Originally posted by Pelaaja

Originally posted by UNH0LYEV1L

Originally posted by Electriceye

If you're having fun this curve is meaningless.

It really doesn't matter if you take years to level cap, as long as you're enjoying the journey. It also goes without saying that in this situation, you won't really feel the grind, as you aren't racing to level cap and don't look at the exp bar every time you kill something/gather something/kill an enemy/ complete a quest etc. because you're having FUN (keyword: Fun).

If you aren't enjoying it like a lot of people and are actually dreading the +30lvls, then I suggest you cancel your account right now as it's futile to continue playing with this mindset.

Contrary to what some people think, Aion is not a chore. It's only work if you make it look like work. It's a game, made for entertainment, if it doesn't entertain you, then to hell with it.

Yea I agree he didn't mention that you can still have fun while leveling.  Only problem is that the fun pretty much flatlines at 25+ so its curve is pretty much the opposite if you were to reflect it across the y axis.

How about one tries to think the game as a whole and not to hit the cap asap?

What I love about Aion is that every level actually matters. And you spend enough time on one level to be happy about the next one once you gain it. And no, there isn't too much work involved to level.

And the game gives you a possibility to get attached with your character. Other lately launched MMOs walk you quickly through the embarrassing phase of levelling (WAR for example) and throw you into making alts. Aion doesn't.

I do agree with you that it is not about hitting the cap but its just that it loses fun.  PvP, PvE, questing and crafting and instancing seemed like a lot when i first started playing but it just lost my interest that is all.  I can't log in and have fun with a game when every time I log in it feels like a chore to play instead of fun.

I see now that others have already pointed out the meaninglessness of the chart both in what it puports to represent and the fact that as long as you are having fun it isn't an issue.

When people were calling Aion just a korean grinder people screamed "NOO the leveling curve is simillar to WoW and its awesome!!"

And now when it shows that Aion is a korean grinder people are screaming "Nooo this is not WoW its supposed to be like this and its awseome!!"

Just a funny observation :)

I'd say grind starts about 34. 37 is pretty much straight grind to complete quests. Some mind this others don't. While the pvp is good, I do not think the overall game play is good. It's just not worth the cost to me. I don't consider grinding that much xp fun.

Its not just the grinding, the famous NCSoft"support". The game crashes in Fortress battles. The lack of rewards for doing things like killing boss' in game. The fact that to get a decent blue you have to kill 100 elites solo or 600 in a group. Just entire game is built around grind as the form of entertainment, and frankly grind isn't entertainment. If its this way at this level, the content at 50, and new content that may enter will be the same. Not interested. But for those of you that are, great, good for you.

Originally posted by Baggs

A normal 2-dotted mob gives me ~30k EXP at level 46.

That is without the +30% EXP buff you get when you log out for hours and without the Lodas Amulet which gives another extra +20% EXP.

Those two combined, give you +50% more EXP.

 

Elite mobs give at LEAST TWICE as much as a normal mob when in a group of EQUAL level people.

 

So if you have half a brain, you will gather some 30% buff and a lodas amulet, make a decent group and go "grind" on elite mobs that you have to kill ANYWAY for QUESTS.

Quests above level 30 give you 1,000,000 exp + (im talking about decent quests, easy ones give anything around 200k - 600k)

 

Hundreds of people are level 50 already, or nearing it because guess what, its EASY.

Also, guess what?

You cant level if you dont play.

You cant possibly expect to hit 50 in a month by playing 2 hours a day. It's an MMORPG. It's supposed to take that long, or lots of effort for that matter.

 

Stop whining, its easier than WoW.

I agree it is technically "easy" to level.  I could have hit 50 by now if I wanted to.  Considering i rerolled to a class that suit me more after leveling first character to 35.  However, the grind, while not hard, is not entertaining.  In fact it is the opposite.  I prefer my games to entertain, but heh that's why i call it a game.  Work is easy too but I prefer not to do it on my down time.  So you enjoy it, good for you.  Just don't be surprised if server pops die after the 29th when free time goes down.

Originally posted by Baggs

 

You cant possibly expect to hit 50 in a month by playing 2 hours a day. It's an MMORPG. It's supposed to take that long, or lots of effort for that matter.

 

Stop whining, its easier than WoW.

This is where I disagree.  The crowd aion is catering too do not care much for grinding.   Its PvP and if players do not get the chance to PvP before they put 60+ hours into the game then something is wrong.  

Originally posted by thinktank001

Originally posted by Baggs

 

You cant possibly expect to hit 50 in a month by playing 2 hours a day. It's an MMORPG. It's supposed to take that long, or lots of effort for that matter.

 

Stop whining, its easier than WoW.

 

 

This is where I disagree.  The crowd aion is catering too do not care much for grinding.   Its PvP and if players do not get the chance to PvP before they put 60+ hours into the game then something is wrong.  

Actually, no. It takes 10 hours before you can PvP and that's when you're playing it laid back. You can join the arena at around lvl20 (not more than 20 hours or you're not playing the game), at the same level bracket you can use Rifts that take you to PvP (or meet those who came through and kill you), at lvl25 (28 hours?) you enter the Abyss and PvP to your hearts content.

Sometimes I wish people here wouldn't just join the choir.

So, what's really wrong here is you saying something you don't even know about.

EDIT: And the people Aion really is catering to don't mind about grinding. The people you described are the ones that play WAR.

Originally posted by Pelaaja

Actually, no. It takes 10 hours before you can PvP and that's when you're playing it laid back. You can join the arena at around lvl20 (not more than 20 hours or you're not playing the game), at the same level bracket you can use Rifts that take you to PvP (or meet those who came through and kill you), at lvl25 (28 hours?) you enter the Abyss and PvP to your hearts content.

Sometimes I wish people here wouldn't just join the choir.

So, what's really wrong here is you saying something you don't even know about.

EDIT: And the people Aion really is catering to don't mind about grinding. The people you described are the ones that play WAR.

o, right.   I forgot level 25s running through rifts to get slaughtered by max level chars is PvP and vice versa.   A game that relies heavily on levels for character progression needs to have PvP content catered to all levels for it to be successful. 

Aion is heavily balanced towards end game so what is the point of making the level progression slow?

Originally posted by thinktank001

Originally posted by Pelaaja

Actually, no. It takes 10 hours before you can PvP and that's when you're playing it laid back. You can join the arena at around lvl20 (not more than 20 hours or you're not playing the game), at the same level bracket you can use Rifts that take you to PvP (or meet those who came through and kill you), at lvl25 (28 hours?) you enter the Abyss and PvP to your hearts content.

Sometimes I wish people here wouldn't just join the choir.

So, what's really wrong here is you saying something you don't even know about.

EDIT: And the people Aion really is catering to don't mind about grinding. The people you described are the ones that play WAR.

 

o, right.   I forgot level 25s running through rifts to get slaughtered by max level chars is PvP and vice versa.   A game that relies heavily on levels for character progression needs to have PvP content catered to all levels for it to be successful. 

Aion is heavily balanced towards end game so what is the point of making the level progression slow?

Try going through the rift with a legion, it works wonders. If you are a lone wolf, don't judge an MMO by your standards.

But to your original point, there is PvP before 60+ hours of PvE.

The level progression is made slow, because in east they pay by hour. It's a pure business decision and us monthly fee payers just have to swallow it.

Entirely separate comment follows: the payment difference was the main cause for the private store issue Aion had at the launch. No sane person in the east would've left their character in PS mode because it would've eaten their payments for nothing.

The XP curve is going to recieve a major overhaul soon. Both quests and mob XP will be increased by a huge amount post 30.

Originally posted by Valentina

The XP curve is going to recieve a major overhaul soon. Both quests and mob XP will be increased by a huge amount post 30.

The only thing I've read so far is a moderate increase in quest experience.  As it stands, quest rewarded experience past a certain level isn't worth bothering with.  You'll end up losing experience because of the time it takes to travel to and from quest objectives when compared to pure grinding.  It might put questing back on people's radars, but I wouldn't call it a major overhaul.

Quote: The XP curve is going to recieve a major overhaul soon. Both quests and mob XP will be increased by a huge amount post 30.

Read my posthistory if you dont believe me, i am the complete opposite of those trolls and Aionhater

But this claim is completely wrong, unless they added a unannounced new patch for xp rewards in the last few days again.

Also there hasnt been anything mentioned on inrease of monsterexperience.

The total average xp reward per level between 40-49 goes up from 18% per level to 23.3% per level with the coming patch.

And between 30-39 from 29.7% to 35.2%

So its still just about 1/2-1/3 of a level if you dont want to repeat any kind of quest you need to grind or get from other sourcers like repeating a dungeon/elitezone/crafting(gathering/crafting XP will be raised too as far as i remember but theres jet any hard numbers) etc.

The patch majorly deals with quest which rewarded far too less xp for the work you did, compared to other quests.

Also the xp rewards will not be heavily noticeable even though ~ +6% XP may sound nice. A good chunk of the xp reward still comes from monsterxp of the monster you kill while doing the quests (something the trolls throwing arround those xp charts mostly try to hide), but those are not increased. So a quest where you get 200k as questreward and 250k from monsterexperience will just reward you now with about 210k XP but still just 250k monsterxp.

Originally posted by supbro

Sorry you cant ding 50 in 2 weeks of casual play.

I dont really get this. Games is about relaxation, having fun. If im not casual while playing, it would just be like having another job. I get how raiding can be more serious; its a fun challenge, instantly rewarding and something you do with alot of friends, you are having alot of fun while trying to be among the best. But casual vs hardcore grinding? Really? A hardcore grinder is neither more man or more skilled then a casual grinder in my book; in fact he might even be a bigger looser. Its abit like those who compete in sitting on poles for the longest amount of time - at least that have some surreel quality.

Aion desperately needs carrots. The rewards(spells, skills) every third level dosnt cut it. Thats a horrible amount of xp grinded before getting a new spell or skill. A interesting talent tree would at least make those inbetween lvls abit rewarding.

My guildmates and friendlists are starting to feint. Ppl really seems to start giving up around 25-30; and i dont blame them. They just dont wanna do something which they dont find fun - those ppl actually have integrity.

 

Originally posted by Furor

My only complaint for aion is the level grind from level 40-45. Its insane not many people will like it.

Its a cruel joke level from ncsoft lol.

 

 

 

go play lineage 2 and then tell me its insane.

Originally posted by comerb

Originally posted by Valentina

The XP curve is going to recieve a major overhaul soon. Both quests and mob XP will be increased by a huge amount post 30.

 

The only thing I've read so far is a moderate increase in quest experience.  As it stands, quest rewarded experience past a certain level isn't worth bothering with.  You'll end up losing experience because of the time it takes to travel to and from quest objectives when compared to pure grinding.  It might put questing back on people's radars, but I wouldn't call it a major overhaul.

would you be happy if ncsoft just gave you a level 50 character? maybe then you would stop whining..baby will cry till baby gets fed.

Originally posted by Valentina

The XP curve is going to recieve a major overhaul soon. Both quests and mob XP will be increased by a huge amount post 30.

I really hope not. All other new MMORPGs are easy-mode with people leveling to cap in a couple of weeks. Aion was one of the very few where it actually is something special to be at level cap because it takes some effort.

But I guess the whiners whined too loud and now the game is being put in easy-mode like the rest. *sigh*

The leveling curve is not meant to be 'challenging' nor is it meant to be something to sort out the losers that can't take the grind.

The leveling curve is only one thing, timesink, the longer people grind the more money they pay. Devs just have to balance the carrot and the sink, it's as easy as that... plus the fact that Korean nerds are considering teh grind as something like a 'Trial of Willpower' kind of Kung Fu mental resilience thing... I guess... or they're just nerdier than western nerds, or whatever...

M

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by Valentina

The XP curve is going to recieve a major overhaul soon. Both quests and mob XP will be increased by a huge amount post 30.

I really hope not. All other new MMORPGs are easy-mode with people leveling to cap in a couple of weeks. Aion was one of the very few where it actually is something special to be at level cap because it takes some effort.

But I guess the whiners whined too loud and now the game is being put in easy-mode like the rest. *sigh*

It won't go easy-mode.

They needed to either add more quests that give valuable experience or edit the existing ones so while your leveling you won't get in some level gap were either you do repeatables or grind.

(My damn sig is stuck at that level for 3 days now -_-)

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by Valentina

The XP curve is going to recieve a major overhaul soon. Both quests and mob XP will be increased by a huge amount post 30.

 

I really hope not. All other new MMORPGs are easy-mode with people leveling to cap in a couple of weeks. Aion was one of the very few where it actually is something special to be at level cap because it takes some effort.

But I guess the whiners whined too loud and now the game is being put in easy-mode like the rest. *sigh*

Actually, I wonder how grinding trashmobs has anything to do with not being 'easymode'. In WoW, you can level to 80 in like 3 weeks if you are a 4, 5 hour/day core player. Granted. But what does it take to actually get the best possible gear in game and make a difference?

Or, not so popular example, EvE Online. You don't have to grind one second in this game if you're clever. There's no uber-max-level in this game; you can either outsmart your opponents, or you can't. Now that's what I myself consider NOT easymode. Giving a monkey a toothbrush and a ballroom floor is easymode, in fact it doesn't get any easier than this...

M

Originally posted by supbro

Sorry you cant ding 50 in 2 weeks of casual play.

I think this is the bottom line right here. people are spoiled. the game hasnt been out a month (i think it ends on the 28th) and people are already bitching they arent max level yet. what has become of mmorpg players i wonder...

I see two groups of people here. one, the people who think you should be able to be 50 after those 2 weeks, ala wow, and the second group, who thinks this is great as it is, and are having fun. I predict the 1st group of people will bitch and moan and make ncsoft change things. what will happen is, the first group will get to max level faster then the second group can say 'go back to wow' and that second group will hate the changes. after max level, the first group will quit the game to the next flashy thing they see in the underbrush, and it will be up to the people that actually like Aion to endure what is now a game where each and every quest gives you a quarter of your total xp bar.

I hope not though.

Have you guys ever though about the fact that getting done with the whole leveling crap might have other motivations than 'lol too slow I wanna pwn teh game now!!11'?

Maybe people want to get rid of the leveling because they actually don't like levelling. I mean, do you like the level concept? In a PvP game? Where some random guy can kick your behind just because he is 10 levels above you. The only thing he had to do to be in this position is start the game like 2 weeks before you did.

In my experience, people tend to wear this 'teh level grind is for true hardcore gamers' because they actually enjoy the genuine advantage that comes with the easymode-grind. All you have to do to get easy kills is sit there and mash 4 buttons, while in a skill-based game, or a game that virtually starts at maxlevel, you have to actually be clever/social/organized to succeed.

M

Originally posted by Meridion

Have you guys ever though about the fact that getting done with the whole leveling crap might have other motivations than 'lol too slow I wanna pwn teh game now!!11'?

Maybe people want to get rid of the leveling because they actually don't like levelling. I mean, do you like the level concept? In a PvP game? Where some random guy can kick your behind just because he is 10 levels above you. The only thing he had to do to be in this position is start the game like 2 weeks before you did.

In my experience, people tend to wear this 'teh level grind is for true hardcore gamers' because they actually enjoy the genuine advantage that comes with the easymode-grind. All you have to do to get easy kills is sit there and mash 4 buttons, while in a skill-based game, or a game that virtually starts at maxlevel, you have to actually be clever/social/organized to succeed.

M

So what you are saying is that its perfectly reasonable for a person to pay a ticket to watch a football match, and when that person is in the stadium demand! that the teams start playing basketball instead because that person doesnt like to watch football? Didnt these people know Aion was a level based game? didnt they know the game was from korea? dont they know by now how korean games handle the leveling curve? if you dont like football, then dont pay tickets for football matches, simple. but dont ruin it for us who like it.

I think EVE is a glorified screensaver and you dont see me posting in the EVE forums bitching about how bad it is do you?

Originally posted by Meridion

The leveling curve is not meant to be 'challenging' nor is it meant to be something to sort out the losers that can't take the grind.

The leveling curve is only one thing, timesink, the longer people grind the more money they pay. Devs just have to balance the carrot and the sink, it's as easy as that... plus the fact that Korean nerds are considering teh grind as something like a 'Trial of Willpower' kind of Kung Fu mental resilience thing... I guess... or they're just nerdier than western nerds, or whatever...

M

That is like saying that the dificulty of the game is not meant to be challenging but only there as a timesink. That is nonsense. Since games were first done they needed to have some kind of dificulty to be interesting and challenging to people. Otherwise people would just get bored quickly and leave.

Nothing to do with nerdiness or whatever. Games, be it computer games or not, need to be challenging or people wont be playing them.

Originally posted by Meridion

Have you guys ever though about the fact that getting done with the whole leveling crap might have other motivations than 'lol too slow I wanna pwn teh game now!!11'?

Maybe people want to get rid of the leveling because they actually don't like levelling. I mean, do you like the level concept? In a PvP game? Where some random guy can kick your behind just because he is 10 levels above you. The only thing he had to do to be in this position is start the game like 2 weeks before you did.

In my experience, people tend to wear this 'teh level grind is for true hardcore gamers' because they actually enjoy the genuine advantage that comes with the easymode-grind. All you have to do to get easy kills is sit there and mash 4 buttons, while in a skill-based game, or a game that virtually starts at maxlevel, you have to actually be clever/social/organized to succeed.

M

More rubbish. I have played RPG games since I was a child and all of them had some kind of development. You finish quests, deeds or whatever and you gained some benefit. That is how RPGs have always been.

If you dont like that then maybe RPGs are not for you? You sound like you are more interested in a traditional FPS game where you are just thrown into the action. That is fine, but dont expect RPGs to be the same. Developing your character has always been an integral part of RPGs and I hope will always be.

Now the problem of the high levels vs the lower levels will always exist but that does not mean that all fights are like that. There are fighting among higher levels as well (probably more so since it is completely voluntary if you want to enter the Abyss or not). And in those fights you need to be "clever/social/organized to succeed".

Funny though that you are playing Eve, which has probably the largest difference between people with different ships, modules and skills than any other game. It takes MONTHS to be competetive in Eve and many corps have a minimum reqs. for how many SPs you got before you can be invited.

Originally posted by zantax

You know back in the day, god that makes me sound old but, back in the day I used to play Asheron's Call, and from release day on there was one goal on my mind and that was to hit level 126.  I listened to the message boreds and it took 1 guy almost a year of constant playing to finally get to max level.  The only reason he got there was because he had exploited the vassel/monarch system, well not an exploite he just found a way to maximize what he was doing.  I remember the devs saying the exp curve goes up such that the total experiance you attained by 125 is the same amount you now need to get to 126, so you have to double your experiance to go up to 126.  Now thinking logically if it took you 1 year to get to 125 it should take you 1 year to get to 126 playing the same amount.

The thing with AC is sometimes gaining experiance to raise a skill was boreing but the need to get those extra 3 points in sword or life magic was important enough to make you push through it, or any of the other skills in the game.  The point being if getting to max level is your goal then games should be a grind, but if enjoying the journey, or all the game has to offer so that you get the best bang for your buck then grinds are masked with a purpose that go by quickly.  Everyone has a compulsion to get to max level in every MMO, most are not taking the time to enjoy what games have to offer.

In today's Theme park games that lead you from ride to ride with a little golden "!" or "?" we have lost the want to just play the full game IMO of course.  True Open world/universe MMO's seem to be a dieing breed but I wish they would come back, todays MMO's are nothing but FPS games with a minor achievment system implemented.  The immersion factor is gone, as for Aion I don't mind it but again it hasn't given me that feeling of a great community, or world that I am making a difference in or that I can truely explore.  Maybe I will go back to COD4 at least then I don't waste my time leveling up, I just play my 3 hours and swear at people...LOL

 

I agree.  If Aion had more 'sandbox' type content, I could understand the people who say don't rush to endgame, slow down, enjoy the ride - but these themepark MMOs seem all about chasing the carrot from ride to ride.  Rushing to endgame is what it's all about.  That's the way all the content is designed, to point the character in that direction.  So, that's how people are going to play it.

And the PvP, of course, but that's largely an endgame thing - or it certainly will be, as more people get there.  Just another part of the carrot on the string system, to help encourage people to buckle down and grind, in a game that isn't really about giving players much to do that isn't a big neon arrow pointing to 50.

It's an issue common to MMOs, though.  I don't agree with people who say Aion is any worse than most of the competition for it, and I think whether the grind is too fast or too slow is really besides the point.