Originally posted by Ihmotepp

Originally posted by cyphers

 

 

Yes, I know the adagium, 'sex sells', and they're games, not based on reality, but really, when you look at a lot of the skimpy outfits in a lot of the MMORPG's, like also the latest one TERA, then you have to wonder:  what are they protecting against?

The only thing I can realistically think of is mosquitos flying in unwanted holes, but certainly the armor is no real protection against sharp swords and arrows. A few strips of leather or metal as armor is stretching believability, it makes one wonder that with one slash it'd all fall off anyway (now that'd add a new dimension to combat, armor that would get rent and removed when damaged enough in fights).

 

 

You can shoot lightning bolts from your finger tips. You can fly with wings. You can teleport across the world. You can turn yourself invisible. You can wield a sword that can burst into flames, and kill a dragon. You can mesmerize creatures so they are stopped in their tracks. You can shoot a laser gun, or fly a space ship that can travel across the galaxy.

And you can't make magic armor that protects without covering? Or you can't make armor that produces a forcefield, instead of covering your body with metal?

Bikini Armor is magic, or technology. Just like flaming swords, teleporting, or shooting lightning out of your fingertips, or shooting a laser gun.

 

It's also been around in comics, book covers, movies, etc., long before MMORPGs and the home computer.

 

 You ever saw a warrior cast a magic protection? The indecent clothes apply to EVERY class there is. Rogues, mages or warrior.As for it's been around...

You ever saw Mother Theresa? Priests or any cloth-wearers have never been as hot as a tree.

There's hardly ever been traces of any additional magic protection.

The argument isn't the same for rogues, who wears leather and maybe even use body to deceive opponents.

Warriors wear chainmail and plate, enough said.

I just think they are overdoing it. Slim bodies and perfect shape are fine. We are talking about video games. You don't see less in movies, why should you in an artificially made product? But at this point, I think it's just gross.

P.S. I am a  heterosexual man for those wondering. That's just the way I feel about it.

Those complaining about the " skimpy" outfits then calling for realism boggle me. Considering in History it was very common for Warrior women and women leaders to go either topless or completely naked. LOL!

So you should have no problem with this:

The clothes factor really doesn't bother me. Yes, I'm female. I like my toons to look good as I'm staring at them all day. If I think a male toon looks better, then I'll roll a guy. If I think a female toon looks better....same thing.

Personally, I like the difference in the male/female armor. I think it adds more to the game. I don't really like it when everyone looks the same. A sense of induviduality adds to the overall experience for me [meaning, I find it more easy to get into the lore/feel of the game when everyone isn't running around looking exactly the same]. If I wanted a warrior to look tough and be in full mail or plate, I'ld roll a guy.  I however like the females of that class as they look sassy, sexeh while tanking a dragon etc.

Remember, it was a female designer that approved( and designed?) all of the revealing female equipment and armorless models in EQ.

Also, did the majority of women take up the feminist model after they won their "freedom"? Not even close.

Not into looking at female dwarfs in full plate mail.  Give me an skimpy elf any day of the week.

We're video game dorks for crying out loud!

Originally posted by midmagic

Remember, it was a female designer that approved( and designed?) all of the revealing female equipment and armorless models in EQ.

Also, did the majority of women take up the feminist model after they won their "freedom"? Not even close.

Is there a good reason for comparing equal rights for women as men to the fashion sense of women? 

Originally posted by deviliscious

Those complaining about the " skimpy" outfits then calling for realism boggle me. Considering in History it was very common for Warrior women and women leaders to go either topless or completely naked. LOL!

So you should have no problem with this:

Hatshepsut

I'd do her. Even with the beard.

I hate the bikini armor! I had to wear a frigging cape in WoW to cover up my thong covered fanny because I was so embarassed LOL.

It might be my age but I find that kind of armor low class and tacky.  I'm glad LoTRO doesn't have it but even then, I think the breasts are way too big in that classy game !  I don't want size DD boobs on my pretty thin girly toons:) Gimme some A cup or B cup size  boob options please:)

I wanna look like myself in games and  never can. Making a thin AND small-chested lady toon isn't an option in any of the games I've played. It's too bad cus I love being little and I wish my toons could be too.

Originally posted by silkakc

I hate the bikini armor! I had to wear a frigging cape in WoW to cover up my thong covered fanny because I was so embarassed LOL.

It might be my age but I find that kind of armor low class and tacky.  I'm glad LoTRO doesn't have it but even then, I think the breasts are way too big in that classy game !  I don't want size DD boobs on my pretty thin girly toons:) Gimme some A cup or B cup size  boob options please:)

I wanna look like myself in games and  never can. Making a thin AND small-chested lady toon isn't an option in any of the games I've played. It's too bad cus I love being little and I wish my toons could be too.

 

 

I wonder what game you are talking about when you talk about boobs size? They are not that big just for your info. Even age of conan boobs are not big at all. Maybe you hate boobs period so it have to be small to look like a man boobs???

Anyway, i voted for the better the armor, more cover. I like porn, (everydays), but when i play a video game, i dont want to feel like i am in playboy mension. When i watch porn, i make sure that no one is around. I dont want to play a game and feel like i have to hide everytime.

Age of conan is not a problem because there is a difference between realistic, logic and exaggeration. Korean games is usually exaggeration so i dont like them.

Originally posted by midmagic

Remember, it was a female designer that approved( and designed?) all of the revealing female equipment and armorless models in EQ.

Also, did the majority of women take up the feminist model after they won their "freedom"? Not even close.

 You're trying to lump all women into one neat category that agrees with you which is  a pretty ridiculous position to take.

Originally posted by Nesrie

Originally posted by midmagic

Remember, it was a female designer that approved( and designed?) all of the revealing female equipment and armorless models in EQ.

Also, did the majority of women take up the feminist model after they won their "freedom"? Not even close.

 You're trying to lump all women into one neat category that agrees with you which is  a pretty ridiculous position to take.

You appear to like to make assumptions. The post is rather vague and doesn't say very much at all it only touches on some peoples outward expression but lacks any comment on the motivation which is where I would have a break down on categories for discussion. It does appear to make for nice flame bait though.

haha, you think that is flaming? Welcome to the internet; it will be a rough ride for you for sure. Yeah, and i found a woman who agrees with me therefore its okay and representative of women in general, still not a supported position to take.

Originally posted by Nesrie

haha, you think that is flaming? Welcome to the internet; it will be a rough ride for you for sure. Yeah, and i found a woman who agrees with me therefore its okay and representative of women in general, still not a supported position to take.

 It appears the majority of women that posted on this thread enjoy the sexy armor. I would be fine if our characters could run around nekkid. I think it has more to do with personal issues with women being taught to be ashamed of their bodies, whereas from different cultural backgrounds it is just the opposite. Some view nudity as immoral, others do not- we were all born that way.

Some view restrictive clothing as being forced upon them by other religions and beliefs and view it as an oppression of women. That women must be covered because men cannot control themselves, and they wish to " hide" the women from their view. In this day and age, women should be able to do as they please, wear or not wear what they want and be proud of their bodies without concerning themselves with beliefs other than their own.

I Find it offensive that when Europeans invaded the Americas, they forced clothing upon the natives who had no issues without them. Why try and force your " beliefs " onto other women? To each their own. I think that both styles should be available in games so that women are free to choose how to dress their character however they wish.

Originally posted by deviliscious

Originally posted by Nesrie

haha, you think that is flaming? Welcome to the internet; it will be a rough ride for you for sure. Yeah, and i found a woman who agrees with me therefore its okay and representative of women in general, still not a supported position to take.

 It appears the majority of women that posted on this thread enjoy the sexy armor. I would be fine if our characters could run around nekkid. I think it has more to do with personal issues with women being taught to be ashamed of their bodies, whereas from different cultural backgrounds it is just the opposite. Some view nudity as immoral, others do not- we were all born that way.

Some view restrictive clothing as being forced upon them by other religions and beliefs and view it as an oppression of women. That women must be covered because men cannot control themselves, and they wish to " hide" the women from their view. In this day and age, women should be able to do as they please, wear or not wear what they want and be proud of their bodies without concerning themselves with beliefs other than their own.

I Find it offensive that when Europeans invaded the Americas, they forced clothing upon the natives who had no issues without them. Why try and force your " beliefs " onto other women? To each their own. I think that both styles should be available in games so that women are free to choose how to dress their character however they wish.

 I am all for choices. That's not the issue i have at all. If people want their characters close to naked, that's their choice. This individual I was referring to seemed to think that because one woman had a hand in design, that means what exactly, that she represents women in general. No she doesn't. No more than any other woman represents all women. The crack about feminism... right, because most women want to be paid less for equal work right, be treated like a second class citizen... I don't think so.  I am guessing this person just has an issue with some women he labels as feminist who are representing only a part of what was the feminist movement.

Originally posted by deviliscious

I Find it offensive that when Europeans invaded the Americas, they forced clothing upon the natives who had no issues without them. Why try and force your " beliefs " onto other women? To each their own. I think that both styles should be available in games so that women are free to choose how to dress their character however they wish.

I'm pretty sure that's not what happened.  European interference with the native americans disrupted their ability to make their own clothes, as they had in most instances (with a few exceptions) been doing for a long time.  See here.  That's not to say a million horrible things weren't done to native americans by Europeans and the American settlers, because tragically there were, but I don't think that was one of them.

Originally posted by Amathe

Originally posted by deviliscious

I Find it offensive that when Europeans invaded the Americas, they forced clothing upon the natives who had no issues without them. Why try and force your " beliefs " onto other women? To each their own. I think that both styles should be available in games so that women are free to choose how to dress their character however they wish.

 

I'm pretty sure that's not what happened.  European interference with the native americans disrupted their ability to make their own clothes, as they had in most instances (with a few exceptions) been doing for a long time.  See here.  That's not to say a million horrible things weren't done to native americans by Europeans and the American settlers, because tragically there were, but I don't think that was one of them.

 It was what happened. Of course tribes in colder climates wore more than those in warmer climates, but when Columbus first arrived, the people there had never even seen clothing. LOL, But of course European History is written by Europeans, so they leave much out.

"The Taino had never before seen white men, clothed people, people with beards or ships like that - they thought these people must be from heaven. So the Taino came out to greet them, as was their custom, and brought the travelers - who surely must have been tired and hungry - food, drink and gifts. Such strong swimmers were the Taino that some of them swam right out to the boats some three miles offshore." ----------

"Columbus installed himself as Governor of the Caribbean islands, with headquarters on Hispaniola (the large island now shared by Haiti and the Dominican Republic). He described the people, the Arawaks (called by some the Tainos) this way:

"The people of this island and of all the other islands which I have found and seen, or have not seen, all go naked, men and women, as their mothers bore them, except that some women cover one place only with the leaf of a plant or with a net of cotton which they make for that purpose. They have no iron or steel or weapons, nor are they capable of using them, although they are well-built people of handsome stature, because they are wondrous timid.... [T]hey are so artless and free with all they possess, that no one would believe it without having seen it. Of anything they have, if you ask them for it, they never say no; rather they invite the person to share it, and show as much love as if they were giving their hearts; and whether the thing be of value or of small price, at once they are content with whatever little thing of whatever kind may be given to them."[

Originally posted by Nesrie

haha, you think that is flaming? Welcome to the internet; it will be a rough ride for you for sure. Yeah, and i found a woman who agrees with me therefore its okay and representative of women in general, still not a supported position to take.

See. Did it again. Just had to add the word flamebait and you went right for it. Oh yeah, forgot. There ya go assuming again .

Realism doesn't matter to me. Do I like looking good? Why, yes! And often the sexy looks are the nicer looks. 

I am comfortable wearing the bikini-maille in game. I do appreciate games that have the option of showing a clothing set or a stat gear set (or, in some games, hiding both), so that I can choose what look and level of coverage I am showing.  I wish I had the amazing, gravity-defying body that my game characters generally do, and if I did, I might consider running around in nothing but a set of leather straps IRL too. ( < emoticon for the humor impaired)

For me, as a woman, the bottom line is this: What I really care about is numbers. If there's a thong of godliness that has stats better than the full-body oven mitt I've been wearing, I am going to wear the thong. Even if I am an ogress in that game. But if I can equip a nice dress for the visuals alone, I might do that, when it isn't going to affect my stats.

(Full-body oven mitt is the best description I can think of for some of the armor I ended up wearing on some characters in EQ2. It wasn't a flattering look.)

Originally posted by dreamscaper

The OP seems to be assuming that there's a general consensus among women about armor in games. But just like you guys, we all have different tastes as well. Some women don't mind dressing up as though she should have her sword in one hand, and his sword in the other. Others would prefer that we keep it realistic - after all, back in medival days, armor didn't come in cup sizes.

Oh, I wasn't assuming any consensus, that's why I asked the question in the OP, to see what the different reactions were upon the female armor.

I think it's several questions that you encounter with this topic:

- it's the discrepancies between male armor and female armor with the same stats in a number of MMO's/games but where the female armor covers a lot less of the body than the male armor

- the level of believability of the gameworld you and many others are wandering around in: it's the difference between 'low fantasy' and high fantasy among others and often between western styled games and asian styled games, the asian ones fooling around more with realism (ie Aion's attacking mushrooms and high heeled combat) and needing less cloth, leather or metal for the female chars' armor.

- the average difference between how male and female gamers look upon the skimpy armor for women, in contrast to the less-skimpy armor for men.

I think for most women they look positive towards their characters (that they spent a lot of gametime with) looking sexy, but there's often a fine line between looking and feeling sexy and feeling as if they're a sex object, a piece of meat, and treated as such: where that line lies is different for every situation and for every woman, also it will make less of an impact within a MMO when it comes to the chars you play than when it happens IRL.

Regarding believability, some people like more realism in their game as also the poll shows, even if it is about a virtual world where magic is more common: they liken it more to be like a Lord of the Rings movies with higher realism and thus credibility than just a cartoonstyle magical wonderworld where anything can happen like even talking ducks or a mouse hitting the cat that chased him with a hammer ten times its size.

Looking at the posts, it looks like people'd like most of all having the choice what to wear for looks, without their choice being steered by stats.