Originally posted by Xennith

fail. mission running in eve is like doing your daily quests in wow. it gets you a little cash and some standings, but the big bucks comes from trading.

 

do yourself a favour, give a fresh alt 200 million and send them to amarr, buy named mods, so fleeting warp scrams, ddo target painters, cl- shield boosters etc, and then resell them. in a week you should have doubled that cash with ease.

agreed

 I just reactivated my account and even though the game has great promise I cannot get away from the feeling that the difference from the "has" and the "has not" is HUGE.

A regular player that does not have access to T2 BPOs can make maybe 20-30 millions/hour where as, the OP said, people with T2 BPOs can make ten times that much just by buying minerals, building and selling T2 stuff and they dont even need to be logged in most of the time while raking up the money.

Not sure if this is supposed to be some kind of RL simulation but it is a game after all and allowing a select few having such an advantage is just.... stupid.

Originally posted by Yamota

 I just reactivated my account and even though the game has great promise I cannot get away from the feeling that the difference from the "has" and the "has not" is HUGE.

A regular player that does not have access to T2 BPOs can make maybe 20-30 millions/hour where as, the OP said, people with T2 BPOs can make ten times that much just by buying minerals, building and selling T2 stuff and they dont even need to be logged in most of the time while raking up the money.

Not sure if this is supposed to be some kind of RL simulation but it is a game after all and allowing a select few having such an advantage is just.... stupid.

 

I am curious as to how you earn your EvE cash [Mission running?], Because there are severall ways a new player can start to earn a good modest cash flow thats enough to fund your frigates and mid range cruisers. Here is a list of them.

Mission running.

Trading

Mining

Ore stealing

Loot stealing.

The last 2 tho should only be tried if you dont care too much about your reputation in a given sector or EvE space as in future you will need to make connections with other players if you want to earn the big buck in some earning methods such as trading in moon minerals.

Originally posted by chikinhok

 

After doing some research, T2 BPO owners make billions of ISK per week with little to no effort, while I max out at maybe 30mil per hour grinding.  

......

Invention has tiny profit margins, risk, and is vastly inferior to the ISK made by T2 BPO holders, in fact, nothing compares to the ISK they make, and nothing ever will until more T2 BPOs are released, which they never will be

 

This is the wrong mind-set for eve.

First off, Invention "usually" has low profit margins, but there are always market fluxuations, and there are always items that can make a nice profit if you jump on them fast enough.

Also, get more creative with your isk gaining if you don't like missioning. Wormhole space is fun, and if done right can reap massive rewards. Personally I came up with a creative way to make isk and now make 4 billion a month for 1-3 hours a week of work.

There are some pretty cool ways to make isk out there ;)

To be fair: I do play Eve and over my long career in the game I have been many things. Spy, raider, guerilla warfare leader, industrialist.....and I have enjoyed doing each of these.

Throughout all of it though I have had one CONTINUAL problem with the game - combat. As much as I enjoy the features of the game I _loathe_ the combat. It is much slower and unresponsive that I would like. I would like to be able to aim my ships weapons, to fly a frigate or even a fighter/bomber and be able to dance around using a joystick or even Freelancer-styled controls.

I would love to have control over my ships rudder around all axis. Meaning that instead of clicking to turn I can use an assortment of keys to change speed and direction dynamically. Sure clicking does have a measure of dynamic control, but it's hardly what most of us would like.

I would LOVE sectional damage to ships. Meaning that shields and armor have different values that are sectioned off from each other. Combined with more dynamic control this would allow players to actively control the facing of their ship and in turn determine the damage they take.

Well....suffice it to say there are a LOT of changes to the world of combat in Eve that many of us would like to see happen. I know it would be an immense amount of work and may not even be possible, but that doesn't stop me from wishing. I also know that if these changes were made there would likely be a pretty hefty surge of players into the game. That is to say, if combat were changed to resemble something a bit more akin or Freespace or Tachyon or Homeworld. Homeworld in the sense of how things are set up - fewer large ships and a lot of tactical spacing and action between fleets.....that would require a lot more explanation.

Originally posted by chikinhok

So after playing for about 5 months, I trained up a mission runner and just started doing level 4s.  This is supposed to be where I start raking in the ISK, which I guess I am...

But how is this different from grinding in any other MMO? 

After doing some research, T2 BPO owners make billions of ISK per week with little to no effort, while I max out at maybe 30mil per hour grinding.  

Why do I care?  I accept the fact that losing pvp fights costs money, but if the value of that money is different to different people, then the cost of losing a pvp fight is different for different people, this I cannot accept.

Invention has tiny profit margins, risk, and is vastly inferior to the ISK made by T2 BPO holders, in fact, nothing compares to the ISK they make, and nothing ever will until more T2 BPOs are released, which they never will be.

A ship loss for me results in hours of work to recoup losses, a ship loss for them is a rounding error, What's the point of a sandbox if other players have a massive unfair advantage?

 

I love the idea of EVE, and if not for this huge cancer to the economy, I would still be playing it.

2 ISK for your thoughts

 

 

This, but more importantly the fact that the whole game revolves around isk. If you gain absolutely zero joy from having a full wallet, then there's little motivation to do anything as anything thats not "making isk" costs you amazing sums of isk which means you spend more of your time gathering funds and jumping in circles for a brief few moments of doing anything constructive or in action. 

And before anyone chimes in, no, RMT for isk (time cards) is not a real "solution". Additionally, allowing the community to essentially require you dual box or have an alt to "stay in the game" is a design flaw, not a strategy. 

It's a shame, because there's a good game under there, but it's already attracted the community it's built for. If your idea of fun isn't fueled by greed, ambition, or power, there's not much there. 

Originally posted by HYPERI0N

Originally posted by Yamota

 I just reactivated my account and even though the game has great promise I cannot get away from the feeling that the difference from the "has" and the "has not" is HUGE.

A regular player that does not have access to T2 BPOs can make maybe 20-30 millions/hour where as, the OP said, people with T2 BPOs can make ten times that much just by buying minerals, building and selling T2 stuff and they dont even need to be logged in most of the time while raking up the money.

Not sure if this is supposed to be some kind of RL simulation but it is a game after all and allowing a select few having such an advantage is just.... stupid.

 

 

I am curious as to how you earn your EvE cash [Mission running?], Because there are severall ways a new player can start to earn a good modest cash flow thats enough to fund your frigates and mid range cruisers. Here is a list of them.

Mission running.

Trading

Mining

Ore stealing

Loot stealing.

 

The last 2 tho should only be tried if you dont care too much about your reputation in a given sector or EvE space as in future you will need to make connections with other players if you want to earn the big buck in some earning methods such as trading in moon minerals.

I am making my money from doing level 3 missions, when in empire space, and ratting when I am in 0.0 space. The latter one I have not get so involved in because the corp I joined is under a blockade and not been able to escort me in. So stuck in empire space right now. 

Mining I tried, by using two accounts, but it was not profitable enough in high sec space and in low sec space I kept getting blowed up by PC pirates, so that was not profitable either. Also I needed to pay two subscribtion fees for that which made it even less worthwhile.

Trading I have never tried and frankly dont know how to. Buy cheap and sell expensive I guess but not sure how to do that to make it worthwhile.

But cruisers and frigates I have not problem funding (currently in an Armageddon) problem is that one death in an Armageddon set me back for hours, which makes me not want to use it in PvP. So I am stuck being a tackler, which is not very fun. Running anything else will just make you cannon fodder for the pirates out there. 

Problem is that I dont mind dying, in PvP you die (alot). Problem is that one death cost you too much (unless you in a cheap ship, which means you will never win any encounters). So only option is get into a 0.0 corp and roam around in gangs, which is fun, but I think the game would be so much more fun if it was little more forgiving when you died.

Right now 99% of the playerbase are dependant on those few super-rich people that produce ships and the reason is that producing T2 stuff is so much more profitable than most other things in the game which gives them all the power. Would be nice to see ratting or missions giving more cash, that way the gap would be smaller and us who arent producers/traders could have some more fun in PvP as well.

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Originally posted by Yamota
The latter one I have not get so involved in because the corp I joined is under a blockade and not been able to escort me in.

---

How does that work? If i can't get to my corp because every single pipe is camped i just set my clone to one of our nullsec offices and pod myself to 0.0.
Or, if that fails, a fast cloaky ship always gets through.

Your "analysis" on the t2 market is completely wrong. Invention can be done by anybody. The real profit comes from moon mining which is usually used to fund ship replacement programs to allow everyone in the holding alliance to fly well fitted ships to defend those moons.

How a geddon loss sets you back several hours doesn't quite make sense either. I make a solid profit if i lose an insured bs right now since ccp screwed up mineral prices. The only thing that's expensive are the mods which amount to 20 minutes killing npc if i were doing that to fund my private pvp..

Originally posted by Kyleran

You don't really make big money in wormholes unless you live in them at a POS, so find yourself a good WH corp and join their operation.  Regarding entry, I've never gone through 0.0 to gain entry to our hole, however sometimes I  have to go through a few hops of low sec and 2 or 3 WH's to get there.  Once in a great while we get a direct exit from our hole into empire. (we usually close them quickly to prevent raiders from showing up)

Yes, you can get in many 0.0 corps with about 5M SP's and Caldari ships are great for ratting so no problem on that score.  Everyone in 0.0 loves Caldari for ewar/ECM and many a Raven pilot have successfully hunted in 0.0.

Never really looked for cargo containers when probing, but if they can be found it would be with combat probes.

Be warned, we view anyone using combat probes in our WH as a hostile act and we will kill you without pause if we catch you.

 

HAHAHAHAHAHA...... i can solo a class 5 and I do it from hi-sec, yea... didn't expect that did ya? The tougher wormholes come out more in low to null sec but you can find them in hi-sec (you can't find class 4's in hisec). If you want to learn the art of soloing.... you can't learn the art because......... ITS ALL MINE HAHAHAHAHA.

TO THE OP- I make 200mil weekly, yes you can make more from doing lvl4s and salvaging that biache but that gets boring (although I do it on and off). I also produce T3 ships with 140mil profit margins, I play the market every sunday after a week's worth of killing and looting and that profit varies depending on how stupid some capsuleers are. Anyway the point I'm making here is there are many ways you can make money, don't pigeon hole yourself into doing one thing and believing the T2 BPO holders make all the isk, if you capitalise on every new expansion you WILL make all the isk... just look at me I kinda got bored when I basically killed wormholing..... it was fun doing it though heheheh.