble, both times there where clearly exterior circumstances involved beyond their control. What CM did for us:

 

1. Offer LTAs a whole lot longer, infact they are still offering them. LTA = Good.

2. Offer us RP servers, this is more work, extra GMs and just to please a relatively small part of their customers. RP server = Good. Landroval in the US isn't really the same, you won't even know its the unofficial RP server unless you dig into the forums. A [RP] tag in the serverlist really goes a long way to consolidate the RPs.

3. Do not censor their forums as much as Turbine. I always found it ironic that the US are so adamant and vocal about free speech(the spirit, not the law), yet their forums often choose to kick it while its down. Just because you have the right to do something doesn't mean you have to do it ...

4. Remember the adventurer pack? It cost less than half in Europe, i bought it on both services and paid like 15 or 20$ in the US and got it for less than 8 in europe. Same for moria box, its currently about half the price on amazon than the US version.

 

Strangely enough all these delays only happen when Turbine is involved somehow, be it contractual issues like F2P launch or the new mylotro site and lorebook. Also i remember a tweed from patience i think, where he was asked why Turbine couldn't comment on the launch issues in Europe, he said they could comment, but choose not too. So they slapped a NDA on CM, forced them to take blame for the delay, and then didn't even have the decency to tell people that they where in contractual negotiations with CM who after all couldn't speak for themselves.

Besides how much of what we see is Turbine, and how much is WB? I mean we blame CM for the delay right? But who did announce F2P for the 10.09. in europe without any contracts set? It was WB, not CM.

My reasons for not liking CM is personal..They took £20 from me when I sighed up for the DDO trial a couple years back and they would not give me a refund even though I only played the trial for 1 day..
Somehow I ended up paying for two months sub when I did not subscribe.
  Rocketeer

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/07/04
Posts: 1310

10/20/10 7:21:29 AM#48
Originally posted by SgtFrog
My reasons for not liking CM is personal..They took £20 from me when I sighed up for the DDO trial a couple years back and they would not give me a refund even though I only played the trial for 1 day..
Somehow I ended up paying for two months sub when I did not subscribe.

Ouch, yeah i wouldn't take kindly to that either. But usually CM customer service isn't that bad, i only had a problem once 2 years ago(their system wouldn't accept a CD key from a box) and got it solved in like 5 min by just phoning them.

  User Deleted
10/20/10 7:32:00 AM#49
Originally posted by Rocketeer
Originally posted by SgtFrog
My reasons for not liking CM is personal..They took £20 from me when I sighed up for the DDO trial a couple years back and they would not give me a refund even though I only played the trial for 1 day..
Somehow I ended up paying for two months sub when I did not subscribe.

Ouch, yeah i wouldn't take kindly to that either. But usually CM customer service isn't that bad, i only had a problem once 2 years ago(their system wouldn't accept a CD key from a box) and got it solved in like 5 min by just phoning them.

Yeah, anyway in the end LOTRO is a great game..either by Turbine or CM.

CM may be a little behind LOTRO Turbine but you usually get that with third party publishers.

 

  rturja

Novice Member

Joined: 10/10/05
Posts: 199

10/20/10 7:33:45 AM#50
Originally posted by Rocketeer

2. Offer us RP servers, this is more work, extra GMs and just to please a relatively small part of their customers. RP server = Good. Landroval in the US isn't really the same, you won't even know its the unofficial RP server unless you dig into the forums. A [RP] tag in the serverlist really goes a long way to consolidate the RPs.

 The RP server and ruleset is token only. Codemasters use the exact same GM's and do allow immersion breaking names despite the ruleset saying otherwise. I personally despise Codies for that - If players are promised a server where names etc. would suit to the world and they are given a regular server with a funny tag, it's just meh.

Codies do not put ANY extra effort in running RP servers.

I rather had an unofficial RP server, at least there the naming and other immersion breakers could be glossed over...

Playing: AC2
Played: UO, DaoC, Horizons, Ryzom, WAR, LotRO, Eve, VG...

  Rocketeer

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/07/04
Posts: 1310

10/20/10 9:04:20 AM#51
Originally posted by rturja
Originally posted by Rocketeer

2. Offer us RP servers, this is more work, extra GMs and just to please a relatively small part of their customers. RP server = Good. Landroval in the US isn't really the same, you won't even know its the unofficial RP server unless you dig into the forums. A [RP] tag in the serverlist really goes a long way to consolidate the RPs.

 The RP server and ruleset is token only. Codemasters use the exact same GM's and do allow immersion breaking names despite the ruleset saying otherwise. I personally despise Codies for that - If players are promised a server where names etc. would suit to the world and they are given a regular server with a funny tag, it's just meh.

Codies do not put ANY extra effort in running RP servers.

I rather had an unofficial RP server, at least there the naming and other immersion breakers could be glossed over...

 

1. All names i have reported got changed.

2. You can gloss over immersion breaker on official RP servers aswell.

 

And yes they do put extra effort in it, many many people agree that CM is reacting swift and decisively with any infraction of their rules, i have GMs answer my tickets in <1 hour on the RP servers. I have seen whole kinship names vanish and hardly ever see someone with an lore immersion breaking name survive to the 40s even.

And atleast we can report such people on RP servers, and don't have to listen to soccer discussions in general chat. Its a difference between night and day for me, on unofficial RP servers you see all kinds of crappy RL discussions in chat, and they have a right to do that as the server isn't official RP. On EU RP servers you warn them once, then they get reported and it will stop very shortly afterwards.

  crazynanny

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/03/10
Posts: 175

10/21/10 4:19:51 AM#52


Originally posted by Rocketeer
4. Remember the adventurer pack? It cost less than half in Europe, i bought it on both services and paid like 15 or 20$ in the US and got it for less than 8 in europe. Same for moria box, its currently about half the price on amazon than the US version.


In the initial offer You could get free Mirkwood xpac in US just for paying multi month subscription(which You had to do anyways in order to play), Codies offer were nowhere near good. Lifers had a bit rougher offer, but got free adventurers pack when purchasing Mirkwood. Also CM charge about 30% more for people outside UK due to "exchange rates".

So depending on person, I guess there grass is always greener...


Though LTAs is indeed a sweet deal, tho I wonder if it's contractual or only Turbines good will to honor them when license will expire.

  User Deleted
10/21/10 4:30:46 AM#53
Originally posted by crazynanny

 


Originally posted by Rocketeer
4. Remember the adventurer pack? It cost less than half in Europe, i bought it on both services and paid like 15 or 20$ in the US and got it for less than 8 in europe. Same for moria box, its currently about half the price on amazon than the US version.



In the initial offer You could get free Mirkwood xpac in US just for paying multi month subscription(which You had to do anyways in order to play), Codies offer were nowhere near good. Lifers had a bit rougher offer, but got free adventurers pack when purchasing Mirkwood. Also CM charge about 30% more for people outside UK due to "exchange rates".

So depending on person, I guess there grass is always greener...


Though LTAs is indeed a sweet deal, tho I wonder if it's contractual or only Turbines good will to honor them when license will expire.

 

People who use the € always end up paying more for games online, not just CM...I know this is a problem on other mmorpg and online retailers like steam.

  User Deleted
10/22/10 4:11:31 AM#54
Originally posted by SgtFrog

People who use the € always end up paying more for games online, not just CM...I know this is a problem on other mmorpg and online retailers like steam.

That's because they like them so much... the more the better!

If I had an international company, I'd love to have my income in euros and my debt in US dollars...

  Rocketeer

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/07/04
Posts: 1310

10/22/10 8:34:45 AM#55

That problem is actually one of tax evasion. US companies usually list prices without VAT because its different in every state(they only have like 7% anyway), while in europe prices are always listed with VAT. So what happens when you order from a US service is that they don't add the VAT because your not living in the US, but your not paying the EU VAT either. So actually your not only comparing currencies, you compare tax free shopping vs taxed shopping.

I actually had a nice discussion with our local customs here in germany, where they confirmed that i actually should declare and pay tax for these kind of things but it only ever gets enforced for values above 40€ or 50€ i think, and even there only if they catch you redhanded which is more than unlikely with subscriptions and the like.

 

So yeah, technically your evading tax(though its usually below some free limit), and thats why its so cheap. Once you slap on that 18-20% VAT we have in europe these things do not look as cheap anymore.

  crazynanny

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/03/10
Posts: 175

10/23/10 9:14:40 AM#56

Well my point about 30% difference was between United Kingdom aka in Europe vs say Germany again in Europe. Unless I'm horribly wrong UK has a VAT tax as well.

  User Deleted
10/23/10 9:19:31 AM#57
Originally posted by crazynanny

Well my point about 30% difference was between United Kingdom aka in Europe vs say Germany again in Europe. Unless I'm horribly wrong UK has a VAT tax as well.

Yeah 20%.

  Rocketeer

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/07/04
Posts: 1310

10/23/10 9:33:28 AM#58
Originally posted by crazynanny

Well my point about 30% difference was between United Kingdom aka in Europe vs say Germany again in Europe. Unless I'm horribly wrong UK has a VAT tax as well.

Inner European tax is something else completely, i was only talking about transactions between US and Europe. If you are inside the EU, you pay the tax of the country where the service provider is located, and do not have to pay your own countries tax.

Simple example, say i order a game from Amazon.co.uk to an address in Germany. I will pay whatever tax there is in UK for the product, which then will never even touch customs.

 

Which of course raises the question of why there is such a difference between UK and EU prices that goes beyond the exchange rate or VAT differences. If have some ideas but that would get pretty offtopic. Suffice to say there is a similar situation in regards to medicine, which has a less then pleasant explanation for us customers.

  User Deleted
10/24/10 5:18:29 AM#59
Originally posted by crazynanny

Well my point about 30% difference was between United Kingdom aka in Europe vs say Germany again in Europe. Unless I'm horribly wrong UK has a VAT tax as well.

That might be solved by (virtually) moving to the UK to allow payment in Pound Sterling instead of Euro.

  Wickedjelly

Novice Member

Joined: 4/19/09
Posts: 5064

The Dude abides

10/24/10 9:33:37 AM#60

I'm so glad I never had to deal with Code Masters.  They seem to cause nothing but problems for players in games they have been involved in.

1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.

2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.

3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.

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