Normally watching the chat logs in WoW for anything 99.9  percent of the time is just a complete waste of various child bashing, self propelled egos, and just incoherent non social chat. But not long ago the other day something caught my eye. 

It was a conversation between 4 people at first about a random run with another player who they claimed they had to just toss out before starting because "his skill rating is just too low on GS". No, not  because his GS was low, they said skill rating.

When did Gearscore turn into Skillscore? How does a number rating on gear tell you wether a player can do the job or not?

The conversation went on and on between these guys. One claimed he wasnt concerned with the numbers of his GS, but just the fact the numbers were low, meant his skill level was low.

This is all I see now on my realm, GS = Skill. This stupid comment comes up almost every time  in the prerequisites when many are putting together a group.

I  started WoW to play the game with my daughter who asked, I'm not that much of a fan of the game period but she is.

Jesus, how frigin stupid can the lot of you be that use GS in this way to turn a tool like GS into a "player"rating?

If you really want a trip, look at what instance the people are running - the GS they are looking for - then look at the comprable score/requirements for those instances on wow-heroes.

The normal reply to this is that people want the highest GS possible so the instance is as quick a run as possible.

So yes, people are pretty obtuse about the fact that GS in of itself pretty useless for determining skill.

For a little while there, I put the most moronic enchants and gems on/in gear and ran three tree hybrid specs trying to get into things... was slightly amusing for a short period of time.

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Originally posted by VirusDancer

For a little while there, I put the most moronic enchants and gems on/in gear and ran three tree hybrid specs trying to get into things... was slightly amusing for a short period of time.

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I used to collect completely random high ilvl gear pieces on my alts just so they could get into pugs and not get kicked when mouse-overed, fun times!

Well, GS may not be an indication of skills, it certainly *is* correlated with performance.

Take a sample of dps with 6k GS, and take a sample of dps with 5k GS, and go up to any ICC boss and i bet there is a statistical difference between their DPS performance.

Clearly, a small difference in GS does not mean much. There are so many variables. But a big difference is useful information. No matter how good a player is, i probably don't want to group with a 4K GS dps for ICC 25 content, unless he/she is a friend I am wililng to carry.

There is a right way to use GS.

Originally posted by GameFarmer

Normally watching the chat logs in WoW for anything 99.9  percent of the time is just a complete waste of various child bashing, self propelled egos, and just incoherent non social chat. But not long ago the other day something caught my eye. 

It was a conversation between 4 people at first about a random run with another player who they claimed they had to just toss out before starting because "his skill rating is just too low on GS". No, not  because his GS was low, they said skill rating.

When did Gearscore turn into Skillscore? How does a number rating on gear tell you wether a player can do the job or not?

The conversation went on and on between these guys. One claimed he wasnt concerned with the numbers of his GS, but just the fact the numbers were low, meant his skill level was low.

This is all I see now on my realm, GS = Skill. This stupid comment comes up almost every time  in the prerequisites when many are putting together a group.

I  started WoW to play the game with my daughter who asked, I'm not that much of a fan of the game period but she is.

Jesus, how frigin stupid can the lot of you be that use GS in this way to turn a tool like GS into a "player"rating?

Complete nubs that use gearscore as a definition of skill have never played another MMO , in older MMO and some of the newer FFA PVP MMOs those people would be eaten alive and spit back out and there gear taken, gear means nothing you could have all the best equipment in the game and still be a complete nub who cant play (buying gold-Ebay characters). I lol'ed at this hard.

Originally posted by Dreathor

 

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Originally posted by VirusDancer

For a little while there, I put the most moronic enchants and gems on/in gear and ran three tree hybrid specs trying to get into things... was slightly amusing for a short period of time.

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I used to collect completely random high ilvl gear pieces on my alts just so they could get into pugs and not get kicked when mouse-overed, fun times!

You will still get kick if you are doing 2k dps or die 10 times from standing in fire.

Not surprising, people figure if you got the gear (GS) then you might have actually learned something along the way. (forgetting that you might suck but have been carried along the way).

But more often than not they'll be right in assuming players with the higher gear scores are more skilled hence the attitude.

Not a gameplay  mechanic that I enjoy so yet another reason why I'd never return to WOW. (but by no means one of the larger ones)

Originally posted by GameFarmer

Normally watching the chat logs in WoW for anything 99.9  percent of the time is just a complete waste of various child bashing, self propelled egos, and just incoherent non social chat. But not long ago the other day something caught my eye. 

It was a conversation between 4 people at first about a random run with another player who they claimed they had to just toss out before starting because "his skill rating is just too low on GS". No, not  because his GS was low, they said skill rating.

When did Gearscore turn into Skillscore? How does a number rating on gear tell you wether a player can do the job or not?

The conversation went on and on between these guys. One claimed he wasnt concerned with the numbers of his GS, but just the fact the numbers were low, meant his skill level was low.

This is all I see now on my realm, GS = Skill. This stupid comment comes up almost every time  in the prerequisites when many are putting together a group.

I  started WoW to play the game with my daughter who asked, I'm not that much of a fan of the game period but she is.

Jesus, how frigin stupid can the lot of you be that use GS in this way to turn a tool like GS into a "player"rating?

 It started about two years ago. Welcome to the party that is online virtual gaming :)

Originally posted by GameFarmer

 

... One claimed he wasnt concerned with the numbers of his GS, but just the fact the numbers were low, meant his skill level was low...

Are you sure he didn't mean his actual dps when he was saying that his numbers were low? I've heard and used that wording before and was referring to his dps.

The whole gearscore issue has been pretty common since the addon was released. It does provide some usefulness, but most of the time people misuse it. I've been in some ICC five man heroics with players that are around 3.5k GS and it helped to inform me that this group was going to be pretty rough for me as the healer. I am always willing to be proven wrong so I stuck around until the very end and I was correct. I worked a lot harder in that group.

You also need to consider that many players in WoW are subpar. To some extent gearscore does help the poopy players become average and acceptable in PuGs. That is why you sometimes see raid groups requesting silly gearscore requirements. A raid/group run isn't always a guaranteed success with people that have high gearscore, but with normal content you have a higher chance of success with a higher gearscore.

Originally posted by nariusseldon

Well, GS may not be an indication of skills, it certainly *is* correlated with performance.

Take a sample of dps with 6k GS, and take a sample of dps with 5k GS, and go up to any ICC boss and i bet there is a statistical difference between their DPS performance.

Clearly, a small difference in GS does not mean much. There are so many variables. But a big difference is useful information. No matter how good a player is, i probably don't want to group with a 4K GS dps for ICC 25 content, unless he/she is a friend I am wililng to carry.

There is a right way to use GS.

This!  This!  This!

This is the complete fail that the OP is talking about.

Just because a person has a certain GS and thus a theoretical DPS they can put out does not mean they have the skill to put out that DPS.

It is entirely possible for the person that knows what they are doing with a GS of 4K to put out more DPS than the person with a a GS well over 5K that does not know what they are doing.

The other thing to take into account is that the mouseover GS only shows a base score - it does not take into account how many PvP pieces they have which would contribute to an overall GS but not offer the better stats of somebody with less GS but with only PvE pieces.

Remember when we used to play MMOs for fun?

Originally posted by Marcus-

Remember when we used to play MMOs for fun?

Not since last century...lol.

I'm not defending it; I consider it a horrible game mechanic .. but it does make a sort of sense.

When in a PUG, you're dealing with unknowns. Player skill is not a visible quality. Gearscore is. It's always a bit of a gamble, but a higher gearscore at least reduces the chance that a player will be absolutely terrible on the grounds that:

1. If they have great gear, they've obviously been in a lot of groups. Experience counts a little.

2. The higher the gear is, the more the item stats will act as a crutch to mitigate poor performance.

I agree, GS is meaningless.  I have outshined many healers on my server with way higher GS's than I.

Originally posted by JSchindler

...

When in a PUG, you're dealing with unknowns. Player skill is not a visible quality. Gearscore is. It's always a bit of a gamble, but a higher gearscore at least reduces the chance that a player will be absolutely terrible on the grounds that:

1. If they have great gear, they've obviously been in a lot of groups. Experience counts a little.

2. The higher the gear is, the more the item stats will act as a crutch to mitigate poor performance.

Well put and I agree totally.

Originally posted by JSchindler

I'm not defending it; I consider it a horrible game mechanic .. but it does make a sort of sense.

When in a PUG, you're dealing with unknowns. Player skill is not a visible quality. Gearscore is. It's always a bit of a gamble, but a higher gearscore at least reduces the chance that a player will be absolutely terrible on the grounds that:

1. If they have great gear, they've obviously been in a lot of groups. Experience counts a little.

2. The higher the gear is, the more the item stats will act as a crutch to mitigate poor performance.

But #2 is a fallacy.

You could put me in an Indy car and put an Indy driver in my car... guess who is going to win the race?

A better player can do more with less - a worse player is only going to be overgeared.

The W-H numbers would be better numbers than the GS numbers for what people say GS is good for... because it is not even good for that - does not take into account spec, enchants, gems, PvP v PvE, etc...

Thats the reason I quit WoW because of the GS, I think on my pally I was 5300GS and I never got into raids because it  was to low so i said f_ck it and quit about a week ago. I'm now waiting for APB to release so I can play a game that is more skill related than gear related.

Originally posted by JSchindler

I'm not defending it; I consider it a horrible game mechanic .. but it does make a sort of sense.

When in a PUG, you're dealing with unknowns. Player skill is not a visible quality. Gearscore is. It's always a bit of a gamble, but a higher gearscore at least reduces the chance that a player will be absolutely terrible on the grounds that:

1. If they have great gear, they've obviously been in a lot of groups. Experience counts a little.

2. The higher the gear is, the more the item stats will act as a crutch to mitigate poor performance.

I can tell in the first 3 minutes of a run if I need to kick someone due to the lack of thier crapptastic hand eye coordination. I also know when to leave a crapptastic group in the first 3 minutes, I have used this philosophy for the last 15 years.  I try to surround myself with "like" gamers.  The only ppl I like playing with are competative gamers who play as if they are one with thier toon.

u can get higher GS just by simply farming heroics and never entering a raid dungeon and u would still be consider to be PRO for some reason? i would prefer for them to link their achievements instead showing proof that you actually did the encounter and know WTF u are doing.

This is why, in games where people can inspect you and your gear, I turn that option off if possible; people who judge performance based on gear are as dumb as they come.