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The wife and I are big fantasy fans, we are planning to make are own mmo. She is an artist and I am a writer, between the two of us we have some graphic design knowledge. However, this maybe the biggest project I have ever taken on.
What are all the resources I need to make this project a reality and where can I get them?
update: Need more info on game engines. Spefically oned for suporting 2D graphics & turned based combat. |
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11/14/09 7:30:54 PM#2
You need a good bunch of money to have a quality product, 30-50mil seems like the average budget for p2p MMOs nowadays so start getting some investors. |
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11/14/09 7:31:43 PM#3
Originally posted by Carcer
I am an artist (Currently have my Associates in Graphic Design and working on my BA in Game Art & Design), as well as a writer. A friend and I started working on our own MMO concept awhile ago. Be prepared for YEARS of creation before presenting it to a potential company for creation. If you plan on doing it on your own...I hope you are sickeningly rich and resourceful.
But some of what you need (Not all now, but eventually)... - TONS of paper for concept art, notes, etc. - A good computer animation program ( I am currently using both 3D Max and Maya) Can buy them online, but NOT cheap. Luckily got mine through school. - TONS of free time and patience - Game engine (Just google "Game design engines") and go from there. I wouldn't worry too much about the computer animation stuff right now if your just starting. Focus on a good back story/lore, Game mechanics you want to have and be fairly sure they can work in theory prior to actual testing, weapon/armor/character/environment designs, etc, etc.
Good luck!
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11/14/09 7:34:42 PM#4
Artists and writers are a dime a dozen.... ok well a dime for several dozen. A programmer willing to make the commitment as large as an MMO is pretty rare, without a considerable incentive.... $100k+/yr for a talented one.
Good luck on getting an investor without a product to show them first (which means you need several of those programmers I mentioned above). Because, Artists and Writers are a dime for several dozen........ MMO ideas are worth even less. Very few investors are going to be willing to put down millions of dollars for less than a 50% chance on a return on their money and not only is the return chance low, but most investors don't like waiting 5-8yrs (avg time it takes to make a decent MMO) for a return on their investment. EVEN THEN you're looking at another year after release before the investors will even see a return on their investment, if they have one at all.
You're looking at a market that's new and very volatile. In the next few years, you're going to see less and less of the mid range games (Darkfall, Fallen Earth, etc) and more of the high range (WoW, EQ2, SW:TOR) and more of the low range completely indy games..... and most of those don't really see much profit if any. I think we will be seeing more of the fast production mid range cookie cutter games though, but they won't be worth a crap. Those will be by companies who already have the capital and will just be aiming at making a quick buck. (STO comes to mind) |
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Ramonski7
 Spotlight Poster
Joined: 5/21/03
"A wise man has something to say, but a fool just has to say something." |
11/14/09 7:42:21 PM#5
Originally posted by Carcer
Trust me don't let your passion to create a MMO inflate your head as big as the heart you're showing, because your body won't be able to support them both. Coming up with a concept for an MMO would be vastly more ideal for a team of 2. Coming up with a working demo of your concepts takes light years more time, money and effort than 2 people can muster in a reasonable amount of time.
Trust me take it slow. Ideas rarely go out of style, but the methods/tools used to create "homegrown" MMOs are already outdated by years of advancements.
Come up with lore, character advancement systems, combat systems, leveling systems and any other ideas you have floating around and then after you get everything on harccopy, go out and get a copyright. Then explore venues that you can pitch your idea to. You'll have better luck accomplishing that.
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Valentina
 Hard Core Member
Joined: 5/28/06
They told me I'd never survive, but survive was my middle name. |
11/14/09 7:49:27 PM#6
Well I will start off by saying obviously it will take time for just 2 of you, BUT do not let that get you down, and do not let anyone that may say you're in over your head get you down. There is an MMO coming out next year I believe that was done by 1 man alone, I think the project name is LOVE and it was shown at E3 and other gaming conventions and is quite gorgeous and looks very interesting, so it is definitely possible, it just gets down to how passionate you are about your project.
I would definitely agree with some others here that you need to flesh out your mechanics, story, and all of that good stuff really, really well before you undertake the physical development of the title. Upcoming MMO's are very focused on story-telling and character development far more than games that are out right now so keep that in mind.
With that said, I wish you the best of luck and take your time! Playing: Star Wars: The Old Republic Waiting For: Absolutely Nothing. |
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11/14/09 7:52:25 PM#7
Originally posted by Carcer
The I and E are on the opposite sides of the keyboard........... some typo. :-| |
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11/14/09 7:53:10 PM#8
Originally posted by Ramonski7
Trust me don't let your passion to create a MMO inflate your head as big as the heart you're showing, because your body won't be able to support them both. Coming up with a concept for an MMO would be vastly more ideal for a team of 2. Coming up with a working demo of your concepts takes light years more time, money and effort than 2 people can muster in a reasonable amount of time.
Trust me take it slow. Ideas rarely go out of style, but the methods/tools used to create "homegrown" MMOs are already outdated by years of advancements.
Come up with lore, character advancement systems, combat systems, leveling systems and any other ideas you have floating around and then after you get everything on harccopy, go out and get a copyright. Then explore venues that you can pitch your idea to. You'll have better luck accomplishing that.
We've been working on a Source mod (www.orion-project.com) for around 10 years now and it's much, much smaller scale than an MMO. Granted most mods get completed within 6mo-1yr, but we had to switch engines from 1.6 => Source => Orange Box. Plus, working with volunteers is a time consuming process. I think one of the hardest things for personal-indie developers with virtually no funding is the fact you're working with volunteers and they just cannot dedicate enough time into the project as an actual development team working full-time could. It really slows the process down, even communication at times can almost grind to a hault. Plus the development tools are priced extremely high these days. Get all the fundamentals of your game down, absolutely everything, and start from there. Wish you nothing but the best of luck with the project.
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Originally posted by TheHatter
The I and E are on the opposite sides of the keyboard........... some typo. :-|
Not when you are typing on a black berry, but yes I totally fuck up my I's and E's. |
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11/14/09 8:23:24 PM#10
Originally posted by Carcer
Not when you are typing on a black berry, but yes I totally fuck up my I's and E's.
Yes, I noticed it too, but I let it go to hit the main point of your post...not knit pick it like some live to do. Just ignore him.
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11/14/09 8:27:38 PM#11
At the very least you'll need to familiarize yourself with some kind of scripting or programming language if you don't want to hire a programmer. I don't know of any 2D software engines you can use to make a MMO without modifying it with a complex programming language like C++. You could use Realm Crafter for a 3D engine, but you'll probably still need to know C++ or at least have the ability to write scripts (I never used Realm Crafter so I can't tell you specifically how much you will need to know). If you use Realm Crafter you'll also have to work with 3D models which means your wife will need experience working with 3D models and using a program like 3D Studios Max or Maya. Overall the biggest resource you are going to need is time. For a 2 person project expect at least 8 years working on a MMO for a low quality MMO. Since you don't have any experience, you'll probably want to double that number. I'm aware that MMOs have been made with small groups and there is even one that's been made solo, but the best advice I'd give anyone who plans on making a MMO with 1 or 2 people is DON'T DO IT. It's not worth it unless you have tons of free time for a hobby that will likely never be profitable. The MMOs that have been made by 1 or 2 people are typically from people who have worked jobs programming in the past.
If you want to make something close to a MMO that has the potiental to be profitable, but won't take nearly as much time and experience make a browser based application (especially one that runs via Facebook). Take a look at any of the facebook games by Zynga for any idea.  |
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11/14/09 8:55:10 PM#12
<blockquote><i>Originally posted by Goatgod76</i> <br /> |
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11/14/09 8:57:36 PM#13
Originally posted by Goatgod76
Not when you are typing on a black berry, but yes I totally fuck up my I's and E's.
Yes, I noticed it too, but I let it go to hit the main point of your post...not knit pick it like some live to do. Just ignore him. Well, at lest in my first post I wasn't trying to give him some false hope, like so many others have done in this thread. With the skills he posted, a MMO isn't even in the vicinity of reality. Meh, even saying that's being conservative. If making an MMO was a tangible object and each person had their own.... his would be sitting somewhere buried on Neptune. With those skills, you're looking at 10+yrs before the hope of it coming to reality is even within site, much less within arms length. A P&P RPG is alot more realistic. A friend just had his GI Joe P&P RPG published after 4yrs of talks getting the licensing from Hasbro and Wizards of the Coast
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11/14/09 9:19:10 PM#14
You don't NEED money. But you do need man-power or at least a lot of free time. The MMO LOVE that's now in alpha testing was made by one man. The money people keep mentioning is for things like hiring people and marketing and everything. You just need the right programs, the right drive, and a heck of a lot of free-time. Now for game engines that support 2-d, there aren't a ton that I know of. I can do some research for you though. Gimme a bit. |
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I'm surprised your nickname isn't the Hater, I hope you don't talk to people like this in real life. Luckly years of good money decisions and building long turm friendships through kindness and respect has left me with all the resources needed to make this happen. I got all the advise I need for now, found the engine I am going to use and put out employee searches for 100k+/y programmers. I will be back in a few years with beta opertunties. Goodbye for now. |
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11/14/09 9:31:45 PM#16
Originally posted by Carcer
Not trying to flame you man, I'm just being real. If you had what you said you have, then you wouldn't need to be coming here for advice on the subject. You would have contacts that could give you better advice than anyone here and you would be attempting to talk to people who are in some sort of gaming industry. There is a reality and there is a dream world. You're not the first one to come here saying that you have an idea and you have some skills and you want to make an MMO.... and that you'll be back in a few years. I know it seems like a flame, but it's not. I'm simply trying to be real. |
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11/14/09 9:50:35 PM#17
Originally posted by TheHatter
Not trying to flame you man, I'm just being real. If you had what you said you have, then you wouldn't need to be coming here for advice on the subject. You would have contacts that could give you better advice than anyone here and you would be attempting to talk to people who are in some sort of gaming industry. There is a reality and there is a dream world. You're not the first one to come here saying that you have an idea and you have some skills and you want to make an MMO.... and that you'll be back in a few years. I know it seems like a flame, but it's not. I'm simply trying to be real. Yup. I think risking your own money is not the best idea either. |
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11/14/09 9:55:36 PM#18
i heard that one of the best game engines just became free.
cant say i know anything but i just heard someone say it good luck to you and hope this helps |
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11/14/09 10:33:36 PM#19
If you don't know where to start you aren't ready to start your own team. As a matter of scale you aren't even ready enough to be on a basic multiplayer team. |
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11/14/09 10:34:20 PM#20
Originally posted by Carcer
There's a list of 2d mmorpg engines here: Several are free, but I'm not sure about the turn based combat.
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11/14/09 10:36:30 PM#21
i would seriously recommend using unreal engine and do a little demo before you waste more money, you can use the engien free unless you publish your product but for a little demo or just playing around its perfect. Also i don't wanna burst your bubble but if your dishing out money in a matter of a day like this are you sure you wanna do this? i mean even i sometimes i get really hyped for things but this is serious business and a bad mmo is literally gonna make you bankrupt. |
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11/14/09 10:38:48 PM#22
You could use something like NWN2 and create a pw, which is very similar to an MMO, much less time consuming as well. It's perfect for what your planning on doing, though unless you can model and texture you will not be able to use original art, the option is there though. Just a suggestion. For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson If I respond to you I don't find you to be a yes man or grumpy smurf. |
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11/14/09 11:00:58 PM#23
Originally posted by Gabby-air
The original post indicates he is making a 2d game. It's not expensive, or that hard.
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11/14/09 11:18:28 PM#24
Originally posted by Ihmotepp
Ooh guess i didn't read the update, just out of curiosity though can a person with literally no experience in this kind of stuff make a proper 2d game if they try? i've messed around with torque engine a bit to see how things are done and stuff but that was kind of too complicated and i heard somewhere 2d game engines is more of a put the puzzle together kinda thing so might give that a shot if it really is. |
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11/14/09 11:25:57 PM#25
Originally posted by Gabby-air
Ooh guess i didn't read the update, just out of curiosity though can a person with literally no experience in this kind of stuff make a proper 2d game if they try? i've messed around with torque engine a bit to see how things are done and stuff but that was kind of too complicated and i heard somewhere 2d game engines is more of a put the puzzle together kinda thing so might give that a shot if it really is.
Yes: http://mmorpgmaker.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=8201
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