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2/17/10 9:47:23 PM#21
Originally posted by Xondar123
Whether you like it or not, lifetime subscriptions generally don't bode well for an MMORPG. Why? Because it means that the developer/publisher of said game does not believe they will be able to keep long term subscribers to their game, so it's better to gain their subscription fees in one lump sum rather than expecting those long term subscription. This is why games like City of Heroes, EVE Online, and World of Warcraft will never offer lifetime subscription (or else off very expensive ones, $650-$750 range.) These companies know that people will be subscribing to their games for years and years to come. I can't speak for LotRO, but CO and STO both offer lifetime subscriptions because Cryptic expects that either a) both games will have trouble holding an audience in the long term, or b) they can recoup costs of people getting a "free ride" for years to come by those players spending lots of money in their item mall. Essentially, they are running STO and CO like very expensive free to play games. Very high initial box sale, and then money earned through the item mall. And that is why people are calling lifetime subscriptions a money grubbing move. People generally don't like item malls for games they have to pay monthly for, as Cryptic found out the hard way with Vibora Pay. i can dig that
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2/17/10 9:49:24 PM#22
Originally posted by spyder2k5
Companies that believe in their product don't offer lifetime subscriptions. They know they'll earn far, far more money by having players who subscribe for years and years. 
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2/17/10 9:50:54 PM#23
CO is a franchise based on a comic book series. As for everyone else still looking into conspiracy theories. No one, including myself know why lifetime offers are offered, but one thing is for sure and cannot be debated. If you like the game, and know you will play it for a long time, it is a good idea to pick one up. If you don't think the game will last and don't buy one for that simple reason, yet like the game, then it is your loss and trust issue. That does not make the game, nor its developers bad for offering to those who want it.
Players that do lifetime can play for cheaper in the long run, while the money gained will allow the developer to get a jump start on future development of the product. Neither are anything bad, both get something out of it. |
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2/17/10 9:53:30 PM#24
Originally posted by spyder2k5 But if you buy the lifetime sub, you'll never know if you are playing because you enjoy the game, or because you spent so much money on it and feel foolish not to keep playing. But hey, its your money, spend it like you wish. As for the population in CO, its just a glimpse of the future for STO and any game pretty much made by Cryptic.
I have not played CO. I played CoH and still maintain an active sub there. If you bought the lifetime when you were playing and enjoying the game, and you know you will for long time to come, then you wouldn't be playing because you spent a lot of cash would you? As for STO, STO is a great game, I am loving it and have been playing for over 2 days now since I bought it. IT has its issues, but ALL MMOs and games do. It will only get better, the story really pulled me in and I enjoy the combat and never knowing what will happen next. Stop the Cryptic hate, yes they made mistakes, all companies do at some point, but at least they made the changes that will correct the mistakes. They said they were wrong for those mistakes, and they are seeking to correct them and are listening now to players like they never have before. Give them a chance and stop pushing their head under the water to drown them at every turn they take.
Interesting how you mention that you're subscribed to CoH. I'm a 39 (I think) month vet there myself. And this thread on the CoH official forums is why CoH will never have lifetime subscriptions: boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php
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2/17/10 9:57:18 PM#25
Originally posted by spyder2k5 if you note i said it plays like the movies not that it was based on the movies my point was basically the same as i was pointing out ppl who watch the movies rather then have read the books would be more likely to stick around to a game that immerses them like the movies
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2/17/10 10:01:09 PM#26
Originally posted by Esther-Chan
I've also tried the trial and I liked the character creator, I liked the voice acting, but I hated the stupid cartoony, comic-book graphics. Also, I should warn everyone, you can't judge a game based on its trial if they restrict you to the newbie zone! Sometimes game companies will put a tonne of work and effort into the newbie zone, then leave the rest of the game completely unfinished. For example: The devs for Star Wars Galaxies created a newbie space station that had a voice acted han solo, easy to complete quests, and decent graphics. I'd played SWG before they put in the newb space station so I knew that the rest nof the game was absolutely nothing like it. Second example: I'm playing the Age of Conan trial currently, and the starting zone, Tortage, is really awesome. But from what I've read the rest of the game is nothing like the starting zone and is in fact extremely unfinished and quite boring. If you choose to buy a game based on the tutorial zone, then caveat emptor, buyer beware.
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2/17/10 10:03:40 PM#27
So wait, let me get this right, you play a comic book based game, and yet expect it to NOT be cartoony and have the look of a comic book? O.o? |
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2/17/10 10:04:32 PM#28
Originally posted by spyder2k5
How would someone possibly know that at or before launch?
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2/17/10 10:07:00 PM#29
Since this thread has become a topic about Lifetime Subscriptions, I would like to add my two cents. Its always smart for a consumer to look for bargains. Like buying items in bulk at a reduced price. Wich is basicly what buying a Lifetime Sub is. But the problem with Lifetime Subs in an MMO is that the product you paid for may not be the same product in 6 months. Or even at Launch. Even if you played Beta and decided you liked the game and bought a Lifetime Sub, there is no guarentee that the game wont change in an unfavorable way a week after launch. And they can do that because they are protected by thier EULA. Wich leaves the paying customer screwed. The best a customer can do is suspend thier account untill they feel the game is back to thier likeing if it even survives. CO is a prime example of all of these. The day the game launched they put in a launch day xp nerf wich reduced xp gains. It made it so if a player missed some missions, they would hit a leveling gap and couldnt go on any further without spending hours and hours trying to hunt down missed missions, or grind repeatable missions untill they reached a level that they could go on. They changed the way the game worked on day One. Then over the next three months CO seen 4 (I think it was 4. dont remember now) rounds of nerfs and power set rebalancing. Still changing the game even more. I could go on, but I think thats enough.... Now here we are 5 months into CO's life and its a mess. They have pissed off so many people that the game is Tanking and its not even 6 months old yet. The Lifers are all pissed and with good reason because this is not the game or service they thought they were buying, and they cant get thier money back. So even if you played the beta of an MMO and liked it, you are still taking a gamble with your money because you never know wich direction an MMO will take. Personally, I would rather pay month to month and if the game takes a turn for the worse, I can just simply stop paying and walk away with the option to still be able to come back any time in the future if I choose. |
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2/17/10 10:08:38 PM#30
Originally posted by dhayes68
How would someone possibly know that at or before launch?
Because usually games that offer lifetime offer beta access, and headstarts which you can tell if it is something you are interested in or not. |
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2/17/10 10:08:47 PM#31
Originally posted by spyder2k5
CO is not a comic book based game. It's based on a pen-and-paper RPG. It's a super hero game, and they had the right to go for the "Action Comics" look rather than the "Superman/Superman II" look, but I felt that the graphics looked wrong as if they were a clumsy parody or pastiche of comic book style art. I vastly prefer the more realistic approach to the graphics of City of Heroes. Edit: Why does everyone suddenly think CO is based on comic books? It never was. City of Heroes is based more on comic books just from the fact there was once a City of Heroes comic book.
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2/17/10 10:13:25 PM#32
Originally posted by Xondar123
CO is not a comic book based game. It's based on a pen-and-paper RPG. It's a super hero game, and they had the right to go for the "Action Comics" look rather than the "Superman/Superman II" look, but I felt that the graphics looked wrong as if they were a clumsy parody or pastiche of comic book style art. I vastly prefer the more realistic approach to the graphics of City of Heroes. Edit: Why does everyone suddenly think CO is based on comic books? It never was. City of Heroes is based more on comic books just from the fact there was once a City of Heroes comic book.
Right and wrong,
Champions is a role-playing game designed to simulate and function in a four-color superhero comic book world. Starting in June 1986, a comic mini-series was published by Eclipse Comics based on characters from the first Champions campaign. After the initial mini-series a regular series was published by Hero Comics (later Hero Graphics, later still Heroic Publishing).
So it started as one thing, led to another, and the fact remains it is based on a comic book style thus should look like it, and by the way, since when did CoX ever look realistic? Not even remotely. |
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2/17/10 10:15:25 PM#33
Originally posted by spyder2k5
Because usually games that offer lifetime offer beta access, and headstarts which you can tell if it is something you are interested in or not.
In those types of situations you usually get the beta/headstart as a reward for buying the lifetime sub, so again, how could you know you're going to like it? I could see if they came out with lifetime subs 6 months out, but its just silly at or before launch. And even if you got into beta before buying your lifetime, its still silly because its beta. There is no community and no guarantee that what you're playing in beta is what you'll get at launch. |
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2/17/10 10:20:17 PM#34
Originally posted by spyder2k5 ...and the fact remains it is based on a comic book style thus should look like it, and by the way, since when did CoX ever look realistic? Not even remotely. Comic book styles are vast and wide ranging and cover almost all styles imaginable. Cryptic could have made it look any way they wanted. They chose the way it is now. Personally I liked the look, but just pointing out that their hands were in no way tied by the IP
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2/17/10 10:20:40 PM#35
Some things in beta change correct, however another thing is usually they do not change much that close to launch. Oh and the whole buy the game to get beta thing? You can pre order it, get into beta try it, if you don't like it cancel your pre order. It is really that simple. Ample time to check the game out is there, also lifetime for these games don't end at launch, matter of fact you can still get lifetime for STO, LoTRO etc... So you would have had 2 weeks to play STO and decide is lifetime is good for you. Your argument is void and falls flat, in all merits. |
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2/17/10 10:25:01 PM#36
Originally posted by spyder2k5 Yeah, they change a lot. Remember we're talking about a lifetime sub. Within 6 months most MMO's a near unrecognizable from their launch state. Also my argument is very valid because what you're arguing is not for buying a lifetime sub. pre-ordering/trying beta/canceling is hardly the equivalent to buying a lifetime sub. In fact by trying before you decide, you're making an argument AGAINST the blind lifetime sub at launch. You're essentially admitting it'd be a foolish thing to do. |
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2/17/10 10:26:15 PM#37
Originally posted by spyder2k5
Ok those are some good points. But what if the game changes unfavorably in 4 months? Or even 6 months? |
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2/17/10 10:28:21 PM#38
Yeah, they change a lot. Remember we're talking about a lifetime sub. Within 6 months most MMO's a near unrecognizable from their launch state. Also my argument is very valid because what you're arguing is not for buying a lifetime sub. pre-ordering/trying beta/canceling is hardly the equivalent to buying a lifetime sub. In fact by trying before you decide, you're making an argument AGAINST the blind lifetime sub at launch. You're essentially admitting it'd be a foolish thing to do. [/quote] Never did I say anything about blindly buying lifetime, I said if someone likes the game, knows they will stick with it, there should be no reason they couldn't buy it. Don't twist my words around to prove your own lack of valid points in an argument.
MMOs change, those that subscribe for lifetime know those risks, and those that do not should not have a credit card to mess up like that. That is still not the companies fault nor the developers fault if the player does not like certain changes. It is a slight risk and leap of faith, but what in life isn't? |
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2/17/10 10:28:47 PM#39
Nothing wrong with offering lifetime subs. Players make out in long run on a game they wish to commit to. Devs make out for the bigger chunk of cash up front to help with all the extra costs of launch. It's not the lifetime offer, it's making sure you commit to a game you can have confidence in. LOTRO if that is a game, IF you like is my opinion a good investment. It has longevity, and a solid company tending to it. Champions, is made by a company that never had released it's own MMO before. People think just because Cryptic developed City of Heroes, they can totally manage a MMO on their own. City of Heroes has ALWAYS been under NCSOFT management. It's NCSOFT that has CoH now, and that game is in MUCH better shape then CO. Especially with the upcoming Graphic overhaul. City of Heroes has the most loyal and friendly player base, and devs that really seem to care about the game. CoH is not a game for everyone (not enough pvp for me), but it's one of the most solid MMO's ever released, thanks (as we all see now) in BIG part to NCSOFT.
There was a reason Marvel pulled out of CO. They were smart for it.
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2/17/10 10:29:32 PM#40
Originally posted by Apache_
Ok those are some good points. But what if the game changes unfavorably in 4 months? Or even 6 months?
In fact didn't Cryptic made very unfavorable changes to CO at and right after launch? |
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