I see a lot of people quit because the grind was too hard....

Right now there are plenty people at lvl 40 or at least close and there not hardcore grinders who got to lvl 50 in 2 weeks, so about 1 month and a bit more to get to lvl 40ish isnt really that hard. but in Aion there is Raids and dungoens as well and most important the ABYSS i spend most of my time dungoening and grinding in the abyss and its really fun bcuz you'll never know when ull get attacked which puts fun into grinding. and when i had enough grind i go around killing people XD

putting all these together and for me i've never gotten bored

there are some things that piss me off tho....

you cant got sieges .....crash or dc

spammers gold sellers(the numbers got less after the new patch avg. 1 new spammer per day)

but i can live with this =] im sure NCsoft will address those 2 problems soon after all.

WHO WANTS TO LOSE MONEY???

The new crop of MMO players are conditioned to believe that "The game starts at the end-game". So they are basically ignoring everything and they play any game in the most unfunny but effective way in order to reach the end-game. Usually the end up burned out and disgusted by the whole process, blaming the game instead of blaming themselves and the way they approached the game in the first place.

Originally posted by Xasapis

The new crop of MMO players are conditioned to believe that "The game starts at the end-game". So they are basically ignoring everything and they play any game in the most unfunny but effective way in order to reach the end-game. Usually the end up burned out and disgusted by the whole process, blaming the game instead of blaming themselves and the way they approached the game in the first place.

As ofcourse you got plenty of those. That try to rush to the cap and ignore all the rest and then burn out real quick.

There are also plenty of people, like me, that take their time. Do the quests, craft and gather stuff and don't rush to the cap.

The reason why me, and plenty of others quit Aion before the first month is up, has been discussed to death by now on plenty of forums.

It's not because of the grind. As most of us haven't even reached that part yet. As we didn't rush.

It's because of all the bots in the game. There are so many of them, that on the most popular quest spots, they already outnumbering the legit players.

Not to mention that there are also plenty of legit players, complete legions even, who are botting themselves and buy kinah and so cheat themselves to the top.

Sorry. But I don't want to be part of such a community and a game. In wich cheating and botting is becoming more the norm then the exception. Just like it was in Lineage 2.

It's disgusting!

And then we haven't even talked about the pathetic communication and lack of ingame support by NCSoft.

Originally posted by Xasapis

The new crop of MMO players are conditioned to believe that "The game starts at the end-game". So they are basically ignoring everything and they play any game in the most unfunny but effective way in order to reach the end-game. Usually the end up burned out and disgusted by the whole process, blaming the game instead of blaming themselves and the way they approached the game in the first place.

QFT

Originally posted by Wolfenpride

Originally posted by Xasapis

The new crop of MMO players are conditioned to believe that "The game starts at the end-game". So they are basically ignoring everything and they play any game in the most unfunny but effective way in order to reach the end-game. Usually the end up burned out and disgusted by the whole process, blaming the game instead of blaming themselves and the way they approached the game in the first place.

QFT

second the QFT for emphasis 

Originally posted by Xasapis

The new crop of MMO players are conditioned to believe that "The game starts at the end-game". So they are basically ignoring everything and they play any game in the most unfunny but effective way in order to reach the end-game. Usually the end up burned out and disgusted by the whole process, blaming the game instead of blaming themselves and the way they approached the game in the first place.

QFT

WOW has made players think they can get everything they want if they cry enough, like babies. Well im sorry but Aion isnt easymode..

Originally posted by Guillermo197

Originally posted by Xasapis

The new crop of MMO players are conditioned to believe that "The game starts at the end-game". So they are basically ignoring everything and they play any game in the most unfunny but effective way in order to reach the end-game. Usually the end up burned out and disgusted by the whole process, blaming the game instead of blaming themselves and the way they approached the game in the first place.

 

As ofcourse you got plenty of those. That try to rush to the cap and ignore all the rest and then burn out real quick.

There are also plenty of people, like me, that take their time. Do the quests, craft and gather stuff and don't rush to the cap.

The reason why me, and plenty of others quit Aion before the first month is up, has been discussed to death by now on plenty of forums.

It's not because of the grind. As most of us haven't even reached that part yet. As we didn't rush.

It's because of all the bots in the game. There are so many of them, that on the most popular quest spots, they already outnumbering the legit players.

Not to mention that there are also plenty of legit players, complete legions even, who are botting themselves and buy kinah and so cheat themselves to the top.

Sorry. But I don't want to be part of such a community and a game. In wich cheating and botting is becoming more the norm then the exception. Just like it was in Lineage 2.

It's disgusting!

And then we haven't even talked about the pathetic communication and lack of ingame support by NCSoft.

Name me ONE MMO that didn't have bot's at release? You don't like cheaters? Holy shit your up for a rude awaking son, the whole world cheats dude, look around! From baseball to wall-street they all cheat,lie and steal don't fool yourself.

Its a game too btw, its not life and death and its just $60 so get over it man.......

The game is great and if you let Bot's ruin it for you, its your own fault man. There will always be cheaters in every game no matter what, the key is to ignore them and have FUN!

If ppl cheat let them cheat, your not a cheat that's the only thing that matters dude, they have to live with the fact that there not good enough so they have to cheat......if you ask me I would not want that on my shoulders.........

I would rather finish last and not cheat then be first and cheat:P

Originally posted by macmall

 

If ppl cheat let them cheat, your not a cheat that's the only thing that matters dude, they have to live with the fact that there not good enough so they have to cheat......if you ask me I would not want that on my shoulders.........

I would rather finish last and not cheat then be first and cheat:P

Amen to that! Don't ever compromise your real life values for something as cheap as a game. Now if only we could convince people to only say things online that they would be willing to say to someone in person, that would be awesome.

Originally posted by macmall

 

Name me ONE MMO that didn't have bot's at release? You don't like cheaters? Holy shit your up for a rude awaking son, the whole world cheats dude, look around! From baseball to wall-street they all cheat,lie and steal don't fool yourself.

Its a game too btw, its not life and death and its just $60 so get over it man.......

The game is great and if you let Bot's ruin it for you, its your own fault man. There will always be cheaters in every game no matter what, the key is to ignore them and have FUN!

If ppl cheat let them cheat, your not a cheat that's the only thing that matters dude, they have to live with the fact that there not good enough so they have to cheat......if you ask me I would not want that on my shoulders.........

I would rather finish last and not cheat then be first and cheat:P

LOL! How about pretty much every western developed MMO?

I have never seen so many bots and cheaters in an MMO before as in games developed by NCSoft.

This is a known fact. And everyone knows it. Especially those that played Lineage 2.

The problem is, that NCSoft is lazy and doesn't give a s hit! Their game clients have ZERO security (as GameGuard is a joke and now not even present anymore in NA/EU AION) and one of the easiest hackable and modifiable clients when it comes to P2P MMO's!

Ofcourse you have cheaters and bots in every MMO. But at least in other games I hardly see any nor do they interfere directly with my gameplay. And companies actually take visible action against it.

In other MMO's, when people buy gold... they mostly do it for buying a mount. Big deal!

In AION people can litterly bot to cap themselves, buy kinah and buy EVERYTHING! As the whole game revolves around kinah!

And as Gear has a HUGE impact on PVP (if you don't know that, you will find out sooner then later), then cheating is a BIG DEAL!

At least in most other MMO's you actually have to PLAY the game to obtain the best stuff. As most is also Bind on Pickup.

In AION, everything that drops in the game can be sold on broker. Nothing is Bind on Pickup.

That's why NCSoft games are so prone to botting and cheating. I only truly believed that with AION it would finally be different and that NCSoft learned it's lesson with their Lineage games.

I was wrong.

One thing about grind at higher levels. I see a lot of players bypass the mobs on their way to their quest objective. They either run on the side or just glide away from the mobs.

Why? Since you know this game have more grind than others, why not kill all the mobs along your path? Surely they add up along the way. In the end you don't have to grind more when you hit higher levels.

Another thing, i always read that players abandon quests that they have out level, why again? They still give some decent xp and titles also helps with your stats.

I've not reach level 25, the so-call level where you seriously run out of quests, so please correct me if i'm wrong...

OP:
But Aion really needs to cut alot of the time needed to reach max level.

As of now quests are a joke (I know it's adressed for a fix though) and the only option you will have in the end is mindlessly killing mobs. I have done nothing but questing up to level 31, but at this point it's really slow to continue due to most quests being group oriented and finding a group to do quests is hard because not many wants to do them due to lack of XP gain.

Which is sad because the quests and story in this game really are nice (the campaign).

I'm hoping the XP patch will make this more versile so I can continue to play the game with the same joy as I have been able to up to this point.

I'm also hoping that PvP will grant you levels in reasonable times in the future. Because as of now you won't notice the XP bar moving anything even after timeless amounts in the Abyss.

More ways of progressing = more variation = more fun.

Originally posted by Xasapis

The new crop of MMO players are conditioned to believe that "The game starts at the end-game". So they are basically ignoring everything and they play any game in the most unfunny but effective way in order to reach the end-game. Usually the end up burned out and disgusted by the whole process, blaming the game instead of blaming themselves and the way they approached the game in the first place.

  I agree.  For me an MMORPG is primarily the process of leveling (or whatever the form of advancement is in the game) and not the end-game. Sadly, Aion does not cater to the advancement experience, but to the end-game by trivializing RP elements and treating quests/dungeons/you name it like merely a means to the end-game. 

  Grinding would not bother me so much if there were more places to explore and simply more things to do that weren't boring: Crafting is incredibly boring as it is merely WoW's with an added random chance of creating a superior item, or failure and gathering is the same as it is in any other game. The restriction of PvP to rifts and the Abyss really takes the immersion out of the game (what little there could be with such linear zones) and the lack of content makes creating more than one alt pointless.

  I enjoyed Vanguard more at release: Some of the classes were new and interesting, the world was vastly open and the few quests there were were many times more interesting than those in Aion; I recall there being a vampire quest in Vanguard that you randomly came upon through a mob drop and it put you through an epic chain giving you the choice to become a vampire, or a slayer. Vanguard also had the diplomacy card game, which while trivial was still a step in the right direction and don't forget the EQ2 crafting with a grind...

Originally posted by Wolfenpride

Originally posted by Xasapis

The new crop of MMO players are conditioned to believe that "The game starts at the end-game". So they are basically ignoring everything and they play any game in the most unfunny but effective way in order to reach the end-game. Usually the end up burned out and disgusted by the whole process, blaming the game instead of blaming themselves and the way they approached the game in the first place.

QFT

Quote For Error. 

This game does start at end game.  Have you been the Abyss and seen the level 40s do nothing but kill level 25s and never fight level 40s?  Have you seen the bots and ppl who obviosuly bought kinah?  Have you seen the forts and the way PvP ranks are structured?

Don't kid yourselves this game does start at endgame and the grind at the later 30s and the 40s is rather long and definitely pretty much mindless crap.  And if you don't grind on both XP and gear in a mindless and not very fun way you will get your ass torn out.  I mean have seen the hair/molar quest or lepharists oaths?  Talk about lazy design and stupid boring grind.

Nope, still have a full quest log and there are also quests in the abyss. There are quests at the new PvE zones and some of my campaign quests are still red to me or not available yet. I guess you run out of quests at 35.

I don't know I have blues. Then again I craft. Maybe you should craft and you would have better gear. The stuff you craft is just as good as what drops. In fact, you'll more likely get a blue crafting then by farming. I have never seen one drop. Also, grouping doesn't hurt, that way you are harder to kill and people can res you. There's level 25's that are rank 8 and rank 7s. How can that be unless they are winning battles?

If you try to get loot by grinding then you will be in for a long and boring time because you aren't really playing the whole game and taking advantage of the system. This game has many features that other games have, in fact, it has no unique features to speak of. But, that doesn't mean you play this game the same way other games are played. At least you have incentive to craft in this game. In WoW crafting was meaningless. No one used crafted gear unless they didn't have their "set pieces" yet. The really great pieces, were mostly BoP, and the ones that weren't were overshadowed by set pieces. So even if you crafted the good stuff a lot of times you couldn't craft more of them and get your money back.

If you play the whole game and run campaign quests without abandoning them, craft at least 2 professions, and have your gathering skills where they need to be you will never be short on cash (at least for long) and you will always have gear. In fact I can say people who just grind levels have been funding my character deveolpment quite nicely. I wouldn't be able to sell so much stuff if everyone gathered and crafted.

People were expecting this game to be WoW and are now upset that it is not WoW. I for one will be truly glad once the 12 year olds cry and leave. It will make grouping even more fun. If you are grinding levels in this game, you are not completely developing your character. Having all of your skills, including the "domestic" skills is important in this game. Not crafting, not gathering, and just screaming towards your level cap actually gimps you in this game. Those level 40's killing level 25's will only have their fun for a short time, then they will have a gimped toon while the skilled players reap the benefits.

In AION, everything that drops in the game can be sold on broker. Nothing is Bind on Pickup.

Just wanted to pipe in and say this isn't true.  I've personally looted soulbound (BoP) items.  The first was off a named, a blue chain chest piece.

Not that this changes anything, just wanted to clarify.

Acidon

Originally posted by mrbbman

Nope, still have a full quest log and there are also quests in the abyss. There are quests at the new PvE zones and some of my campaign quests are still red to me or not available yet. I guess you run out of quests at 35.

  You're joking: My main is 30 and I ran out of quests at 22 and 29 respectively. I did almost every quest there was to do, yet I did not gain much out of it. Leveling from 25-30 is mostly Nochsana Training Camp and with the 18 hour lockout I could see the hardcore player finishing up all of the quests well before 27.

  When most quests give you less or equal to what 10-12 abyss mobs give you, there is hardly incentive to do quests on top of it. 

Originally posted by Acidon

In AION, everything that drops in the game can be sold on broker. Nothing is Bind on Pickup.

 

Just wanted to pipe in and say this isn't true.  I've personally looted soulbound (BoP) items.  The first was off a named, a blue chain chest piece.

Not that this changes anything, just wanted to clarify.

 

Acidon

  Yes, most of the BoP items are quest items. However, a lot of the open world loots are BoE. I was just in an ice claw group yesterday where a 32 gladiator ninjaed a blue sword that a temp wanted (the gladiator already had a better weapon and had no intention of using it); drama ensued and he was kicked from the group.

Originally posted by Guillermo197

Originally posted by Xasapis

The new crop of MMO players are conditioned to believe that "The game starts at the end-game". So they are basically ignoring everything and they play any game in the most unfunny but effective way in order to reach the end-game. Usually the end up burned out and disgusted by the whole process, blaming the game instead of blaming themselves and the way they approached the game in the first place.

 

As ofcourse you got plenty of those. That try to rush to the cap and ignore all the rest and then burn out real quick.

There are also plenty of people, like me, that take their time. Do the quests, craft and gather stuff and don't rush to the cap.

The reason why me, and plenty of others quit Aion before the first month is up, has been discussed to death by now on plenty of forums.

It's not because of the grind. As most of us haven't even reached that part yet. As we didn't rush.

It's because of all the bots in the game. There are so many of them, that on the most popular quest spots, they already outnumbering the legit players.

Not to mention that there are also plenty of legit players, complete legions even, who are botting themselves and buy kinah and so cheat themselves to the top.

Sorry. But I don't want to be part of such a community and a game. In wich cheating and botting is becoming more the norm then the exception. Just like it was in Lineage 2.

It's disgusting!

And then we haven't even talked about the pathetic communication and lack of ingame support by NCSoft.

This is not an Aion problem, it's a problem with all MMOs.  The only difference is it's more prevelent because of the visibility on the global chat lines, but the reality is that it's a much bigger problem in games like WoW, etc. that have pretty much given up on trying to stop the affects that gold sellers have had on the economy there.

Originally posted by macmall

Name me ONE MMO that didn't have bot's at release? You don't like cheaters? Holy shit your up for a rude awaking son, the whole world cheats dude, look around! From baseball to wall-street they all cheat,lie and steal don't fool yourself.

Its a game too btw, its not life and death and its just $60 so get over it man.......

The game is great and if you let Bot's ruin it for you, its your own fault man. There will always be cheaters in every game no matter what, the key is to ignore them and have FUN!

If ppl cheat let them cheat, your not a cheat that's the only thing that matters dude, they have to live with the fact that there not good enough so they have to cheat......if you ask me I would not want that on my shoulders.........

I would rather finish last and not cheat then be first and cheat:P

In all fairness, he does have a point though.  You're right that there are people that bot in all of these game but right now it is out of control in this game least on my server.  I'm still playing the game and enjoying myself but NCSoft needs to start cracking down on these guys. They're everywhere and there are some that I have seen running around now for two weeks that I somehow doubt I'm the only one reporting them for botting.

It's not like it's difficult to spot most of them.  I know they need to investigate to ensure someone they ban is actually botting but give me a break.  Frankly, the way they're handling things between their forums and in game it seems to me they are currently understaffed for what they need to accomplish.

Anyone who thinks quests are a decent or even viable way to level is either vastly ignorant or lying.  Can you get a journal full of quests?  Yes.  Does it matter?  No.  Quest rewards are by and large a joke.

70% of quest at level 30+ give the equivalent of one solo kill of an elite.  I can solo an elite in 4-5 minutes on my ranger in high 30's.  Those quests take quadruple that time and there are not anywehere even close to enough to give you a level, there are not enough to even give you half a level.

80% of all xp is from mobs.  Some ppl come on here and claim doing the repetables means there are plenty of quests.  They conviently leave out that 90% of the xp they are getting is from the mob kills from those repeatables.

Not only is solo grinding the fastest way to level, but quests themselves are no where even close to even half of the xp you would get.  Quest xp relative to mob xp is minmal.

All these ppl talking about their quest journal being full have no idea how the game works.  Its not even up for debate.  Anyone saying quests matter has automatically shown themselves to not have any clue.  Once you get past level 20 or so you should understand this.  Anyone level 30 or higher who claims quests mean jack diddly poop is either lying or so incredibly clueless that they should see a doctor and get a CAT scan.

I did quests and I am lvl 40.  So exp is enough to level up if you do NOT DIE.

Originally posted by //\\//\\oo

Originally posted by Acidon

In AION, everything that drops in the game can be sold on broker. Nothing is Bind on Pickup.

 

Just wanted to pipe in and say this isn't true.  I've personally looted soulbound (BoP) items.  The first was off a named, a blue chain chest piece.

Not that this changes anything, just wanted to clarify.

 

Acidon

 

  Yes, most of the BoP items are quest items. However, a lot of the open world loots are BoE. I was just in an ice claw group yesterday where a 32 gladiator ninjaed a blue sword that a temp wanted (the gladiator already had a better weapon and had no intention of using it); drama ensued and he was kicked from the group.

 

Come on people.  Fire Temple?  The whole place is BOP every non-world drop is BOP even the greens.  It is the most restrictive loot table i have ever seen in an MMO.

The amount of misinformation about this game sometimes boggles my mind.  There is tons of BOP in Aion, even on just plain stupid stuff.

Open world stuff tends to almost always be BOE.  Instances are rife BOP.  Fire temple is ALL BOP.  Training grounds boss items are BOP.  Do you know how many ppl are losing good equipment because of myths like this?  The boss of trianing grounds give only BOP rewards and people are not even realizing they are screwing ppl over by rolling because someone told them stuff that is not just inaccurate but wildly and completely wrong.

Originally posted by teco221

I did quests and I am lvl 40.  So exp is enough to level up if you do NOT DIE.

Bullshit.  There is not enough quest xp to level to 40, not even close.  A least 60% of all of your xp was from mobs.  Just because those mobs were part of some quest does not make it quest xp.

You may have been working on a quest the whole time.  So what.  I just did a quest that had me kill 60 lepharists.  It gave me like 500k xp.  Killing 60 lepharists is like 2-3M xp from the mob kills.

You could probably level to 50 just by doing repeatable quests the whole time.  You would be working on quests the whole time.  You still would have leveled 90% of your xp from mob xp since repeatables give shit xp as the quest reward.

The quests in this game are a non-factor.  The only ones that matter are the ones that give a good item or a bunch of monye or the very rare ones with decent xp (like some campaign quests).  Those are few and far between.  The vast majority of quest give something like 250k at level 35-40.  Considering you need 26M xp to from 37-38 most ppl can do the math.  There are not 100 quests at that level, the vast majority of the xp you will get at that level will be from mobs. 

Originally posted by Xasapis

The new crop of MMO players are conditioned to believe that "The game starts at the end-game". So they are basically ignoring everything and they play any game in the most unfunny but effective way in order to reach the end-game. Usually the end up burned out and disgusted by the whole process, blaming the game instead of blaming themselves and the way they approached the game in the first place.

Of all the MMO's out there, Aion truly does begin at endgame. 

The things that I would normally enjoy in an MMORPG don't exist in Aion.

You want to explore?  Sorry, tiny little zones. 

You want to do a low level dungeon with friends?  Tough, there are no low level dungeons. 

You want to PvP in the Abyss when you finally hit 25?  No comment.

Crafting is fun, I guess.

I don't care if it takes me a year to hit 50 if it is an adventure getting there.  This game has no adventure, just levels.

It is not the leveling curve that is the problem, it's the sheer boredom.