Originally posted by egotrip

Originally posted by daarco

Its the company that decide what they want to call it, not the fans or haters.

Some they call patches and some they call expansions.

AV calls this a exapnsion, thus making it a expansion.

Later there will be a patch to fix this expansion, and some will argue that is a "expansion".

And here i thought that whatever standards constitute an expansion and what a patch were pretty much the same for all companies and all games and that they were set based on something more than "....because they say so "

So does that thing go for all or is it one of those things only AV can get away wi......*cough* *cough* ,ahem meant can do?

I mean if i said that the below picture was C-A-K-E (even if it indeed was an oddly shaped C-A-K-E ) would anyone just believe me without questioning or even doubting me and just take a bite.........or does this only work with AV?

So if Blizzard did call a patch for a expansion in  WoW....would that make it easier to understand?

It does not matter what company you talk about.

I often call this a patch instead. And that is what it is for me. But it make no difference what i call it...its stil a expansion!

Originally posted by phrank

Let me make it simple for simple minds:

Expansion= You can continue to play the game without buying or installing the expansion. You don't have all the new content, levels, classes, etc but you can continue to play. For example Vanilla WoW or for that f'n matter Everquest; one of my accounts has 2 expansions the other has all of them and both work fine.

Patch= You must install it to be at the correct revision level to play the game. A certain game currently in beta for example releases new patches almost weekly (which have more content BTW then DnF's expansions) and if you dont' install them you can't even log in.

It really is that simple no matter what Lord Tacos and his minions of slavering sycophantic obsequious shillbots want to call it.

Thanks.  That makes a lot of sense.

I like that definition, and it's pretty cut and dry.  No translation needed.

If the game can run without it... it's an expansion.  (Doesn't matter if it's free or not).

If the game needs it to run... it's a patch.

Originally posted by xzyax

Originally posted by phrank

Let me make it simple for simple minds:

Expansion= You can continue to play the game without buying or installing the expansion. You don't have all the new content, levels, classes, etc but you can continue to play. For example Vanilla WoW or for that f'n matter Everquest; one of my accounts has 2 expansions the other has all of them and both work fine.

Patch= You must install it to be at the correct revision level to play the game. A certain game currently in beta for example releases new patches almost weekly (which have more content BTW then DnF's expansions) and if you dont' install them you can't even log in.

It really is that simple no matter what Lord Tacos and his minions of slavering sycophantic obsequious shillbots want to call it.

 

Thanks.  That makes a lot of sense.

I like that definition, and it's pretty cut and dry.  No translation needed.

 

If the game can run without it... it's an expansion.  (Doesn't matter if it's free or not).

If the game needs it to run... it's a patch.

 

 

Then what about EvE's free expansions?

There's two types of expansions.

Free and P2P expansions. 

P2P(Pay to play) are expansions that add on to the game you are already paying for at an additional retail box cost. 

Free expansions are most commonly refered to as content updates, free content, etc.  Typically not as expansions, since expansions usually are considered costing money.  Thus why Darkfall's devs keep calling their updates expansions.

In truth the expansions aren't expansions if they listed the things in the expansion before the game was released as being in the original product.  Thus is the case with Darkfall.  Everything in the coming update was listed to be already in the game if you check their site and look back at old posts you will find countless dev posts about what they were going to have in the game.  They even insinuate that it's in in multiple cases on their web site.  Most of what is in the patch is just that, patches to problems.  None of it is new content really other than the randomly wandering mobs.  Keep in mind everything in that patch has been requested since launch by subscribers, and they're just now getting around to it.

Of course Aventurine is just farming for cash.  They are a business after all, and they're going to spin things to sound delicious even more so than any other game company because their profit stinks, it's bleeding out the butt from subscribers leaving the game and they're trying to cash out on it as quickly as possible instead of long term.  Same thing happened with Roma Victor which went down as one of the biggest flops in history.  Personally I think Darkfall's worse  than Roma Victor since RV had at least an adult community that was mature.

Originally posted by daveospice

There's two types of expansions.

Free and P2P expansions. 

P2P(Pay to play) are expansions that add on to the game you are already paying for at an additional retail box cost. 

Free expansions are most commonly refered to as content updates, free content, etc.  Typically not as expansions, since expansions usually are considered costing money.  Thus why Darkfall's devs keep calling their updates expansions.

In truth the expansions aren't expansions if they listed the things in the expansion before the game was released as being in the original product.  Thus is the case with Darkfall.  Everything in the coming update was listed to be already in the game if you check their site and look back at old posts you will find countless dev posts about what they were going to have in the game.  They even insinuate that it's in in multiple cases on their web site.  Most of what is in the patch is just that, patches to problems.  None of it is new content really other than the randomly wandering mobs.  Keep in mind everything in that patch has been requested since launch by subscribers, and they're just now getting around to it.

Of course Aventurine is just farming for cash.  They are a business after all, and they're going to spin things to sound delicious even more so than any other game company because their profit stinks, it's bleeding out the butt from subscribers leaving the game and they're trying to cash out on it as quickly as possible instead of long term.  Same thing happened with Roma Victor which went down as one of the biggest flops in history.  Personally I think Darkfall's worse  than Roma Victor since RV had at least an adult community that was mature.

The game released with what the devs said it would be released with minus skill cap and racial abilities. All you have to do is read the mmorpg.italia and war cry intrevewis and watch the beta trailers sam game. AV even said that their website was outdated and shouldn't be looked at as what the game would contain at relaease and gave you the interviews and IRC chat to find out waht the game would actually have. Thining other wise is either due to over hypeing yourself, or ingnorance. But of course, me saying this puts me in shill bot  fanboy mode to you people, but its the truth.

BTW, DFO is still profitable regarudless of what you want to think. Since launch they have hired a "full" time staff for CSR, added 1-3 new developers (graphics and animation I believe), have updated their website to professional status, are going to be releasing boxed copies of the game soon, and have updated their own website. You don't have to admit it if you don't want to though, I'll understand.

Originally posted by xpiher

 

BTW, DFO is still profitable regarudless of what you want to think. Since launch they have hired a "full" time staff for CSR, added 1-3 new developers (graphics and animation I believe), have updated their website to professional status, are going to be releasing boxed copies of the game soon, and have updated their own website. You don't have to admit it if you don't want to though, I'll understand.

They only have a few thousand people playing it. How can it possibly be profitable?  That wouldn't generate enough money to pay for their currrent costs. And then there is the interest they owe on that 20 million dollar loan. There is no way they are making a profit.

Originally posted by xpiher

Originally posted by daveospice

There's two types of expansions.

Free and P2P expansions. 

P2P(Pay to play) are expansions that add on to the game you are already paying for at an additional retail box cost. 

Free expansions are most commonly refered to as content updates, free content, etc.  Typically not as expansions, since expansions usually are considered costing money.  Thus why Darkfall's devs keep calling their updates expansions.

In truth the expansions aren't expansions if they listed the things in the expansion before the game was released as being in the original product.  Thus is the case with Darkfall.  Everything in the coming update was listed to be already in the game if you check their site and look back at old posts you will find countless dev posts about what they were going to have in the game.  They even insinuate that it's in in multiple cases on their web site.  Most of what is in the patch is just that, patches to problems.  None of it is new content really other than the randomly wandering mobs.  Keep in mind everything in that patch has been requested since launch by subscribers, and they're just now getting around to it.

Of course Aventurine is just farming for cash.  They are a business after all, and they're going to spin things to sound delicious even more so than any other game company because their profit stinks, it's bleeding out the butt from subscribers leaving the game and they're trying to cash out on it as quickly as possible instead of long term.  Same thing happened with Roma Victor which went down as one of the biggest flops in history.  Personally I think Darkfall's worse  than Roma Victor since RV had at least an adult community that was mature.

 

The game released with what the devs said it would be released with minus skill cap and racial abilities. All you have to do is read the mmorpg.italia and war cry intrevewis and watch the beta trailers sam game. AV even said that their website was outdated and shouldn't be looked at as what the game would contain at relaease and gave you the interviews and IRC chat to find out waht the game would actually have. Thining other wise is either due to over hypeing yourself, or ingnorance. But of course, me saying this puts me in shill bot  fanboy mode to you people, but its the truth.

BTW, DFO is still profitable regarudless of what you want to think. Since launch they have hired a "full" time staff for CSR, added 1-3 new developers (graphics and animation I believe), have updated their website to professional status, are going to be releasing boxed copies of the game soon, and have updated their own website. You don't have to admit it if you don't want to though, I'll understand.

You really believe that and can say it with a straight face?

Man talk about being in denial and living in a dream world.

Go back and learn some young padawan, you really are coming off like a fool making comments like those with the people on here that have followed this game for any length of time.

Hint: the game released with less then 40% of what they had promised and was still up until a few months ago posted on their website. That is called fraud and is actionable in every EU country and the US. They are just such small fry that no one is wasting the legal action on them. Not worth going after a failed cause and failed company.

Originally posted by ghoul31

Originally posted by xpiher

 

BTW, DFO is still profitable regarudless of what you want to think. Since launch they have hired a "full" time staff for CSR, added 1-3 new developers (graphics and animation I believe), have updated their website to professional status, are going to be releasing boxed copies of the game soon, and have updated their own website. You don't have to admit it if you don't want to though, I'll understand.

 

They only have a few thousand people playing it. How can it possibly be profitable?  That wouldn't generate enough money to pay for their currrent costs. And then there is the interest they owe on that 20 million dollar loan. There is no way they are making a profit.

 

The launch probably sold 30-50k boxes, most of those stayed sub'd for 2-3 months, after that is dropped down to 5,000.

I'd say they probably will make back their money and then some.

Originally posted by daywalker27

The launch probably sold 30-50k boxes, most of those stayed sub'd for 2-3 months, after that is dropped down to 5,000.

 

I'd say they probably will make back their money and then some.

 That got them a couple mill. That will just pay the interest they owe this year.  If they don't get a lot more subscribers, they are going to be in trouble.

Originally posted by ghoul31

Originally posted by daywalker27

The launch probably sold 30-50k boxes, most of those stayed sub'd for 2-3 months, after that is dropped down to 5,000.

 

I'd say they probably will make back their money and then some.

 

 That got them a couple mill. That will just pay the interest they owe this year.  If they don't get a lot more subscribers, they are going to be in trouble.

 

I know we had this argument on another thread but I didnt take you seriously and didnt answer you. The link that you provided to back up your 20 mil dollar statement only said they secured that ammount from a bank, not that they used the money.

The absolute truth is and always will be the greek tv interview where tasos stated on live national television that the game development cost 10 million dollars. 

/thread

Originally posted by tensspotting

 

I know we had this argument on another thread but I didnt take you seriously and didnt answer you. The link that you provided to back up your 20 mil dollar statement only said they secured that ammount from a bank, not that they used the money.

 

The absolute truth is and always will be the greek tv interview where tasos stated on live national television that the game development cost 10 million dollars. 

 

/thread

Even if they only spent ten mil, thats still a million a year in interst they owe, plus a million or so in expenses. With 5k players, there is no way they will make a profit.