The success of WoW has attracted  a million fools and his money, that want to create another wow. 

As a result, we have a million wow clones, and most of these suck. 

PLEASE STOP IT.  Use the money more wisely, maybe make a serie of good Singleplayer games for the PC, maybe a single MMO, that has a novel idea.  Stop reiterating the wow idea, and wasting enough money to build a colony in Mars. 

I always wondered something and now I really need to ask...

Do you play the game mechanics of games in this genre, or do you try to immerse yourself into the gameworld?

Meaning when I think of people with focus on gamemechanics I believe that most games in this genre could be seen as Clones.

When I think of people who immerse themselfs within these games, I think about gamers who read the quest, get involved with the story or even creat there own story's, when a person play's this way no game will or can be the same but obvious many game mechanics in this genre will always be either the same or very familiar.

Originally posted by Reklaw

I always wondered something and now I really need to ask...

Do you play the game mechanics of games in this genre, or do you try to immerse yourself into the gameworld?

Meaning when I think of people with focus on gamemechanics I believe that most games in this genre could be seen as Clones.

When I think of people who immerse themselfs within these games, I think about gamers who read the quest, get involved with the story or even creat there own story's, when a person play's this way no game will or can be the same but obvious many game mechanics in this genre will always be either the same or very familiar.

 

Play the game. Who has time to read quest text? BTW, game mechanics can differ a lot. The play style of an arcane mage on WOW is very very different from a Rune Master in LOTRO .. though both are magic users.

You do very different things to optimize ur dps.

I take the time to read the text quest... The worst thing about clones is they do imitate WOWs inanity. And as for developers actually listening to players suggestions i continue to loose hope, i expect eventually theyll at least come to realize is far from sound bussiness to clone WOWs model.

Only explanation is that they still do good money with few risk. Why would they change that? They just want the money.

About reading the quests, there are just too many of them, I'd rather skip them and spend the time reading a good book.

it would be different if the clones brought something new to the table along with the tried and true, So far that doesn't seem to be the case.

I find that having the same game mechanics doesn't bother me, it's the lack of features that bothers me.   Housing, crafting, fishing, the little things that a game offers to keep things interesting. It seems that the games coming out do not offer anything but a quest line, grinding, and some form of pvp. Nothing really "extra" are being designed into them.

Early SWG was a good example of this. you could fart around shopping in the different towns, look for the perfect spot to sit your house down. Fish could be used as decorations.  the entertainers put on shows, made vids .  There was a lot to do.

Now it seems it's rush to the end to pvp or get in that instance for the bling, That's not enough to make most players enjoy the ride to the top levels, so rush, rush, rush.  Where's the fun?

Originally posted by Reklaw

I always wondered something and now I really need to ask...

Do you play the game mechanics of games in this genre, or do you try to immerse yourself into the gameworld?

Meaning when I think of people with focus on gamemechanics I believe that most games in this genre could be seen as Clones.

When I think of people who immerse themselfs within these games, I think about gamers who read the quest, get involved with the story or even creat there own story's, when a person play's this way no game will or can be the same but obvious many game mechanics in this genre will always be either the same or very familiar.

 

Why does everybody call games with fantasy settings that have WASD controls, instances, and Raids WoW clones? Have we forgotten that Blizzard didn't really come up with anything new, but cherry-pick ideas from other MMO's and polish them? Futire games will definately take ideas from WoW since it is very successful and does have a lot of great features. LOTRO is NOT a WoW clone neither is FFXI nor is Ryzom. They are all great games in their own right and even though they share some similar features, they ARE MMO's and will have to include some tried and true features so as to have subscribers. People treat WoW like it was new and innovative, but it took ideas that were already in the market, polished them, added a few of their own features, included an open UI (best idea ever, btw), and kept adding content and tweaking things. All game designers should do just that. It doesn't make them clones, it makes them good designers. 

 Exactly why people have issues finding a new game and end up back at WoW I really have not played an MMO in a couple of months due to the fact they are all the same. Hell I should go play Crimecraft even if it is bad but at least it's not WoW. These company's need to stop trying to make a WoW killer and dabble in something not like WoW. I will just wait for APB FFXIV and SW:TOR maybe start playing FFXI again till then or check out EQ.

No one is going to listen to you OP. You're not the voice of reason.

People like that game, that is why they play it. No one pays for something they hate (at least most people).

Get over yourself, you're not the Messiah of the WoW community they will all read this post and realize their 'mistakes.' Your opinion is exactly that, your opinion.

Lets get real please.

Originally posted by Murdus

No one is going to listen to you OP. You're not the voice of reason.

People like that game, that is why they play it. No one pays for something they hate (at least most people).

Get over yourself, you're not the Messiah of the WoW community they will all read this post and realize their 'mistakes.' Your opinion is exactly that, your opinion.

Lets get real please.

Well said.

"Cloning" worked for WoW after all it is a EQ clone but WoW improved on things EQ was doing wrong.The only thing games nowdays are doing wrong is that when they copy WoW they are not better games than WoW. They are not copying all the good things and improving on the bad.

Originally posted by luckturtz

"Cloning" worked for WoW after all it is a EQ clone but WoW improved on things EQ was doing wrong.The only thing games nowdays are doing wrong is that when they copy WoW they are not better games than WoW. They are not copying all the good things and improving on the bad.

Dan Quayle:  I have a lot in common with JFK.

Senator:  Sir, I served with JFK, knew JFK, and can say YOU ARE NO JFK.

WOW:  I'm a lot like Everquest.

EQ Player:  SIr, I played Everquest, had Everquest on my computer, and can say YOU ARE NO EVERQUEST.

WOW improved on graphics, polish, and class design, and stepped backwards on world feel, and freedom and consequences.  When Evequest Next comes out in 2010, I expect it to be a superior game to WOW. (Crossing fingers and hoping.)

Originally posted by Reklaw

I always wondered something and now I really need to ask...

Do you play the game mechanics of games in this genre, or do you try to immerse yourself into the gameworld?

Meaning when I think of people with focus on gamemechanics I believe that most games in this genre could be seen as Clones.

When I think of people who immerse themselfs within these games, I think about gamers who read the quest, get involved with the story or even creat there own story's, when a person play's this way no game will or can be the same but obvious many game mechanics in this genre will always be either the same or very familiar.

 

I used to be a quest reader, but frankly quests these days are an absolute joke and shouldn't be completed, much less read.  They are entirely meaningless (go here, kill this many orcs and harvest this many berrries, come back, move to next quest hub, do same damn thing, reach max level).  I would so much rather delve into a dungeon somewhere and "grind" mobs (which, for my money, is far less a grind than solo questing) than do these brain-dead quests. 

I'm on an MMO break at the moment and am waiting for a game that ditches pointless questing for meaningful questing (i.e. a few good quests that affect gameplay and don't give you an "x marks the spot" mini-map baloney in lieu of 10,000 fetch and bring back quests).  Will a game like this arise?  Tough to say, but with each successive release I'm becoming less and less optimistic.

Originally posted by pencilrick

Originally posted by luckturtz

"Cloning" worked for WoW after all it is a EQ clone but WoW improved on things EQ was doing wrong.The only thing games nowdays are doing wrong is that when they copy WoW they are not better games than WoW. They are not copying all the good things and improving on the bad.

 

Dan Quayle:  I have a lot in common with JFK.

Senator:  Sir, I served with JFK, knew JFK, and can say YOU ARE NO JFK.

 

WOW:  I'm a lot like Everquest.

EQ Player:  SIr, I played Everquest, had Everquest on my computer, and can say YOU ARE NO EVERQUEST.

 

WOW improved on graphics, polish, and class design, and stepped backwards on world feel, and freedom and consequences.  When Evequest Next comes out in 2010, I expect it to be a superior game to WOW. (Crossing fingers and hoping.)

 

Classes in WoW actually seemed a dumbed down version of EQ, with less variety, so I would not call that an improvement. It didn't seem very polished to me either when it first came out. So much stuff didn't work, horrible lag, many things broken.

It was more accessible, and the IP was popular which is why I think it was so successful, otherwise, I still think EQ is a better game even now, just with worse graphics, lol.
 

Originally posted by Vallanor

Originally posted by Reklaw

I always wondered something and now I really need to ask...

Do you play the game mechanics of games in this genre, or do you try to immerse yourself into the gameworld?

Meaning when I think of people with focus on gamemechanics I believe that most games in this genre could be seen as Clones.

When I think of people who immerse themselfs within these games, I think about gamers who read the quest, get involved with the story or even creat there own story's, when a person play's this way no game will or can be the same but obvious many game mechanics in this genre will always be either the same or very familiar.

 

 

I used to be a quest reader, but frankly quests these days are an absolute joke and shouldn't be completed, much less read.  They are entirely meaningless (go here, kill this many orcs and harvest this many berrries, come back, move to next quest hub, do same damn thing, reach max level).  I would so much rather delve into a dungeon somewhere and "grind" mobs (which, for my money, is far less a grind than solo questing) than do these brain-dead quests. 

I'm on an MMO break at the moment and am waiting for a game that ditches pointless questing for meaningful questing (i.e. a few good quests that affect gameplay and don't give you an "x marks the spot" mini-map baloney in lieu of 10,000 fetch and bring back quests).  Will a game like this arise?  Tough to say, but with each successive release I'm becoming less and less optimistic.

Kind of in the same boat as you. Sick of these horrible quest based games. I'm not playing atm, but hoping for something that has some quests that are truly epic, that affect the world or gameplay at least. Most of the quests I enjoyed were like the epic weapons in EQ, some other tough quests that had nice rewards, the daoc epic armor ones and a few other than had some really interesting storylines than took days to complete.

I even liked a few in WoW such as the thunderfury quest. Other than that, kill x, delivery y are a bore and becomes the only way to progress decently, which bores me even more. Thankfully I have been finding some console games to play, so I don't miss MMOs too much, hehe.

i dont mind if the game play is a rip-off from WoW or some other game. what takes my attention is the story of the game, the quests, and the community. coz face it, the industry doesn't want to risk coming up with a new game mechanic. imho what really breathes life into a game is the player. if the player like the quests and is along with other players, and they enjoy it, does it really matter if its another WoW clone?

on the topic of games having similar game mechanics. this issue isnt limited to MMOs. look at FPS games, strategy games, 4x games and rpgs. most of them have very similar gameplay. are people complaining about how similar they are?

anyway, just my two cents.

Originally posted by haelikoth

i dont mind if the game play is a rip-off from WoW or some other game. what takes my attention is the story of the game, the quests, and the community. coz face it, the industry doesn't want to risk coming up with a new game mechanic. imho what really breathes life into a game is the player. if the player like the quests and is along with other players, and they enjoy it, does it really matter if its another WoW clone?

on the topic of games having similar game mechanics. this issue isnt limited to MMOs. look at FPS games, strategy games, 4x games and rpgs. most of them have very similar gameplay. are people complaining about how similar they are?

anyway, just my two cents.

Exactly, nicely said

Originally posted by Vallanor

Originally posted by Reklaw

I always wondered something and now I really need to ask...

Do you play the game mechanics of games in this genre, or do you try to immerse yourself into the gameworld?

Meaning when I think of people with focus on gamemechanics I believe that most games in this genre could be seen as Clones.

When I think of people who immerse themselfs within these games, I think about gamers who read the quest, get involved with the story or even creat there own story's, when a person play's this way no game will or can be the same but obvious many game mechanics in this genre will always be either the same or very familiar.

 

 

I used to be a quest reader, but frankly quests these days are an absolute joke and shouldn't be completed, much less read.  They are entirely meaningless (go here, kill this many orcs and harvest this many berrries, come back, move to next quest hub, do same damn thing, reach max level).  I would so much rather delve into a dungeon somewhere and "grind" mobs (which, for my money, is far less a grind than solo questing) than do these brain-dead quests. 

I'm on an MMO break at the moment and am waiting for a game that ditches pointless questing for meaningful questing (i.e. a few good quests that affect gameplay and don't give you an "x marks the spot" mini-map baloney in lieu of 10,000 fetch and bring back quests).  Will a game like this arise?  Tough to say, but with each successive release I'm becoming less and less optimistic.

Well I can not immerse myself with the kill x wolves type of quest, but then again I would have thought this would be logical, geuss not, besides those type of quest are just the basics and sorry have no complaint about the basics as I don't need to do them unless I want to do every single quest a game offers I have that choice.

Every MMORPG I played had meaningfull quest and had your basic amount of basic quest like the kll X amount of this or that, sometimes I would just pick up those basic quest as those type of quest aren't really meaningfull to do at once, but you're are bound to come across items/creatures or mobs that are in those quest any way. I feel when people start to really focus on these basic quest then sure questing will become a borefest.

I will agree that I truly dislike it when maps mark the excact spot for quests, regardless if it's a basic quest or a more mainingfull quest, but then again I will ignore those type of games or stop playing them.

Trust me I am in the same boot of not having that one MMORPG to enjoy to it's fullest, also me saying creat your own story involves more then just quests, again thought that would be logical but again I think I was wrong seeing this reply. There is more to a MMORPG then just questing for me, but tried to keep it simple, which didn't work.

I've never seen a single WoW clone in my life, ever.

I'll call it a WoW clone when the fictional world it is set in is called Azeroth and the title of the game is called "World Of Warcraft".

Until then, they are all just following a standard template that most MMOs have followed.

Originally posted by Ibluerate

I've never seen a single WoW clone in my life, ever.

I'll call it a WoW clone when the fictional world it is set in is called Azeroth and the title of the game is called "World Of Warcraft".

Until then, they are all just following a standard template that most MMOs have followed.

Originally posted by altairzq

Originally posted by Ibluerate

I've never seen a single WoW clone in my life, ever.

I'll call it a WoW clone when the fictional world it is set in is called Azeroth and the title of the game is called "World Of Warcraft".

Until then, they are all just following a standard template that most MMOs have followed.

 

W-h-a-t?

I never said I liked that they followed this template.

WoW and EQ2 are the only ones that, I feel, got it right.

Honestly, I cannot be bothered whether a game is considered a WoW clone or not. As long as I like the gameplay mechanics, the storyline, quests, the characters, I will continue to play. And yes, I am one of those people who actually read quest text; I find it increases my enjoyment of the game by at least fifty percent. Unless it's in Engrish of course; then I cringe.

Originally posted by Reklaw

I always wondered something and now I really need to ask...

Do you play the game mechanics of games in this genre, or do you try to immerse yourself into the gameworld?

Meaning when I think of people with focus on gamemechanics I believe that most games in this genre could be seen as Clones.

When I think of people who immerse themselfs within these games, I think about gamers who read the quest, get involved with the story or even creat there own story's, when a person play's this way no game will or can be the same but obvious many game mechanics in this genre will always be either the same or very familiar.

 

In single player games, the quests change the game world. That is why they become interesting to read, and why they are immersive.

In KOTOR for example, you follow the darkside or the lightside. This will lead to different quest lines, and a different outcome at the end of the game. YOU become the story, because you decide what will happen to the world.

IN FAllout 3, you even have quests which can destroy and entire city. Once you do that, it's gone for the rest of the game. Think of doing that in an MMORPG. An entire city full of quests and NPCs completey destroyed never to return.

So, I need to read the quests, and I'm quite interested. Should I destroy the city or not? After all, if I do it isn't coming back.

Compare that to an MMORPG.

Do this, do that, do some other thing.

What's going to change in the game world? Absolutely NOTHING!

So why should I read it? It's pointless.

Go save the princess because blah, blah, blah.

What's going to happen if I don't save the  princess? Nothing. What's going to happen if I DO save the Princess? You'll get boots of crappiness, or perhaps a rusty sword of not quite uberness. Then gee, if that's the only thing that's going to happen, isn't that all I really need to know?

There is a solid argument for using the wow model for different IPs, which I ultimately believe that LOTRO did quite well.  I don't like LOTRO as a mmo (heck, I don't like any mmos right now), but for your average person who doesn't scrutinize mmos the way I do, LOTRO is a good game. 

But for us mmo gamers, we certainly don't need another wow, and most definately not in a different skin that's not as good as the original.