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For those people who think their idea of a government is the only good form of government- you're blind. Corruption is everywhere. Even the United States that claims to have a government 'for the people, by the people' just has a few assholes in charge that run everything. Its not truly a government for the people, by the people. I'm going to state my political views, but I'm not even sure if MINE would ever work. Here it is: A government in which there is NOBODY in charge, except for everybody. The ultimate downfall of every country's government is they place one or two or a few people in charge of everything, leaving no room for the people themselves to decide on issues. Am I saying there should be no organized structure of rank for the police, the military, etc? No. I'm simply saying that as humans, everybody should have an equal vote. A few people in power hold too much power, and that power is the ability to make votes of their choosing count more.
As far as I'm educated, that is. Again, I'm not saying my idea of a government is right. One might call my views somewhat anarchist (and I hope theres nothing wrong with that).
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If everyone gets an equal say and it's a straight up democracy nothing would ever be done. There'd be 30 different things on the ballot for each issue.
We're not arguing which form of government is perfect, we're arguing which is the least problematic. |
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Originally posted by Sabiancym Is that why you support a type of government Obama pushes? One where the people are taken out of the equation and the government takes control of everything? 
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Briansho
 Hard Core Member
Joined: 3/05/06
Functionless Art is Simply Tolerated Vandalism...We Are The Vandals. |
Originally posted by Dekron
Politicians keep preaching about cutting spending and limiting government. But Bush played up to the corporations and Obama is just continuing where he left off. Why are people acting like Obama is pushing some new type of govt when he is just carrying on the status quo? The corporations and lobbyists have Washington, D.C. by the balls and they want their profits met no matter what. The democrats that currently have control can't even do anything with their power, they are too tangled up in the lobbyists and special interest groups to make a solid decision on anything. "Don't sweat it -- it's not real life. It's only ones and zeroes." Gene Spafford "A lot of hacking is playing with other people, you know, getting them to do strange things." |
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kiddyno071
 Elite Member
Joined: 5/17/06
I thought the toilet was funny... others may give it more meaning. *sigh* |
Originally posted by Briansho
Politicians keep preaching about cutting spending and limiting government. But Bush played up to the corporations and Obama is just continuing where he left off. Why are people acting like Obama is pushing some new type of govt when he is just carrying on the status quo? The corporations and lobbyists have Washington, D.C. by the balls and they want their profits met no matter what. The democrats that currently have control can't even do anything with their power, they are too tangled up in the lobbyists and special interest groups to make a solid decision on anything.
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Originally posted by kiddyno071
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Vemoi
Hard Core Member
Joined: 5/14/05
Government always finds a need for whatever money it gets. |
Originally posted by Briansho
Politicians keep preaching about cutting spending and limiting government. But Bush played up to the corporations and Obama is just continuing where he left off. Why are people acting like Obama is pushing some new type of govt when he is just carrying on the status quo? The corporations and lobbyists have Washington, D.C. by the balls and they want their profits met no matter what. The democrats that currently have control can't even do anything with their power, they are too tangled up in the lobbyists and special interest groups to make a solid decision on anything.
Have to dissagree. The taking over of business has never been done as far as I remember. Perhaps there are some examples from the past but I haven't seen them. These are businesses held in large part by shareholders. Now there are government run boards. Unelected people setting pay at these businesses. If I have heard Shumer right, they are trying to control the pay of all public companies. I don't remember Bush attacking a news organization. or attacking private citizens and insulting large portions of the population. or going after Clinton admiistration. Later, got to get ready for work.
You know when a leftest runs out of ideas...it is when they pull out the racist card. |
Originally posted by Fishermage
Do you support Liberty, Freedom and wish to Uphold the Constitution? Join the movement - http://CampaignForLiberty.com |
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Originally posted by Vemoi
Bush did all of these things. He basically nationalized the auto industry and banking industry (done on his watch). He also hated everyone but Fox; only difference is he did this in private. Also the nationalization of business has happened before, FDR did it during WWII to help the war effort. Crystler has been bailed out before, I think in the 1970's. People who were against the Iraq war were deemed to be traitors and unpatriotic. I'm pretty sure Clinton got a fair blame for 9/11 and not killing Osama bin Laden. Obama is Bush v2.0 with a better look and well practiced oratory skills. Do you support Liberty, Freedom and wish to Uphold the Constitution? Join the movement - http://CampaignForLiberty.com |
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kiddyno071
Elite Member
Joined: 5/17/06
I thought the toilet was funny... others may give it more meaning. *sigh* |
Originally posted by smokemonsc
Haha, I... uh... like that! |
Originally posted by kiddyno071
Haha, I... uh... like that! We'll make a libertarian out of you yet, my friend! Prepare to be disassimiliated. Resistance is required :) |
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Vemoi
Hard Core Member
Joined: 5/14/05
Government always finds a need for whatever money it gets. |
Originally posted by smokemonsc
Bush did all of these things. He basically nationalized the auto industry and banking industry (done on his watch). He also hated everyone but Fox; only difference is he did this in private. Also the nationalization of business has happened before, FDR did it during WWII to help the war effort. Crystler has been bailed out before, I think in the 1970's. People who were against the Iraq war were deemed to be traitors and unpatriotic. I'm pretty sure Clinton got a fair blame for 9/11 and not killing Osama bin Laden. Obama is Bush v2.0 with a better look and well practiced oratory skills.
I am talking of these things coming directly out of the administration. Site where Bush called people traitors. Bloggers and such did but not the Bush administration. Crysler I remember, and I was not a takeover. The government loaned them money and that was the extent of it. Lee Iaccoca (sp?) did the recovering and they paid back the money. Bush did not threaten prosecution of Clinton people. You know when a leftest runs out of ideas...it is when they pull out the racist card. |
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seabass2003
 Hard Core Member
Joined: 8/31/05
Why the hell should I work? She''ll just spend all my money on shoes anyways! |
Originally posted by Briansho
Politicians keep preaching about cutting spending and limiting government. But Bush played up to the corporations and Obama is just continuing where he left off. Why are people acting like Obama is pushing some new type of govt when he is just carrying on the status quo? The corporations and lobbyists have Washington, D.C. by the balls and they want their profits met no matter what. The democrats that currently have control can't even do anything with their power, they are too tangled up in the lobbyists and special interest groups to make a solid decision on anything. So basically if you didn't like Bush you shouldn't like Obama either. Strange that no one seems to get that.
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Briansho
Hard Core Member
Joined: 3/05/06
Functionless Art is Simply Tolerated Vandalism...We Are The Vandals. |
Originally posted by seabass2003 So basically if you didn't like Bush you shouldn't like Obama either. Strange that no one seems to get that.
Some people would say hating Bush back then was unpatriotic and could get you on the terrorist watch list. Now when people hate on Obama is patriotic and they are exercising their freedom of speech. "Don't sweat it -- it's not real life. It's only ones and zeroes." Gene Spafford "A lot of hacking is playing with other people, you know, getting them to do strange things." |
Originally posted by Briansho So basically if you didn't like Bush you shouldn't like Obama either. Strange that no one seems to get that.
Some people would say hating Bush back then was unpatriotic and could get you on the terrorist watch list. Now when people hate on Obama is patriotic and they are exercising their freedom of speech.
Evidence? |
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Briansho
Hard Core Member
Joined: 3/05/06
Functionless Art is Simply Tolerated Vandalism...We Are The Vandals. |
Originally posted by Fishermage
Some people would say hating Bush back then was unpatriotic and could get you on the terrorist watch list. Now when people hate on Obama is patriotic and they are exercising their freedom of speech.
Evidence?
Just an observation of the way people act and talk around me. "Don't sweat it -- it's not real life. It's only ones and zeroes." Gene Spafford "A lot of hacking is playing with other people, you know, getting them to do strange things." |
Originally posted by Briansho So basically if you didn't like Bush you shouldn't like Obama either. Strange that no one seems to get that.
Some people would say hating Bush back then was unpatriotic and could get you on the terrorist watch list. Now when people hate on Obama is patriotic and they are exercising their freedom of speech.
and yet those of us with Ron Paul bumper stickers were put on a list... How odd. If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude; greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen. |
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Originally posted by Briansho
Some people would say hating Bush back then was unpatriotic and could get you on the terrorist watch list. Now when people hate on Obama is patriotic and they are exercising their freedom of speech.
Evidence?
Just an observation of the way people act and talk around me.
You must hang with some weird folks. I know a lot of conservatives and liberals and never met one conservative that liked Bush so much that hating him was thought to be unpatriotic, much less anyone thinking hating Obama is patriotic. The people I know don't believe in hate, first of all. Secondly, the conservatives I know never liked Bush, and don't like Obama for the same reason they didn't like Bush -- he was a big spender. I suggest you move to a new circle. You hang with some really toxic folks. |
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Originally posted by Ekibiogami
Some people would say hating Bush back then was unpatriotic and could get you on the terrorist watch list. Now when people hate on Obama is patriotic and they are exercising their freedom of speech.
and yet those of us with Ron Paul bumper stickers were put on a list... How odd.
LOL yeah, go figure. Plus I still want some evidence that anyone was put on a terrorist watch list simply for "hating Bush." Methinks our friend is making things up in an attempt to be funny. |
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Briansho
Hard Core Member
Joined: 3/05/06
Functionless Art is Simply Tolerated Vandalism...We Are The Vandals. |
Originally posted by Fishermage
Evidence?
Just an observation of the way people act and talk around me.
You must hang with some weird folks. I know a lot of conservatives and liberals and never met one conservative that liked Bush so much that hating him was thought to be unpatriotic, much less anyone thinking hating Obama is patriotic. The people I know don't believe in hate, first of all. Secondly, the conservatives I know never liked Bush, and don't like Obama for the same reason they didn't like Bush -- he was a big spender. I suggest you move to a new circle. You hang with some really toxic folks.
Hah, it's no big deal. Different people think different. I do still hear the occasional Obama is a muslim because of his name. I don't get into many political discussions except when the Obama worship starts. Then I start asking questions about the bailouts and the economy and people ask to change the subject and leave economics to the professionals. "Don't sweat it -- it's not real life. It's only ones and zeroes." Gene Spafford "A lot of hacking is playing with other people, you know, getting them to do strange things." |
Originally posted by Briansho
Evidence?
Just an observation of the way people act and talk around me.
You must hang with some weird folks. I know a lot of conservatives and liberals and never met one conservative that liked Bush so much that hating him was thought to be unpatriotic, much less anyone thinking hating Obama is patriotic. The people I know don't believe in hate, first of all. Secondly, the conservatives I know never liked Bush, and don't like Obama for the same reason they didn't like Bush -- he was a big spender. I suggest you move to a new circle. You hang with some really toxic folks.
Hah, it's no big deal. Different people think different. I do still hear the occasional Obama is a muslim because of his name. I don't get into many political discussions except when the Obama worship starts. Then I start asking questions about the bailouts and the economy and people ask to change the subject and leave economics to the professionals.
Who told you hating Bush could get you on a terrorist watch list? |
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seabass2003
Hard Core Member
Joined: 8/31/05
Why the hell should I work? She''ll just spend all my money on shoes anyways! |
Originally posted by Briansho So basically if you didn't like Bush you shouldn't like Obama either. Strange that no one seems to get that.
Some people would say hating Bush back then was unpatriotic and could get you on the terrorist watch list. Now when people hate on Obama is patriotic and they are exercising their freedom of speech. Actually no, we are called racists and astro-turf.
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Sorry for the late reply everybody! I had school today <_< I'm not really interested in the conversation as I've been reading through all the posts, and they seem kind of off topic but that might just be me. Hopefully its okay to leave threads and let people discuss on their own?
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Originally posted by Vemoi
Yes it has, a few times, one in particular was in the 50's when Truman took control of the steel industry in order to build up the military's arms, also threatened to draft all union coal workers into the war when they went on strike and replace them with the army. |
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Originally posted by glord
Thats called a democracy. They don't work well, at least none have yet. They tend to fall apart very fast into war and death.
Which is why the founders built this Republic the way they did |
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QFT
As to the above I can find no fault and agree.
