Magic is worthless now. After some extensive testing with various spells a person with 99 in a fireball, crossive blast, etc  aginst a person in full scale with 98 rigor, without a shield, or the extra protections from the specializations, you will only take about 20 damage. This means that instead of the situational balance we all hoped for, AV has made magic worthless by removing the ability to do damage. 

If you don't like the fact that magic damage is practically worthless now do what we did when they removed jump casting from the game: Send a support ticket that says something like the following

=========================================================

 To Whom it May Concern

The recent changes to the Darkfall Online have some pros and cons, but over all the patch is pretty decent. However, there are two things that are nearly game breaking either due to completely imbalancing the play styles or making PvE to hard. The following two things need to be changed to fix both of these issues.

First, PvP is has become imbalanced to favor archery over magic due to the changes done with [b]metal armor's elemental resistance[/b]. This change makes magic damage completely worthless in most instances. To fix this issue, tweak elemental resistance to force people to wear full plate+ to get just above the current resistance attained with scale. Currently, scale adds 15 resistance to all magic types, except arcane, this makes a person with 99 fire ball, 60 fire intensity only do on avg 20 damage to a person wearing full scale without a shield or the extra magical resistance from the specialization skills. Instead, a person wearing full scale should take about 5 more damage per spell, but heal for a bit more as well. This can be done by making scale have 10 elemental resistance, full plate having 18, and so on and so forth.

Secondly, PvE should not be completely un-soloable. In my opinion, the one change that needs to be done is to remove immunities from PvE mobs, but make them highly resistant to damage types.

These two changes will bring the game closer to the balance everyone thought would of happened with the patch, but was not achieved due to over kill.

Funny... I saw this same post by you on every single thread on the DF forums.

We get it, resistances are whacked with AV's knee jerk magic fix, but spouting off isn't going to fix it any faster.

Originally posted by Netzoko

Funny... I saw this same post by you on every single thread on the DF forums.

We get it, resistances are whacked with AV's knee jerk magic fix, but spouting off isn't going to fix it any faster.

Its there to counter everyone who thinks that all the changes were good and the game is more balanced than before. And I posted this here because the mods deleted the post. doing the above will actually get avs attention., 

i think they know with 1 thread they will fix it it could just be a bug to with resistance it was a pretty big exspansion right?

PVP wasn't unbalanced before when magic was over powered? Seems to me that since I'm able to close distance on a magic monkey before dieing now or avoid their AoEs the playing field got alot more even. I think alot of people just want their FOTM template back, now that easy mode has been removed.

Originally posted by Agricola1

PVP wasn't unbalanced before when magic was over powered? Seems to me that since I'm able to close distance on a magic monkey before dieing now or avoid their AoEs the playing field got alot more even. I think alot of people just want their FOTM template back, now that easy mode has been removed.

All elemental schools are worthless now. A person wearing full scale gets hit for only 20 damage with a fire ball from a person with 99 in fire ball and 60 intesify, yet he/she can do 50 damage to the mage. Thats the problem. They need to tweak elemental resistances and make debuffs useful, or nearly remove the changes in elemental resistance on heavy armor. This is assuming that AV weren't completely retarded and actually scaled armor correctly to make full plate+ armor make magic do only 5 damage. 

Originally posted by Agricola1

PVP wasn't unbalanced before when magic was over powered? Seems to me that since I'm able to close distance on a magic monkey before dieing now or avoid their AoEs the playing field got alot more even. I think alot of people just want their FOTM template back, now that easy mode has been removed.

I think the truth lies between. Magic was absurd before but they turned the glass cannons into glass popguns. However I don't think flooding their support sysetem with complaints is going to do anything but piss them off.

Originally posted by zymurgeist

Originally posted by Agricola1

PVP wasn't unbalanced before when magic was over powered? Seems to me that since I'm able to close distance on a magic monkey before dieing now or avoid their AoEs the playing field got alot more even. I think alot of people just want their FOTM template back, now that easy mode has been removed.

 

I think the truth lies between. Magic was absurd before but they turned the glass cannons into glass popguns. However I don't think flooding their support sysetem with complaints is going to do anything but piss them off.

Actually, it was effecitve last time the community did it. When they removed jump shooting from the game completlely the skill based PvP community of darkfall flooded AV support with tickets saying fix this or we all quit. After the weekend AV announced the addition of jump shooting through specializations. That could of been their plan all along, but the point is, they told us about it when the devs didn't say anything about future plans. Doing that same thing again may actually infrom the devs they messed up since 90% of the forums are saying the patch is 100% perfect for pvp balance. 

 They did seem to overcompensate just a tad. This is some of the problems with listening to your base whine though. The hate toward magic was intense so they made adjustments I believe they thought the community would embrace. As far as pve goes I am somewhat baffled at the community complaints on this since in general I thought the hardcore crowd didnt want everything to be soloable so not sure what to think on this one.

Originally posted by parrotpholk

 They did seem to overcompensate just a tad. This is some of the problems with listening to your base whine though. The hate toward magic was intense so they made adjustments I believe they thought the community would embrace. As far as pve goes I am somewhat baffled at the community complaints on this since in general I thought the hardcore crowd didnt want everything to be soloable so not sure what to think on this one.

Theres two people with the PvE patch: the PvPers so want PvE to be easy to make PvP more fequent and the rest. Since most people really only play the game for PvP, its not suprise. And you are right, they went to far and its easily changed; however, that also requires an armor wipe or roll back to remove all the metal armor crafted and found in the game now. I can see it now, selling pre-patch full plate sets 20k, 

Originally posted by parrotpholk

 They did seem to overcompensate just a tad. This is some of the problems with listening to your base whine though. The hate toward magic was intense so they made adjustments I believe they thought the community would embrace. As far as pve goes I am somewhat baffled at the community complaints on this since in general I thought the hardcore crowd didnt want everything to be soloable so not sure what to think on this one.

I thought the community was just asking for global cooldowns on the AoE spells???  

Originally posted by Agricola1

PVP wasn't unbalanced before when magic was over powered? Seems to me that since I'm able to close distance on a magic monkey before dieing now or avoid their AoEs the playing field got alot more even. I think alot of people just want their FOTM template back, now that easy mode has been removed.

To be fair to xpiher; he was advocating balance before as well.

I'll let him speak to the details, but I do remember seeing posts from him saying that magic needed adjustments to bring it into balance. (Mainly the global cooldowns).  It would appear that Aventurine went too far the other way now.

These are the kind of things that an actual test server would help Aventurine with.  I realize they are a small company, and they might not have the people and/or hardware to provide a test server... but, it's really the best way to go.

Even if it's only a couple weeks of testing, it would help to alleviate some of these bigger issues.

Anyway, it'll be interesting to see how this goes over the next few days.

I've seen some players saying:

"You'll just have to get used to it.  This is the way it is from now on."

Kinda reminded me of the SWG pre-CU vs. NGE saga.  I was there for that one, and it didn't turn out well for SOE.  Hopefully this won't turn out the same for Aventurine.  Drastic changes in gameplay are not well-received by the MMO player-base.  Sooner or later you'd think developer would realize that. 

Originally posted by thinktank001

Originally posted by parrotpholk

 They did seem to overcompensate just a tad. This is some of the problems with listening to your base whine though. The hate toward magic was intense so they made adjustments I believe they thought the community would embrace. As far as pve goes I am somewhat baffled at the community complaints on this since in general I thought the hardcore crowd didnt want everything to be soloable so not sure what to think on this one.

 

 

I thought the community was just asking for global cooldowns on the AoE spells???  

It started out as just fix it. GCD were brought up and everyone jumped on that bandwagon. It was a general although somewhat justified string of whining yet no one had a problem spamming 12345............. Granted I am in the camp that thinks GCD would have been good enough however I can see the silver lining in that they are trying to force a bit of variety in how people play. Granted a good portion of the crowd will go with what ever is uber at the time but there is also a section which will still want to be mages and find ways to win and be competitive. Its not the end of magic users but it is the end of the FOTM incarnation of it. We will have to see how it plays out though. 90% of the problem is people became accustomed to playing one way for so long now that its different instead of exploring ways to make it work they played for 10 minutes and took to the forums. 

I respect what xipher says and in many ways I agree with this but trying to see the other side to it as well.

Originally posted by parrotpholk

Originally posted by thinktank001

Originally posted by parrotpholk

 They did seem to overcompensate just a tad. This is some of the problems with listening to your base whine though. The hate toward magic was intense so they made adjustments I believe they thought the community would embrace. As far as pve goes I am somewhat baffled at the community complaints on this since in general I thought the hardcore crowd didnt want everything to be soloable so not sure what to think on this one.

 

 

I thought the community was just asking for global cooldowns on the AoE spells???  

It started out as just fix it. GCD were brought up and everyone jumped on that bandwagon. It was a general although somewhat justified string of whining yet no one had a problem spamming 12345............. Granted I am in the camp that thinks GCD would have been good enough however I can see the silver lining in that they are trying to force a bit of variety in how people play. Granted a good portion of the crowd will go with what ever is uber at the time but there is also a section which will still want to be mages and find ways to win and be competitive. Its not the end of magic users but it is the end of the FOTM incarnation of it. We will have to see how it plays out though. 90% of the problem is people became accustomed to playing one way for so long now that its different instead of exploring ways to make it work they played for 10 minutes and took to the forums. 

 

I respect what xipher says and in many ways I agree with this but trying to see the other side to it as well.

Elemental damage is worthless. The only magic damage spells that are worth using now are Blast, Manna Missile, Eldritch Sphere, Rend, Venom, Needles, Missile Fury, Shrapnel, Mana Blast, Toxic Rain, Insect Swarm, Meteor strike, and Impale. And all the good ones minus two from that list can also be used by mage killers. The game isn't balanced, and people will be using scale + archery + melee just like people were using bone + melee + magic. It doesn't solve the issue, it just changes it. If AV wants to promote diversity, wants rolls to devlope, and want people to be more tactical about what they do and how they play they need to tweak elemental resistances on all mental armor types, a tank should be forced to wear full plate+, and make debuff combat useable by doing the following

Debuffs
* Specialization additions (affects all debuffs)
- Single target: This specialization allows all spells in this school of magic to travel at arrow speed at default and gives spells a slight splash. Currently, you can hit right next to someone with spells like sluggish and cursed bolt and not hit them. In a game where ping determines how accurate you are, there should be a little "give" in spells but not much
- Multiple targets: This specialization reduces the over all effectiveness of spells by 20% (time the spell last and effect) it has, but allows you to hit up to multiple targets and has a fairly big AoE. The spells also takes longer to cast and has longer travel time. 

In addition to the above Debuffs should have a natural AoE size of r50 MM - still dodge able, but enough give and enough aoe to hit more than 1 person, but not be OP.

Game will be closed to the type of balance that can easily be tweaked: situational balance 

I really don't understand most complaints about PvE. I mean, as long as you use the right weapons, you can kill a monster a lot faster than you could before the patch. It's just a matter of finding the right monster spawns to fight and this won't force people to use all the weapons. As I just said, you have the find the right monster spawns.

Technically, because I use Blunt weapons, I can kill skeletons a lot easier than other players so I can quickly gain a lot of important materials that I can then trade to other players for a decent price. It will greatly affect the market in a positive way. Heck, teaming up is encouraged too which is just awesome. Now I just need a fire enchant on my blunt weapon and I can kill Undeads.
----

As for Magic, yeah....they nerfed magic WAY TOO MUCH. But got to admit a 144 damage fireball pre-patch was WAY TOO STRONG. Honestly, magic should go back to the "Way too strong" part but increase (2x, 3x) the magic resistance you gain from Melee Passive Skills. That should make sense...

And with monsters having resistance and weakness, it won't be possible to spam magic to solo them so it doesn't matter that much.

----

People have been fed with easy mode monsters AI for too long, glitching the monsters to raise their skills etc and now that the monsters are finally challenging, they all cry and cry. Sigh.....I really hope AV doesn't dumb down the AI.

Originally posted by xpiher

 

- Multiple targets: This specialization reduces the over all effectiveness of spells by 20% (time the spell last and effect) it has, but allows you to hit up to multiple targets and has a fairly big AoE. The spells also takes longer to cast and has longer travel time. 

In addition to the above Debuffs should have a natural AoE size of r50 MM - still dodge able, but enough give and enough aoe to hit more than 1 person, but not be OP.

 

Game will be closed to the type of balance that can easily be tweaked: situational balance 

 

Thats interesting.   I saw AoE damage as having a huge radius, almost unavoidable, but much lower damage (20 - 30), and global cooldowns.   That way it would actually be useable in large scale battles with a group of mages.  

They should implement Combat skill Cap -.- if you are doing melee you should be able to skill aswell magic or melee and vice versa. That would make a diversity not the things they try to do. And lets dont speak about PvE changes which are a knee shoot for newly started players like me.

Originally posted by Xianthos

They should implement Combat skill Cap -.- if you are doing melee you should be able to skill aswell magic or melee and vice versa. That would make a diversity not the things they try to do. And lets dont speak about PvE changes which are a knee shoot for newly started players like me.

Group up. Find another player and group up to kill Goblin spawns. No need to actually play together but the simple fact of having more than 1 player at a monster spawns means that not all the monsters attacks will be directed at you. I also suggest you use sprint and crouch a lot to avoid arrows. It takes skills but as soon as you understand how it works, evading Archers in PvP will be a piece of cake.

Here's a second tip for goblins: They are weak against Piercing (Archery and Polearms).

Originally posted by MadnessRealm

Originally posted by Xianthos

They should implement Combat skill Cap -.- if you are doing melee you should be able to skill aswell magic or melee and vice versa. That would make a diversity not the things they try to do. And lets dont speak about PvE changes which are a knee shoot for newly started players like me.

 

Group up. Find another player and group up to kill Goblin spawns. No need to actually play together but the simple fact of having more than 1 player at a monster spawns means that not all the monsters attacks will be directed at you. I also suggest you use sprint and crouch a lot to avoid arrows. It takes skills but as soon as you understand how it works, evading Archers in PvP will be a piece of cake.

Here's a second tip for goblins: They are weak against Piercing (Archery and Polearms).

Dude please dont insult me.

Im newb but im not brainless idiot ....

Goblin farming isnt an option. Ive tried today 6 spots and and all were patrolled by gankers squads ... ill have to wait to the night till im able to farm ... Ive tryed grouping and farms mobs but its sooooooooo fucking slow to kill them on our skill level. No they got no immunity. They bow accuracy is just insane and it oftens look like they are seeing through walls WTF? I come out of cover and there is already an arrow flying towards me and hits .. If we werent in a grp it wouldnt be possible to kill them at all and not to mention the loot is UBERCRAP for more then 1 player.

So this patch is a knee shoot for newbs / newly started players as they are forced to grind gobs till they vomit or burn out. PvP isnt aswell an option right now. Skill are lows and every noob ganker in full scale can doomroll me and my mate ... You have to grind at least a month till you get a bit competative but now im hardly able to grind as mobs getting harder for newbs and gobs spawns are infested with gankers ...

Originally posted by xpiher

Magic is worthless now. After some extensive testing with various spells a person with 99 in a fireball, crossive blast, etc  aginst a person in full scale with 98 rigor, without a shield, or the extra protections from the specializations, you will only take about 20 damage. This means that instead of the situational balance we all hoped for, AV has made magic worthless by removing the ability to do damage. 

If you don't like the fact that magic damage is practically worthless now do what we did when they removed jump casting from the game: Send a support ticket that says something like the following

=========================================================

 To Whom it May Concern

The recent changes to the Darkfall Online have some pros and cons, but over all the patch is pretty decent. However, there are two things that are nearly game breaking either due to completely imbalancing the play styles or making PvE to hard. The following two things need to be changed to fix both of these issues.

First, PvP is has become imbalanced to favor archery over magic due to the changes done with [b]metal armor's elemental resistance[/b]. This change makes magic damage completely worthless in most instances. To fix this issue, tweak elemental resistance to force people to wear full plate+ to get just above the current resistance attained with scale. Currently, scale adds 15 resistance to all magic types, except arcane, this makes a person with 99 fire ball, 60 fire intensity only do on avg 20 damage to a person wearing full scale without a shield or the extra magical resistance from the specialization skills. Instead, a person wearing full scale should take about 5 more damage per spell, but heal for a bit more as well. This can be done by making scale have 10 elemental resistance, full plate having 18, and so on and so forth.

Secondly, PvE should not be completely un-soloable. In my opinion, the one change that needs to be done is to remove immunities from PvE mobs, but make them highly resistant to damage types.

These two changes will bring the game closer to the balance everyone thought would of happened with the patch, but was not achieved due to over kill.

LOL you and the others where dissing MO, saying this expack and update where the 2nd coming and hyping it

Now that its out and as i said AV dosnt have a test server so nothing was tested just simply released.

It makes me laugh to see you go from saying how bad ass this patch will be and how its just gonna magically balance everything untested. LOL

But now your butt hurt about the changes that for the past 2 months you did nothing but blindly hype the product to turn and put your foot right in your mouth.

Now actually magic doing no dmg actually makes it sound better to me thats 1 of the reasons i left DF was magic was so OP and i hate magic classes and mages i just find it cheap and stupid. (even tho that sounds like im rooting for the new "fix" im totally not ill never give the failures at AV money)

But just gos to show you dont hype things when there not being tested in the MMO field you HAVE TO TEST YOUR MATERIALS defiantly before you just throw them into LIVE.