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News & Features Discussion  » General: Fighting Talk: LoTRO vs. WoW

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288 posts found
  pixelRainbow

Novice Member

Joined: 11/08/08
Posts: 4

8/30/10 9:30:04 AM#241
Originally posted by tooned


Later in the game you could solo but why play an mmo solo?

 

Why solo? Because not everyone can be committed to a group in games, being more of a casual gamer (having less time to play and/or not according to a set schedule). So why not play a sinle player RPG insetad? Because for example LOTRO has lots ot offer for a solo player, and most importantly, an MMO has a lot bigger content than any other single player game. It is extended all the time and new story elements appear. Not for 3-5 DLCs but for years...

LOTRO for me is espacially solo-friendly. Not in a sense that I can advance as fast as people who actively play together with kinnies (I am a slow player anyway, story is more important than getting to max level the fastest way), but for the fact that if you like playing alone, you are not forced to to otherwise.

For those who are not aware of it: LOTRO started to make previously fellowship-only epic quests available for solo players, too. For me it is a huge relief, as I can see even nore of the story. Is then the community aspect of the game lost then? Absolutely not. I tend to roleplay sometimes and get into conversaton with strangers. Also, when I hit max level, my kinnies can surely count on me for some raids. Not every week, but they can. :)

  MMartian

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/25/10
Posts: 46

8/30/10 9:31:46 AM#242

I agree with the conclusion that the games are very similar. Personally I prefer WoW over LOTRO.

I do feel that some aspects were incorrectly characterized.

For the starting area's I found equal diversity and difference in story line. WoW does have a starting area that is currently shared by two races in both factions. If the reviewer just did the two races that share a starting area I can see where they drew the wrong conclusion.

While I agree with how he characterized the two communities I disagree with him blaming Blizzard for their community and Turbine for their. I completely disagree with his blasting the cross game, cross server, and facebood extensions to the Blizzard friends list. Like the reviewer I have no use for the feature. But those features did not add to the community problems that he described and were requested by a large number of players so I will not fault Blizzard for implementing things that players requested.

  ThePendragon

Novice Member

Joined: 11/21/08
Posts: 3

8/30/10 11:16:00 AM#243

WOW may win with this guys reviews..which though insightful..do betray a slight bias.  Having been a long time LOTRO player..I may too have a bias..however...after trying WOW..I was mostly disappointed by a number of things.  The cartoony avatars and the world...the general lack of maturity of the community..and the difficulty in trying to locate people in game. 

LOTRO's world is truly remarkable (Ofcourse that is because the world is full of a large number of die-hard Tolkein fans,..and if Turbine screws anything up in Middle Earth..there would be such a tide of woe that they would suffer greatly...something they are no doubt aware of)  The community if LOTRO shows a remarkable level of Maturity for an MMO.  The few annoyances face not only getting quickly put on everyone;s ignore list..but truly offensive types will face banning.  Locating someone in game can prove difficult however.  With LOTRO's server set up isolating each server from the others..it can be very hard to hunt up someone without knowing which server they may be on.  After 6 years of CIty Of Heroes/Villains..I am somewhat spoiled by their global channels..and hoping that Turbine may yet offer something similar...it is not a major priority.

 

One point I wanted to make about his comparrisons of endgame and PVP is that one...Endgame is not a HUGE part of LOTRO's Endgame...and thus not a required part of every players experience.  With the huge ammount of quests and story lines...there is alot to do.  Hell..even hitting 65..alot of people find they have lots to finish yet..myself included.

 

Two..PVP...while WOW has this set up from the beginning...LOTRO did not focus on that.  Middle Earth is about heroes fighting the great evils...and thus PVP is not a major focus of the genre.  The PVP in LOTRO is restricted..for the moment..to one zone...but is still available for any player who wants to do so..but again..is not required to play the game. 

 

Taking these points into consideration...I think one could consider the two games drawn..with a slight edge to LOTRO...but again the bias is by what the player prefers.  I prefer a game that is worthy of my time..and not so much about the grind as it is for the esperience.

  Echo08

Novice Member

Joined: 2/06/07
Posts: 57

8/30/10 3:43:33 PM#244

[Mod Edit]

my point is.... I have trouble staying awake playing wow or LOTRO... Neither is all that exciting to me.  Unfortunately... not too much is on the horizon industry wise and like many others I'm ready for something fresh, innovative, and challenging.  

  Kratier

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/13/09
Posts: 78

8/30/10 10:06:34 PM#245

wow's endgame = good? LOL nice one, have fun re-grinding the same dungeon for over a year straight 2x a week with no endgame content released since that year started

 

you have to buy the new 40$ expansion to get the next content update,

 

meanwhile lotro gives content updates regularly, and the content is GOOD

oh yeah what was the population census for WOW again? 99% hybrid classes, 1% pure? over 60-70% population entirely paladins?

 

good luck with that kid,

  Dreadstone

Novice Member

Joined: 2/13/10
Posts: 125

8/31/10 12:42:35 AM#246
Originally posted by Kratier

wow's endgame = good? LOL nice one, have fun re-grinding the same dungeon for over a year straight 2x a week with no endgame content released since that year started

 

you have to buy the new 40$ expansion to get the next content update,

 

meanwhile lotro gives content updates regularly, and the content is GOOD

oh yeah what was the population census for WOW again? 99% hybrid classes, 1% pure? over 60-70% population entirely paladins?

 

good luck with that kid,

 

Nice dude!  You managed to get absolutely everything wrong about WoW except for the price of the next expansion.  And even that is wrong if you're implying that you need to pay that to get new content.  All of Azeroth will be effected by the Cataclysm whether you have the expansion or not giving a changed world (with new maps and terrain) even for people who don't have the expansion.

I hear LoTRO is a really good game.  No reason to make things up to make it sound better, lol.

  User Deleted
8/31/10 12:48:02 AM#247
Originally posted by Dreadstone
Originally posted by Kratier

wow's endgame = good? LOL nice one, have fun re-grinding the same dungeon for over a year straight 2x a week with no endgame content released since that year started

 

you have to buy the new 40$ expansion to get the next content update,

 

meanwhile lotro gives content updates regularly, and the content is GOOD

oh yeah what was the population census for WOW again? 99% hybrid classes, 1% pure? over 60-70% population entirely paladins?

 

good luck with that kid,

 

Nice dude!  You managed to get absolutely everything wrong about WoW except for the price of the next expansion.  And even that is wrong if you're implying that you need to pay that to get new content.  All of Azeroth will be effected by the Cataclysm whether you have the expansion or not giving a changed world (with new maps and terrain) even for people who don't have the expansion.

I hear LoTRO is a really good game.  No reason to make things up to make it sound better, lol.

Of course they are giving everyone the graphical update..Would be retarded to run the game on two different clients.
  laxika91

Novice Member

Joined: 2/27/10
Posts: 50

8/31/10 5:06:02 AM#248

WoW's PvP 9/10? Then GW's PvP must be 12/10. :D WoW's really good but not 9/10. I think it's 7 or 8/10 points.

  KouDy

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/14/05
Posts: 39

Knowledge brings fear.

8/31/10 5:56:20 AM#249

Innovative article. More like these please.

Koudy Xfire Miniprofile
  Ramzeppelin

Novice Member

Joined: 10/10/04
Posts: 104

8/31/10 6:59:40 AM#250

Firstly to the OP subject. We all know Blizzard makes games that run near to flawlessly. This is a huge part of why people like their games and rightly so. But come on, we all also should know why WoW appeals to the short attention span generation. 

Frankly almost all MMo's do. But they really really do! I really want MMo's to challenge us more then they do. Star Wars Galaxies in many ways had some awesome ideas there but alas, it also was mismanaged.

So I would take LoTR's over WoW simply based on content. The fact that it is not as well put together is less of an issue then the fact that WoW has nothing to offer that makes anyone anywhere at anytime really give a damn about it's story or world.It is a fun game for a while but if you play it for more then a year, you likely are in too much need to fill something missing in your life. It has so little substance even though it is brilliant in many ways.

BUT! to the subject of "it makes more money and has more people so it is better"!!

9 out of 10 people I have ever met seem to me, in my opinion to be stupid. Therefore I am not surprised that the most popular things 9 out of 10 times are stupid. Like say American Idol. WoW is actually not stupid but about 10.5 million of it's players surely are.

Community does matter to alot of people. As to the guy who said guilds are all that matters so community does not...I say if you do not have a happy family and friends situation in real life I get that. Most people who do though do not want to deal with fake friends every time we log in. I would guess at least 50% of people in guilds would rather not be. I mean in game guilds that is.

They should make guilds play on separate servers IMO. People talk about imbalance all the time but do not see how guilds make MMO's imbalanced for the average player every single time. you actually need them to play through some content and they skew PvP and crafting as well. Give them their own servers and everyones happy. Many would not see how much happier they would be til that change I think.

  Drazo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/27/10
Posts: 13

8/31/10 7:07:21 AM#251

Tried lotr and it honostly looks like a wow wannebee which just plays less smoothly.

 

  Battlestorm

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/11/06
Posts: 102

"If your stomach feels weak then my work here is done." ~Chiodos

8/31/10 4:10:29 PM#252
Originally posted by Drazo


Tried lotr and it honostly looks like a wow wannebee which just plays less smoothly.

 

 

That line physically hurt me; the same could be said in reverse from another point of view. Then again, I guess they all can.

I play LOTRO because I played WoW to level 80 with max'd out . . . everything, and I can't say that there was anything about the game that sent my RPG senses to tingling. The story was okay, most were just good enough to pass WoW off as an RPG, but to a massive amount of people it's more than adequate.

LOTRO has a more realistic design, all-around. From armor to animals to trees and mountains I don't encounter anything that looks ridiculously impossible or insultingly preposterous. The only reason I didn't play LOTRO sooner is because I've already heard, read and watched the stories and I already know the ending; however, I dramatically overlooked the value of "living" in that world during the whole campaign (whether a part of or completely separate from the main storyline the world was originally designed for).

If you're level of interest in classic, genre-developing lore is low and your desire for fun (often silly) graphics and game-play/animations outweighs your desire for "realistic" and more-serious graphics and lore, then World of Warcraft is for you. If that is NOT the case and you love realistic colors, structures, designs and the wonderful world of Tolkien, then Lord of the Rings Online is the better option. All else (other than WoW's truly superior PvP system and level of participation) is really a non-point.

Happy gaming, but I would say to try them both and see which you like best!

IMPORTANT: I'm right 100% of the time; even if I completely contradict something I, myself, have previously said I'm still right . . . on both accounts. Any arguments to the contrary are wrong. If you disagree please begin reading this important message from the beginning. Thank you for your time and understanding. ~Battlestorm

  gothmog56

Novice Member

Joined: 1/03/07
Posts: 47

8/31/10 7:25:24 PM#253

wow i did not know you can't criticize an articles opinion, omg i was warned  for calling his conclusions idiotic.

  silkakc

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/05/06
Posts: 381

8/31/10 8:09:26 PM#254

I almost stopped reading when I saw WoW get  a 9 on 'Game World" and LoTRO a 8 !  Dude!! Let me buy you some visine  =)

 

But I kept reading and agree with many of your points except this is how I would vote:

Lotro Game world : 10/10

WoW: 5/10

Character  : WoW : 10/10 ( Those models fit that neon world perfectly)

Character LoTRO:  6/10   ( The models are average compared to the beauty of that game world)

 

Here are some categories that I wish you would add in the future and how I would rate these two:

 

Classes-

LoTRO: 10/10 - no duds in any of their classes. Makes playing alts a joy.

WoW: 6/10

Game Engine:

LoTRO: 8/10

WoW: 10/10

Content Updates

LoTRO: 10/10

WoW: 3/10

  User Deleted
9/01/10 2:41:49 AM#255

The main problems with these kinds of comparisons is that people consider different things important.

For instance, I cannot play WOW anymore because the graphics hurt my eyes. But I enjoyed the game for quite a while some years ago.

In the article, role playing has been just a factor in "community", but the way LotRO facilitates it is way superior to WoW (which is reflected in the amount of RP going on in those games' RP servers).

  User Deleted
9/01/10 2:51:13 AM#256
Originally posted by gothmog56

wow i did not know you can't criticize an articles opinion, omg i was warned  for calling his conclusions idiotic.

Just send a mail to mikeB@mmorpg.com and explain.

They probably thought you were calling him an idiot.

  Rocketeer

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/07/04
Posts: 1310

9/01/10 5:53:19 AM#257

I think its a logical fallacy to assume a group of people will always choose the best product if presented with equal prices and accessability. It completely ignores what we know about human group dynamics(we are herd animals), and how effective marketing is and puts way to much weight into common sense.

If people where like that we wouldnt have warning labels on microwaves or coffee cups. 

 

For example if you have a clearly recognizable product. Lets say you take a toothpaste that gets TV spots and stuff, and then put the exact same toothpaste but with a changed look and name against it(so ingredience list etc stays same). At the same price id bet the majority of people would choose the known brand. 

In a market like MMOs where success is based on further developement which again is based on money available which in turn is based on current subscribers that is like a selffullfilling prophecy. For example many people criticize LotROs pvp, if they had a couple million subscribers they easily could hire a whole devteam to incorporate a pvp aspect deemed proper by the majority.

 

This is what WoW has been doing, they reacted to market demands. They added BGs before Warhammer came out(since it takes years of developement for MMO you can counterreact years before), they added an e-sport aspect before e-sport got big in their market. People complained about waiting times so they implemented cross server queues. People complained about trouble getting tanks and healers for their groups so they did dualspec and improved the hybrids roles.

The thing is, get enough subscribers and you get the money you need to retain your subscribers. WoW is only held back by two things. 1. Blizzards natural inclination to make as much profit as possible and 2. Making changes that would alienate large percentages of subscribers.

 

Edit: Imho its also a logical fallacy to assume a big IP translates into commercial success. It works at a glance in theory, however in practice i would go so far as to say it failed every single time. I cant think of a single big IP game that overshadowed small or no IP based competition. The few times the big IP games where successful it was usually due to lack of competition(i do not consider WoW to be based on a big IP, not compared to Star Wars, Star Trek or LotR).

If it failed a dozen times, why are people confused when it fails a 13th? Its pretty logical for me that if you get 200 mil from your publisher to develope a game, and spend 100 mil of that on the IP, and then get even restricted on what you can do, you would be worse of than someone just taking the 200mil and putting it all into the game.

  Gikku

Old School

Joined: 8/01/03
Posts: 212

"I can't do it" never yet accomplished anything: "I will try" has accomplished wonders.

9/01/10 9:23:49 AM#258

I am not going to go through all these grand posts. Excellent article and pretty fair comparsions.

I have and do play both these games. I have been playing WoW since about a month or two after its release. Sadly not as long for LotR. I love each for different reasons but the community within WoW is there but I keep my trade chat off because it is abosllutely horrible for the most part. Yes LFG has been made simple but to be  honest I believe this was done because the population even with the stated account owners of the game is not that high. This made it possible for those that play regular to have a better chance at groups which is needed to obtain better gear.  Having a good guild is also needed to really obtain the end game content. It is easy to play more so than many of the games I have played and tried but after you have hit 80 it is boring. I have gotten to where I only log in for raids.  Like many I have more than one level 80 and more than one account. So maybe that accounts for the high numbers of subscribers for WoW. I mean I know many that have two or more accounts and they boast full or almost full of level 80's.

LotR while not as high in subscribers and maybe with some drawbacks in comparsion to WoW is much more fun to play and the player base is absolutely great. The community is much more mature and helpful. Maybe the content is not as in depth in comparison to WoW but overall I am less stressed and enjoy my time in LoTR a great deal. Like WoW starting new characters is fun but both you are pretty much seeing the same thing once you have worked every class/race. 

Cat may put WoW on the charts for a bit longer or like with EQ this could be the expansion that sends it on a spiral down. Time will tell.  I really think LotR will be around for a while even it can't boast the millons of subscribers. My only fear is the F2P aspect and how it may affect the communtity and overall game.

So all in all they are both nice games but I think the graphics in LotR is much nicer overall. Maybe in some parts it could expand to feel a bit larger but if not it is still beautiful and real.

Gikku

  Daffid011

Old School

Joined: 1/03/04
Posts: 7652

9/01/10 10:15:52 AM#259
Originally posted by Rocketeer

I think its a logical fallacy to assume a group of people will always choose the best product if presented with equal prices and accessability. It completely ignores what we know about human group dynamics(we are herd animals), and how effective marketing is and puts way to much weight into common sense.

At the same time that doesn't mean we can just assume anything popular isn't among the best of class.  The details need to be looked at instead of dismissed behind generalized statements. 

Sure it might be difficult for the average person to tell the difference between toothpastes effectiveness and an advertised brand might sell better as a result of that.  However it isn't hard for players to see what works and what doesn't in a video game. 

All the marketing in the world didn't save warhammer or age of conan and they certainly had their fair share of marketing and piles of money to work with.  Nothing more than wow had.  Collectively they sold millions of copies so the marketing was working, but look at both a few months later and you see a different story.  A company cannot advertise away the problems of a game and make masses of people pay money for something they don't enjoy. 

Listening to what players want and delivering a functional and enjoyable system is what made wow so different than the rest of the market at release and after.  Blizzard wasn't reacting to warhammer when they created battlegrounds.  Mythic acquired the warhammer license in May 18, 2005, blizzard released battlegrounds in June 7th, 2005.   That is a 20 day difference and I think it is safe to assume blizzard was working on battlegrounds for much longer than that. 

In the end, marketing will only get people to try a game, but it will not create quality and it won't deceive players into staying away from games they might find better and remaining customers for years and years. 

 

Lotro is about the only game post 2004 that has done anything similar to that. 

  Rocketeer

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/07/04
Posts: 1310

9/01/10 12:25:27 PM#260
Originally posted by Daffid011
Originally posted by Rocketeer

I think its a logical fallacy to assume a group of people will always choose the best product if presented with equal prices and accessability. It completely ignores what we know about human group dynamics(we are herd animals), and how effective marketing is and puts way to much weight into common sense.

At the same time that doesn't mean we can just assume anything popular isn't among the best of class.  The details need to be looked at instead of dismissed behind generalized statements. 

I agree. But my post was more about implying that if you are the top dog for a while, the money you earn will help you stay topdog if your clever. Rich and clever = successful game, poor and clever = poor game. You need that money or all the ideas in the world are not going to help you compete.

Sure it might be difficult for the average person to tell the difference between toothpastes effectiveness and an advertised brand might sell better as a result of that.  However it isn't hard for players to see what works and what doesn't in a video game. 

Incase of MMOs it actually is, because endgame usually is vastly different from leveling, and it can take you months to get there as a casual. Upon which point its no longer about best, its about investment and keeping contact with the people you have grown friends with.

All the marketing in the world didn't save warhammer or age of conan and they certainly had their fair share of marketing and piles of money to work with.  Nothing more than wow had.  Collectively they sold millions of copies so the marketing was working, but look at both a few months later and you see a different story.  A company cannot advertise away the problems of a game and make masses of people pay money for something they don't enjoy. 

Thats true again, but imagine how well that advertising would have worked out longterm if it hadnt been for these problems. Obviously you need marketing and a atleast working product. Also its always about competetion, the first TVs where utter crap, tiny black and white things at horrendous prices(my grandpa bought one for 3 monthly wages), but people bought them because there wasnt anything better so it looked like a good product. So its not quality alone, its quality compared to whats available.

Listening to what players want and delivering a functional and enjoyable system is what made wow so different than the rest of the market at release and after.  Blizzard wasn't reacting to warhammer when they created battlegrounds.  Mythic acquired the warhammer license in May 18, 2005, blizzard released battlegrounds in June 7th, 2005.   That is a 20 day difference and I think it is safe to assume blizzard was working on battlegrounds for much longer than that. 

Your probably right on that, wasnt checking the actual timeline. So lets change my argument into that they would have been able to react to warhammer if they hadnt already done so before(i think they actually added BG XP for kills later), the principle is the same. WoW is mobile for a lack of a better word, and they are mobile because they have the necessary money to implemented the things they need to stay top dog.

In the end, marketing will only get people to try a game, but it will not create quality and it won't deceive players into staying away from games they might find better and remaining customers for years and years. 

Lotro is about the only game post 2004 that has done anything similar to that. 

Eve actually illustrates it even better. Objectively looked at its not that good(compared to how we perceive good in fantasy MMOs, raids, instances, ranked pvp etc.), but it utterly lacks competition so it thrives like no MMO besides WoW in its glory time(the scifi market is alot smaller). WoW is to fantasy MMOs what EvE is to a lesser degree to Scifi MMOs. Its your competition that defines how good your product is, the customers only think they get to decide(check my TV analogy above, we dont even notice whe bought crap until we see something better).

And i reiterate my point. You need money to release a good product. But in the MMO market your products attractiveness steadily declines, you need liftings and lots of them, which require more money. Better pray you dinged in lots of subscription money or you will be in maintenance mode in no time.

If warhammer had released later, in a bugfree state and promises met, maybe the first expansion hadnt been a free content patch(Land of the Dead) but a full store expansion with lots of content. Maybe we would be nearing the release of its second expansion now to a successful game instead of the shadow of itself that we have now. We are talking about maybe a couple months difference granted by EA to mythic, about a devteam not shrunken and butchered and a core playerbase not disillusioned.

 

MMOs are like tomatoes. Sure some are just nasty, pestridden or foul, but others just got plucked while they where still green and unripe. Sure they taste nasty too, but unlike the former they had potential.

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