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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Chinese company bans opposite gender playing

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296 posts found
  ozerinx

Novice Member

Joined: 4/03/08
Posts: 201

10/28/09 2:02:41 PM#121
Originally posted by Toquio3
Originally posted by ozerinx
Originally posted by Toquio3
Originally posted by Brixon

There seems to be a lot of homophobia going on with the people who have a problem with people playing a character of the opposite gender. It's no ones business how people want to play the game, but the person playing the game.

Another disturbing trend in this post is the willingness of some people to give China a pass on it's long history of denying human rights and freedom to it's people. It's real easy for people who have never lived in tyranny, to underestimate the blessings of their own liberty.

 

THANK YOU!

 

I am going to assume you both lived in China and therefore are saying that it sucks?

I've lived there for 2 years and I thought it was great. Most the students I met there and people

that I know in US that were from China can't wait to finish college and go back. We may view communism as tyranny

but who cares if the people there don't really care.

Yes, in news your going to see extremist like tibet monks etc that hate their country but you have those type of people

in every country.

 

Except in civilized countries, those peaceful "extremists" dont get shot by the police, and political refugees are not sent back to their country of origin to face consequences for leaving.. and calling people who just want freedom extremists is pretty extreme.

 

Please learn to read news from all sources instead of just media. The Tibetan monks were attacking other civilians before they got shot. If there were "protest" like that in the US, force would be used in the States as well. There were a video that you obviously did not see where a random Chinese civilians got beat by a group of Tibetan monks and drag across the floor. Also, regarding that incident you do know why the monks protested? They wanted China to pass a law in the Tibetan area only Monks are allowed to be educated. They also want to be self governed. So let me ask you, if Californians all got together and protested to be separated and become independent of United States, would military force be used?

  someforumguy

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/25/07
Posts: 3504

10/28/09 2:03:26 PM#122
Originally posted by Daedalus732
Originally posted by Brixon

There seems to be a lot of homophobia going on with the people who have a problem with people playing a character of the opposite gender. It's no ones business how people want to play the game, but the person playing the game.

Another disturbing trend in this post is the willingness of some people to give China a pass on it's long history of denying human rights and freedom to it's people. It's real easy for people who have never lived in tyranny, to underestimate the blessings of their own liberty.

 

I don't think it's homophobia or a problem with sexual orientation, but rather a problem with gender bending. The two can sometimes be related, but in this case, the focus is on gender, not sexual orientation.

Unless I read the OP wrong, this is a private company, not the government, setting up this requirement.

Also, I don't think this qualifies as a human rights violation. Plenty of private companies levy restrictions on their employees private lives, even in the U.S., and no one complains because most people agree that a private company has the right to decide such things.

Given that we're talking about a game restriction, I think it's a little insulting to put this in the same category as, say, the crackdown on protesters in the post-Iranian election period.

This has nothing to do with human rights violation, no. Its just a cowardly rule of a private company. And the ppl who think its creepy that a guy is playing a female character, without actually being able to explain why they think that, need their heads examined.

I dont care what kind of phobia we should officially call it, but it is the kind of phobia that I like to call 'if i want to play a fem character as male, i play a fem character! mind your bloody own business already'-phobia :p

  Caleveira

Novice Member

Joined: 9/13/09
Posts: 563

10/28/09 2:05:36 PM#123

That Chinas policy toward its own subjects is violatory of human rights and liberties is undisputed fact. Evidence may be derived from the work of NGOs like Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch, the different conventions derived from the Universal Declaration of Human Rights (to which the Peoples Republic of China is signatory) and their working bodies at the UN. Documentation by the US State Department as well as American Congressional comissions, not to mention similar works by most western nation states. Well publicized incidents in the media as well as investigative journalism by reputed sources such as Le Monde or the BBC.

Its only been two decades since the worst of the repression demonstrated by the Chinese government against the protestors in Tiananmen square, and the ongoing mistreatment of Tibetan and Uighur minorities were the subject of international attention in the past few months.

Anyone disputing that China does not pursue oppressive and dictatorial tactics against its own citizens is either uninformed or outright pursuing a personal agenda.

Just to make things clear...
I speak for myself and no one else, unless i state otherwise mine is just an opinion. A fact is something that can be independently verified, you may challenge such but with proof. You have every right to disagree with me through sound argument, i believe in constructive debate, but baseless aggression will warrant an unkind response.

  Brixon

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/01/04
Posts: 255

10/28/09 2:05:59 PM#124
Originally posted by Daedalus732
Originally posted by Brixon

There seems to be a lot of homophobia going on with the people who have a problem with people playing a character of the opposite gender. It's no ones business how people want to play the game, but the person playing the game.

Another disturbing trend in this post is the willingness of some people to give China a pass on it's long history of denying human rights and freedom to it's people. It's real easy for people who have never lived in tyranny, to underestimate the blessings of their own liberty.

 

I don't think it's homophobia or a problem with sexual orientation, but rather a problem with gender bending. The two can sometimes be related, but in this case, the focus is on gender, not sexual orientation.

Unless I read the OP wrong, this is a private company, not the government, setting up this requirement.

Also, I don't think this qualifies as a human rights violation. Plenty of private companies levy restrictions on their employees private lives, even in the U.S., and no one complains because most people agree that a private company has the right to decide such things.

Given that we're talking about a game restriction, I think it's a little insulting to put this in the same category as, say, the crackdown on protesters in the post-Iranian election period.

Problems with gender bending seem a liltte homophobic to me.

Would this "private company" be doing this if was anywhere else but China?
 

  rothbard

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/20/09
Posts: 251

10/28/09 2:06:10 PM#125
Originally posted by Toquio3

Except in civilized countries, those peaceful "extremists [tibetans(sp?)]" dont get shot by the police

Lol, YES THEY WOULD!  The people of tibet basically want to be left alone right, and govern themselves the way they see fit?  Try secession against your friendly "civilized" rulers, and you will quickly find out that they are no different then the eastern big red scare.

  ozerinx

Novice Member

Joined: 4/03/08
Posts: 201

10/28/09 2:10:12 PM#126
Originally posted by Caleveira

That Chinas policy toward its own subjects is violatory of human rights and liberties is undisputed fact. Evidence may be derived from the work of NGOs like Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch, the different conventions derived from the Universal Declaration of Human Rights (to which the Peoples Republic of China is signatory) and their working bodies at the UN. Documentation by the US State Department as well as American Congressional comissions, not to mention similar works by most western nation states. Well publicized incidents in the media as well as investigative journalism by reputed sources such as Le Monde or the BBC.

Its only been two decades since the worst of the repression demonstrated by the Chinese government against the protestors in Tiananmen square, and the ongoing mistreatment of Tibetan and Uighur minorities were the subject of international attention in the past few months.

Anyone disputing that China does not pursue oppressive and dictatorial tactics against its own citizens is either uninformed or outright pursuing a personal agenda.

 

.....No one is saying they are not oppressive or dictatorial. It is a communist government what do you expect? Personally, I don't think the UN should've let China join just because the difference in government and beliefs of the people are too different. Instead of focusing on China if the Human Rights Watch actually do their jobs, there is probably a handful of third world countries causing genocides in Africa right now.

  someforumguy

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/25/07
Posts: 3504

10/28/09 2:10:23 PM#127

Stop turning this into some silly internet politics debate already. Its about a private company's policy.

  dterry

Novice Member

Joined: 1/03/07
Posts: 457

"Inanimate objects must pay for their insolence"

10/28/09 2:12:06 PM#128
Originally posted by ozerinx
Originally posted by Toquio3
Originally posted by ozerinx
Originally posted by Toquio3
Originally posted by Brixon

There seems to be a lot of homophobia going on with the people who have a problem with people playing a character of the opposite gender. It's no ones business how people want to play the game, but the person playing the game.

Another disturbing trend in this post is the willingness of some people to give China a pass on it's long history of denying human rights and freedom to it's people. It's real easy for people who have never lived in tyranny, to underestimate the blessings of their own liberty.

 

THANK YOU!

 

I am going to assume you both lived in China and therefore are saying that it sucks?

I've lived there for 2 years and I thought it was great. Most the students I met there and people

that I know in US that were from China can't wait to finish college and go back. We may view communism as tyranny

but who cares if the people there don't really care.

Yes, in news your going to see extremist like tibet monks etc that hate their country but you have those type of people

in every country.

 

Except in civilized countries, those peaceful "extremists" dont get shot by the police, and political refugees are not sent back to their country of origin to face consequences for leaving.. and calling people who just want freedom extremists is pretty extreme.

 

Please learn to read news from all sources instead of just media. The Tibetan monks were attacking other civilians before they got shot. If there were "protest" like that in the US, force would be used in the States as well. There were a video that you obviously did not see where a random Chinese civilians got beat by a group of Tibetan monks and drag across the floor. Also, regarding that incident you do know why the monks protested? They wanted China to pass a law in the Tibetan area only Monks are allowed to be educated. They also want to be self governed. So let me ask you, if Californians all got together and protested to be separated and become independent of United States, would military force be used?

Hmmm.... wasn't Tibet annexed by force by China?

dave1972 Xfire Miniprofile
  rothbard

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/20/09
Posts: 251

10/28/09 2:12:36 PM#129
Originally posted by Brixon
Originally posted by Daedalus732
Originally posted by Brixon

There seems to be a lot of homophobia going on with the people who have a problem with people playing a character of the opposite gender. It's no ones business how people want to play the game, but the person playing the game.

Another disturbing trend in this post is the willingness of some people to give China a pass on it's long history of denying human rights and freedom to it's people. It's real easy for people who have never lived in tyranny, to underestimate the blessings of their own liberty.

 

I don't think it's homophobia or a problem with sexual orientation, but rather a problem with gender bending. The two can sometimes be related, but in this case, the focus is on gender, not sexual orientation.

Unless I read the OP wrong, this is a private company, not the government, setting up this requirement.

Also, I don't think this qualifies as a human rights violation. Plenty of private companies levy restrictions on their employees private lives, even in the U.S., and no one complains because most people agree that a private company has the right to decide such things.

Given that we're talking about a game restriction, I think it's a little insulting to put this in the same category as, say, the crackdown on protesters in the post-Iranian election period.

Problems with gender bending seem a liltte homophobic to me.

Would this "private company" be doing this if was anywhere else but China?
 

Why the scare quotes on "private company"?  As far as location, who cares?  Are you saying they would be prevented by force from doing this in another country?  If so, isn't that an argument that there is MORE freedom in China versus less?

  ozerinx

Novice Member

Joined: 4/03/08
Posts: 201

10/28/09 2:14:13 PM#130
Originally posted by Brixon
Originally posted by Daedalus732
Originally posted by Brixon

There seems to be a lot of homophobia going on with the people who have a problem with people playing a character of the opposite gender. It's no ones business how people want to play the game, but the person playing the game.

Another disturbing trend in this post is the willingness of some people to give China a pass on it's long history of denying human rights and freedom to it's people. It's real easy for people who have never lived in tyranny, to underestimate the blessings of their own liberty.

 

I don't think it's homophobia or a problem with sexual orientation, but rather a problem with gender bending. The two can sometimes be related, but in this case, the focus is on gender, not sexual orientation.

Unless I read the OP wrong, this is a private company, not the government, setting up this requirement.

Also, I don't think this qualifies as a human rights violation. Plenty of private companies levy restrictions on their employees private lives, even in the U.S., and no one complains because most people agree that a private company has the right to decide such things.

Given that we're talking about a game restriction, I think it's a little insulting to put this in the same category as, say, the crackdown on protesters in the post-Iranian election period.

Problems with gender bending seem a liltte homophobic to me.

Would this "private company" be doing this if was anywhere else but China?
 

 

I personally think the Aurora company would do this regardless since I've been actually reading forums and blogs of the beta. The change was asked by the players due to a imbalance in games. What is it exactly I don't know it is 10-15 pages of QQ and troll that I don't want to read.

  Toquio3

Novice Member

Joined: 7/02/09
Posts: 1105

"Excellent breeze... Great day for cards."

10/28/09 2:16:03 PM#131
Originally posted by rothbard
Originally posted by Brixon
Originally posted by Daedalus732
Originally posted by Brixon

There seems to be a lot of homophobia going on with the people who have a problem with people playing a character of the opposite gender. It's no ones business how people want to play the game, but the person playing the game.

Another disturbing trend in this post is the willingness of some people to give China a pass on it's long history of denying human rights and freedom to it's people. It's real easy for people who have never lived in tyranny, to underestimate the blessings of their own liberty.

 

I don't think it's homophobia or a problem with sexual orientation, but rather a problem with gender bending. The two can sometimes be related, but in this case, the focus is on gender, not sexual orientation.

Unless I read the OP wrong, this is a private company, not the government, setting up this requirement.

Also, I don't think this qualifies as a human rights violation. Plenty of private companies levy restrictions on their employees private lives, even in the U.S., and no one complains because most people agree that a private company has the right to decide such things.

Given that we're talking about a game restriction, I think it's a little insulting to put this in the same category as, say, the crackdown on protesters in the post-Iranian election period.

Problems with gender bending seem a liltte homophobic to me.

Would this "private company" be doing this if was anywhere else but China?
 

Why the scare quotes on "private company"?  As far as location, who cares?  Are you saying they would be prevented by force from doing this in another country?  If so, isn't that an argument that there is MORE freedom in China versus less?

 

Its a matter of mentalities. imposing restrictions to freedeom like this is much more likely to happen in china then holland, for example. saying china is more free then holland because companies have the freedom to limit your freedom is just wrong.


If you stand VERY still, and close your eyes, after a minute you can actually FEEL the universe revolving around PvP.

  ozerinx

Novice Member

Joined: 4/03/08
Posts: 201

10/28/09 2:17:43 PM#132

....That's like saying weren't the Indians annexed by force by the Europeans(Americans).

  Ravik

Novice Member

Joined: 10/07/06
Posts: 610

10/28/09 2:18:07 PM#133

"There was no further explanation of the ruling, although the headline on the Pacific Epoch site says it is an attempt to rein in transsexuals in games."

I feel that companies should be allowed to run however they want within the law, but if that is the real reason behind this along with banning people already playing the game instead of players joining the game....WTF

And it's only guys playing female chars...not girls playing male chars

Make games you want to play.

  someforumguy

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/25/07
Posts: 3504

10/28/09 2:19:07 PM#134

Wth has Tibet got to do with this private company's cowardly policy?

Apart from that, China is really not the only country where a company would do such a thing. Not that long ago a different large country almost went to defcon 5 after someone showed a nipple on national tv. I can easily imagine that some MMO company in that country would come up with a similar ridiculous policy.

 

  Toquio3

Novice Member

Joined: 7/02/09
Posts: 1105

"Excellent breeze... Great day for cards."

10/28/09 2:20:41 PM#135
Originally posted by someforumguy

Wth has Tibet got to do with this private company's cowardly policy?

Apart from that, China is really not the only country where a company would do such a thing. Not that long ago a different large country almost went to defcon 5 after someone showed a nipple on national tv. I can easily imagine that some MMO company in that country would come up with a similar ridiculous policy.

 

 

hilarious the way you put that =). but no, sorry I wont bite this one. ;-)


If you stand VERY still, and close your eyes, after a minute you can actually FEEL the universe revolving around PvP.

  Horusra

Hard Core Member

Joined: 6/26/05
Posts: 2240

10/28/09 2:21:27 PM#136

Many American companies have rules against cross dressing in the work place and they are legal due to them being private companies.  So long as the rules are displayed to you before you are hired you have to accept those rules to work for the company.

In England the government forced an old woman to take down a sign that said "Homosexuality is a sin" on her own property because they said it was hate speech...does this make the gays Hetrophobes?

  someforumguy

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/25/07
Posts: 3504

10/28/09 2:21:53 PM#137
Originally posted by Toquio3
Originally posted by rothbard
Originally posted by Brixon
Originally posted by Daedalus732
Originally posted by Brixon

There seems to be a lot of homophobia going on with the people who have a problem with people playing a character of the opposite gender. It's no ones business how people want to play the game, but the person playing the game.

Another disturbing trend in this post is the willingness of some people to give China a pass on it's long history of denying human rights and freedom to it's people. It's real easy for people who have never lived in tyranny, to underestimate the blessings of their own liberty.

 

I don't think it's homophobia or a problem with sexual orientation, but rather a problem with gender bending. The two can sometimes be related, but in this case, the focus is on gender, not sexual orientation.

Unless I read the OP wrong, this is a private company, not the government, setting up this requirement.

Also, I don't think this qualifies as a human rights violation. Plenty of private companies levy restrictions on their employees private lives, even in the U.S., and no one complains because most people agree that a private company has the right to decide such things.

Given that we're talking about a game restriction, I think it's a little insulting to put this in the same category as, say, the crackdown on protesters in the post-Iranian election period.

Problems with gender bending seem a liltte homophobic to me.

Would this "private company" be doing this if was anywhere else but China?
 

Why the scare quotes on "private company"?  As far as location, who cares?  Are you saying they would be prevented by force from doing this in another country?  If so, isn't that an argument that there is MORE freedom in China versus less?

 

Its a matter of mentalities. imposing restrictions to freedeom like this is much more likely to happen in china then holland, for example. saying china is more free then holland because companies have the freedom to limit your freedom is just wrong.

 

What a bs. Private companies always can and will restrict your freedom on their own turf. Just look at official forumrules of any game. There is no such thing as freedom of speech on those forums.

  rothbard

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/20/09
Posts: 251

10/28/09 2:22:37 PM#138
Originally posted by Toquio3
Originally posted by rothbard

Why the scare quotes on "private company"?  As far as location, who cares?  Are you saying they would be prevented by force from doing this in another country?  If so, isn't that an argument that there is MORE freedom in China versus less?


Its a matter of mentalities, not freedom. imposing restrictions to freedeom like this is much more likely to happen in china then holland, for example. saying china is more free then holland because companies have the freedom to limit your freedom is just wrong.

I think you have it backwards.  The aurora company is not restricting anyone's freedom.  They offer a product, which people are free to purchase or not.  That's it.  If some busybody bureaucrat with a legion of armed thugs at their command can use force to stop the company from offering it's product, then that is a loss of freedom.  Such things are more likely to occur in the "civilized" "moral" social democracies of europe and north america, than they are in China.  That's why, in this case, there is more freedom in China than in other countries of the world.

  Toquio3

Novice Member

Joined: 7/02/09
Posts: 1105

"Excellent breeze... Great day for cards."

10/28/09 2:24:30 PM#139
Originally posted by someforumguy
Originally posted by Toquio3
Originally posted by rothbard
Originally posted by Brixon
Originally posted by Daedalus732
Originally posted by Brixon

There seems to be a lot of homophobia going on with the people who have a problem with people playing a character of the opposite gender. It's no ones business how people want to play the game, but the person playing the game.

Another disturbing trend in this post is the willingness of some people to give China a pass on it's long history of denying human rights and freedom to it's people. It's real easy for people who have never lived in tyranny, to underestimate the blessings of their own liberty.

 

I don't think it's homophobia or a problem with sexual orientation, but rather a problem with gender bending. The two can sometimes be related, but in this case, the focus is on gender, not sexual orientation.

Unless I read the OP wrong, this is a private company, not the government, setting up this requirement.

Also, I don't think this qualifies as a human rights violation. Plenty of private companies levy restrictions on their employees private lives, even in the U.S., and no one complains because most people agree that a private company has the right to decide such things.

Given that we're talking about a game restriction, I think it's a little insulting to put this in the same category as, say, the crackdown on protesters in the post-Iranian election period.

Problems with gender bending seem a liltte homophobic to me.

Would this "private company" be doing this if was anywhere else but China?
 

Why the scare quotes on "private company"?  As far as location, who cares?  Are you saying they would be prevented by force from doing this in another country?  If so, isn't that an argument that there is MORE freedom in China versus less?

 

Its a matter of mentalities. imposing restrictions to freedeom like this is much more likely to happen in china then holland, for example. saying china is more free then holland because companies have the freedom to limit your freedom is just wrong.

 

What a bs. Private companies always can and will restrict your freedom on their own turf. Just look at official forumrules of any game. There is no such thing as freedom of speech on those forums.

 

absolutely right on that one. however, companies in the western world know that its people are not very likely to roll over and accept certain things. unlike the chinese people, who seem to enjoy being oppressed.


If you stand VERY still, and close your eyes, after a minute you can actually FEEL the universe revolving around PvP.

  maji

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 1/15/04
Posts: 1933

10/28/09 2:24:35 PM#140
Originally posted by Horusra

Many American companies have rules against cross dressing in the work place

Sheesh, next they have rules against people who are not attractive enough.

Let's play Fallen Earth (blind, 300 episodes)

Let's play Guild Wars 2 (blind, 45 episodes)

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