Originally posted by rlmccoy1987

He did not get banned, he lost his admin status because he was trying to start a confrontation with a customer.  Any company would fire an employee if they did that to a customer, and this guy was not even paid he was a volunteer so it was easier to force him to leave.

Now that is just speculation and an attempt at spreading a rumor...

I was just informed that due to personal reasons StJudas, volunteer Community Admin and former leader of the moderation team, is leaving the team effective immediately.

You even link the post where he says goodbye and leaves voluntarily.

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/34205-stjudas-leaving-volunteer-team.html

I'll be around not just gonna do volonteerjob anymore for StarVault, its been a long 1 year of helping out and im glad today that i took the decision to step aside knowing the capable Modsquad thats holding the fort.

No one knows if it's true or not, but chances are he woke up on the wrong side of the bed that morning, let that ignorant poster have a piece of his mind, then realized alot of things had been building up for him.

At which point you realize you have to make a choice between sticking with the game, or sticking to moderating a forum about the game.

Originally posted by XxMaticxX

Originally posted by rlmccoy1987

Originally posted by LiquidWolf

I approved of what St.Judas did.

That "customer" does not belong in our community.

If it takes a Mod chewing him out to get him to leave, then so be it. If you have an issue with the way St.Judas handled it, or do not believe any Representative should ever handle a situation like that...

Feel free to leave... or perhaps send him a strongly worded PM informing him of your beliefs.

 

 

You approve of a company "chewing out" a potential customer?  Why do you want everyone to leave the MO community if they ask tough questions?  Is it because they are not "hardcore" enough to stay with MO/SV?  You know that SV needs as much money as possible as they had to open this beta up to the public just to try and make a few more bucks to survive until release.  Why are you approving of alienating potential customers that can keep SV alive?

 

I know your a fan, but a company raging against the guy in public is very unprofessional and the admin should get his powers revoked.

 

you can ask your tough questions but not come off as an a**hole doing so. typical ignorance and stupidity of the anonymous internet trolls, "i'm a customer I have the right to say anything i want to customer service and i can say it how I want".

I work in customer service and while i understand someone being frustration and being angry that still doesn't give you the RIGHT to go off on me or any company. I've had my manager a few times tell someone "you know what you're a rude little person and we don't want your business ... get out now".

but typical you kids (mr. 1987) think you deserve everything and think you can say no wrong.

There is a huge difference between explaining to someone they are rude and hanging up the phone and stalking a member who potentially buys your product over the course of time and taunting him. I worked in one of the big 3 1st party publishers in the console industry for 10 years, both as online security, anti piracy and online manager and had one of my employees contacted another player online that way he would be fired on the spot.  It was one thing for my guys to say "Hey you are being rude and when you are willing to calm down I will help you" then terminate the discussion, it is a whole other situation like I said to continue to post and taunt him after the OP left the thread alone.

If you can't bring yourself to be a bigger man then a child who is posting on your forums then you need to not be a community manager. Simple as that. Your maturity is your JOB as a community manager, Mature people don't argue with teenagers and then stalk them and so he was "let go" which in turned was made to look like he resigned, pro tip: Anytime someone "resigns" after a fiasco like this it is because they were fired.

Originally posted by Koroshiya

If you can't bring yourself to be a bigger man then a child who is posting on your forums then you need to not be a community manager. Simple as that. Your maturity is your JOB as a community manager, Mature people don't argue with teenagers and then stalk them and so he was "let go" which in turned was made to look like he resigned, pro tip: Anytime someone "resigns" after a fiasco like this it is because they were fired.

While this is certainly agreeable to anyone willing to operate within society, in numerous cases you have individuals who invoke their "right to free speech" and their "rights as a paying customer" without taking responsibility for what they do.

These rights exist for individuals who take responsibility for their words and actions, and attempt to better the area they are in. They make an effort to better their community and society as a whole. For those that wish to continue to operate within the laws and freedoms they believe they deserve... yet not be responsible for what they do or where they operate...

You beat them over the head with a shovel... because essentially they are abusing the system.

In this instance, a shovel might not be needed, but someone needed to wake this individual up to what he was doing. His statements and actions might be alright down in Georgia, but he needs to know the rules and laws for the state he is currently in.

Originally posted by LiquidWolf

Originally posted by Koroshiya

If you can't bring yourself to be a bigger man then a child who is posting on your forums then you need to not be a community manager. Simple as that. Your maturity is your JOB as a community manager, Mature people don't argue with teenagers and then stalk them and so he was "let go" which in turned was made to look like he resigned, pro tip: Anytime someone "resigns" after a fiasco like this it is because they were fired.

 

While this is certainly agreeable to anyone willing to operate within society, in numerous cases you have individuals who invoke their "right to free speech" and their "rights as a paying customer" without taking responsibility for what they do.

These rights exist for individuals who take responsibility for their words and actions, and attempt to better the area they are in. They make an effort to better their community and society as a whole. For those that wish to continue to operate within the laws and freedoms they believe they deserve... yet not be responsible for what they do or where they operate...

You beat them over the head with a shovel... because essentially they are abusing the system.

In this instance, a shovel might not be needed, but someone needed to wake this individual up to what he was doing. His statements and actions might be alright down in Georgia, but he needs to know the rules and laws for the state he is currently in.

I am not sure, so Ill ask.  Are you really eluding to the fact that he could have broken a state or federal law by posting what he did ANYWHERE in the US?  If so you would be wrong.  There is no law that states you can not ask questions to a company, on their website that is rude or demeaning.  An opinion is just that an opinion.  Are you now saying that anytime a magazine blasts a game that is crappy they might have to worry about breaking a law?

I think you might want to do a little bit more research on defamation (also called calumny, libel, slander, and vilification) laws.  You might be surprised at what you CAN say about someone =).

This isn't about free speech.  This isn't about breaking a law.  This was a case of a community manager who has friends who work at SV getting offended and trying to defend the dev team when there is NO WHERE in a community manager job description that reads his duties were to defend SV at all costs against trolls.  Again, this man (St.) had a job.  Even as an intern he has to learn that there are certain rules you follow when producing games and talking face to face with your customer base via online, whether that medium be forums, email, chat, or in-game.  It wasn't even his FIRST post that got him in trouble I bet you, it was the subsequent attacks and taunting of the poster AFTER he had left the thread.  Any job, any company any country as a community manager if you go after a customer you will be let go.  It is really that simple.

Originally posted by Koroshiya

Originally posted by LiquidWolf

Originally posted by Koroshiya

 

I am not sure, so Ill ask.  Are you really eluding to the fact that he could have broken a state or federal law by posting what he did ANYWHERE in the US?  If so you would be wrong.  There is no law that states you can not ask questions to a company, on their website that is rude or demeaning.  An opinion is just that an opinion.  Are you now saying that anytime a magazine blasts a game that is crappy they might have to worry about breaking a law?

I think you might want to do a little bit more research on defamation (also called calumny, libel, slander, and vilification) laws.  You might be surprised at what you CAN say about someone =).

 

This isn't about free speech.  This isn't about breaking a law.  This was a case of a community manager who has friends who work at SV getting offended and trying to defend the dev team when there is NO WHERE in a community manager job description that reads his duties were to defend SV at all costs against trolls.  Again, this man (St.) had a job.  Even as an intern he has to learn that there are certain rules you follow when producing games and talking face to face with your customer base via online, whether that medium be forums, email, chat, or in-game.  It wasn't even his FIRST post that got him in trouble I bet you, it was the subsequent attacks and taunting of the poster AFTER he had left the thread.  Any job, any company any country as a community manager if you go after a customer you will be let go.  It is really that simple.

 

St. Judas, being a volunteer... not an employee, owner, or developer... retaliated against a post that was thought to be... well thoughtless.

St. Judas was a moderator... not a customer service representative.

He moderates forums for... well crap. Locks posts, moves posts, suspends people, and generally maintains the forums. For the most part, moderators are typically not on the inside of what is going on with the game, and are typically selected from individuals who do good in the forums.

Sometimes moderators provide help... but their main job is forum management. It just makes sense that people who manage posts are easily able to answer questions on certain subjects, but other players are perfectly capable of answering a number of questions for other players.

So... this moderator and volunteer is perfectly capable of expressing their own opinion or defend the company they are volunteering for. St. Judas in particular might have personal ties to the developers... i'm not 100% on that... but essentially he is still just like any other player out there when it comes to the game.

Now... in regards to the analogy...

The internet is a free zone... wild west even... where certain communities develop with their own rules and laws. While you exist within these regions you agree to operate by the local rules and laws. Sheriffs perhaps?

MMORPG.com for example.

Or... if it makes it easier, each forum can be a house, and you agree to operate under the rules of that house.

What that person did, knowingly or not, broke the rules of that house in the eyes of one of the caretakers/managers of that house. Sure, he didn't just toss the person out... but that was his decision to make. St. Judas apologized and left due to personal issues.

Yes, you can talk about what you have the right to do out in public... protected by whatever constitution you want to hold up...

But someone will still throw you out of their house for not following those rules... or perhaps just for being a jerk. No amount of debate, discussion, or communication will change some people who believe they are right, have rights, or can do whatever they want... until you knock some sense into them.

I just happen to like using shovels to do it.

Originally posted by LiquidWolf

Originally posted by Koroshiya

Originally posted by LiquidWolf

Originally posted by Koroshiya

 

I am not sure, so Ill ask.  Are you really eluding to the fact that he could have broken a state or federal law by posting what he did ANYWHERE in the US?  If so you would be wrong.  There is no law that states you can not ask questions to a company, on their website that is rude or demeaning.  An opinion is just that an opinion.  Are you now saying that anytime a magazine blasts a game that is crappy they might have to worry about breaking a law?

I think you might want to do a little bit more research on defamation (also called calumny, libel, slander, and vilification) laws.  You might be surprised at what you CAN say about someone =).

 

This isn't about free speech.  This isn't about breaking a law.  This was a case of a community manager who has friends who work at SV getting offended and trying to defend the dev team when there is NO WHERE in a community manager job description that reads his duties were to defend SV at all costs against trolls.  Again, this man (St.) had a job.  Even as an intern he has to learn that there are certain rules you follow when producing games and talking face to face with your customer base via online, whether that medium be forums, email, chat, or in-game.  It wasn't even his FIRST post that got him in trouble I bet you, it was the subsequent attacks and taunting of the poster AFTER he had left the thread.  Any job, any company any country as a community manager if you go after a customer you will be let go.  It is really that simple.

 

St. Judas, being a volunteer... not an employee, owner, or developer... retaliated against a post that was thought to be... well thoughtless.

St. Judas was a moderator... not a customer service representative.

He moderates forums for... well crap. Locks posts, moves posts, suspends people, and generally maintains the forums. For the most part, moderators are typically not on the inside of what is going on with the game, and are typically selected from individuals who do good in the forums.

Sometimes moderators provide help... but their main job is forum management. It just makes sense that people who manage posts are easily able to answer questions on certain subjects, but other players are perfectly capable of answering a number of questions for other players.

So... this moderator and volunteer is perfectly capable of expressing their own opinion or defend the company they are volunteering for. St. Judas in particular might have personal ties to the developers... i'm not 100% on that... but essentially he is still just like any other player out there when it comes to the game.

Now... in regards to the analogy...

The internet is a free zone... wild west even... where certain communities develop with their own rules and laws. While you exist within these regions you agree to operate by the local rules and laws. Sheriffs perhaps?

MMORPG.com for example.

Or... if it makes it easier, each forum can be a house, and you agree to operate under the rules of that house.

What that person did, knowingly or not, broke the rules of that house in the eyes of one of the caretakers/managers of that house. Sure, he didn't just toss the person out... but that was his decision to make. St. Judas apologized and left due to personal issues.

Yes, you can talk about what you have the right to do out in public... protected by whatever constitution you want to hold up...

But someone will still throw you out of their house for not following those rules... or perhaps just for being a jerk. No amount of debate, discussion, or communication will change some people who believe they are right, have rights, or can do whatever they want... until you knock some sense into them.

I just happen to like using shovels to do it.

Does not matter if he was not a dev.  He tried to start a conflict with a customer while being the head admin of the MO forums.  Why are you saying that does not matter?  It shines a bad light on Starvault. 

Again...

Does not matter if he was just a volunteer, he tried to start a conflict with a customer while being the head admin of the forums.

Stop with the excuses please...

 Wow, an administrator used "QQ'. Suddenly Mortal Online isn't looking too good.

Originally posted by ironfungus

 Wow, an administrator used "QQ'. Suddenly Mortal Online isn't looking too good.

People that use QQ and CAREBEAR get on my nerves.  I thought I left those types of people back in WoW, but I am actually seeing it more and more in this "hardcore" game.  Game is suppose to be hardcore yet the majority of the members are under 18.

Originally posted by LiquidWolf

Originally posted by Aeternum

Originally posted by XxMaticxX

Originally posted by Aeternum

So its rude to say that a product which is soon to be released is unfinished when it is indeed unfinished? What would the polite thing to do then? Accept the game as it is and fork out your money for it just because you dont want to accept that your dreams and expectations are shattered? Like the Joker would say, why so desperate?

 

I dont know maybe I'm weird, but the OP seemed a lot more mature than the admin. I guess they either employ 12 year olds or crackheads at Starvault. I shudder to think how their customer support will be when they actually launch the game.

 

just the title alone is insulting "do the developers have the skill ..." come on man you would be insulted if someone questioned your skill to do your job too.

 

anyone would, especially in a public forum.

 

Believe me I certainly would not. Because I am aware of what I can do and what I cannot do. I actually laughed at the admins response. Why would you bother to reply at such a claim if you do indeed have the required programming knowledge and skill to present a game worthy of anyone's money? Actions speak louder than words.

 

Which is all well and good for you, but in that forum, the Admins/Mod's beliefs and rules are law.

No matter how well worded the statement you don't do that in someone's domain.

You have the whole internet, and a variety of places to make a post like that, but he did it right in their face.

I won't put up with that, nor would I back down. He might not have known better... but that doesn't absolve you of the consequences of your actions.

Intentional or not, it was a challenge.

It still does not matter how much he challenged him.  I know the dev/admin rules are law. But instead of deleting the thread like a professional would , his reply spreads across the Internet.  It can be argued that this admins stupidity could cost them millions of dollars in potential subs lost.

I know I would not do any business with a company that cant be bothered to have professionals for CS.
 

edit....

I understand why he raged, just unprofessional and bad fot the company.

Originally posted by Arlana75 

 

It still does not matter how much he challenged him.  I know the dev/admin rules are law. But instead of deleting the thread like a professional would , his reply spreads across the Internet.  It can be argued that this admins stupidity could cost them millions of dollars in potential subs lost.

I know I would not do any business with a company that cant be bothered to have professionals for CS.
 

Good response, I agree with you.  Immature moderators/admins and I wouldn't mess with the company or game anymore.

Originally posted by Arlana75

I understand why he raged, just unprofessional and bad fot the company.

I think the Administrator would have been OK if he had stopped after his first reply (though I think it was a poor way to handle the situation).  Where I feel he jumped the shark was when he repeatedly taunted the OP to continue the argument with responses like 'Whats the matter OP fall asleep at the KB"?  As soon as the "person in charge" starts to escalate the situation and drag it out that's a sure sign something is wrong there.

Anyhow.. the guy resigned or was removed.. so the issue is really over.

This issue has went from a hot topic to dead horse. I think it's time to stop beating it. It's starting to smell. We should let this thread die a slow, graceful death..

Originally posted by Esther-Chan

This issue has went from a hot topic to dead horse. I think it's time to stop beating it. It's starting to smell. We should let this thread die a slow, graceful death..

The smell is strong in this one.

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Originally posted by Slapshot1188

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Originally posted by Kyleran

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Originally posted by rlmccoy1987

Customers attacking a company is one thing, its different when the company attacks a customer.

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No, its not really, no excuse for rude or ignorant behavior from either side.  Being a potential customer does not give a person the right to be an arse.
Harden up folks, this is a game made for the thick skinned.  Can't take the forum PVP, don't play.
 

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Most "companies" would simply delete/warn/edit the post in question.   Making fun of posters, taunting them and stalking them is not the way to moderate a forum...
 
 

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True.

Good

Originally posted by davmac22

Good

What?

hahahhahahahahahaaaaaaaa

Originally posted by pukebaby1954

!!!!!!!!!!

Do you have anything relavent to say or not?

Locked due to necro.