Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by infofront

The reason PvPers like MMOs over standard FPSes (Call of Duty and such) is that they can get an advantage over everyone else in an MMO. It's all about having an unfair advantage over everyone in PvP, as it proves one's massive epeen to the world. When you're one of the the people who rushes to level 45, you're perpetually a step ahead of the vast majority of players at everything. I've already seen a couple geared 45s running around (showing off in noob towns). These guys are perfecting their gear  while the rest of us are still  levelling.

I think that's why these people are always bitching about more content and more end-game. They  have to make sure their items are better than everyone else's.

 

MMO's also offer more scope and variation than a standard FPS game. Some people prefer to play them because they get the player conflict that they could be getting in a standard FPS game, but they also get a large world to roam around in and hunt other players. It all takes place in a persistent world rather than being a load of unconnected seperate battles that have no bearing on anything. MMO's also offer more scope to customise your character which you dont get in normal FPS games. This is why many people prefer to use these games as their battlegrounds rather than standard FPS games. You can whine and moan about e-peen waving if you like but then you could just as well accuse anyone who makes/buys a powerful piece of armour/weapon and equips it. Oh gosh who do they think they are?! Strutting around showing off their gear! How dare they rub it in the faces of people who have weaker characters! Shame on them for having higher level characters with better stuff! The scum!

Also the fact that a level 45 player can wander back to a starting town completely invalidates peoples claims that they are "skipping 90% of the content". The content doesnt disappear simply because they are high level. They can go back and do it any time they like. The fact of the matter is that they CHOOSE not to do so because they know its irrelevant. You could throw the same "your skipping 90% of the content" accusation at people who choose to play the game without doing quests. All that "content" is literally just a collection of text files. Its nothing more than that. You're kidding yourself if you think its something deeper.......not that there's anything wrong with kidding yourself mind you. We're all free to waste our time however we choose in these games.......a fact you seem to be overlooking.

I think people who get irritated by high level players who have rushed to the end do so because those players are a constant reminder of how pointless the games "content" actually is (pointless doesnt neccessarily = unenjoyable or bad by the way). People who want to feel immersed in the game world dont like to be reminded that all of their "hard work" (lol) is completely futile. When you're roaming through the wilderness harvesting vegetables and fighting coyotes for their scraps of leather so that you can eventually save up enough to make yourself a new pair of trousers, I'm sure it can be a real slap in the face when a max level player strolls by wearing all of the gear that you are eventually looking forward to having.....and knowing that they got all of it with absolute minimum effort or time investment. The swine! How dare they cheapen your experience of the game! Its a reminder that you are not unique in any way at all and that in fact you are just a drone (or a clone) plodding along through the pre-planned content just like everyone else. On that matter you could actually have all the stuff they have so I dont see why its a problem for you. Afterall everything in the game is accessable to everyone equally. Besides do these high level players send you mocking messages about how superior their gear is? No I didnt think so. You're perception of e-peen waving is simply in your head and probably stems from jealosy because you would like to be e-peen waving yourself. You shouldnt judge others by your own standards.

Basicly Fallen Earth is an open-ended level based themepark game and as such all of its quests are not neccessary or required. They're optional. As such there is no reason to complain about how people choose to play the game as it has no real impact on your experience of it. If a person wants to rush to max level and then freely roam around the entire game world at their leisure wiping the floor with lower level mobs and players then there is nothing wrong with that. The lower level players can bitch and moan about how unfair it is while they slowly plod their way through the game but thats their problem. Icarus chose to make a game with levels in it and then introduced PvP.......so naturally people are gonna want to be max level so their characters are more powerful. Its a sensible thing to do in a level based game. Everyone strives for perfection just as they do in real life. However in MMO's like this one perfection is measured by numbers on a character sheet as well as player skill so its normal to try and gain any advantage you can get. Why would you choose to deliberately make your character worse than everyone else?

Apparently one is left with lots of time to type when one rushes to max level and has nothing better to do. Instead of wasting my time typing an equally long reply, I'll give you a gift:  www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/  Once you memorize these, you'll find that you can delete 85% of your post. This could save you lots of time in the future.

Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by infofront

The reason PvPers like MMOs over standard FPSes (Call of Duty and such) is that they can get an advantage over everyone else in an MMO. It's all about having an unfair advantage over everyone in PvP, as it proves one's massive epeen to the world. When you're one of the the people who rushes to level 45, you're perpetually a step ahead of the vast majority of players at everything. I've already seen a couple geared 45s running around (showing off in noob towns). These guys are perfecting their gear  while the rest of us are still  levelling.

I think that's why these people are always bitching about more content and more end-game. They  have to make sure their items are better than everyone else's.

 *Wall of text*

You generalize way too much, and are way too sure about how other people's minds work. You are very wrong in most of your points, but you will never see it, as you are quite obviously convinced that you know all and everyone. Trust me, it's not like that.

Anyway, everyone is entitled to their own beliefs :D

DB

Originally posted by infofront

Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by infofront

The reason PvPers like MMOs over standard FPSes (Call of Duty and such) is that they can get an advantage over everyone else in an MMO. It's all about having an unfair advantage over everyone in PvP, as it proves one's massive epeen to the world. When you're one of the the people who rushes to level 45, you're perpetually a step ahead of the vast majority of players at everything. I've already seen a couple geared 45s running around (showing off in noob towns). These guys are perfecting their gear  while the rest of us are still  levelling.

I think that's why these people are always bitching about more content and more end-game. They  have to make sure their items are better than everyone else's.

 

* my wall of text *

 

Apparently one is left with lots of time to type when one rushes to max level and has nothing better to do. Instead of wasting my time typing an equally long reply, I'll give you a gift:  www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/  Once you memorize these, you'll find that you can delete 85% of your post. This could save you lots of time in the future.

I'm level 6. As I clearly said in a previous post I'm not interested in rushing to max level. I have always enjoyed playing games slowly and taking my time and this one is no exception. So far I havent really left the area of Odenville, the second town I visited. Once again you display how utterly ignorant and judgemental of others you are. Think before you type.

However unlike yourself I dont look down my snooty nose at people who play the game at a different pace to me. I can see all sides of the multi-faceted coin, not just the one I prefer to be on. Some people like to spend ages reading the text files and pretending they are in a world. Others like to powergame and be competitive with others.

(insert shrug of indifference here) 

Oh and your lack of a decent reply has nothing to do with you not wanting to waste your time.......and you know it

Originally posted by DonnieBrasco

Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by infofront

The reason PvPers like MMOs over standard FPSes (Call of Duty and such) is that they can get an advantage over everyone else in an MMO. It's all about having an unfair advantage over everyone in PvP, as it proves one's massive epeen to the world. When you're one of the the people who rushes to level 45, you're perpetually a step ahead of the vast majority of players at everything. I've already seen a couple geared 45s running around (showing off in noob towns). These guys are perfecting their gear  while the rest of us are still  levelling.

I think that's why these people are always bitching about more content and more end-game. They  have to make sure their items are better than everyone else's.

 *Wall of text*

 

You generalize way too much, and are way too sure about how other people's minds work. You are very wrong in most of your points, but you will never see it, as you are quite obviously convinced that you know all and everyone. Trust me, it's not like that.

Anyway, everyone is entitled to their own beliefs :D

DB

Actually no I offered alternate viewpoints as to why people powergame, rather than simply joining in with the elitist mmo snobbery that is taking place in this thread. I’m sorry but I refuse to view powerlevelers and anyone who chooses to rush through the game with contempt. Its stupid. They are just players that are enjoying the game in there own particular way. This is a themepark game and what other players choose to do has no real impact on how I play the game. Hell I havent even needed to talk to anyone in this game so far apart from in the help channel.

I'm not convinced that I know how everyone thinks at all. However most of the people in this thread seem to think they do......which is why I was pointing out that powerlevelers are not "the bad guys". I'm not the one generalising. Other people in this thread are already doing a much better job of that. The majority of the replies go along the lines of "I play the game slowly and read all the quest text. Anyone who powerlevels and ignores all the text files is not playing the game properly.....because they are not appreciating the game in the same way that I am".

Like you said everyone is entitled to their own beliefs. So why is it that most of the people in this thread cant understand that? If someone wants to rush to max level as fast as they can then there is nothing wrong with that.......especially when you can freeling roam anywhere you like. It actually makes sense in this game to be max level. They are not missing out on anything at all. So some of them are not interested in reading all the text files that the devs have littered around the game. Big deal. Some people are more focused on playing competitive online games with other people rather than reading stories. Thats up to them isnt it? I personally quite like reading what the quests have to say but at the same time I know its all bullshit and I can perfectly understand why someone would find it all boring.

Different strokes for different folks.

Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by DonnieBrasco

Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by infofront

The reason PvPers like MMOs over standard FPSes (Call of Duty and such) is that they can get an advantage over everyone else in an MMO. It's all about having an unfair advantage over everyone in PvP, as it proves one's massive epeen to the world. When you're one of the the people who rushes to level 45, you're perpetually a step ahead of the vast majority of players at everything. I've already seen a couple geared 45s running around (showing off in noob towns). These guys are perfecting their gear  while the rest of us are still  levelling.

I think that's why these people are always bitching about more content and more end-game. They  have to make sure their items are better than everyone else's.

 *Wall of text*

 

You generalize way too much, and are way too sure about how other people's minds work. You are very wrong in most of your points, but you will never see it, as you are quite obviously convinced that you know all and everyone. Trust me, it's not like that.

Anyway, everyone is entitled to their own beliefs :D

DB

 

Actually no I offered alternate viewpoints as to why people powergame, rather than simply joining in with the elitist mmo snobbery that is taking place in this thread. I’m sorry but I refuse to view powerlevelers and anyone who chooses to rush through the game with contempt. Its stupid. They are just players that are enjoying the game in there own particular way. This is a themepark game and what other players choose to do has no real impact on how I play the game. Hell I havent even needed to talk to anyone in this game so far apart from in the help channel.

I'm not convinced that I know how everyone thinks at all. However most of the people in this thread seem to think they do......which is why I was pointing out that powerlevelers are not "the bad guys". I'm not the one generalising. Other people in this thread are already doing a much better job of that. The majority of the replies go along the lines of "I play the game slowly and read all the quest text. Anyone who powerlevels and ignores all the text files is not playing the game properly.....because they are not appreciating the game in the same way that I am".

Like you said everyone is entitled to their own beliefs. So why is it that most of the people in this thread cant understand that? If someone wants to rush to max level as fast as they can then there is nothing wrong with that.......especially when you can freeling roam anywhere you like. It actually makes sense in this game to be max level. They are not missing out on anything at all. So some of them are not interested in reading all the text files that the devs have littered around the game. Big deal. Some people are more focused on playing competitive online games with other people rather than reading stories. Thats up to them isnt it? I personally quite like reading what the quests have to say but at the same time I know its all bullshit and I can perfectly understand why someone would find it all boring.

Different strokes for different folks.

I think the point is being missed in this thread.  There is nothing wrong with powerlevelers, been guilty of doing it myself on occasion.  The problem is that the people the OP origionally talks about are upset because they want to buy chips/materials with real money.  Those kind of players aren't powerlevelers, they are scrubs that want everything handed to them or bought for them.  They are the same ones that buy accounts on ebay and have no idea what they are doing but think they are the greatest thing since sliced bread.  Those players have no idea about how the game really works and clog up chat channels with questions that the game answered for most people in the early levels.  They also are the ones that scream for nerfs and that they are gimped. 

They bitch about low level AP missions cause it is a chore to go back to the starting towns to get the extra AP (tired of this whine).  The game was made a certain way so leveling characters would get some extra AP while leveling regardless of their starting town.  If you want more than your starting town AP missions then you have to go earn it.  It's not supposed to be convenient since the game wasn't made that way.

Originally posted by StuBidasoe

Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by DonnieBrasco

Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by infofront

The reason PvPers like MMOs over standard FPSes (Call of Duty and such) is that they can get an advantage over everyone else in an MMO. It's all about having an unfair advantage over everyone in PvP, as it proves one's massive epeen to the world. When you're one of the the people who rushes to level 45, you're perpetually a step ahead of the vast majority of players at everything. I've already seen a couple geared 45s running around (showing off in noob towns). These guys are perfecting their gear  while the rest of us are still  levelling.

I think that's why these people are always bitching about more content and more end-game. They  have to make sure their items are better than everyone else's.

 *Wall of text*

 

You generalize way too much, and are way too sure about how other people's minds work. You are very wrong in most of your points, but you will never see it, as you are quite obviously convinced that you know all and everyone. Trust me, it's not like that.

Anyway, everyone is entitled to their own beliefs :D

DB

 

Actually no I offered alternate viewpoints as to why people powergame, rather than simply joining in with the elitist mmo snobbery that is taking place in this thread. I’m sorry but I refuse to view powerlevelers and anyone who chooses to rush through the game with contempt. Its stupid. They are just players that are enjoying the game in there own particular way. This is a themepark game and what other players choose to do has no real impact on how I play the game. Hell I havent even needed to talk to anyone in this game so far apart from in the help channel.

I'm not convinced that I know how everyone thinks at all. However most of the people in this thread seem to think they do......which is why I was pointing out that powerlevelers are not "the bad guys". I'm not the one generalising. Other people in this thread are already doing a much better job of that. The majority of the replies go along the lines of "I play the game slowly and read all the quest text. Anyone who powerlevels and ignores all the text files is not playing the game properly.....because they are not appreciating the game in the same way that I am".

Like you said everyone is entitled to their own beliefs. So why is it that most of the people in this thread cant understand that? If someone wants to rush to max level as fast as they can then there is nothing wrong with that.......especially when you can freeling roam anywhere you like. It actually makes sense in this game to be max level. They are not missing out on anything at all. So some of them are not interested in reading all the text files that the devs have littered around the game. Big deal. Some people are more focused on playing competitive online games with other people rather than reading stories. Thats up to them isnt it? I personally quite like reading what the quests have to say but at the same time I know its all bullshit and I can perfectly understand why someone would find it all boring.

Different strokes for different folks.

 

I think the point is being missed in this thread.  There is nothing wrong with powerlevelers, been guilty of doing it myself on occasion.  The problem is that the people the OP origionally talks about are upset because they want to buy chips/materials with real money.  Those kind of players aren't powerlevelers, they are scrubs that want everything handed to them or bought for them.  They are the same ones that buy accounts on ebay and have no idea what they are doing but think they are the greatest thing since sliced bread.  Those players have no idea about how the game really works and clog up chat channels with questions that the game answered for most people in the early levels.  They also are the ones that scream for nerfs and that they are gimped. 

They bitch about low level AP missions cause it is a chore to go back to the starting towns to get the extra AP (tired of this whine).  The game was made a certain way so leveling characters would get some extra AP while leveling regardless of their starting town.  If you want more than your starting town AP missions then you have to go earn it.  It's not supposed to be convenient since the game wasn't made that way.

Well, I think it depends on the power leveler.  I mean, yeah, in CoX I've power leveled a character by way of in game grouping and XP farming after playing through the game a few times on other characters.  I think what irked me was the way they wanted to power level.  Saying things like "I'll have the best items in the game and you'll still be grinding your character for the chips" puts power leveling in perspective as far as the different facets of the way these guys wanted leveling to be done.

Gold sellers farming steel and fasteners and selling them online for 10 bucks a pop? They'll pay it.  Need 60 red chips for a complete armor set? Buy it from the gold seller.    

Its like, in a mature game I was hoping to meet people who were looking for the journey, not the destination.  With 150 levels total to go, and the immense amount of time it takes to level, playing cut-throat to have an advantage over other players and encouraging sellers so that they can use the easy button just didn't seem right.  These are the same guys who come back to Sector 1 at max level and kill players in the PvP zones. 

Originally posted by maskedweasel

Originally posted by StuBidasoe

Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by DonnieBrasco

Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by infofront

The reason PvPers like MMOs over standard FPSes (Call of Duty and such) is that they can get an advantage over everyone else in an MMO. It's all about having an unfair advantage over everyone in PvP, as it proves one's massive epeen to the world. When you're one of the the people who rushes to level 45, you're perpetually a step ahead of the vast majority of players at everything. I've already seen a couple geared 45s running around (showing off in noob towns). These guys are perfecting their gear  while the rest of us are still  levelling.

I think that's why these people are always bitching about more content and more end-game. They  have to make sure their items are better than everyone else's.

 *Wall of text*

 

You generalize way too much, and are way too sure about how other people's minds work. You are very wrong in most of your points, but you will never see it, as you are quite obviously convinced that you know all and everyone. Trust me, it's not like that.

Anyway, everyone is entitled to their own beliefs :D

DB

 

Actually no I offered alternate viewpoints as to why people powergame, rather than simply joining in with the elitist mmo snobbery that is taking place in this thread. I’m sorry but I refuse to view powerlevelers and anyone who chooses to rush through the game with contempt. Its stupid. They are just players that are enjoying the game in there own particular way. This is a themepark game and what other players choose to do has no real impact on how I play the game. Hell I havent even needed to talk to anyone in this game so far apart from in the help channel.

I'm not convinced that I know how everyone thinks at all. However most of the people in this thread seem to think they do......which is why I was pointing out that powerlevelers are not "the bad guys". I'm not the one generalising. Other people in this thread are already doing a much better job of that. The majority of the replies go along the lines of "I play the game slowly and read all the quest text. Anyone who powerlevels and ignores all the text files is not playing the game properly.....because they are not appreciating the game in the same way that I am".

Like you said everyone is entitled to their own beliefs. So why is it that most of the people in this thread cant understand that? If someone wants to rush to max level as fast as they can then there is nothing wrong with that.......especially when you can freeling roam anywhere you like. It actually makes sense in this game to be max level. They are not missing out on anything at all. So some of them are not interested in reading all the text files that the devs have littered around the game. Big deal. Some people are more focused on playing competitive online games with other people rather than reading stories. Thats up to them isnt it? I personally quite like reading what the quests have to say but at the same time I know its all bullshit and I can perfectly understand why someone would find it all boring.

Different strokes for different folks.

 

I think the point is being missed in this thread.  There is nothing wrong with powerlevelers, been guilty of doing it myself on occasion.  The problem is that the people the OP origionally talks about are upset because they want to buy chips/materials with real money.  Those kind of players aren't powerlevelers, they are scrubs that want everything handed to them or bought for them.  They are the same ones that buy accounts on ebay and have no idea what they are doing but think they are the greatest thing since sliced bread.  Those players have no idea about how the game really works and clog up chat channels with questions that the game answered for most people in the early levels.  They also are the ones that scream for nerfs and that they are gimped. 

They bitch about low level AP missions cause it is a chore to go back to the starting towns to get the extra AP (tired of this whine).  The game was made a certain way so leveling characters would get some extra AP while leveling regardless of their starting town.  If you want more than your starting town AP missions then you have to go earn it.  It's not supposed to be convenient since the game wasn't made that way.

 

Well, I think it depends on the power leveler.  I mean, yeah, in CoX I've power leveled a character by way of in game grouping and XP farming after playing through the game a few times on other characters.  I think what irked me was the way they wanted to power level.  Saying things like "I'll have the best items in the game and you'll still be grinding your character for the chips" puts power leveling in perspective as far as the different facets of the way these guys wanted leveling to be done.

 

Gold sellers farming steel and fasteners and selling them online for 10 bucks a pop? They'll pay it.  Need 60 red chips for a complete armor set? Buy it from the gold seller.    

 

Its like, in a mature game I was hoping to meet people who were looking for the journey, not the destination.  With 150 levels total to go, and the immense amount of time it takes to level, playing cut-throat to have an advantage over other players and encouraging sellers so that they can use the easy button just didn't seem right.  These are the same guys who come back to Sector 1 at max level and kill players in the PvP zones. 

Yeah but the way they choose to play the game has not got nothing to do with you. If they want to spend real money on stuff then thats up to them. If it makes them happy then good for them. Why are you bothered about it? What they choose to do has no relevance to what you want to do. Just stop playing with them if hanging around with them is so annoying. There are loads of people in the game so find someone else to play it with.

Originally posted by StuBidasoe

Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by DonnieBrasco

Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by infofront

The reason PvPers like MMOs over standard FPSes (Call of Duty and such) is that they can get an advantage over everyone else in an MMO. It's all about having an unfair advantage over everyone in PvP, as it proves one's massive epeen to the world. When you're one of the the people who rushes to level 45, you're perpetually a step ahead of the vast majority of players at everything. I've already seen a couple geared 45s running around (showing off in noob towns). These guys are perfecting their gear  while the rest of us are still  levelling.

I think that's why these people are always bitching about more content and more end-game. They  have to make sure their items are better than everyone else's.

 *Wall of text*

 

You generalize way too much, and are way too sure about how other people's minds work. You are very wrong in most of your points, but you will never see it, as you are quite obviously convinced that you know all and everyone. Trust me, it's not like that.

Anyway, everyone is entitled to their own beliefs :D

DB

 

Actually no I offered alternate viewpoints as to why people powergame, rather than simply joining in with the elitist mmo snobbery that is taking place in this thread. I’m sorry but I refuse to view powerlevelers and anyone who chooses to rush through the game with contempt. Its stupid. They are just players that are enjoying the game in there own particular way. This is a themepark game and what other players choose to do has no real impact on how I play the game. Hell I havent even needed to talk to anyone in this game so far apart from in the help channel.

I'm not convinced that I know how everyone thinks at all. However most of the people in this thread seem to think they do......which is why I was pointing out that powerlevelers are not "the bad guys". I'm not the one generalising. Other people in this thread are already doing a much better job of that. The majority of the replies go along the lines of "I play the game slowly and read all the quest text. Anyone who powerlevels and ignores all the text files is not playing the game properly.....because they are not appreciating the game in the same way that I am".

Like you said everyone is entitled to their own beliefs. So why is it that most of the people in this thread cant understand that? If someone wants to rush to max level as fast as they can then there is nothing wrong with that.......especially when you can freeling roam anywhere you like. It actually makes sense in this game to be max level. They are not missing out on anything at all. So some of them are not interested in reading all the text files that the devs have littered around the game. Big deal. Some people are more focused on playing competitive online games with other people rather than reading stories. Thats up to them isnt it? I personally quite like reading what the quests have to say but at the same time I know its all bullshit and I can perfectly understand why someone would find it all boring.

Different strokes for different folks.

 

I think the point is being missed in this thread.  There is nothing wrong with powerlevelers, been guilty of doing it myself on occasion.  The problem is that the people the OP origionally talks about are upset because they want to buy chips/materials with real money.  Those kind of players aren't powerlevelers, they are scrubs that want everything handed to them or bought for them.  They are the same ones that buy accounts on ebay and have no idea what they are doing but think they are the greatest thing since sliced bread.  Those players have no idea about how the game really works and clog up chat channels with questions that the game answered for most people in the early levels.  They also are the ones that scream for nerfs and that they are gimped. 

They bitch about low level AP missions cause it is a chore to go back to the starting towns to get the extra AP (tired of this whine).  The game was made a certain way so leveling characters would get some extra AP while leveling regardless of their starting town.  If you want more than your starting town AP missions then you have to go earn it.  It's not supposed to be convenient since the game wasn't made that way.

Yeah but its not a problem though is it. It simply doesnt matter. So they are nasty evil old scrubs who dont want to grind to get stuff. So what? So they buy accounts on e-bay. So what? Its up to them. It doesnt matter to anyone else what they decide to do with their time and money.

....and you're talking about these people clogging up the channels with questions. Really? Prove it. They are the ones who scream for nerfs? Prove it.

From what I have seen so far the help channel is already a constant flow of stupid questions. Duhh whats best? Pistols, rifles or melee? Duuuhhh where should I kill stuff for level 6? Duuuhh how do I put my horse back in my inventory? Duuuuh whats the best class in this game? Duuuhh should I put my points in stats or skills? I'm interested in knowing how you can spot these "e-bay account buying scrubs" amongst all of that. How the hell does it detract from your gaming experience anyway? I mean really come on its an MMO for gods sake. It doesnt require that much figuring out to play it.......and it certainly doesnt require you to play through all the repeated content to become some "uber player". Or is there something really different, super clever and complex partway through the game that I dont know about?

Yeah the game was made a certain way. It doesnt mean you MUST play it that way. Thats one of the good things about this game. You can play it in whatever way you like. If that involves buying a max level character on an e-bay and then running around ganking all the low level players and mobs then thats fine too. They're gonna get to max level eventually anyway.

Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by maskedweasel

Originally posted by StuBidasoe

Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by DonnieBrasco

Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by infofront

The reason PvPers like MMOs over standard FPSes (Call of Duty and such) is that they can get an advantage over everyone else in an MMO. It's all about having an unfair advantage over everyone in PvP, as it proves one's massive epeen to the world. When you're one of the the people who rushes to level 45, you're perpetually a step ahead of the vast majority of players at everything. I've already seen a couple geared 45s running around (showing off in noob towns). These guys are perfecting their gear  while the rest of us are still  levelling.

I think that's why these people are always bitching about more content and more end-game. They  have to make sure their items are better than everyone else's.

 *Wall of text*

 

You generalize way too much, and are way too sure about how other people's minds work. You are very wrong in most of your points, but you will never see it, as you are quite obviously convinced that you know all and everyone. Trust me, it's not like that.

Anyway, everyone is entitled to their own beliefs :D

DB

 

Actually no I offered alternate viewpoints as to why people powergame, rather than simply joining in with the elitist mmo snobbery that is taking place in this thread. I’m sorry but I refuse to view powerlevelers and anyone who chooses to rush through the game with contempt. Its stupid. They are just players that are enjoying the game in there own particular way. This is a themepark game and what other players choose to do has no real impact on how I play the game. Hell I havent even needed to talk to anyone in this game so far apart from in the help channel.

I'm not convinced that I know how everyone thinks at all. However most of the people in this thread seem to think they do......which is why I was pointing out that powerlevelers are not "the bad guys". I'm not the one generalising. Other people in this thread are already doing a much better job of that. The majority of the replies go along the lines of "I play the game slowly and read all the quest text. Anyone who powerlevels and ignores all the text files is not playing the game properly.....because they are not appreciating the game in the same way that I am".

Like you said everyone is entitled to their own beliefs. So why is it that most of the people in this thread cant understand that? If someone wants to rush to max level as fast as they can then there is nothing wrong with that.......especially when you can freeling roam anywhere you like. It actually makes sense in this game to be max level. They are not missing out on anything at all. So some of them are not interested in reading all the text files that the devs have littered around the game. Big deal. Some people are more focused on playing competitive online games with other people rather than reading stories. Thats up to them isnt it? I personally quite like reading what the quests have to say but at the same time I know its all bullshit and I can perfectly understand why someone would find it all boring.

Different strokes for different folks.

 

I think the point is being missed in this thread.  There is nothing wrong with powerlevelers, been guilty of doing it myself on occasion.  The problem is that the people the OP origionally talks about are upset because they want to buy chips/materials with real money.  Those kind of players aren't powerlevelers, they are scrubs that want everything handed to them or bought for them.  They are the same ones that buy accounts on ebay and have no idea what they are doing but think they are the greatest thing since sliced bread.  Those players have no idea about how the game really works and clog up chat channels with questions that the game answered for most people in the early levels.  They also are the ones that scream for nerfs and that they are gimped. 

They bitch about low level AP missions cause it is a chore to go back to the starting towns to get the extra AP (tired of this whine).  The game was made a certain way so leveling characters would get some extra AP while leveling regardless of their starting town.  If you want more than your starting town AP missions then you have to go earn it.  It's not supposed to be convenient since the game wasn't made that way.

 

Well, I think it depends on the power leveler.  I mean, yeah, in CoX I've power leveled a character by way of in game grouping and XP farming after playing through the game a few times on other characters.  I think what irked me was the way they wanted to power level.  Saying things like "I'll have the best items in the game and you'll still be grinding your character for the chips" puts power leveling in perspective as far as the different facets of the way these guys wanted leveling to be done.

 

Gold sellers farming steel and fasteners and selling them online for 10 bucks a pop? They'll pay it.  Need 60 red chips for a complete armor set? Buy it from the gold seller.    

 

Its like, in a mature game I was hoping to meet people who were looking for the journey, not the destination.  With 150 levels total to go, and the immense amount of time it takes to level, playing cut-throat to have an advantage over other players and encouraging sellers so that they can use the easy button just didn't seem right.  These are the same guys who come back to Sector 1 at max level and kill players in the PvP zones. 

 

Yeah but the way they choose to play the game has not got nothing to do with you. If they want to spend real money on stuff then thats up to them. If it makes them happy then good for them. Why are you bothered about it? What they choose to do has no relevance to what you want to do. Just stop playing with them if hanging around with them is so annoying. There are loads of people in the game so find someone else to play it with.

Well that can be debated as if they support gold sellers they kill the economy and as a crafter that effects me very much. Some could argue voting with your wallet, that you'd rather pay someone else to play the game and get everything for you kills community, kills gameplay and gives unfair advantages... but then again, thats what its all about.. unfair advantages.  

I won't debate it though,  you're right that they can play the game however they want, even if by their playing the game, they aren't actually playing the game.  Do I like it? No.  Why do I hang around them? I don't.  They were in my clan, and they still are in my clan, or... I should say, I'm still in that clan.  I don't team with them, and since that night I haven't spoken to them, and I'm actually excited that I have an alt working on an opposing faction so that I'll have the chance to test their theory on how good they really are.

But, I bring this up because I just want to see how other players feel about it.  The conversation obviously made me out to be the bad guy because I disapproved.... maybe that makes me the bad guy that I don't understand it, and don't like the practice of encouraging gold selling.....     I've never been the bad guy before.

Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by StuBidasoe

I think the point is being missed in this thread.  There is nothing wrong with powerlevelers, been guilty of doing it myself on occasion.  The problem is that the people the OP origionally talks about are upset because they want to buy chips/materials with real money.  Those kind of players aren't powerlevelers, they are scrubs that want everything handed to them or bought for them.  They are the same ones that buy accounts on ebay and have no idea what they are doing but think they are the greatest thing since sliced bread.  Those players have no idea about how the game really works and clog up chat channels with questions that the game answered for most people in the early levels.  They also are the ones that scream for nerfs and that they are gimped. 

They bitch about low level AP missions cause it is a chore to go back to the starting towns to get the extra AP (tired of this whine).  The game was made a certain way so leveling characters would get some extra AP while leveling regardless of their starting town.  If you want more than your starting town AP missions then you have to go earn it.  It's not supposed to be convenient since the game wasn't made that way.

 

Yeah but its not a problem though is it. It simply doesnt matter. So they are nasty evil old scrubs who dont want to grind to get stuff. So what? So they buy accounts on e-bay. So what? Its up to them. It doesnt matter to anyone else what they decide to do with their time and money.

....and you're talking about these people clogging up the channels with questions. Really? Prove it. They are the ones who scream for nerfs? Prove it.

From what I have seen so far the help channel is already a constant flow of stupid questions. Duhh whats best? Pistols, rifles or melee? Duuuhhh where should I kill stuff for level 6? Duuuhh how do I put my horse back in my inventory? Duuuuh whats the best class in this game? Duuuhh should I put my points in stats or skills? I'm interested in knowing how you can spot these "e-bay account buying scrubs" amongst all of that. How the hell does it detract from your gaming experience anyway? I mean really come on its an MMO for gods sake. It doesnt require that much figuring out to play it.......and it certainly doesnt require you to play through all the repeated content to become some "uber player". Or is there something really different, super clever and complex partway through the game that I dont know about?

Yeah the game was made a certain way. It doesnt mean you MUST play it that way. Thats one of the good things about this game. You can play it in whatever way you like. If that involves buying a max level character on an e-bay and then running around ganking all the low level players and mobs then thats fine too. They're gonna get to max level eventually anyway.

I've been in guilds on other games with people who have admitted to buying their account.  They spent every day bugging everyone else about how to do everything...how do I fish?  Why can't I use [insert skill here] more than once a minute?  I got killed by [insert clas here] 2x in a row, they are so op they need to be nerfed.  I'm good why can't I run [insert raid here] with you all?  I can heal/tank/dps all at once so that makes me the best.  I'm just giving my opinion on what I've seen from gold buyers/account buyers.  That's if they even admit to doing it.  Most won't and you'll spend a week trying to figure out what is wrong with them and why they can't carry their own weight. 
 

You're right about what FE's current help channel looks like.  Once you start picking up mutations (level 20 or so) you'll want all the AP you can get.  So you'll run back to starter towns and pick up low level AP missions to get more or you'll grind the faction wheel to get more.  Do I care if you choose to do that?  No.  Does it annoy me when people whine about having to do it for extra AP?  Yes.  Why?  Because they cry on forums and call for the game to be changed so that they can have those extra AP without having to play the game and do the missions for them.

Granted you don't have to play the game that way.  Everyone can play how ever they want, it doesn't bother me.  What bothers me is the people that call for changes to the core of the game simply to convenience themselves instead of putting the effort in to achieve what they want.  It happens all too often in MMOs especially. 

Originally posted by neonwire

Yeah but its not a problem though is it. It simply doesnt matter. So they are nasty evil old scrubs who dont want to grind to get stuff. So what? So they buy accounts on e-bay. So what? Its up to them. It doesnt matter to anyone else what they decide to do with their time and money.

....and you're talking about these people clogging up the channels with questions. Really? Prove it. They are the ones who scream for nerfs? Prove it.

From what I have seen so far the help channel is already a constant flow of stupid questions. Duhh whats best? Pistols, rifles or melee? Duuuhhh where should I kill stuff for level 6? Duuuhh how do I put my horse back in my inventory? Duuuuh whats the best class in this game? Duuuhh should I put my points in stats or skills? I'm interested in knowing how you can spot these "e-bay account buying scrubs" amongst all of that. How the hell does it detract from your gaming experience anyway? I mean really come on its an MMO for gods sake. It doesnt require that much figuring out to play it.......and it certainly doesnt require you to play through all the repeated content to become some "uber player". Or is there something really different, super clever and complex partway through the game that I dont know about?

Yeah the game was made a certain way. It doesnt mean you MUST play it that way. Thats one of the good things about this game. You can play it in whatever way you like. If that involves buying a max level character on an e-bay and then running around ganking all the low level players and mobs then thats fine too. They're gonna get to max level eventually anyway.

Trading real money for in-game advance/advantage is a problem. It is not "up to them". It is cheating and if they are caught they will be dealt with harshly.

The reason this sort of thing is a problem, and the reason it is dealt with harshly, is that it *does* impact other players. Sure, some players may not care, and some players are largely unaffected, but at a broader level it has a negative impact - on the economy and the general atmosphere of everyone being on a level playing field.

It is really no different to any other game or sport, even those that are not particularly competitive. Cheating is lame, whatever spin you want to put on it.

Speaking of lame... getting to max level and then returning to the lower level PvP zones to gank is actually a good definition of the word.

Originally posted by StuBidasoe

Originally posted by neonwire

Originally posted by StuBidasoe

* stuff *

* more stuff *

I've been in guilds on other games with people who have admitted to buying their account.  They spent every day bugging everyone else about how to do everything...how do I fish?  Why can't I use [insert skill here] more than once a minute?  I got killed by [insert clas here] 2x in a row, they are so op they need to be nerfed.  I'm good why can't I run [insert raid here] with you all?  I can heal/tank/dps all at once so that makes me the best.  I'm just giving my opinion on what I've seen from gold buyers/account buyers.  That's if they even admit to doing it.  Most won't and you'll spend a week trying to figure out what is wrong with them and why they can't carry their own weight. 
 

You're right about what FE's current help channel looks like.  Once you start picking up mutations (level 20 or so) you'll want all the AP you can get.  So you'll run back to starter towns and pick up low level AP missions to get more or you'll grind the faction wheel to get more.  Do I care if you choose to do that?  No.  Does it annoy me when people whine about having to do it for extra AP?  Yes.  Why?  Because they cry on forums and call for the game to be changed so that they can have those extra AP without having to play the game and do the missions for them.

Granted you don't have to play the game that way.  Everyone can play how ever they want, it doesn't bother me.  What bothers me is the people that call for changes to the core of the game simply to convenience themselves instead of putting the effort in to achieve what they want.  It happens all too often in MMOs especially. 

If you've had personal experiences with bad players that used paid for accounts then fair enough. It doesnt mean that all people who buy an account are going to be like that. I've had experiences with bad players who havent paid for their accounts too. Whether they paid for their max level character or not is kind of irrelevant. Some people are just shit at playing certain games.

On the other side of the coin, I have a friend who paid for two max level WoW characters. He can play the game perfectly fine and often got pissed off with various people in his guild who didnt know what they were doing and ended up wasting lots of his time. I still thought he was an idiot for wasting his money......but then on the other hand he wasnt doing any harm at all. Its his money afterall. He knew how to play the game and buying some max level characters was just something he wanted to do. He simply wanted to have some extra alts to use for end game stuff when he fancied it and didnt want to waste time going through the leveling process.

To be honest though I cant see any of this being a particularly big issue in Fallen Earth with its emphasis on solo play. Besides if you come across someone who doesnt know what they are doing then.....oh well.....just stop playing with them and play it with someone else. Its only a game. Its not as though anyones life depends on it.

.....and yeah some of those people might whine on forums. So what? Hundreds of people are constantly whining on forums......like this one. The devs are hardly going to rush to change their game simply to fulfil the demands of a few individuals asking for something on the forum. I think they're quite capable of weighing up what is needed in their own game. In fact the devs at Icarus seem to be very good at what they do.

Originally posted by Strap

Originally posted by neonwire

Yeah but its not a problem though is it. It simply doesnt matter. So they are nasty evil old scrubs who dont want to grind to get stuff. So what? So they buy accounts on e-bay. So what? Its up to them. It doesnt matter to anyone else what they decide to do with their time and money.

....and you're talking about these people clogging up the channels with questions. Really? Prove it. They are the ones who scream for nerfs? Prove it.

From what I have seen so far the help channel is already a constant flow of stupid questions. Duhh whats best? Pistols, rifles or melee? Duuuhhh where should I kill stuff for level 6? Duuuhh how do I put my horse back in my inventory? Duuuuh whats the best class in this game? Duuuhh should I put my points in stats or skills? I'm interested in knowing how you can spot these "e-bay account buying scrubs" amongst all of that. How the hell does it detract from your gaming experience anyway? I mean really come on its an MMO for gods sake. It doesnt require that much figuring out to play it.......and it certainly doesnt require you to play through all the repeated content to become some "uber player". Or is there something really different, super clever and complex partway through the game that I dont know about?

Yeah the game was made a certain way. It doesnt mean you MUST play it that way. Thats one of the good things about this game. You can play it in whatever way you like. If that involves buying a max level character on an e-bay and then running around ganking all the low level players and mobs then thats fine too. They're gonna get to max level eventually anyway.

 

Trading real money for in-game advance/advantage is a problem. It is not "up to them". It is cheating and if they are caught they will be dealt with harshly.

 

The reason this sort of thing is a problem, and the reason it is dealt with harshly, is that it *does* impact other players. Sure, some players may not care, and some players are largely unaffected, but at a broader level it has a negative impact - on the economy and the general atmosphere of everyone being on a level playing field.

 

It is really no different to any other game or sport, even those that are not particularly competitive. Cheating is lame, whatever spin you want to put on it.

 

Speaking of lame... getting to max level and then returning to the lower level PvP zones to gank is actually a good definition of the word.

Ok yeah sure I agree that cheating is indeed lame.......particularly in a PvP game.......BUT........what are these people actually buying? They certainly arent buying something that is not accessable to other players in the game. For example players cant illegitimately purchase a super weapon that no-one else can get and thus gain an unfair advantage. All these people are getting for their money is time.......and thats precidely how Icarus are making their money. They are charging you money to spend your time in their game. Obviously the length of time it takes to level a character in FE varies from person to person, but lets say it takes a particular person 3 months. That means that person has paid Icarus nearly £30 (spread over 3 monthly payments) for a max level character. Its the same thing as someone just buying the max level character straight out. The only thing that is different is the time investment. No advantage is really gained at all.

Also getting to max level and then returning to low level areas to gank people is not a good definition of the word "lame" at all. In a PvP game its actually a sensible thing to do. It is however a good definition of "bad game design". However is that even possible in Fallen Earth? I have no idea to be honest.

The thing is Icarus made a game that has levels and then introduced PvP into it. Someone is always going to be higher level than someone else. Its a shame actually that they did that. Icarus appear to have lacked the confidence to go all the way and make their game into something that really stands out. They have a stat based system.......and yet they still have character levels. Why? They have a big open-ended game world......and yet they still have linear zone progression. Why? Its as though they were too scared that all the players who have been brain-washed by the latest mmos just wouldnt get it, so they played it safe and only went halfway. They still did a good job with what they have achieved though and I'm not knocking that.

Originally posted by Aganazer

Its been since Asheron's Call that I have been able to play a MMOG as an explorer. All the newer games have been designed purely around acheivement. I think there are a lot of gamers that aren't able to break the habit.

Absolutely. 

That game (as my first MMO) absolutely spoiled me. Nothing since then has even come close in terms of scope, breadth, and maturity. It looks like FE might be close.

As AC Alumni... Have you played the game? What do you think?

I'm currently downloading the trial, if you haven't played yet, I'll let you know.