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Lord of the Rings Online

Lord of the Rings Online 

General Discussion  » Are pay as You go even worth it ?

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54 posts found
  crazynanny

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/03/10
Posts: 175

 
OP  9/16/10 9:34:55 AM#1

After reading forums here and official ones I heard so much about hybrid payment being a reasonable thing for people, as it gives a choice to pay as You go or subscribe. Subscription is quite obvious so I want to consider pay as You go.

So payment for all areas and unlocks is more or less cost of what lifetimers(perma VIP) paid. But is it worth it? Considering issue with no sensible swift travels available in turbine store(60 minute one is a joke). This alone makes me feel like 2nd rate customer. Kinda felt bad when questing(epic books) with friend and recognizing I have to trot over Angmar on horse as swifts are no avail. Now if I imagine going to Rivendell from there(like 30 minutes ride) I get kinda annoyed. I thought that quest pack bought = all swifts available.

I sure hope that this will change as basic things like this are nearly gamebreaking and I thought pay as You go was a reasonable option.

  SnarlingWolf

Novice Member

Joined: 6/23/09
Posts: 2728

9/16/10 9:38:49 AM#2

Pay as you go is just that, pay as you go. It should really only be used by 3 types of people. 1) Those that want to check out the game but aren't ready to make an investment in it. 2) Those who are very very casual and don't have much time to play, so they play for an hour here and there and drop in money when they need something. 3) The super cheap who think they should never have to pay for anything and are willing to grind out Turbine points/run everywhere since they don't want to pay for swift travel.

 

You are NOT supposed to have all the benefits as those who sub unless you pay a significant amount of money, simple as that. If you want swift travel then keep paying for it or sub. Subscription is the smart choice and as people have said on MMORPG a million times, it is about the same cost as going to the movies ONCE in an entire month.

  Jackdog

Elite Member

Joined: 3/19/04
Posts: 6370

9/16/10 9:59:02 AM#3

By the time you get to Rivendale and Angmar you will know if the game is worth 50 cents a day top you. If you want all the bells and whistles buy a subscription. If you just want free play or cannot afford that 50 cents then fine,  just don't complain cause they don't give you everything the subbers get

I miss DAoC

  User Deleted
9/16/10 10:03:34 AM#4

I am currently free to play and I'm loving it, It's letting me experience the game and have a blast. I will  probably sub as I cna see how LOTOR online is one of the most casually friendly games with it's systems and crafting. However if I don't want to play or I get into something else. I can stop paying and keep playing and if I want some featuers I pay for them. I like the idea because it means I can always play the game wether it's my main game or not.

  crazynanny

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/03/10
Posts: 175

 
OP  9/16/10 10:03:49 AM#5


Originally posted by SnarlingWolf
Pay as you go is just that, pay as you go. It should really only be used by 3 types of people. 1) Those that want to check out the game but aren't ready to make an investment in it. 2) Those who are very very casual and don't have much time to play, so they play for an hour here and there and drop in money when they need something. 3) The super cheap who think they should never have to pay for anything and are willing to grind out Turbine points/run everywhere since they don't want to pay for swift travel.
 
You are NOT supposed to have all the benefits as those who sub unless you pay a significant amount of money, simple as that. If you want swift travel then keep paying for it or sub. Subscription is the smart choice and as people have said on MMORPG a million times, it is about the same cost as going to the movies ONCE in an entire month.


So all the buzz about Turbine hybrid payment model being great, innovative and a more convenient way for people to pay, was just marketing? I thought the reason of cash shop being brought to give a choice - You sub and don't care. Or You pay as You go. From what You are writing it seems not. Subscribe or be gimped. Thanks for clearing that one for me.

  SnarlingWolf

Novice Member

Joined: 6/23/09
Posts: 2728

9/16/10 10:07:26 AM#6
Originally posted by crazynanny

 


Originally posted by SnarlingWolf
Pay as you go is just that, pay as you go. It should really only be used by 3 types of people. 1) Those that want to check out the game but aren't ready to make an investment in it. 2) Those who are very very casual and don't have much time to play, so they play for an hour here and there and drop in money when they need something. 3) The super cheap who think they should never have to pay for anything and are willing to grind out Turbine points/run everywhere since they don't want to pay for swift travel.
 
You are NOT supposed to have all the benefits as those who sub unless you pay a significant amount of money, simple as that. If you want swift travel then keep paying for it or sub. Subscription is the smart choice and as people have said on MMORPG a million times, it is about the same cost as going to the movies ONCE in an entire month.



So all the buzz about Turbine hybrid payment model being great, innovative and a more convenient way for people to pay, was just marketing? I thought the reason of cash shop being brought to give a choice - You sub and don't care. Or You pay as You go. From what You are writing it seems not. Subscribe or be gimped. Thanks for clearing that one for me.

 

 If you are going to play hard and level fast, pay as you go isn't going to work for you. The rate at which you will have to buy content and perks will be expensive therefore a subscription is the way to go.

 

If you don't play much/level fast then you can likely make F2P be cheaper month to month by a bit. And you can take two weeks to a month off without feeling like you are wasting your money.

 

It really isn't a tough concept. The problem is that people who like to game several hours a night WANT to not have to pay for their gaming so they keep getting mad when f2p games still cost them money. They don't get the having to pay for entertainment idea.

  Odysses

Novice Member

Joined: 4/11/05
Posts: 582

9/16/10 10:07:40 AM#7

My take on it is the F2P really works great for casual players.   You can basically start the game play at a very slow pace and not pay a dime.   Once you get into your 20's then you can drop a minimal amount of money for more content if you haven't acquired enough pts to unlock it for free.   It also works great for former subscribers that bought the game.  Full access to the game without paying the subscription fee.   Everything else is just like it was before, paying subscribers get access to everything.

  Jackdog

Elite Member

Joined: 3/19/04
Posts: 6370

9/16/10 10:09:09 AM#8
Originally posted by crazynanny


So all the buzz about Turbine hybrid payment model being great, innovative and a more convenient way for people to pay, was just marketing? I thought the reason of cash shop being brought to give a choice - You sub and don't care. Or You pay as You go. From what You are writing it seems not. Subscribe or be gimped. Thanks for clearing that one for me.

suppose for a minute you are in the military and subject to being home  a week or two, then out to sea for a week or two. Suppose you are in college or med school and can only play a couple of days a week. Suppose you are dead broke with three kids to feed and clothe. May be you just want to play to 30 to see if you like it?  It will be great for some people, just because it is not for you does not mean it is bad.

I miss DAoC

  crazynanny

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/03/10
Posts: 175

 
OP  9/16/10 10:14:58 AM#9


Originally posted by Jackdog
By the time you get to Rivendale and Angmar you will know if the game is worth 50 cents a day top you. If you want all the bells and whistles buy a subscription. If you want free play or cannnot afford that 50 centsd then fine, just don't complain cause they don't give you everything the subbers get


Umm I have no idea why You confuse buying in turbine store with playing for free. Surely there should be some incentives(like destiny points, free updates, 500 free points a month) for subscribers. But from what I have read about the best f2p game I though hybrid means also possibility of buying all basic things. Cutting 40 minute travels is hardly a convenience, it's a basic thing. And no I don't want it for free(thought that it was clear).

  crazynanny

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/03/10
Posts: 175

 
OP  9/16/10 10:21:44 AM#10


Originally posted by Jackdog
suppose for a minute you are in the military and subject to being home  a week or two, then out to sea for a week or two. Suppose you are in college or med school and can only play a couple of days a week. Suppose you are dead broke with three kids to feed and clothe. May be you just want to play to 30 to see if you like it?  It will be great for some people, just because it is not for you does not mean it is bad.


Hmmm if I wanted to try game I'd just play free trial. And from what I know this didn't changed much, except becoming endless trial. Now if I was a very casual person and traveling would eat half of my gaming session and I wouldn't have any reasonable way to omit it I'd certainly feel bad.

It's not about expecting everything for free or being casual or not. It's about if paying as You go is viable at all.

  SnarlingWolf

Novice Member

Joined: 6/23/09
Posts: 2728

9/16/10 10:26:25 AM#11
Originally posted by crazynanny

 


Originally posted by Jackdog
By the time you get to Rivendale and Angmar you will know if the game is worth 50 cents a day top you. If you want all the bells and whistles buy a subscription. If you want free play or cannnot afford that 50 centsd then fine, just don't complain cause they don't give you everything the subbers get



Umm I have no idea why You confuse buying in turbine store with playing for free. Surely there should be some incentives(like destiny points, free updates, 500 free points a month) for subscribers. But from what I have read about the best f2p game I though hybrid means also possibility of buying all basic things. Cutting 40 minute travels is hardly a convenience, it's a basic thing. And no I don't want it for free(thought that it was clear).

 

 It is a convenience.

 

Do all the quests in an area and then run to the next area. Amazingly enough this was actually how MMORPGs were played by subscribing customers in the early days. It is not a necessity to be able to hop from point a to point b in 2 seconds.

 

Thinking that it is a necessity does show your mindset when it comes to MMOs and that you feel you are owed many things simply for playing.

  Rocketeer

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/07/04
Posts: 1310

9/16/10 10:29:40 AM#12

I think the OP is right though. A premium spendign enough money should be on equal eye high with subscriptions, it should be a different model, not a second class customer. But the swift travel issue is really a bit harsh. Its really the only part of the game that significiantly divides VIPs and premium players that are ready to pay, and i just do not see a good reason for it(unlike say the gold limit or trade limits of F2P accounts which do serve a distinct purpose).

This is a problem thats only going to grow, the more people that take Turbines offer and permanently buy questpacks etc, the more people there will be that are willing to pay in principle but will unwilling to subscribe. Its one thing to tell a a new player to do subscription instead of premium content, its quite another to tell a premium member who possibly has already spend hundreds of dollars on the game that he needs to subscribe if he wants a basic gamefeature like swift travel.

 

It will become a problem in the long run, when we have lots of premium players that are basically stuck with their premium account since they bought so much content it would be economically unviable to subscribe for them. Swift travel needs to be a permanent unlock in the store just like gold limit, bag space or AH slots. If those critical protections against gold farmers/spammers can be permanently unlocked the same should be true for Swift travel.

This will affect all of us, even the lifetimers, when we have to wait 20 min on someone in our group because he has no access to Swift travel. I don't want to be in the position that i have to remove someone from the group or wait 20 min, i can see no good coming from this restriction.

  Nozzie

Novice Member

Joined: 9/05/08
Posts: 55

9/16/10 10:47:40 AM#13
Originally posted by crazynanny

 

So payment for all areas and unlocks is more or less cost of what lifetimers(perma VIP) paid. But is it worth it? Considering issue with no sensible swift travels available in turbine store(60 minute one is a joke). This alone makes me feel like 2nd rate customer. Kinda felt bad when questing(epic books) with friend and recognizing I have to trot over Angmar on horse as swifts are no avail. Now if I imagine going to Rivendell from there(like 30 minutes ride) I get kinda annoyed. I thought that quest pack bought = all swifts available.

 

Don't jump down my throat for stating the bleeding obvious , but as a subscriber I generally need to have gained a certain reputation with the local faction & have previously been to my destinations stable-master before I have access to swift travel . Is this not available for F2P players ? If so , then I can understand your frustration . 

  crazynanny

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/03/10
Posts: 175

 
OP  9/16/10 10:59:19 AM#14


Originally posted by Nozzie

Don't jump down my throat for stating the bleeding obvious , but as a subscriber I generally need to have gained a certain reputation with the local faction & have previously been to my destinations stable-master before I have access to swift travel . Is this not available for F2P players ? If so , then I can understand your frustration . 


Yes You can do all reputation and level requirement , yet You can't use swift travel. Only normal if it's available. And my point is not to get this for free, but being a part of quest pack or as an unlock in cash shop.

  crazynanny

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/03/10
Posts: 175

 
OP  9/16/10 11:05:52 AM#15


Originally posted by SnarlingWolf
 It is a convenience.
 
Do all the quests in an area and then run to the next area. Amazingly enough this was actually how MMORPGs were played by subscribing customers in the early days. It is not a necessity to be able to hop from point a to point b in 2 seconds.
 
Thinking that it is a necessity does show your mindset when it comes to MMOs and that you feel you are owed many things simply for playing.


Ah so personal attack starts, just because I have a different opinion? This is necessity if it takes 30-40 minutes to travel from one NPC to another. Have You ever done epic books in LOTRO? If yes You should know what I'm talking about. And please stop trolling I already said I don't want it for free. I just want to be able to buy things in turbine store to be on VIP level minus some conveniences.

  Jackdog

Elite Member

Joined: 3/19/04
Posts: 6370

9/16/10 11:23:37 AM#16
Originally posted by crazynanny


Umm I have no idea why You confuse buying in turbine store with playing for free. Surely there should be some incentives(like destiny points, free updates, 500 free points a month) for subscribers. But from what I have read about the best f2p game I though hybrid means also possibility of buying all basic things. Cutting 40 minute travels is hardly a convenience, it's a basic thing. And no I don't want it for free(thought that it was clear).

 I have no idea why you are whining about a company giving you the chance to play a AAA MMO to level 50 for the cost of a download. I sure don't see other companies out there doing that.

if you want to play free then take what they give for free instead whining. That is like some homeless person complaining the mashed potatoes are cold and the hamburger patty is not a steak LOL

I miss DAoC

  Jackdog

Elite Member

Joined: 3/19/04
Posts: 6370

9/16/10 11:25:05 AM#17
Originally posted by crazynanny

 


. I just want to be able to buy things in turbine store to be on VIP level minus some conveniences.

so either buy the swift travel scrolls or go vip for 50 cents a day. Sounds more like you want  the lifetime membership than anything else.

I miss DAoC

  Morrowbreeze

Novice Member

Joined: 9/04/10
Posts: 126

9/16/10 11:37:57 AM#18

Just to post my "opinions" I  personally think the AH restriction needs loosened some as well as the no trade with money between players. Those two do put a strangle on a f2per who may be a crafter type.

And horses! my goodness! HOw many times has this question been asked,..."Where/how do I get a horse"?  Giving a 24 hour horse and then removing it is torture almost. That seems to be the most agonizing play mechanism f2pers get.

Swift travel is gonna be pretty important for a f2per who joins a group 10000 meters away. Tweak is the word of the day.

  Rocketeer

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/07/04
Posts: 1310

9/16/10 12:04:59 PM#19
Originally posted by Jackdog
Originally posted by crazynanny

 


. I just want to be able to buy things in turbine store to be on VIP level minus some conveniences.

so either buy the swift travel scrolls or go vip for 50 cents a day. Sounds more like you want  the lifetime membership than anything else.

In all fairness thats how it works in DDO, premium is exactly supposed to be like a lifetime without future content and the 500 TP stipend. Its very likely that premium players would spend a lot more cash than subscribers in the short term, so it makes no sense they should have worse service.

And my point stands, gold limits don't bother me, but swift travel limitations of half your group will affect even VIPs unless you refuse to group with Premium players. Im not trying to say turbine should't get the money, im just saying its imho not a good place for them to earn it. The whole idea of renting swifttravel for 1hr is poorly thought out since there is hardly any need to use swift travel for a whole hour. Even an on use counter would make more sense, i.e. 5 Swift travel rides for xx TP.

 

But like they said they will tweak things in the store, and looking how well they reacted to beta feedback im sure they will find a solution here that works well.

  Jackdog

Elite Member

Joined: 3/19/04
Posts: 6370

9/16/10 12:15:01 PM#20
Originally posted by Rocketeer

In all fairness thats how it works in DDO, premium is exactly supposed to be like a lifetime without future content and the 500 TP stipend. Its very likely that premium players would spend a lot more cash than subscribers in the short term, so it makes no sense they should have worse service.

Well maybe I am looking at it the wrong way, but other than in a few instances I cannot see why anyone would choose pay as you go over a monthly sub if they are going to do anything other than the most casual gameing.

As far as dungeon groups I would think that 99% of the time VIPs are going to do them via the skirmish system these days anyway and thqat is VIP only if I am not mistaken.

I miss DAoC

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