Originally posted by SignusM

Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by SignusM

Second, if you want solo playing, don't play an MMORPG?

 

Direct him to a SPRPG with a persistant world, the ability to interact with massive amount of players in one area or take part in PvP.

It's called a single player game with a chat room built in. Try Oblivion. 

 

This game does not have a persistant world, because persistant worlds are not instanced. You will never see massive amounts of people because instances don't allow everyone in the same instance. 

PvP means absolutely nothing if its boxed into its own little FPS server zone with no impact on the actual game world. 

Oblivion has a chat room? I can play with friends? The game is always evolving? Can I PvP?

Please don't tell somebody to play single player game because they refuse to group with morons like yourself.

Originally posted by SignusM

Second, if you want solo playing, don't play an MMORPG?

If you want to play a group game, go play team fortress or call of duty muliplayer. See these types of arguments can go on and on becuase I'm sure you or someone else will counter what I just wrote, then either I or someone else will counter your counter.

Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by SignusM

Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by SignusM

Second, if you want solo playing, don't play an MMORPG?

 

Direct him to a SPRPG with a persistant world, the ability to interact with massive amount of players in one area or take part in PvP.

It's called a single player game with a chat room built in. Try Oblivion. 

 

This game does not have a persistant world, because persistant worlds are not instanced. You will never see massive amounts of people because instances don't allow everyone in the same instance. 

PvP means absolutely nothing if its boxed into its own little FPS server zone with no impact on the actual game world. 

Oblivion has a chat room? I can play with friends? The game is always evolving? Can I PvP?

Please don't tell somebody to play single player game because they refuse to group with morons like yourself.

I don't think you understand what a persistant world is. This game will not have one. You will not be able to play with all your friends. You will not be interaction with thousands of people, you will be in an instance. They have made that game already, its called Kotor. Adding a tiny little shard where you can play in some mock PvP does not make it an MMO. 

Originally posted by SignusM

Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by SignusM

Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by SignusM

Second, if you want solo playing, don't play an MMORPG?

 

Direct him to a SPRPG with a persistant world, the ability to interact with massive amount of players in one area or take part in PvP.

It's called a single player game with a chat room built in. Try Oblivion. 

 

This game does not have a persistant world, because persistant worlds are not instanced. You will never see massive amounts of people because instances don't allow everyone in the same instance. 

PvP means absolutely nothing if its boxed into its own little FPS server zone with no impact on the actual game world. 

Oblivion has a chat room? I can play with friends? The game is always evolving? Can I PvP?

Please don't tell somebody to play single player game because they refuse to group with morons like yourself.

I don't think you understand what a persistant world is. This game will not have one. You will not be able to play with all your friends. You will not be interaction with thousands of people, you will be in an instance. They have made that game already, its called Kotor. Adding a tiny little shard where you can play in some mock PvP does not make it an MMO. 

That is your view of persistent world.  That is not the only way of seeing things.

Persistent world or not, I usually interact with 100 or so people, half of them friends.  That is more than enough for me to keep myself very busy.  Another 20,000?  What the hell am I going to do with them?  Send a tell to each and consume my 4 hours online?

When I do a raid, or fight a boss, I will be mainly working with my team.  Even in EQ, we usually compromised so that the other team do not cross into our zone of pull.  What the hell does it matter if they are in another instance instead of hiding in their part of the zone?  Technically, they only matter if they train their mobs thru our camp.  Frankly that is not good interaction.

Persistent world to me, TO ME, is a world in which my past acts and achievement stays with me next time I log on.  Diablo 2 is persistent enough for me, if the world outside is fun.  Solo or group.  GW is fun b/c of the very short and smooth ride to 20 then great arena fights (at that point in time).  SWG is fun b/c when I log on, I have the friends I know, the houses to visit and buy guns, the mission computer to grab some boring BH quests, and good PVP once in a while ....

I do not feel the need to confine myself to certain gamestyle.  I do not need play only specific forms of openworld pvp or sandbox game, just for the sake of it.  Solo or group alone is not the criteria, gameplay is.  If the game is fun, I play.  Hack, I dearly cherish the days I play MMOs alone on my IBM XT using floppy disks.  Might and Magic, SirTech RPGs, Ultima series, and Arena ... why do I bother if the game is solo or open world or whatever?  If the game sucks it sucks, vice vera.

Just hope ToR will be good.

Originally posted by chrisel

I am very happy that it seems this game will offer alot of solo content. People are comparing every game to World of  Warcraft, and this will be no different; One of the major things that made WoW so popular, is that it has massive amount of solo content to offer.

 

Every MMO today has "some" ambitions to be popular, and today, I swear, that this is impossible unless solo content is offered both before and at end level.

 

So, finally I have a new sci-fi game to wait for, after the failure of Fallen Earth!

Don't make me cringe. WoW is one of the worst games in existence. Its MMO's light. I played that game for 3 weeks and I will never torture myself like that again.

This game will be better than WoW, though maybe not for the WoWified.

I dont mind solo play for mmo, sometimes i would like to solo depends on my mood etc...

But for the sake of everything that's blue! STOP cutting the xp by half or more when you group! STOP!!!

Originally posted by tkreep

idiot, that instant revive was a developer command,

Nice way to start a post - with name-calling. Very mature.

players wouldnt be able to do that.

Your proof of that is...?

Originally posted by Comnitus

For all the people wondering about PvP:

Don't worry, Bioware has Mythic helping them now. If you're a troll, you'll think I'm being sarcastic. If you want this game to succeed, you'll see this as a good thing.

To the OP, it seems like (at least lately) around here, the biggest sin you could commit is mention "solo" or "group". Before you know it, Ihmotepp and the gang will roll in here proclaiming how there needs to be more (ahem) "Games with Challenging Group Content Throughout the Game, Not Just At the End!", not these (ahem) "dumbed down solo pieces of crap a monkey could play".

Defiently a good thing but the thought of pvp with light sabers and lazer guns makes me shudder...lol. Once again, Star Wars will only really hold the avid fans, no matter how good the pve/pvp is. I truly do hope Bioware is good to you all though because this will likely be the only star wars MMO for many many years.

Turbine ruined my hopes of a good LOTR MMO. :-(    Bioware better deliver or they'll have a whole lot of Star Wars nerdrage!!

heheh, I never said Darkfall was a good mmo.. just pointing out that Darkfall was intentionally designed for pure pvp content.  Plenty of other game developers have tried to force a round peg into a square hole.. like WAR and AoC.. WAR was fun when it had tons of people battling over keeps.. but as soon as the short attention spans of most players died off, it got really stale and AoC just sucked from the get go.

I think what most casual players dislike about pvp in mmorpgs, is they dislike they're one or two hours of gameplay to be dictated to them by other players who are serious about group hunting in a an open world.   Mmo's don't always do a good job of it, so the FPS type games (I think) do a  better job, cause you don't log into Call of Duty thinking you're gonna solo a bunch of npcs.

Kind of the same arguement about forced groupage in pve content.  Someone mentioned FFXI.  I played that game for about 3 months, but I finally game up on it, cause it got boring waiting around for 2 or 3 hours to form a group that disbanded after 30 mins, becuase it was like 5 in the morning.

Personally, I like being in a mature guild, I like a splash of raiding and good group missions.  But I need tons of solo missions, because I play weird hours, not because I don't like to group.  As long as the group stuff isn't so intense that you need "class A" and only "Class A" to succeed, then I'm cool with mmo group content.  A good balance of the classes can solve all that.

Having said all of that, I've sort of givin up on mmo"pvp".  I would be completely content if TOR had only dueling.  If I want to pvp, I can always just boot up the 360 and pwn some tard in 6 or 7 different FPS games I don't have ot pay to play.  Plus mmo"pvp" always and I mean always, is so imbalanced between the class arch types.  (ergo, tank vs healing vs dps is a jugglying act that the devs never get right and often cause both pvp'ers and pve'ers to leave the game)

And as for instancing missions, that doesn't mean the whole world is not expansive or persistant.  For the WOW fans out there, they have private instancing in a decent sized world.  Instancing missions just means the specific quest objectives are stand alone, so you don't have to cue with other parties to finish them, or fight over some slow spawning boss.  I don't think Bioware is going to make the mistake Turbine made with DDO, eventhough they did eventually add some open area stuff.

Besides, this whole arguement about solo vs group vs pvp is kinda mute and premature at this point.  Bioware isn't going to change they're mind this late in the game, and it hasn't been released so we don't know how good or bad the group issue is going to be.

Originally posted by Moirae

Originally posted by chrisel

I am very happy that it seems this game will offer alot of solo content. People are comparing every game to World of  Warcraft, and this will be no different; One of the major things that made WoW so popular, is that it has massive amount of solo content to offer.

 

Every MMO today has "some" ambitions to be popular, and today, I swear, that this is impossible unless solo content is offered both before and at end level.

 

So, finally I have a new sci-fi game to wait for, after the failure of Fallen Earth!

 

Don't make me cringe. WoW is one of the worst games in existence. Its MMO's light. I played that game for 3 weeks and I will never torture myself like that again.

 

This game will be better than WoW, though maybe not for the WoWified.

You're right, WoW is HORRIBLE, because it is a simplified, no risk, solo focused, half assed MMO.
 

This game is looking to be just the same. 

The rule of MMOs is, if you make soloing MORE viable and easier than grouping, people will not group, and the only socializing you will do, will be with people you already knew before you bought the game, which is not how MMOs are supposed to be at all.

That, and add in the fact that the world is broken up into a series of instanced hubs with maybe an instanced PvP zone to give people the illusion of PvP, is setting this up to be a super casual fake MMO that people will hail as the next Jesus.

Originally posted by SignusM

Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by SignusM

Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by SignusM

Second, if you want solo playing, don't play an MMORPG?

 

Direct him to a SPRPG with a persistant world, the ability to interact with massive amount of players in one area or take part in PvP.

It's called a single player game with a chat room built in. Try Oblivion. 

 

This game does not have a persistant world, because persistant worlds are not instanced. You will never see massive amounts of people because instances don't allow everyone in the same instance. 

PvP means absolutely nothing if its boxed into its own little FPS server zone with no impact on the actual game world. 

Oblivion has a chat room? I can play with friends? The game is always evolving? Can I PvP?

Please don't tell somebody to play single player game because they refuse to group with morons like yourself.

I don't think you understand what a persistant world is. This game will not have one. You will not be able to play with all your friends. You will not be interaction with thousands of people, you will be in an instance. They have made that game already, its called Kotor. Adding a tiny little shard where you can play in some mock PvP does not make it an MMO. 

cute, it's actually you who does not understand. Keep thinking that cupcake.

I'm glad you have ANOTHER solo orientated game. Genuinely i am. I just hate when soloists come to the very few games that are group orientated and bitch that theres not enough solo content

Sorry to bust in the fun little banter you've got going here.  I happen to be in the camp that absolutely prefers grouping over soloing and firmly believes that the solo questline-based progression system is what is killing MMOs (for me obviously, a lot of you seem to like them ).

That said, I will absolutely be playing this game.  Bioware has never made a bad game in my estimation, and TOR will be a good game.  Yes, it will probably be fairly heavily instanced (sp?) and very solo friendly, both of which are things I really don't care for.  It probably won't be the MMO I pick up and play for years.  But the storyline will be good and the gameplay will be fun.  For all of you out there who are little suspicious of the game (and granted, it could be two years so it's almost not worth speculating), just think of it as a Bioware roleplaying game that you can play with friends if you want.  If that's all it ends up being, it will be worth every penny.

That's my take at any rate.

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Originally posted by MMO_Doubter

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Originally posted by tkreep

idiot, that instant revive was a developer command,
Nice way to start a post - with name-calling. Very mature.
players wouldnt be able to do that.

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Your proof of that is...?

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A brain. With eyes attached to it.

I am also quite happy with the supposed focus on solo activity above indirect forced group play. As someone already pointed out, I much prefer to play whenever I feel like it and not be forced to wait or group with others. This is how I have played both SWG, FlyFF and now Aion.

But this does certainly not mean I could just as well be playing a standard RPG. I really liked KoTOR and to have the same gameplay in a world with thousands of other player would, for lack of a better word, be epic. I really enjoy the atmosphere of a living, vibrant game that is all MMOs (even FlyFF lol). I will probably not group with you, but I will chat with you and craft stuff for you and buy stuff you have looted.

My only real concern is about longevity. I played SGW for 6 months, FlyFF for 1½ year and will probably not be playing Aion for more than 6 months. And I fear that TOR will not be deep enough to keep me more than 3-6 months. If memory serve me, BioWare as hinted that people can just create a new character to get more concent e.g. a new personal story. I think this could be the achilles heel of TOR: people will pick a class and stick with it. If MY story as a Sith is epic then I am probably not going to make a Jedi and practically work against myself.

But will shall see :)

Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by Vagrant_Zero

 

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Originally posted by Anubisan

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Originally posted by greed0104

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Originally posted by Palebane

 

I'm not against solo play. I admit I actually enjoy it sometimes, but I'm not going to pay $15/month to solo in a multiplayer game. There are better games out there I can play without a subscription. But as far as a sci-fi RPG goes, yeah it should be pretty cool.

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Xfire: WoW hours this week: 21. What?
 

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Just because he plays WoW that means he likes to Solo? Sometimes I wonder if people have even actually played WoW.
The entire end-game consists of raids and other instances which ALL require GROUPs.

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Except 1-80 is pretty much an entirely solo experience. Azeroth is almost completely barren of people.

So I have to ask, have YOU actually played WoW?

Fix'd

But you're right. Really people can say what they want, but.....in WoW, anything you can do grouped I can do solo. Even end game is soloable in a certain way.

"Like these epic shoulders you waited to drop in Naxx?  ty AH."

 

I mostly run dungeons with groups. Right now I'm playing a rogue who just got to level 20. I group alot. I don't like end-game raiding. I like to meet people and be social. And soloing in a MMORPG is a waste of money in my opinion because there are better single player experiences to be had in SPRPGs, even if they aren't the same to you. Most players might as well just be NPCs if you aren't going to engage the community at some point.
 

Originally posted by Palebane

I mostly run dungeons with groups. Right now I'm playing a rogue who just got to level 20. I group alot. I don't like end-game raiding. I like to meet people and be social. And soloing in a MMORPG is a waste of money in my opinion because there are better single player experiences to be had in SPRPGs, even if they aren't the same to you. Most players might as well just be NPCs if you aren't going to engage the community at some point.
 

What a silly veiw you have. Why assume solo play never involves engaging the community? Are you to assume all solo players are virtual hermits never to speak a word to anybody?I can inform you now that you're dead wrong. And apparentlly MMOs and SPRGS differ to more people then just myself considering the support for solo play.

I don't like end-game raiding to much either, but then again my last five years of experience with it were in WoW. Which was a repeating borefest, maybe that's part of the reason there are so many solo players now. Random encounters/events and no more long hours of being stuck in a instance would probably make it more enjoyable for myself. But if they made grouping fun and worthwhile what would all the groupers have to cry about, "x-solo players are now grouping and getting gear, that's unfair because we are the "true" hardcore groupers." I'm being sarcastic, or am I? 

We still do not know enough about the game. People on this forum are making way too many assumptions......

(AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH fires plungers at Lando Calrissian)

Originally posted by Bribone

Ya, it probably should have been a solo game to begin with.

I agree with the Lord Humungous.

Originally posted by GazMc

I'm glad you have ANOTHER solo orientated game. Genuinely i am. I just hate when soloists come to the very few games that are group orientated and bitch that theres not enough solo content

 Same here. In AION people complain theres not much group stuff in the early levels and then they turn around and complain thats theres too much near end-game. Others can't stand the "grind" and then complain thats WoWs too easy...I mean seriously folks? LOL

Its very hard to please MMO gamers these days. Their expectations are way too high so they play MMOs looking for problems and then bitch and whine trying ruin it for others because the MMO isnt good enough for them. This genre truly has turned out pretty bad. Everyone wants the "perfect" MMO resembling games like Oblivion or Dragon Age but they don't realize its not going to happen in our time.... Live and learn I guess lol

 I personally don't care if it is PvE or PvP focused. The point for me is that it is a Star Wars MMO.... and not just any Star Wars MMO but one made by Bioware! As has been said I have high hopes for Bioware even while being slightly scared because this is their first MMO. 

I do hope that it contains a lot of Solo content because of my work schedule and this annoying thing called "Life" and even more annoying... "Wife". These factors make it hard to play any group focused game. I just never know when I may be able to get on or for how long. Thats not to say that I don't want any group content in there cause there should be group content. It may not be for me but I am a kind hearted individual that not only wants myself to be happy, but also my fellow MMO gamers.

Originally posted by illanadan

 I personally don't care if it is PvE or PvP focused. The point for me is that it is a Star Wars MMO.... and not just any Star Wars MMO but one made by Bioware! As has been said I have high hopes for Bioware even while being slightly scared because this is their first MMO. 

I do hope that it contains a lot of Solo content because of my work schedule and this annoying thing called "Life" and even more annoying... "Wife". These factors make it hard to play any group focused game. I just never know when I may be able to get on or for how long. Thats not to say that I don't want any group content in there cause there should be group content. It may not be for me but I am a kind hearted individual that not only wants myself to be happy, but also my fellow MMO gamers.

That is very kind and generous.

Life + wife = strife.

Originally posted by Vallanor

Sorry to bust in the fun little banter you've got going here.  I happen to be in the camp that absolutely prefers grouping over soloing and firmly believes that the solo questline-based progression system is what is killing MMOs

MMO's are not being killed off because of solo questline-based progression. In fact it's the opposite. How many MMO's have launched since EQ? In Asia and the U.S. ? WoW (No I dont like WoW) brought accessability to the common gamer, thus PART of the formula for it's success. It's a growing trend and developers are figuring out ways to allow ALL playstyles to get their $15 a month worth. You cant have big sub numbers with group heavy content. At the same time, there has to be some group content to appeal to those types. But if newer games 100% exclude a playstyle completely from seeing all the content, it will turn around bite them in the ass in the long run. It can be done through scaling "dungeons", but some people have already voiced against that idea because they feel only groupers should be allowed to see everything in the game. When talking money, what all big businesses want, exclusion doesn't make good business sense.

Originally posted by illanadan

 I personally don't care if it is PvE or PvP focused. The point for me is that it is a Star Wars MMO.... and not just any Star Wars MMO but one made by Bioware! As has been said I have high hopes for Bioware even while being slightly scared because this is their first MMO. 

I do hope that it contains a lot of Solo content because of my work schedule and this annoying thing called "Life" and even more annoying... "Wife". These factors make it hard to play any group focused game. I just never know when I may be able to get on or for how long. Thats not to say that I don't want any group content in there cause there should be group content. It may not be for me but I am a kind hearted individual that not only wants myself to be happy, but also my fellow MMO gamers.

Hubby and I have been playing Dragon Age Origins, and Mass Effect for the last couple of weeks. I've already played KOTOR I and II and I have to say that Bioware is one of THE best, if not THE best, game developers I've ever seen. Its been hard to go to bed at night lol.

It matters to me if its PvE or PvP focused because I don't like the attitude that PvP brings out in people. If it were friendly competition, it would be one thing, but the reality is that its entirely another where most players get their jollies out of screwing other people over.

I completely agree about having solo content, but I am "the wife" in my house lol. I prefer solo content because I don't like being forced to do something because the group is doing it. I like being able to wander off whenever I feel like to go do something. I do group occasionally, but rarely. Usually only to accomplish a specific task for a short time. I also don't like this trend with ventrillo because I like the anonymity of the internet and ventrillo makes it too personal. I like it when people don't know if I'm a guy or a girl because they usually act respectful when they don't know. Incidentally and for the record, I'm a girl.

I like belonging to a guild and the like, I just don't like being forced to go here or there just because the group wants to go.

Originally posted by Moirae

Originally posted by illanadan

 I personally don't care if it is PvE or PvP focused. The point for me is that it is a Star Wars MMO.... and not just any Star Wars MMO but one made by Bioware! As has been said I have high hopes for Bioware even while being slightly scared because this is their first MMO. 

I do hope that it contains a lot of Solo content because of my work schedule and this annoying thing called "Life" and even more annoying... "Wife". These factors make it hard to play any group focused game. I just never know when I may be able to get on or for how long. Thats not to say that I don't want any group content in there cause there should be group content. It may not be for me but I am a kind hearted individual that not only wants myself to be happy, but also my fellow MMO gamers.

 

Hubby and I have been playing Dragon Age Origins, and Mass Effect for the last couple of weeks. I've already played KOTOR I and II and I have to say that Bioware is one of THE best, if not THE best, game developers I've ever seen. Its been hard to go to bed at night lol.

 

It matters to me if its PvE or PvP focused because I don't like the attitude that PvP brings out in people. If it were friendly competition, it would be one thing, but the reality is that its entirely another where most players get their jollies out of screwing other people over.

 

I completely agree about having solo content, but I am "the wife" in my house lol. I prefer solo content because I don't like being forced to do something because the group is doing it. I like being able to wander off whenever I feel like to go do something. I do group occasionally, but rarely. Usually only to accomplish a specific task for a short time. I also don't like this trend with ventrillo because I like the anonymity of the internet and ventrillo makes it too personal. I like it when people don't know if I'm a guy or a girl because they usually act respectful when they don't know. Incidentally and for the record, I'm a girl.

 

I like belonging to a guild and the like, I just don't like being forced to go here or there just because the group wants to go.

Ditto to both of you. MMOs aren't being killed because of the solo content. If anything, solo content has opened up the MMO business to a much broader audience than it ever had.I have yet to play one that DIDN'T allow folks to group, so all the bellyaching by the groupies is just that. They can form their own guilds and go kill each other for hours upon hours while those of us who don't get their jollies off on fighting over loot and kills can do something else.