Originally posted by Rohn

I think you should add the following to the list: "I'm an MMO vet, and I decree that this game sux / is broken/ is epic fail."

As someone else pointed out, the VAST majority of supposedly "game-breaking" problems or shortcomings or flaws most games have are based solely on personal preference, opinion, and taste, rather than on factual problems or demonstrably flawed game design.

 

/agree

I personally hate WoW cause its rewards are based on grind/time played rather than skill. An you need the rewards to improve your character. IMHO

The measure of grind is what rewards you get verse time, content, character improvements, stimulation and various quest mechanics. I like a game that you can play for 30mins a few times a week make noticeable progression and have a life. Try that with WoW and after a month you may have 1/4-1/3 progression towards a pair of gloves :)

 

Its impossible of a single game to meet every type of player, hence why there are a few games doing alright and soime better.

Wnat I find sad is games with sick potiential are lost amongst the mass of fodder ( spellborn comes to mine ). Oh well.

 

Good list BTW!

I despise grammar police on internet forums, especially in the society we live in today with things such as text messages. 

I'm horrible at grammar and spelling and hated studying it in school.  I improved it a lot while studying for my admissions test to get in Grad school, but I still hate it and make many errors all the time.

I say that to say this, just because i struggle with it does not mean that I am not educated.  My quantitative and analytical skills are very high, I'm an accountant by trade.  I do taxes for doctors and other highly intelligent people all the time, God gave us all abilities that we excel in and other abilities we aren't so good in.

Judging someone's intellect or education based upon one's understanding of written English language is moronic and is many times an indicator that you yourself are not well educated and are taking  an opportunity to try and prove your intellect by degrading someone else by highlighting the tidbit of information you do know.

Good article, thanks for posting.

Originally posted by girlgeek

Originally posted by Miner-2049er

Very good list, and so true.

Maybe every new forum should have a sticky poll where objectors can indicate from 1 to 10 their reason why they want the game to fail.

 

I like this idea.  It would save all of us a lot of time by eliminating the need to read a bunch of useless crap that usually leads to one of those points.  I should know...I type plenty of it.  After all....I have to EXPLAIN why point 1, 4, 7 or 8 applies to MMO X.

However....it would be a lot easier to just make a post now simply stating:

 

"Reason # 7."

 

And then...I would never incur flare ups of carpal tunnel again.

 

You win for most useful post in this thread!  ;)

This stood out to me too. I think this is a great idea.

"This game would be great if it had a little less # 1 and more # 7. Basically I am saying this is a # 6 nightmare."

I hear that combo a lot.

Originally posted by Lexiscat

Originally posted by girlgeek

Originally posted by Miner-2049er

Very good list, and so true.

Maybe every new forum should have a sticky poll where objectors can indicate from 1 to 10 their reason why they want the game to fail.

 

I like this idea.  It would save all of us a lot of time by eliminating the need to read a bunch of useless crap that usually leads to one of those points.  I should know...I type plenty of it.  After all....I have to EXPLAIN why point 1, 4, 7 or 8 applies to MMO X.

However....it would be a lot easier to just make a post now simply stating:

 

"Reason # 7."

 

And then...I would never incur flare ups of carpal tunnel again.

 

You win for most useful post in this thread!  ;)

 

This stood out to me too. I think this is a great idea.

"This game would be great if it had a little less # 1 and more # 7. Basically I am saying this is a # 6 nightmare."

I hear that combo a lot.

ROFL!!!  OMG....that made me actually CACKLE! =D

On reason #1 "This is a complete WoW clone"

When I first started playing WoW, all I could think of was

THIS IS A COMPLETE EQ CLONE

I still think that WoW is a shameless ripoff of EQ1

They just did it slicker, with fewer bugs, worse graphics, and managed to market it enough to break all subscription records.

Griefers are only part of the problem. The other part are the penalties for getting killed. In EVE one griefer looking for a thrill can cost you weeks or months of work. That's something I'd rather not deal with. I mean being a casuality of a faction war is one thing, but biting it because some loser is bored is not something I want to deal with. It's not fun. Games are for fun right? What's the fun in being another notch some jerk's kill list?

Originally posted by Kerix

On reason #1 "This is a complete WoW clone"

When I first started playing WoW, all I could think of was

THIS IS A COMPLETE EQ CLONE

I still think that WoW is a shameless ripoff of EQ1

They just did it slicker, with fewer bugs, worse graphics, and managed to market it enough to break all subscription records.

Do you seriously think WoW's graphics are WORSE than EQ1?  O.o  I mean, I can understand someone saying EQ2 (if they like that more plastic sort of semi-realism look), but to say EQ1 graphics were better than WoW? Better how? WoW actually won numerous awards for their artistic design. Granted it's a stylized game....so maybe you just like the "style" of characters that look like they were drawn by a junior high school artist and move like they have sticks up their butts...okay...I can accept that. But that means that we both have different artistic TASTE, not that one or the other is necessarily better....

Although....I guess I am really saying WoW's graphics are better than EQ1s....

Meh...forgive me.  I suppose it is all really about preference, huh?

But worse than EQ ONE?....  I still can't get over the fact that anyone said that.....

Wait...EQ ONE?!  Really?  ONE?

.........

Still in shock.....

EQ ONE right....not TWO, but....ONE?

Wow....just....wow.

Originally posted by Nostromo21

Travel times. I want to play a mmo game, not an aboriginal walkabout simulation. Cut them the f#$k down & stop wasting our time & money! :)

I think he mentioned personal preferences...  Many people I know think Everquest went downhill sharply after the PoK (fast travel just about everywhere.)    And I agree.   

One ideal is a game you can log into and play 10 minutes and get something done.   The other is a game that seems to want you to play for hours, organizing, camping, traveling, recovering your corpse.

Err, sorry, close to bedtime and I need to decide whether to plant radishes tonight.

I don't think the number one reason is so much a comment on WoW itself or the similarities of other games, but a growing distaste with the overall genre. I played WoW for nearly 5 years, but after that I felt like I had seen it all. I wasn't excited about the Wrath of the Lich King because it only promised more of the same. I've given other games a shot here and there (CoH, EVE, iRO, and Aion) and just couldn't get excited about killing mobs and question for loot.

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Originally posted by Mazin
I despise grammar police on internet forums, especially in the society we live in today with things such as text messages. 
I'm horrible at grammar and spelling and hated studying it in school.  I improved it a lot while studying for my admissions test to get in Grad school, but I still hate it and make many errors all the time.
I say that to say this, just because i struggle with it does not mean that I am not educated.  My quantitative and analytical skills are very high, I'm an accountant by trade.  I do taxes for doctors and other highly intelligent people all the time, God gave us all abilities that we excel in and other abilities we aren't so good in.
Judging someone's intellect or education based upon one's understanding of written English language is moronic and is many times an indicator that you yourself are not well educated and are taking  an opportunity to try and prove your intellect by degrading someone else by highlighting the tidbit of information you do know.

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Dude, you can't be that bad at spelling as I couldn't spot one mistake in that whole post. ;)

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Originally posted by bamdorf

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Originally posted by Nostromo21

Travel times. I want to play a mmo game, not an aboriginal walkabout simulation. Cut them the f#$k down & stop wasting our time & money! :)

---

 
I think he mentioned personal preferences...  Many people I know think Everquest went downhill sharply after the PoK (fast travel just about everywhere.)    And I agree.   
One ideal is a game you can log into and play 10 minutes and get something done.   The other is a game that seems to want you to play for hours, organizing, camping, traveling, recovering your corpse.
Err, sorry, close to bedtime and I need to decide whether to plant radishes tonight.
 

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LOL! I guess I just can't understand (or sympathise) with ppl who actually *prefer* to have to run all over the same countryside 50 times, than some good fast travel options. They clearly have too much time on their hands. Never let realism get in the way of good gameplay. All mmo devs could learn a thing or two from ArenaNet & GW (which isn't a 'real' mmorpg anyway!) if you ask me. Oh wait, they're going to have GW2 out soon - more lessons they won't learn for the rest of the market yet again :).

OTOH, WOW, what can I say about WoW. It's the grindy hamster wheel of uber grindness. It did/does for grind what crack does for the mind <G>. Ok, it's not that bad, but it's addictive & repetitive, while being solo/casual friendly & most PC/platform spec friendly, which are 2 things Blizzard did their marketing on very well. LOTRO is only better imo because of it's integrated lore & story, better visuals/world immersion & far different/better community due to it being an almost purely PvE game.

And you can't compare EQ1 to WoW - it's utterly antiquated & prosaic as a mmo in 2010. Even WoW is falling behind the times, even if it's not losing subs as yet.

[quote]Originally posted by girlgeek
Do you seriously think WoW's graphics are WORSE than EQ1?  O.o  I mean, I can...

<snip>

Wow....just....wow.[/b][/quote]

ROFLMAO!!! Pwned...by a girlgeek! ;)

#9 Graphics like 1999

Gameplay rules, but if the game play  (or the community) just isn't that much obviously better in the demo period, I'll go with a game where the gameplay and community are good and the graphics are prettier (assuming they don't lag me out, see #10 *heh*)

#4 SOE (er, sorry, This Game Shop) Sucks!

It's not just a purchase/choice, it's a relationship (and usually a subscription).  Choosing an MMO is a lot like scoping out a potential GF/BF -- and let's face it, many of us spend more time with our games...:)  You want to know their character and history, and how likely they are to screw you over, and if they're going to produce more drama or joy, and how likely it is they'll stick with you in a pinch, help you with your problems, understand your needs, and be someone you want to see -- and look *forward to seeing* -- every day for years.  How often will they make you go shopping with them at the mall? :) How many relationships go south because one partner changes the rules radically after months or years?  You get my point.

Yrs,

Shava

Maybe 1 or 2 is most likely, but the rest dont make sense.

Not enough quests usually. Boring repeat quests. PVP. Price for MMOs should be 9.99 i think. There is much more but too much to mention. I like MMOs but I have not played a perfect one yet. EQ2 is the closest one to number 1 for me personally. I am a casual gamer although i spend long hours playing when i play.

 People who hate games need to sort out their priorities in life, seriously. 

Dislike? Ok, sure - but hate is a word way too strong to be wasted on something as trivial as a computer game. 

I did enjoy the 10 reason and I can see there is something broken in the MMO world.

Here's what I would like to see in the future of MMO's:

Gaming Engines that look good and run good

I want to see MMO's on console systems, they can handle them...so what gives.

Subscription fee? Maybe 15 dollars is too high, maybe 10 dollars is too high, maybe a subscription fee should removed

Purchase the full retail game and when new content comes out...usually in the form of a patch we would pay for that in a DLC kind of way.

Grinding doesn't have to be a chore, there can be some grinding but don't make it take up so much of our time.

Pre-order bulls@it needs to stop with all of these goodies from dozens of retailers, I think there should only be a few pre-order bonuses and that's it, I don't want to have to check out 15 different places and see what would be better, this shouldn't be window shopping, I shouldn't be stressed out on if I selected the right pre-order or not.

Story that's gripping and pulls you in.

Missions that have more of a meaning to them and they actually make you want to read the text.

Voiced dialog from main NPC's, it's always nice to hear the voice of characters in a game.  I will be happy to see how voice dialog rolls out with Star Wars TOR in 2011.

In-game or CGI cut scenes , this is a huge lack MMO's - I would love to see this more in a game and not a few times in the game, if even that.

Stop making EQ clones, make something different already.  Everyone says oh it's a WOW clone, lol WOW is a heavily modified EQ clone. 

I'm glad to see Character Creator's are becoming more important that's a plus right there.

Customizing your UI, most MMO's now have this which I am so glad to see, stares at Blizzard

Music that actually sounds great and doesn't become annoying after a hour, then you immediately are looking for the mute button. AOC to me had great music and still does to me....I want more of this. I'm sure Hans Zimmer or  John Williams would like to do some MMO music.

Character animations, I would like to see more movement in fighting, walking and how toons are expressed in games.

Sandbox plz, instance zone with limited amount of ppl have been done way too much, I mean were paying money to play these games monthly, I want to see 100's to 1000's of ppl in the same zone.

Questing gives you great items, not just raids, pvp zones or dungeons/instances.

I'm glad to see that Final Fantasy XIV is going to step away from leveling/experience points, this could be something great to see in MMO's

Weather conditions in the game effect how gameplay feels and can change how you look at a fight.

Day and Night quests, having quest givers giving you something different if you seek them out at a different time in the day, this would make the game twice as enjoyable.

Great crafting options if the game has them,  only a few games have done this well, but that's not enough.

Travel options, limiting players on ways to get around can cause us to play less cause it takes so much time to get from point A to point B.

Make exploring fun, maybe while wandering around something happens in real time that effects the area your in.

Skill system to have a easy layout and have guide lines that make it easier to spec your toon the correct way,  more so you don't have to look at websites or search out forums to finding out what your doing incorrectly.

Going in water should not kill your toon...Aion needs to let you swim in water, what the hell is that about, I don't care if I'm wearing all metal, that is just plain ole stupid.

AOC allowed you to attack your foe's with multiple options, giving you a different feel when playing.

Flying and Mount combat, if the game has mount options, maybe a upgrade system that allows you to use your mount in a fight, this would be great to see, I know only a few MMO's have really tried and this and it's still in the trial and error stages.

Trading systems, this always need to be an option, sometimes you want to give a alt something, or a team mate a item or maybe your guild.

Auction Houses, this is a must like always, without this something is going to go wrong.

Spam bots need not to exist, this is why I ended my Aion account, this was a pain for me for over 2months and I got fed up with it.

Server lag needs to be address and corrected, WOW has been the biggest lag to this day and it doesn't matter how great my system is.

Being in a guild gives your perks and of course having guilds in a MMO.

Titles that actually give you stat boost, I loved this in Aion and I know a few other games out there do this as well.

Housing and Guild Housing, EQ2 was the first MMO I played that had this and I was impressed.

I have a feeling that Final Fantasy XIV will be the MMO a lot of ppl have been waiting for and I can't wait till it's launch.

Originally posted by Methos12

I also find the whole "lag is terrible!" thing ridiculous, especially when people can't even differentiate between ACTUAL lag (caused by internet connection and server-side connection or infrastructure) and their own client's hardware performance issues (weak PC)... even more when those very same people complain about lag in singleplayer games.    /face palm

 

Good read.

Ever heard of optimisation issues?  Ever heard of outdated and poorly visioned graphic concepts which does not realise itself couple years down the road upon game release (EQ2)?

Originally posted by rolandhadley

The three that I use the most from your list all go together - Not interested in another themepark, grindfest, WoW clone. See? Three in one. 

The thing I don't like about this post is its intimation that most gripes are irrational, coming from the simple fact of human nature that we all like to bitch. The general notion that most MMO's are not particularly original, being slight variants on other recent MMO's, is a legitimate complaint. The problem with MMOs isn't that they've all gotten terrible since the good all days. It's that they're mostly the same. They have somewhat improved interfaces, slightly nicer graphics, slightly different combat, a slightly different setting, but they're not really doing anything different. And people do have a right to expect innovation.

And yes, to return to my favorite bitch, no one is really looking to create an immersive world anymore. That's too much work. Quest/grind/level/repeat until endgame, cliche though it may be, is still at the heart of 99% of MMOs these days. There's nothing wrong with combat and advancement, but is a game that allows one to discover a new world too much to ask? It's a big job, but if you're not creating immersive worlds, then why are you creating an MMO? 

 

 

The OP never said that complains are illegitimate.  He just list 10 of the more common reasons to come here to spam and moan.  Thank you for confirming the OP's list.