Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by FikusOfAhazi

 

Greed, your 2 options on how people can play this doesnt work here. What are you doing exactly?

Apparently option two works here, quite well. I have to have a reason for being here? Well if you must know.

"A place for disgruntled former and current SWG players to talk about the game that was and the game that now is, as well as for newcomers who are curious about the issues surrounding the changes that this game has undergone. *Note, MMORPG.com RoC will still be enforced. "

I may not be disgruntled, but I'm indeed a former player. I'm giving my opinion, is it not settling well with you? Or what? Let me simplify my opinion. Paying $50 to transfer from a removed server, insane. SoEs ongoing methods of how to maintain SWG and it's services, horrible. People constantly dragging up old news, and/or pretending to be shocked at purely normal SoE behavior, getting old. You say you would like to keep shit like this out of the industry, so would I, apparently we don't have to do that, SoE has already set that example. SoE is the only company to screw me over when it comes to online gaming. So I would say, bringing things like this up to keep it out of the industry, was already done.

Let's be realistic about this, you, me, every vet to stand up to SoE did so with our wallet. People a few years ago would bring up problems with their actions, and rightfully so. Grats, SoE has been proven to be incompetent morons.

Option one, if you want me to go into depth. Drop the act, SoE is bad, feel free to support their future games. It just so happens, my opinion is that people are dwelling on the past, and this prevents them from effectively moving on. Say what you want, but dragging up problem after problem of a game you have no, zero, never have intentions in playing is pretty pathetic. So let's reverse the question. What are you doing here? What are you accomplishing, what purpose is there in beating a dead horse. I'll respect your opinion, but that doesn't mean I have to agree with it. And when it comes to something like this, I find obsessing over a game you literally hate "now" a bit crazy.

Also, please understand, I'm not against discussion, I'm against this board being full of nothing but hate and anger. Reminisce, remember the good, forget the bad. The game was good, not great or perfect, but it was certainly some peoples favorite game of all time. But I have to disagree on the constant bashing on this game, I see it as nothing more then childish and pointless. Feel free to try and convince me otherwise, but at this point, I don't think any of you have a justifiable reason to convince me otherwise.

 

 Hard to comment on anything as it's all based upon hate,anger, the usual. I have no interest in that, anymore than you have any interest in actually understanding.  I was asking what are you doing, not what are you doing here. Too late now so nevermind.

I would have to agree that most have transferred but its the nerve of SOE to even mention that one would have to pay to transfer off a closed server that is annoying.

They should never have offered that option in the first place. Closed server means Closed like lost PreCU Code means lost.

I never played SWG ever, and even I was aware of the free transfers. To me, it seems some SWG vets just like to complain, regardless of what it is.

Originally posted by bluegrazz

LOL $OE does it again. Everytime you think you have seen it all- $OE 1ups the madness.

I mean, wow- theres no server but you need to pay to transfer? What about the "vets" who might want to try out the new changes Sony Reps keep posting about. LOLOLOL.

Sorry I find this funny but I cant help it. One day people will learn to just avoid everything with the $OE name on it. No matter how cool  the idea, no matter the I.P. , No matter the features- Its $OE- Avoid like the plague.

Rather than having no characters because a server was shut down, vets have the remarkable opportunity to recover them -- no other company offers such a feature! 

Originally posted by ArcAngel3

Originally posted by kobie173

Originally posted by miagisan

they gave you weeks to transfer for free, quit your bitching

 

Several months, actually.

 

I received an email giving me 6 days notice, in total, of the upcoming server closures.  I believe the closures were announced on the forums only a few weeks ago, much to many people's surprise, since they said they had no plans to close the "transfer from" servers. 

If you don't read the official forums, and you didn't check your email spam for the last 6 days, you're in for a nasty surprise if you log into one of the closed servers.

Even with 6 days notice, or a few weeks on the forums, why charge a fee to move off of a server they are closing down?  Really?

Well, the first announcement of server closings due to the success of character transfers that I received was on September 16th, for a total of 1 month's notice. I then got a follow up notice on October 9th, the 6 day mark.  Perhaps you missed an email?
 

Why charge a fee?  Because unlike allegedly not archiving PreCU code, they are archiving the player data.  It doesn't mean they're letting it sit on a hard drive somewhere to be accessed at a moment's notice but likely it's compressed and offline.  To retrieve it possibly requires a tech to physically pull the media, perhaps discs for a jukebox, and then, depending on how far in the future this is done, run clean up scripts to ensure it is compatible witht he current server version.  How much are they paying their techies these days...? 

Ultimately they could say "sorry, it's not available, reroll" but they aren't and if a bit of cash can be made, there ya go.

it seems like some posters are having heartburn over what notice was given and when. The Free Character Transfer Service was implemented January 2009 for the 12 most dead servers. It was optional and there was no plans to close the dead servers. If anything, I was a little surprised that there were no plans for server closures given at that time.

I also get the impression that some folks think that players, current and veteran alike, should have surmised that there would be server closings due to the FCTS despite $OE stating there were no plans on server closures. A more vocal current player had gone on to start 'Community Building' on a dead server and claimed how that server and a handful of others were actually growing. He went as far as assuring others the server was not closing. That certainly does not sound like all players  'knew' the dead servers were closing. Some of us saw the handwriting on the wall with the FCTS announcement, but that does not make it 'official' does it?

Since then, there has been three free vet trials, and for those that chose to exercise them, they probably transferred if the FCTS was applicable to them. The official notice of server closure was given September 15th. Some players found out that day. Some may have found out from browsing through game forums. Some found out via e-mail - -  where some only got the e-mail a few days before the servers actually closed. I am also sure there are going to be vets that were unaware of the official server closings.  Since no  free vet trial was offered with or following the announcement, it would cost a player $15 to resub to use the FCTS by the October 15th deadline, and a resub fee and a $50 per toon transfer fee after server closing.

The $50 per toon ransom transfer fee is steep, but $OE must have figured there was not enough non-transferred veteran accounts to really worry about. Since there must be so few left, I think any returning player that is willing to pay the resub fee should have their characters moved for free from the closed servers, but that is MY opinion.

It seems most here can agree that $OE leaves a lot to be desired. It would have been so much simpler (and honest) to have made the FCTS announcement and inform players that the transfer-from servers will be closing later in the year. This would have allowed current players to move earlier (taking advantage of the housing purge) and  vet players to access one of  three free vet trials to transfer toons. The impending server closings just may have been the motivation needed for some vets to return during the free trials.

Well said, Kaz. And to Arc, I appreciate your posts in this section. You raise valid points and awareness of issues that would most certainly be swept under the rug otherwise. Seeing as you have brought thought provoking discussions to the forum before, I guess it is automatically assumed and read into that you have some kind of malign intention. Frankly, having read your initial post and seeing its length which is not your usual fare - I naturally assumed that you were asking a question for the purpose of an answer.

I think this whole area is like a bad relationship with a lot of history. Every action is questioned - everything comes with a slew of previous statements. See the recent examples of post mining. Guilty of it myself. So attacks and suspicion filled posts are now the soup de jour.

On a side note, I got my servers closing letter on 10/9/09. That would have given me less than 6 days to react. And had I been on the business trip I skipped out on - I would have had less time if not any at all. That being said, it is a good thing I don't pay SOE for their incompetence and mismanagement anymore. Better still, had I been doing so and missed this transfer boat - I would have had to pay them $50 + the monthly sub fee.

Originally posted by ArcAngel3

Originally posted by Kazara

Yes, not counting a $15 dollar resub fee unless you have a free vet trial waiting int he wings.

 

Lol, wow, welcome back to SWG :P  Your server is now closed and it'll cost you a 50 to move to one that actually works.  I suppose if you pick one, and it happens to be empty, it'll cost you another 50 to move to one with people on it...

 

LOL. That statement is painfully true. Most of the remaining servers are contending with low populations, so if a returning player does not  do his 'homework' and make an informed server decision, he can end up on a near-death server like Gorath. No telling when and if  the FCTS will be extended to the current dying servers. Once again, players have the choice to continue on a dying server, pony up the transfer fee, reroll or cancel. The server status sounds a lot like it did a year ago before the FCTS.

Originally posted by therain93

Originally posted by bluegrazz

LOL $OE does it again. Everytime you think you have seen it all- $OE 1ups the madness.

I mean, wow- theres no server but you need to pay to transfer? What about the "vets" who might want to try out the new changes Sony Reps keep posting about. LOLOLOL.

Sorry I find this funny but I cant help it. One day people will learn to just avoid everything with the $OE name on it. No matter how cool  the idea, no matter the I.P. , No matter the features- Its $OE- Avoid like the plague.

 

Rather than having no characters because a server was shut down, vets have the remarkable opportunity to recover them -- no other company offers such a feature! 

Every other game that merges servers moves the characters to another server in case former players resub to the game.  SOE did it with EQ (more than once I believe) and EQ2.  The couple EQ character I have from the month I played the game before the first expansion (which was close to ten years ago) are still there, even though the server I started them on is long gone.

The $50 transfer fee from the dead servers tells me SOE has finally given up on former players returning in any significant number, much like they gave up on gaining any significant number of new players a year and a half after the NGE.  If they don't plan to get former players back, and they don't plan to get new players, does anyone think they plan for the game to be around much past TOR's release?

Originally posted by kefkah

Well said, Kaz. And to Arc, I appreciate your posts in this section. You raise valid points and awareness of issues that would most certainly be swept under the rug otherwise. Seeing as you have brought thought provoking discussions to the forum before, I guess it is automatically assumed and read into that you have some kind of malign intention. Frankly, having read your initial post and seeing its length which is not your usual fare - I naturally assumed that you were asking a question for the purpose of an answer.

I think this whole area is like a bad relationship with a lot of history. Every action is questioned - everything comes with a slew of previous statements. See the recent examples of post mining. Guilty of it myself. So attacks and suspicion filled posts are now the soup de jour.

On a side note, I got my servers closing letter on 10/9/09. That would have given me less than 6 days to react. And had I been on the business trip I skipped out on - I would have had less time if not any at all. That being said, it is a good thing I don't pay SOE for their incompetence and mismanagement anymore. Better still, had I been doing so and missed this transfer boat - I would have had to pay them $50 + the monthly sub fee.

I think your analysis of the thread and conversation patterns here is spot on.  It does tend to play out like a bad relationship with lots of mind-reading and off-base accusations.  I've tried to help this out a bit by providing some clarification of motives and information, hopefully without sounding too defensive.

Judging from some of the posts, this has helped to some extent.  Thanks to those who were willing to look past their initial assumptions.

Originally posted by therain93

Originally posted by ArcAngel3

Originally posted by kobie173

Originally posted by miagisan

they gave you weeks to transfer for free, quit your bitching

 

Several months, actually.

 

I received an email giving me 6 days notice, in total, of the upcoming server closures.  I believe the closures were announced on the forums only a few weeks ago, much to many people's surprise, since they said they had no plans to close the "transfer from" servers. 

If you don't read the official forums, and you didn't check your email spam for the last 6 days, you're in for a nasty surprise if you log into one of the closed servers.

Even with 6 days notice, or a few weeks on the forums, why charge a fee to move off of a server they are closing down?  Really?

 

Well, the first announcement of server closings due to the success of character transfers that I received was on September 16th, for a total of 1 month's notice. I then got a follow up notice on October 9th, the 6 day mark.  Perhaps you missed an email?
 

Why charge a fee?  Because unlike allegedly not archiving PreCU code, they are archiving the player data.  It doesn't mean they're letting it sit on a hard drive somewhere to be accessed at a moment's notice but likely it's compressed and offline.  To retrieve it possibly requires a tech to physically pull the media, perhaps discs for a jukebox, and then, depending on how far in the future this is done, run clean up scripts to ensure it is compatible witht he current server version.  How much are they paying their techies these days...? 

Ultimately they could say "sorry, it's not available, reroll" but they aren't and if a bit of cash can be made, there ya go.

 

Just out of curiosity, I checked the date of the original forum post about the server closures.  I'll copy and paste it from Drakuul's notice: "09/14/2009"

There we are; this is exactly how much official notice people were given.  For those that think players were warned months ago, in January or a year ago (one post said that I think), your information is just wrong.

SOE gave people exaclty one month notice on the forums about the closures, and for those that don't frequent the O-boards, many of us got 6 days notice.  I didn't miss an email btw, and others were similarly only given 6 days notice.

Now, please brace yourselves while I say something nice about SOE lol.  Giving one month's notice was much better than the 2 weeks notice we got about the NGE.  Why?  Because people tend to buy a month's subscription at a time.  This time around, people subbing 30 days at a time actually had a choice regarding whether or not they wanted to continue paying for the game minus many of its servers.  That's a small step in the right direction for SOE, imo.  30 days is the absolute least amount of time that should be given for important announcements in any game with a monthly sub.

Now, to the price of the transfer from yesterday onward.  Is it going to cost SOE $50 to have a dev make a server transfer of a character and stored items?  Hey, if it is, no problem.  If, however, this is yet another attempt to drain the dwindling SWG fanbase of as much cash as they possibly can, then once again, I think they are shooting themselves in the foot, at their players' expense, literally.  If they want to maintain the game population at all, I think the steep transfer cost is counter-productive.

From Obee:

"Every other game that merges servers moves the characters to another server in case former players resub to the game. SOE did it with EQ (more than once I believe) and EQ2. The couple EQ character I have from the month I played the game before the first expansion (which was close to ten years ago) are still there, even though the server I started them on is long gone."

I think this is excellent information.  It tells me that character transfers could be handled differently, in a way that is more player-friendly, and that SOE itself even has a history of handling the same issue in a way that doesn't charge players an extra 50 bucks. 

Thanks for that Obee.  I think it highlights my primary concern very nicely.  Doesn't it also highlight a pattern that has plagued this game since day 1?  Doing things to try to maximize revenue that throw players under the bus; in the end it only seems to lose players and the sub fees that they might have paid.

Originally posted by Obee

 

Every other game that merges servers moves the characters to another server in case former players resub to the game.  SOE did it with EQ (more than once I believe) and EQ2.  The couple EQ character I have from the month I played the game before the first expansion (which was close to ten years ago) are still there, even though the server I started them on is long gone.

The $50 transfer fee from the dead servers tells me SOE has finally given up on former players returning in any significant number, much like they gave up on gaining any significant number of new players a year and a half after the NGE.  If they don't plan to get former players back, and they don't plan to get new players, does anyone think they plan for the game to be around much past TOR's release?

 

 

 

/agree.  Even Funcom saved and moved player data for their closed servers.

It really looks like SOE have given up on Deadmeat's plan on getting the "vets" back.  All thru his Producer time, it was pretty much stated that the "vets" were more important than new subs.  Have to agree that they have pretty much given up on both, now.

Originally posted by Esquire1980

Originally posted by Obee

 

Every other game that merges servers moves the characters to another server in case former players resub to the game.  SOE did it with EQ (more than once I believe) and EQ2.  The couple EQ character I have from the month I played the game before the first expansion (which was close to ten years ago) are still there, even though the server I started them on is long gone.

The $50 transfer fee from the dead servers tells me SOE has finally given up on former players returning in any significant number, much like they gave up on gaining any significant number of new players a year and a half after the NGE.  If they don't plan to get former players back, and they don't plan to get new players, does anyone think they plan for the game to be around much past TOR's release?

 

 

 

 

/agree.  Even Funcom saved and moved player data for their closed servers.

It really looks like SOE have given up on Deadmeat's plan on getting the "vets" back.  All thru his Producer time, it was pretty much stated that the "vets" were more important than new subs.  Have to agree that they have pretty much given up on both, now.

If both SOE and Funcom can and have done this kind of character transfer in the past at no additional charge, I have to wonder what this says about SOE's relationship with SWG and its players.

One point:

There is not *now* a fee to transfer off closed servers.

They are no longer offering free transfers off those servers.  If you want to transfer, you pay the standard fee of $50.

Is $50 an obscene cost for server transfers?  Yes.  But they aren't charging any *more* for closed transfers than any other transfers.  If I want to move a toon from Bria to Flurry it costs the same as moving one from Corbantis to Flurry, regardless of the status of the source server.

Soe has always indicated that server xfers in SWG are more complicated than in their other games - they charge more, and they have a "just you" and a "you and your stuff" option.  I don't doubt it's more complex, given all the player housing, vendors, etc.  I don't know that it's worth $50.  I think it's worth more than a similar xfer on WoW or some other game.  

Originally posted by Brixon

Well all hate for $OE aside for the moment, $50 bucks is a pretty steep fee to transfer a character for any game.

Agreed.  I can transfer a character in CoH from one server to another for $10.  It's automated and virtually done instantly.  In this situation if SOE really cared about their potential returning customers--and the fact that SOE closed the servers so that customer is forced to move their character--the fee SOE is charging should be tiny or non-existent. 

It's amazing how SOE does business that is so consistently customer-unfriendly.  Yeah, I shouldn't be surprised.  But most businesses actually learn from their mistakes.  The only explaination is that SOE is so clueless that they don't even know what they are doing is wrong.

The people that play or care about the game had plenty of time to do the free transfer. People are just using this as an excuse to cry about SOE some more. Yes $50 is extreme but so is the torch carrying.

Originally posted by bluegrazz

LOL $OE does it again. Everytime you think you have seen it all- $OE 1ups the madness.

I mean, wow- theres no server but you need to pay to transfer? What about the "vets" who might want to try out the new changes Sony Reps keep posting about. LOLOLOL.

Sorry I find this funny but I cant help it. One day people will learn to just avoid everything with the $OE name on it. No matter how cool  the idea, no matter the I.P. , No matter the features- Its $OE- Avoid like the plague.

You mean the vets that behaved like babies,s creaming about how they would never play SWG or anotehr SOE ever again no matter what? ya im sure they give a crap about those whiners.

Originally posted by warmaster670

Originally posted by bluegrazz

LOL $OE does it again. Everytime you think you have seen it all- $OE 1ups the madness.

I mean, wow- theres no server but you need to pay to transfer? What about the "vets" who might want to try out the new changes Sony Reps keep posting about. LOLOLOL.

Sorry I find this funny but I cant help it. One day people will learn to just avoid everything with the $OE name on it. No matter how cool  the idea, no matter the I.P. , No matter the features- Its $OE- Avoid like the plague.

 

You mean the vets that behaved like babies,s creaming about how they would never play SWG or anotehr SOE ever again no matter what? ya im sure they give a crap about those whiners.

 

SOE has spent the last two and a half years trying to get them to play the game again, so it would seem like they cared.

Originally posted by therain93

Originally posted by bluegrazz

LOL $OE does it again. Everytime you think you have seen it all- $OE 1ups the madness.

I mean, wow- theres no server but you need to pay to transfer? What about the "vets" who might want to try out the new changes Sony Reps keep posting about. LOLOLOL.

Sorry I find this funny but I cant help it. One day people will learn to just avoid everything with the $OE name on it. No matter how cool  the idea, no matter the I.P. , No matter the features- Its $OE- Avoid like the plague.

 

Rather than having no characters because a server was shut down, vets have the remarkable opportunity to recover them -- no other company offers such a feature! 

 Haha, nice one.

Originally posted by ArcAngel3

 

Ok Tman, this for me is a worthwhile discussion.  At least with you I can clarify my meaning, and be taken at face value.  Here's the information a friend shared with me on another forum:

"Beginning October 16th, 2009 at 12:01 AM PT you will be able to contact Customer Support and for the standard Character Transfer fee of $50.00 you will be able to schedule a transfer for your character, eligible structures and inventory."
 

Since it's now October 16, or rather it was when I started this thread, I simply asked if SOE had indeed followed through with this.  That was my intent at least.  I didn't want to accuse them of something if they had decided (again) to extend the free transfer service.

I quickly learned, from the first response, that there is indeed now a charge of 50 dollars to move a character off of closed server.  I wouldn't call my response outrage, or faux outrage.  I'm really not surprised or angered by this move.  In my view, it's actually fairlly consistent with SOE's way of doing business.  I am, however, most definitely questioning the logic of this move.  In my opinion, it only discourages people from rejoining the game from this point forward if they are on one of the closed servers. 

Does that make sense?

P.S. I may edit the title for clarity.  I don't know if I was unclear or if people have a hard time reading the thread objectively.  I know people have a lot of intense feelings about the game, and that can get in the way of effective communication I think.

Okay, the highlighted statement is sh!tty- no argument there.  I still tend to believe it is aimed more at the feet-dragging current players than any possible returning player, but  I agree with what you and others state- Why even mention/have a $50 dollar fee to move off a closed server?  If the server is closed and you have a character on that server,  you should be able to move that character at no charge upon resubbing.   At minum, allow moving one character and charge for subsequent alts.

But I again say - Show me someone who is truly impacted by this.  No one will legitimately try to return to this game at this point (I leave open the possibility of "plants" going through the motions, grabbing screen shots or emails, only to be able to post their "outrage" on these and other forums.)   I said on the other column that I believe SOE has finally given up on us completely.  It is clear "vets" will never return in any appreciable numbers and SOE is finally admitting that to themselves.  They've turned out the porchlight, even if it does mean some few may stumble in the darkness.

Mark this as another SOE outrage.  But it belongs in the "dumb" column rather than the "evil" column.

But I again say - Show me someone who is truly impacted by this.  No one will legitimately try to return to this game at this point (I leave open the possibility of "plants" going through the motions, grabbing screen shots or emails, only to be able to post their "outrage" on these and other forums.)   I said on the other column that I believe SOE has finally given up on us completely.  It is clear "vets" will never return in any appreciable numbers and SOE is finally admitting that to themselves.  They've turned out the porchlight, even if it does mean some few may stumble in the darkness.

Mark this as another SOE outrage.  But it belongs in the "dumb" column rather than the "evil" column.

I'd say that vets that haven't yet returnedf won't

There are a lot of vets in the game now.  But I don't think anyone that didn't give it a try over the last year or so, and do the character xfer, will try after this anyway..

I'm sorry, your complaining about this? Talk about fail on your part. First off the free transfer since JANUARY. Second , when they announced the closing over servers, emails were sent out, it was in giant letters on the main page AND forum. Every major MMO site picked up on the story AND everytime you logged in there was a big warning in bright yellow telling you what was happening.  The dead servers weren't picking up. I know at least Valcyn and Kauri were ghost towns. Numerous times I logged on Valcyn and I could count the number of players online on one hand.

If you missed this, this is entirely your own fault. SOE has borderline spamming people to make sure they know what's going on, and if you were still oblivious then let this be a lesson to next time look up on the game before you rejoin, and not to make assumptions that a company will keep handing out free things.

as others said they gave loads of time and all vets should have had their free trials active during this time.one of my old accounts has had for months 14 day  trial flashing with no time limit.

before shuting soe again relise many companies shutdown without even a recovery option

Originally posted by hercules

as others said they gave loads of time and all vets should have had their free trials active during this time.one of my old accounts has had for months 14 day  trial flashing with no time limit.

before shuting soe again relise many companies shutdown without even a recovery option

Can you give us many examples?