This game has absolutely NO autoaim. This thread is utterly pointless. If your overall point is that newbie players stand little chance against well equipped players with high skills and much more knowledge of PvP, then you've finally realised something the majority of players knew all along: Darkfall is an MMORPG.

Saying that... FPS experience will help you greatly. Go and play Quakeworld (nQuake.com) where ALL characters are the same. Come back and tell us how you did against people that knew what they were doing. I imagine you'll feel a very similar type of frustration but you won't be able to put the blame on something such as skill level.

Originally posted by Consensus

while it is correct grinded up characters do have a MAJOR advantage vs new characters. most the info in the original post is false or exaggerated. and the advantage is factional compared to most level based games out there.

you cannot honestly compare it to other mmo's like wow because low level characters can't hit higher level chars. so they stand absolute 0% chance of killing, killing them is impossible.

in darkfall hitting is not a roll of the dice. you and your aim with your mouse decides whether you hit not the game. its always possible therefore for a new character to kill a high character.

the difference is a new character with low skills and attributes has less hp stamina mana, takes slightly more damage and deals alot less damage.

this difference however again cannot be compared to wow without me laughing at you. in wow a new character hits like ~100 damage, where as end lvl characters hit for multiple thousands of damage. and have what over 10 times more hp?

in darkfall you start out with ~200 hp depending on race. the max hp is 450 even with buffs, that is the cap. do some simple maths and compare that please. even so very very few people have max hp most have about 300 hp, so only like 0.5 times more NOT 10 or 20 times more.

in terms of damage the difference having 0 weapon skill vs max weapon skill and max weapon skill mastery is not that huge. maybe double damage at max? strength attribute also makes a difference but even with maxed strength, which virtually no one has, along with maxed skill it can't be more than 4 times harder. probably more like 3 times harder.. which again is NOTHING like 50 times more in games like WoW.

to sum up all these differences do stack up and make it virtually impossible for a new character to kill a maxed stat character. but comparing it to games like WoW is completely unfounded, borderline retarded. firstly its always at least possible grab some friends and its very very possible because you can HIT even if less hard you can do damage. secondly pretty much nobody has a maxed stat character.

That post won the thread. We can close it here or just leave it alone.

while it is correct grinded up characters do have a MAJOR advantage vs new characters. most the info in the original post is

OOOOOO let's play a game, it's called "who's full of the most shit" ONE TWO THREE GO!

you cannot honestly compare it to other mmo's like wow because low level characters can't hit higher level chars. so they stand absolute 0% chance of killing, killing them is impossible.

Darkfall does have levels. The end result is the same and the serve the same purpose (To place a hard coded barrier of entry into the game); but the method is far different. Most reasonable people would call it "convoluted" you guys call it "deep".

in darkfall hitting is not a roll of the dice. you and your aim with your mouse decides whether you hit not the game. its always possible therefore for a new character to kill a high character.

It is possible in the same way a Whale can run for senate and win; it's just highly unlikely. As you yourself said: stats play a huge role here. Chance to hit and resists checks? You're confusing the issue here. The point is that stats and grinding make a huge difference in performance and add a giant barrier for new players to overcome. No newbie stands any reasonable chance against a veteran player no matter how poor the vet is or how good the new player is. Unless the newbie player for some reason

1 - Somehow knows high level PVE farming area

2 - Somehow manages to know enough to hide

3 - SOMEHOW gets in close enough without this guy noticing, when the guy has literally ONE HP

4 - CATCHES up to him because for some reason, there's a RUN SKILL and the SPRINT SKILL level that determines how fast you can go

5 - Actually manages to land a hit despite aforementioned handicap

6- hits before any self healing materials take effect

Than yeah, a new player can kill a veteran! 

the difference is a new character with low skills and attributes has less hp stamina mana, takes slightly more damage and deals alot less damage.

"slighty" I was three shotted by some guy in banded armor when I made the trek to a capital. I was also in full bone armor that I found from sone guy who went afk near goblin shamans. It was stupid of me to go running around in that stuff; but the point still stands that it wasn't a "slight" disadvantage; there was no way in hell I could stand up, [b]or even RUN away[/b] as I sprinted away, he remained literally glued to my back.

this difference however again cannot be compared to wow without me laughing at you. in wow a new character hits like ~100 damage, where as end lvl characters hit for multiple thousands of damage. and have what over 10 times more hp?

Sounds exactly like darkfall, only with the numbers scaled down. The percentages are still the same; which is what matters in the end.

to sum up all these differences do stack up and make it virtually impossible for a new character to kill a maxed stat character. but comparing it to games like WoW is completely unfounded, borderline retarded. firstly its always at least possible grab some friends and its very very possible because you can HIT even if less hard you can do damage. secondly pretty much nobody has a maxed stat character.

It's exactly like WoW in regards to requisite grinding and hard coded stat differences. OH SO YOU CAN ACTUALLY HIT THEM if you aim well; well that's great, but you'll do next to no damage.

Yes - you may able to hit them unlike in WoW - but you would have to land about 40 shots while they only have to land 3-7 shots to kill you. Even the worst player (aim wise) can hit someone 5 times before a noob (who is skilled at aiming) can hit the grinded out character 40 times. It's not even close.

It's not exactly like WoW - but if a guy that has high stats/skills dies to a noob with crap stats and crap gear then he just needs to quit the game - and maybe even quit life.

Darkfall is highly level-based as the OP said - but that doesn't make it trash or not fun to play - I like the sandbox - just wish it was slightly more of a world rather than a huge gankfest - I know it's a pvp game - maybe MO will have more of that feel (I like pvp a lot - but sometimes you just want that RP or immersion feel in it as well as the FFA pvp). But no point in the hardcore fanboys telling new players lies about how they can beat a vet with their new character if they're skilled enough.

It an MMORPG not a DOOM, get over it ...

Love how Darkfall gets loads of attention of all the trolls and haters. They have played the game and dont like it or have read stuff about it and dont like it, so they feel the need to slag it. Or they feel butt hurt cus Mr T said this would be in the game and its not.

So now we have this new conversation about skill, like Darkfall vs (generic tab target game here).

Fact is a noob char will get owned by some one who had a pimped out one. If you want to be on a equal footing go play CS.

The only MMO I've ever seen without levels, period, was Face Of Mankind.

I enjoyed it, yes, but it also had little depth and content besides shooting people, crafting, breaking the law and hacking.

I really did enjoy freaking out the LED though and making them run over to check why the hell I'd fired my gun.

Originally posted by ozy1

It an MMORPG not a DOOM, get over it ...

Love how Darkfall gets loads of attention of all the trolls and haters. They have played the game and dont like it or have read stuff about it and dont like it, so they feel the need to slag it. Or they feel butt hurt cus Mr T said this would be in the game and its not.

So now we have this new conversation about skill, like Darkfall vs (generic tab target game here).

Fact is a noob char will get owned by some one who had a pimped out one. If you want to be on a equal footing go play CS.

 

"Fact is a noob char will get owned by some one who had a pimped out one. If you want to be on a equal footing go play CS."

But wait a minute, this little statement goes totally against the mantra used by Tasos(Aventurine) and the most ardent of fans since , well, forever.

Originally posted by Cecropia

Originally posted by Angelof2070

Originally posted by mmoluva

I think most people that play this game already know this going in but if they don't now they do:)

 

I really wish I knew, lol.

The game was SO fun at release. I only quit bc of [other] issues, and I just now returned to find out the game isn't the same in this regard :(

It sucks to buy a game solely just to PvP, and find out you have to work for a month before you can even play the game.

 

If you can't put in a measly month of effort to get your character up to a competitive level what are you doing playing mmos?

Honestly I think there are very few people left that understand what mmos should(IMO)/could be. And that is why the giant games list here looks the way it does.

That's right, you should spent countless hours doing something you hate a month to play your game "correctly". By your last statement, it would seem that MMOs are not games, but rather complete unfun time wasters with a hint fun thereafter. Last I checked, games were suppose to place a first impression on a player, not a future behold after you pay your dues (which were obviously paid when you bought the game). People like you truly don't know what a game is nor do you know what a MMORPG is.

I personally would never buy a MMO that I cannot stand playing for the first 15min to 1 hour, yet alone one consistant month just to gain the "fun" parts.

Originally posted by Respit

 

"Fact is a noob char will get owned by some one who had a pimped out one. If you want to be on a equal footing go play CS."

 

But wait a minute, this little statement goes totally against the mantra used by Tasos(Aventurine) and the most ardent of fans since , well, forever.

Why don't you quote the bible again? That did wonders to display your vast wisdom before.

Originally posted by Blindchance

Originally posted by Realbigdeal

Wrong. DF is a skill base game. Not a lvl base game. Yeah, gaining skills can take the same speed as maxing lvl in wow, but lvl are not skills.

If you are a newb in wow, you cant equip the highest pvp gear or the highest pve gear. Some items, you need like lvl 80 to equip it. If you are lvl 1, you cant. Ummm... if you are lvl 1, you cant enter a dungeon that require you to be lvl 50 for example. There are some instance you cant enter. Yeah, there is a range lvl for pvp like if you are lvl 20, only lvl 20 to 30 can kill you, a proof to define wow as a lvl base game. And the worst part, you need to be lvl 40 to ride a mount.

Darkfall. in your 1st day, when you didnt learn any skill, if you are in a powerful clan, they can give you the best items in the game. You can equip them without any problem and use them. There is no instance so you can go anywhere you want. You can use any item in the game, you can get kill by anyone or get killed by anyone. Darkfall dont share any common stuff as a lvl base game. You can also ride any mount including the battle horn.

What you miss here is that no one will be that suicidal to use the best gear with low skill character, the risk of losing them is almost 100 %. It is much better then a typical level based solution, but it still hugely depends on character progression aka GRIND.

Realbigdeal is spot on and what you are addrressing as is the original poster is solo combat.   In group combat, a lesser combat skilled character can make a huge difference but should probably fight at range.   Equipping a high level bow or staff will allow a week old player to contribute significantly in group pvp.

The original post is written from the pov of a solo player.    That said, even a 9 month old character is going to get owned when killing mobs and the coward attacks you at 25% health.

I started a brand new character this week for kicks, even though I've been playing since beta.   Been thinking of writing about it, but in two days of totally casual play I have over 50 Lesser Magic, trained Greater Magic, have my Melee weapon skill up to 36 and archery at over 50.    This in three days time.

DFO can be solo friendly, but it is a group game.    If you play mostly solo, or in a guild that doesn't help or you don't ask for it, I can undertand the original post. 

The very fact one can wear the best armor or wield the best weapons of day 1 of character creation makes the point of this thread pointless.     If your not a team player, DFO is probably not for you and riddled with frustration after frustration, hence the OP.

-CC

Originally posted by Respit

Originally posted by ozy1

It an MMORPG not a DOOM, get over it ...

Love how Darkfall gets loads of attention of all the trolls and haters. They have played the game and dont like it or have read stuff about it and dont like it, so they feel the need to slag it. Or they feel butt hurt cus Mr T said this would be in the game and its not.

So now we have this new conversation about skill, like Darkfall vs (generic tab target game here).

Fact is a noob char will get owned by some one who had a pimped out one. If you want to be on a equal footing go play CS.

 

 

"Fact is a noob char will get owned by some one who had a pimped out one. If you want to be on a equal footing go play CS."

 

But wait a minute, this little statement goes totally against the mantra used by Tasos(Aventurine) and the most ardent of fans since , well, forever.

I play Darkfall all the time and love it, but come on we all know Tasos talks a load of crap allot of the time.

Originally posted by ChinaCat

Realbigdeal is spot on and what you are addrressing as is the original poster is solo combat.   In group combat, a lesser combat skilled character can make a huge difference but should probably fight at range.   Equipping a high level bow or staff will allow a week old player to contribute significantly in group pvp.

The original post is written from the pov of a solo player.    That said, even a 9 month old character is going to get owned when killing mobs and the coward attacks you at 25% health.

I started a brand new character this week for kicks, even though I've been playing since beta.   Been thinking of writing about it, but in two days of totally casual play I have over 50 Lesser Magic, trained Greater Magic, have my Melee weapon skill up to 36 and archery at over 50.    This in three days time.

DFO can be solo friendly, but it is a group game.    If you play mostly solo, or in a guild that doesn't help or you don't ask for it, I can undertand the original post. 

The very fact one can wear the best armor or wield the best weapons of day 1 of character creation makes the point of this thread pointless.     If your not a team player, DFO is probably not for you and riddled with frustration after frustration, hence the OP.

-CC

Was this from your guild's city or did you start in the new player zones. I started in new player areas and the amount of pking would make what you describe impossible from my perspective. Not to mention what do you define as casual play? I played 3-5 hours a day  for 2 weeks and I am not close to your stats.

You do however have way more experience than your average new player, so I am sure that helped you.

Originally posted by h8erberry

Originally posted by ChinaCat

Realbigdeal is spot on and what you are addrressing as is the original poster is solo combat.   In group combat, a lesser combat skilled character can make a huge difference but should probably fight at range.   Equipping a high level bow or staff will allow a week old player to contribute significantly in group pvp.

The original post is written from the pov of a solo player.    That said, even a 9 month old character is going to get owned when killing mobs and the coward attacks you at 25% health.

I started a brand new character this week for kicks, even though I've been playing since beta.   Been thinking of writing about it, but in two days of totally casual play I have over 50 Lesser Magic, trained Greater Magic, have my Melee weapon skill up to 36 and archery at over 50.    This in three days time.

DFO can be solo friendly, but it is a group game.    If you play mostly solo, or in a guild that doesn't help or you don't ask for it, I can undertand the original post. 

The very fact one can wear the best armor or wield the best weapons of day 1 of character creation makes the point of this thread pointless.     If your not a team player, DFO is probably not for you and riddled with frustration after frustration, hence the OP.

-CC

Was this from your guild's city or did you start in the new player zones. I started in new player areas and the amount of pking would make what you describe impossible from my perspective. Not to mention what do you define as casual play? I played 3-5 hours a day  for 2 weeks and I am not close to your stats.

You do however have way more experience than your average new player, so I am sure that helped you.

You might wanna join a guild to get some tips then.

casual play I have over 50 Lesser Magic, trained Greater Magic, have my Melee weapon skill up to 36 and archery at over 50. This in three days time.

"Casual play". I find it hilarious how variable everyone's definition of "casual" is.

---

Originally posted by LogothX
casual play I have over 50 Lesser Magic, trained Greater Magic, have my Melee weapon skill up to 36 and archery at over 50. This in three days time.

"Casual play". I find it hilarious how variable everyone's definition of "casual" is.

---

LogothX, it's hard to tell who you're quoting.

And that is definitely not casual play. I play casually, maybe a few hours a night, if that. In 1 month my lesser magic is at 47, melee weapon is around 40 and archery is around 40. I'm not trying hard to level anything. Just playing the game. Farming, exploring, crafting and so on.

If you focus on a particular skill though, you could quickly level it up.

Originally posted by Nizur

 

---

Originally posted by LogothX
casual play I have over 50 Lesser Magic, trained Greater Magic, have my Melee weapon skill up to 36 and archery at over 50. This in three days time.

 

"Casual play". I find it hilarious how variable everyone's definition of "casual" is.

---

 

LogothX, it's hard to tell who you're quoting.

And that is definitely not casual play. I play casually, maybe a few hours a night, if that. In 1 month my lesser magic is at 47, melee weapon is around 40 and archery is around 40. I'm not trying hard to level anything. Just playing the game. Farming, exploring, crafting and so on.

If you focus on a particular skill though, you could quickly level it up.

Thats the point. Focusing on part by part unless you just want to do all the stuff from day one and i mean exploring, crafting, killing monsters, trying to pvp and others. Once you done all that for atleast a week, any players that played darkfall for the 1st time will then try to focus on skill part by part.

DF is good casually , but like every baddy said, you need to join a clan. And if you are not casually social, your newb period will be boring as hell and you might just quite just because you always get kill by pack of mob and players around.

Originally posted by h8erberry

Originally posted by ChinaCat

Realbigdeal is spot on and what you are addrressing as is the original poster is solo combat.   In group combat, a lesser combat skilled character can make a huge difference but should probably fight at range.   Equipping a high level bow or staff will allow a week old player to contribute significantly in group pvp.

The original post is written from the pov of a solo player.    That said, even a 9 month old character is going to get owned when killing mobs and the coward attacks you at 25% health.

I started a brand new character this week for kicks, even though I've been playing since beta.   Been thinking of writing about it, but in two days of totally casual play I have over 50 Lesser Magic, trained Greater Magic, have my Melee weapon skill up to 36 and archery at over 50.    This in three days time.

DFO can be solo friendly, but it is a group game.    If you play mostly solo, or in a guild that doesn't help or you don't ask for it, I can undertand the original post. 

The very fact one can wear the best armor or wield the best weapons of day 1 of character creation makes the point of this thread pointless.     If your not a team player, DFO is probably not for you and riddled with frustration after frustration, hence the OP.

-CC

Was this from your guild's city or did you start in the new player zones. I started in new player areas and the amount of pking would make what you describe impossible from my perspective. Not to mention what do you define as casual play? I played 3-5 hours a day  for 2 weeks and I am not close to your stats.

You do however have way more experience than your average new player, so I am sure that helped you.

I started in a new player zone as an Ork.     I've gotten ganked at low health, but the Ork newbie area is a lot more sparse than many others, so I'm sure I have that advantage.    While I didn't level guilded or in my guild city, I did give my newbie a bag of rank 0 staffs, bows and arrows.     That is no smaill thing I admit, so my apologies for being misleading at all.    If I was to get along totally on my own, I would have to add at least another three or four days for the sole purpose of training the Alchemy (to make staves), Bowyer (to make arrows and bows) and to gather the resources to make those items and farm the coin to train the crafting skills.    I have fended for myself with food by fishing and cooking it. 

When I say casual, I mean 2-3 hours a day.   When you factor in my experience of how to play the game, with giving my newbie some stuff, I grant you, the average newbie would need 7-10 days in what I did in 2-3, but that's still very very good.   Armor and weapons drop off newbie mobs in Ork lands, and the same is true with other races; you just need to know what to fight.

I made it out to a treasure chest to cash in a key drop and got some sweet magic armor and enchanged weapon.   I hung around to fight the mobs and while engaged and at 1/2 health, a guy from "necessary evil" blasted me from behind with magic, followed by 2 arrow shots and pretty much before I knew what happened I was dead and lost a lot of good stuff.    This experience really hit home as to why so many new players get frustrated and post a lot of what they do, but the fact of the matter is this stuff is to be expected in a game that provides so much player freedom.   The responsibility for that death was mine.     As a newbie, I should have made a greater effort to group with with 1 or 2 players and hunt intelligently with eyes on all sides.   "MOST" gankers of newbie mob hunters are solo, and if one just joins up with 1 or 2 others, the chances of getting attacked are much lower and surviving significantly higher.

-CC

Originally posted by Nizur

 

---

Originally posted by LogothX
casual play I have over 50 Lesser Magic, trained Greater Magic, have my Melee weapon skill up to 36 and archery at over 50. This in three days time.

 

"Casual play". I find it hilarious how variable everyone's definition of "casual" is.

---

 

LogothX, it's hard to tell who you're quoting.

And that is definitely not casual play. I play casually, maybe a few hours a night, if that. In 1 month my lesser magic is at 47, melee weapon is around 40 and archery is around 40. I'm not trying hard to level anything. Just playing the game. Farming, exploring, crafting and so on.

If you focus on a particular skill though, you could quickly level it up.

You can get 50 lesser magic in 5-6 hours of doing nothing but shooting mana missles and healing yourself on newbie mobs (goblins).     Trick is to always have food.   If you mix in using a bow when your mana is depleted by your stamina is not, you can raise Archery to about the same level in the same time frame if you have the arrows, then just sit and rest to get it all back to full.    I confess it taking a fair amount of time to harvest materials, craft them, and such; but what you have accomplished in one month, could easily be done in a week playing a few hours a night.    Certainly if you are lucky enough to have a second computer, or can just farm while doing other things but not really playing the game; just attended macroing harvesting and crafting, it will make things much easier for sure.

Originally posted by Cecropia

Originally posted by Respit

 

"Fact is a noob char will get owned by some one who had a pimped out one. If you want to be on a equal footing go play CS."

 

But wait a minute, this little statement goes totally against the mantra used by Tasos(Aventurine) and the most ardent of fans since , well, forever.

 

Why don't you quote the bible again? That did wonders to display your vast wisdom before.

Why don't you try to be constructive in one of your posts, instead of every comment being a sarcastic, condescending poke?

If you didn't understand the aforementioned quote, feel free to leave a comment and we can discuss it. If you did understand the point I was making, then feel free to join the discussion and offer up your vast wisdom on a given subject.

---

Originally posted by ChinaCat

---

Originally posted by Nizur

---

Originally posted by LogothX
casual play I have over 50 Lesser Magic, trained Greater Magic, have my Melee weapon skill up to 36 and archery at over 50. This in three days time.
 
"Casual play". I find it hilarious how variable everyone's definition of "casual" is.

---

 
LogothX, it's hard to tell who you're quoting.
And that is definitely not casual play. I play casually, maybe a few hours a night, if that. In 1 month my lesser magic is at 47, melee weapon is around 40 and archery is around 40. I'm not trying hard to level anything. Just playing the game. Farming, exploring, crafting and so on.
If you focus on a particular skill though, you could quickly level it up.

---

You can get 50 lesser magic in 5-6 hours of doing nothing but shooting mana missles and healing yourself on newbie mobs (goblins).     Trick is to always have food.   If you mix in using a bow when your mana is depleted by your stamina is not, you can raise Archery to about the same level in the same time frame if you have the arrows, then just sit and rest to get it all back to full.    I confess it taking a fair amount of time to harvest materials, craft them, and such; but what you have accomplished in one month, could easily be done in a week playing a few hours a night.    Certainly if you are lucky enough to have a second computer, or can just farm while doing other things but not really playing the game; just attended macroing harvesting and crafting, it will make things much easier for sure.

---

I can't heal myself fast enough around goblins. The cooldown on heal self is mega slow. They'd get at least 5-6 hits in before I could cast it again.

And I know I could skill any one thing up if I actually focused on it. The deal is I'm not focused on any one thing. I'm the kind of player that will heal myself IF I remember to. I'm so close to 50 lesser magic that I might as well just spam mana missile at some deer or bombardiers. Does that level magic too? I don't see why not.