Also i think it's the story and timeline world pvp would have trouble fitting into, not the lore. the lore supports it perfectly. the timeline makes everything tough to fit into the game.

Because MMO pvp is a joke, no matter what game you are playing (in terms of playability vs an fps, and in terms of the trashy crowd it attracts). 

So, if you're making a MMO, you have to have some kind of pvp, but you want to minimize it so your whole game doesn't become a joke.  

This is what Turbine did with LotRO.  It seems to be working out.

Originally posted by GidSlack

Because MMO pvp is a joke, no matter what game you are playing (in terms of playability vs an fps, and in terms of the trashy crowd it attracts). 

So, if you're making a MMO, you have to have some kind of pvp, but you want to minimize it so your whole game doesn't become a joke.  

This is what Turbine did with LotRO.  It seems to be working out.

 

Arenanet did a much better work in Guildwars. 
 

The problem with LOTRO is that the devs choose to only let players be good. The lore in LOTRO supports both sides but Turbine only wanted players to be good, not to work for Sauron and that is why the PvP is so bad.

The alternative would be making a lot more content for the bad guys also and let the sides meet sometimes but not that often, or have constant wars with eachother. And it would cost more money to make all those zones.

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Originally posted by Loke666

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Originally posted by GidSlack

Because MMO pvp is a joke, no matter what game you are playing (in terms of playability vs an fps, and in terms of the trashy crowd it attracts). 
So, if you're making a MMO, you have to have some kind of pvp, but you want to minimize it so your whole game doesn't become a joke.  
This is what Turbine did with LotRO.  It seems to be working out.
 

---

Arenanet did a much better work in Guildwars. 
 
The problem with LOTRO is that the devs choose to only let players be good. The lore in LOTRO supports both sides but Turbine only wanted players to be good, not to work for Sauron and that is why the PvP is so bad.
The alternative would be making a lot more content for the bad guys also and let the sides meet sometimes but not that often, or have constant wars with eachother. And it would cost more money to make all those zones.

---

But remember, Turbine isnt Blizzard. Nor handed 100 million from a publisher to compete with blizzard. They did the best with what they had. They can always add the other side later like City of heroes did.

Originally posted by Loke666

Originally posted by GidSlack

Because MMO pvp is a joke, no matter what game you are playing (in terms of playability vs an fps, and in terms of the trashy crowd it attracts). 

So, if you're making a MMO, you have to have some kind of pvp, but you want to minimize it so your whole game doesn't become a joke.  

This is what Turbine did with LotRO.  It seems to be working out.

 

Arenanet did a much better work in Guildwars. 
 

The problem with LOTRO is that the devs choose to only let players be good. The lore in LOTRO supports both sides but Turbine only wanted players to be good, not to work for Sauron and that is why the PvP is so bad.

The alternative would be making a lot more content for the bad guys also and let the sides meet sometimes but not that often, or have constant wars with eachother. And it would cost more money to make all those zones.

Remember that very few MMOs let you play true evil characters like the orcs in Lotr and thats for a very good reason. The evil side in Lotr is not "missunderstood" or have any free will at all, they are just pure evil who want do destroý. Therfor having the evil side as a playable factions doesnt make much sense. There is a reason why you cant play as the burning legion in WoW either. PvMP is a geniouse way of making people get a taste of what the evil side of Lotr is about imo. (even thou it could use some more love now ;))

I like that the PvP in LotrO is about having fun and nothing else, PvP in other MMOs are like competitions but in LotrO its actually a War and nothing is fair or balanced in wars. GW is a good example of a game that is like a competition.

Might make for an interesting twist if they allowed you to take (your) monster into a special skirmish instance.

Basically where the monster player signs into a list (LFF - Looking for fight) and if the Free Guy hits the same they both go with the Free Guy doing it like it is presently; random, he picks raid nr and level etc...., and the monster guy becoming one of the LT's or Big Boss.  Still totally random encounter with limited control on the monster side.  Could be looked at as just an extension of Monster Play.

Maybe because the game was not created to have pvp in the first place ?

Originally posted by CrittRockets

If the game is supposed to be based on the books and the lore why cant i start attacking the good guys towns with a monster? When you ask yourself that its when you realize PvP was just an afterthought with this game and how bad the current system really is. Either that or they figured that people who liked the LOTR lore wouldn't LIKE  a game where they would get killed by other players.

There. Fixed that for you.

The better question is, why is monster play a complete joke?

Originally posted by Nebless

Might make for an interesting twist if they allowed you to take (your) monster into a special skirmish instance.

Basically where the monster player signs into a list (LFF - Looking for fight) and if the Free Guy hits the same they both go with the Free Guy doing it like it is presently; random, he picks raid nr and level etc...., and the monster guy becoming one of the LT's or Big Boss.  Still totally random encounter with limited control on the monster side.  Could be looked at as just an extension of Monster Play.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if this was the future of monster play.

Since there are battles betweent the forces, they could set something up like the Warhammer scenarios but scenarios that were story based.

players would sign up, enter, battle it out.

I'd be up for that.

Originally posted by FikusOfAhazi

PVP in lotro is EXACTLY like the pvp in every other mmo. (except for a couple like eve or Darkfall that have a point)

Saying lotro pvp is a joke means? No scoreboard? No gear for wining or losing enough times lol? No xp to force you to level up so you cant stay a twink forever?
What do they mean exactly?

  Have you heard of "Open-world PvP?"

Originally posted by caalem

The better question is, why is monster play a complete joke?

That is a better question. I wonder how people can find following raids around all day and swapping keep ownerships back and forth in the same zone every day enjoyable... Or even worse doing terrible quests "get 10 of these" "kill 10 of these" all day. But that probably explains why there's only a tiny amount of people playing monsters compared to good guys.

The issue there is simple, you can play a monster without having to lvl past lvl 10, it wouldn't be right to allow you to have to much to do in the monster play area simply because it would mean your allowed to get instant max lvl char to do whatever you want with and that isn't even remotely ok if they allowed full world pvp. Secondly they can't add in pvp now cause of the screaming fit most of the strictly monster player players would throw if all of a sudden their max lvl character was reconned into a lvl 10 pc in mordor.  As it is monster play is an add on for fun and for bonuses on a player and realm basis not as a real pvp addition.

Didn't we already cover this very topic like... well over a year ago? Numerous times? With numerous people who all had the same exact arguments?

Ah well.. for old time's sake, I guess...

LoTRO is not an open PvP MMO. It was never designed as one. It was never intended as one. The lore does not support it, nor does the timeline, as others have pointed out. No, "because you really think it would be a good idea" is not a good enough reason to change it. Sorry to burst your bubble.

The people who play and enjoy LoTRO enjoy it despite - if not because - it's not an open FFA PvP MMO, at least in part. Believe it or not, not every MMO out there needs to have open PvP to be "good". And, if its track record is any indication, LoTRO is doing just fine without it since launch.

If you can enjoy PvMP (which is actually pretty fun if you get into it - and yes, I enjoy FFA open world PvP as well, so please don't even go there) then LoTRO should be fine. If you can't, and need to be an orc razing The Shire to enjoy yourself then LoTRO is not the MMO for you.

LoTRO is a PvE MMO first and foremost, and works just fine as such.

Here are some questions I have...
Why is it that every PvE MMO out there inevitably has people coming into its threads insisting that the game would be better if it had open PvP... even when popular consensus (aka the people enjoying it as is) shows otherwise?
Why is it that when they're given perfectly valid answers to the first question - especially in this case where the reasons are *well* known - such people can't accept that as the answer and instead have to keep arguing?
Why is it that in every such thread, those arguing for open PvP in a PvE MMO inevitably start insulting the game and/or those who play it - even if indirectly (e.g. "PvE takes no skill" and myriad other canned mantras)?

Darkfall, Lineage 2, Mortal Online and a number of other MMOs current and upcoming support, or will support open world PvP where you can kill anyone almost anywhere you like (if you're able) as you please. So why not check those games out? It would be like me going into forums for Darkfall and arguing that it would be better if PvP was consensual. It would make absolutely no sense in that game, and so I wouldn't bother. I would simply go play a MMO that has consensual PvP if that's what I was looking for.

its simple LoToR was made for Pver's

Same reason  PVP gankfest PVE is a joke compared to LOTRO?  Cant believe this thread has lived as long as it has.

 Seriously though. The post is legit imo.

LOTRO has the best PvE I've ever seen but as a DAOC refugee I can understand why many players desire a more meaty PvP end game option.

They aren't all that far in some ways. There is fighting over keeps which is a good start. If they were to legitimize "monster play" so as to offer an equivalent monster experience as you find in the free people's and add a few purpose built zones they would be 95% of the way there.

Not saying it's easy, but certainly plausible and I think it would top off a great game. 

even though i enjoy the pve in lord of the rings as its the best i ve come across in an mmo i would like to see the pvp side of the game expanded on . moria is full of all sorts of nasty things in the book so a pvp area there would make sence as would instanced battles somewhere along the lines of a skirmish system . its part of the game i would like to expanded on because i do like to pit my wits against other people .

Originally posted by CrittRockets

Originally posted by FikusOfAhazi

PVP in lotro is EXACTLY like the pvp in every other mmo. (except for a couple like eve or Darkfall that have a point)

Saying lotro pvp is a joke means? No scoreboard? No gear for wining or losing enough times lol? No xp to force you to level up so you cant stay a twink forever?
What do they mean exactly?

  Have you heard of "Open-world PvP?"

I hear it existed once and was a great power. But fell to the tears of farmers disguised as bears that cares.

Notice the exceptions above also. Throw in doac and UO if those games are still relevant to you.

Maybe also notice I also said in this thread that open world pvp works perfectly in the lore, disagreeing with my fellow lotro fans.

I say open world pvp ftw. My bills arent paid threw lotro's success though. They could do it, slowly. Or threw a huge expansion losing some customers and gaining some others. I dont know which would be the bigger group.

Originally posted by metalhead980

Originally posted by Sovrath

 

I don't think you actually understand the world. And it also seems like you didn't read the books.

You can't expect these young kids to actually read if its not a homework assignment.

It's pathetic really I was reading Catcher in the Rye the other day and some chick asked me if it was based on a movie........... :(

Obviously he knows nothing about Tolkien.

Ahhh kids these days.

Please tell me the chick was hot. If not that will be one sad long and lonely life for her.