Originally posted by solareus

Do you speak for a legion of people ? who is this no one ?

You whine and cry like a little girl every chance you get... Wah, wah, aion sucks, how dare you guys like aion when I hate it!   You bring it up in completely unrelated forums.  You just can't let it go.

Grow the fuck up.

Originally posted by solareus

Do you speak for a legion of people ? who is this no one ?

You just lost credibility when you quoted Ed Lover.

could try ten ton hammer, Warcry , last i checked the Pc Gamer had an mmorpg discussion area, and CVG.

Originally posted by mmaize

Originally posted by Dragonalf

Originally posted by mmaize

Originally posted by mmaize

This question is to Jon Wood: Is the intent of this site to let every review stand on it's own? Or do you guys shoot for a score that compares the new games merits to those that have come before it ... i.e. a relative scoring approach?

Based on the data posted by xyzax, it appears you guys are using a "vacuum" approach to reviews. The reviewer fairly admits that the game does nothing new which screams "average", 7 out of 10, a 'C' grade to most people. He unabashedly admits he likes the art style and there is a general overly-enthusiastic tone to the whole piece. A neutral reader can't help but come away from the review thinking that the meat of the review does not match the tone and final score of the review.

I believe in order for reviews to mean something beyond being a fanboy or hater dissertation corroborating their point of view, there has to be meaning to the scale. A relational approach is more useful in that one can, at a glance, look at the rating of a new game and be able to compare it to the highest (and lowest) rated games to get a relative feel of it's place in the MMO universe.

From the body of evidence around the web and within the MMORPG review itself, the consensus is that Aion is a solid but generic MMO title but certainly not a trendsetter as the MMORPG rating portends.

 

Answer these questions.  And no I'm not being smart@ss.  What other major MMO title has done aerial combat/character flight (meaning no mount.)  What other major MMO has a combat system that allows for chains to be connected in such a way that you don't have to worry about putting them all into your tool bar?  What other MMO has a world that is comprised in layers and has an abyss that is also comprised of layers and a multiple artifact system that can turn the tide of a pvp raid?  Personal hand crafted guild icons?  The rift system? 

Again I'm not being smart I'm really asking what else is out there that does some of these things really?  Because if not then I'd call some of these things if not all in it's entire package trend setting for it's genre.

 

Still waiting on answers...

Not meaning to be flippant here but what you're asking is really irrelevant to the discussion about the validity of the rating as pertaining to the content of the MMORPG review and then comparing it to other MMO reviews on this site.

You may feel these are exceptional points to make but apparently the MMORPG reviewer did not feel the same way. I can only assume that if he personally felt these were worthy of mention, he would have. Yet, he does go out of his way to point out that, in general, Aion does nothing really new or spectacular ...

 

The point is completely relevant considering the fact that people keep mentioning innovation as a sticking point.  So if there's no contest to the questions of what Aion brings to the table then obviously it is innovative and therefore should contribute to the rating regardless if the reviewer that is being critiqued did so or not.  In otherwords if someone is going to use that against the reviewer then they better be able to answer to the things that are indeed innovative.

 

I haven't read past this but I feel it necessary to answer your post since you feel that what you mentioned here was from your point of view, "innovation".  You are unfortunately wrong on most, if not all of the points you mentioned which shows your complete lack of MMO experience and how rabidly you want to defend this game.  Your posts remind me of the idiots who tried to defend AoC.  So here goes...
 

1. What other MMO has done aerial combat?  Try CoH/CoV or Champions Online....both do aerial combat.  Nothing new or "innovative" about this sytem.

2. What other MMO has done a chain skill system?  LoTRO had it at launch with group chain skills, have added more in.  The basis of AoC was skill chains.  Again, absolutely nothing new or innovative about this system in Aion.

3.  What other MMO blah blah layers?  I'm really not sure wtf you are even talking about here.  What "layers" do you see in this game that seem to elude me?  PvPvE, umm yeah Warhammer had the exact same general type of system.  Ever MMO has layers to it.  Not even sure what you meant here.  Artifact system is very similar to L2 and to some extent Warhammer as well to help turn the tides of sieges.  Again, not really sure this is an "innovative" idea.

4.  Personal hand crafted guild icons?  Go play some Eve online.

5.  Rift System?  I'll give you this one as I cannot recall any MMO that implemented this system off the top of my head.  /kudos

6.  Crafting/harvesting in Aion is almost an exact replica or rip off of EQ2 and other MMO's. 

Aion does exactly what it's designed to do, which is take systems from other games and repackage them into something with a new wrapper. 

Originally posted by DevilXaphan

Originally posted by solareus

Do you speak for a legion of people ? who is this no one ?

 

You just lost credibility when you quoted Ed Lover.

come on son, come on :D. you got to watch the youtube vids, he is amazing ! he gets an 11/10 !

Ahhh haters haters and more haters....LOL Why do I come to this website agian? *shrugs*

Originally posted by Ethian

Ahhh haters haters and more haters....LOL Why do I come to this website agian? *shrugs*

To get your chuckle on.

Originally posted by nate1980

Since the credibility of this website has been brought up for discussion, are there other websites dedicated only to MMORPG's?

What about websites that cover all games? Any reputable ones? I'm genuinely curious, because if I found a decent and objective, unbiased website, I'll go there. I'm not being sarcastic, I really would like to view some other gaming websites that pay any attention to MMORPG's. So if you can list some, I'll go check them out and add them to my favorites if they're any good.

As I mentioned in one of my previous posts, I don't think there's 1 website that's going to get it exactly right.  My suggestion is to take a look at multiple websites and reviews.  See what the reviewer has to say on positive/negative, does this jive with what other reviewers are saying?  Try to formulate a complete picture based on several different points of view and the whole starts to come a little more in focus. 

LEt me say I'm glad people are enjoying the game, kids in 3rd world countries enjoy throwing sticks at a turd, does that then mean that it should be scored as high as Baseball ? Have fun in the game, but try and fool yourself and everyone else that this game is in some how far superior then anything else released to date. THe reviewer was in my opinion amused to easily by the shiny things and didn't fully take in consideration that mmorpgs have always been about innovation in some  shape or form. The "take everything done before and make it polished" has been already by Blizzard, time to move on. Aion takes you back to2003 with it's lineage 2-eque mentality that people will grind and pay for gold online.

Lineage 2 only got rid of the botter and farming 4 years into the games existence, they fully raped the player base with sub fees and creating a market place so steepo that you had to buy gold online. Aion follows so many rules of lineage 2 in it;s theory  that the reviewer failed to explore that avenue of the design and concept of the game that it leave  him looking like a complete and utter tool trying to get a job at NcSoft Austin studio.

Originally posted by DevilXaphan

Originally posted by Ethian

Ahhh haters haters and more haters....LOL Why do I come to this website agian? *shrugs*

 

To get your chuckle on.

Exactly. About all this site good for these days. I'm having a blast playing Aion but if I wasnt I could care less if others enjoy it. I have more in my life then just video cards thankfully. It really is sad how most the MMORPG community treats each other on this site.

I;'m glad you love the game, but be completly honest with yourself and the people of this website. Does the game feel like a standard mmo ? Does it have the deep story line like LotrO, the massive land area of Vanguard, and amazing fast paced pvp combat of AoC ? 

Is flying combat new to you ?

Boy, this was a real love letter to Aion that glossed over its many shortcomings. Here's some player reviews/critiques over on Aion Source that do a better job of highlighting the problems:

http://www.aionsource.com/forum/reviews-critiques/73580-another-cancelled-account-favor-wow.html

http://www.aionsource.com/forum/reviews-critiques/77547-after-several-days-not-having-urge-logon.html

http://www.aionsource.com/forum/reviews-critiques/76058-parts-aion-would-you-like-see-improved.html

Originally posted by solareus

I;'m glad you love the game, but be completly honest with yourself and the people of this website. Does the game feel like a standard mmo ? Does it have the deep story line like LotrO, the massive land area of Vanguard, and amazing fast paced pvp combat of AoC ? 

 

Is flying combat new to you ?

Honestly dude, I could care less. I'm playing Aion because I was looking for something new and its fun. I didnt sign up to compare it to other MMOs. What does it matter if its as deep as LOTRO, or as big as Vanguard? I'll go play a different game if I perfer something AIon doesnt offer.

I have better things to do with my time then think about other video games while I'm playing video games....LOL

Originally posted by Ethian

Ahhh haters haters and more haters....LOL Why do I come to this website agian? *shrugs*

Because you have to put your troll posts someplace?  BTW there is no such word as hater, you might try the correct word sometime it is called a critic.  Usually a forum is supposed to be a place where you discuss things and not everyone likes everything, it would be a boring world if so.   It is also good to know all the positive and negative aspects of a game.

I disagree with others many times, but they are all entitled to their opinions.  In the case of Aion it is a well done game that looks beautiful, but saying the author of this piece glossed over some of the negative aspects of the game is an understatement and others need to know that.

Maybe you should troll someplace else if that bothers you.

The funny thing is we keep on seeing you here flaming, is this the only way you have to pas time during your day? can't play the amazingly story driven lotro or the tactical pvp in eve or the limitless content and pvp in AoC?

Originally posted by tanoril

I actually thought Paragus had a better/more detailed review of the game since he touched on post 25+ more.  By reading that review he'd probably rate it an 8 which is probably where the game falls.  I'm actually surprised that the game got reviewed so quickly, normally it takes much longer for this site to put a review for a game out.  I think the reviewer is correct that Aion becomes almost a different game post level 25.  Perhaps we can have a review that specifically focuses on that part of the game since everyone who plays Aion has developed the slogan 'Wait until level 25'.

Thanks for the kind words.  So far I have written 3 articles about Aion, one from 1-10, another from 10-25, and my most recent one covers 25-40ish, as I am currently a level 40 ranger.  I personally think a lot of the MMORPG.com official reviews are a little light in the loafers.   I wrote more about the level 1-10 game than the official reviews did in his entire review.   I still stand by my suggestion of having MMORPG.com completely redo its review system by having each game reviewed by multiple people so that readers can not only get a wider array of opinions, but have a better chance of finding a reviewer with similar MMO background as them.

Originally posted by bloodaxes

The funny thing is we keep on seeing you here flaming, is this the only way you have to pas time during your day? can't play the amazingly story driven lotro or the tactical pvp in eve or the limitless content and pvp in AoC?

Not sure who this is directed at but some people have jobs, and during those working hours we need something else to do besides work.  That's why we come here, bitch on the interwebz about video gamez, porn, our wives, whatever.  Then we go home and play our game of choice so we can go back to work tomorrow to troll forums. 

Think if you are enjoying Aion, you have never played an mmorpg before, clearly the review pretends he didn't , though he has over 2 year xp on Warcry network.

Originally posted by solareus

LEt me say I'm glad people are enjoying the game, kids in 3rd world countries enjoy throwing sticks at a turd, does that then mean that it should be scored as high as Baseball ? Have fun in the game, but try and fool yourself and everyone else that this game is in some how far superior then anything else released to date. THe reviewer was in my opinion amused to easily by the shiny things and didn't fully take in consideration that mmorpgs have always been about innovation in some  shape or form. The "take everything done before and make it polished" has been already by Blizzard, time to move on. Aion takes you back to2003 with it's lineage 2-eque mentality that people will grind and pay for gold online.

 

Lineage 2 only got rid of the botter and farming 4 years into the games existence, they fully raped the player base with sub fees and creating a market place so steepo that you had to buy gold online. Aion follows so many rules of lineage 2 in it;s theory  that the reviewer failed to explore that avenue of the design and concept of the game that it leave  him looking like a complete and utter tool trying to get a job at NcSoft Austin studio.

I'm not sure what genre you have been playing because it definitely isn't mmorpgs. MMORPGs have been a lot of things but innovation definitely hasn't been one of them. The MMORPGs of today play pretty much the same as they did in the early 2000 years with some more quests added.

I haven't seen anybody who agree with the score say it's the best mmorpg of all time, just that they agree with the score which is on par with the average review score it's been getting everywhere.

Your comparisson to Lineage 2 is absolutely laughable. The economy and overal playstyle of Aion is nothing like Lineage 2 at all. Don't even try to compare Aion's so called grind to Lineage 2. It easily took about a year of hardcore playing to reach the cap in Lineage 2. To compare, The first western Aion player to reach the cap in Aion took about 2 weeks.

Aions design is much more similar to WoW.

Originally posted by Airwren

Originally posted by bloodaxes

The funny thing is we keep on seeing you here flaming, is this the only way you have to pas time during your day? can't play the amazingly story driven lotro or the tactical pvp in eve or the limitless content and pvp in AoC?

Not sure who this is directed at but some people have jobs, and during those working hours we need something else to do besides work.  That's why we come here, bitch on the interwebz about video gamez, porn, our wives, whatever.  Then we go home and play our game of choice so we can go back to work tomorrow to troll forums. 

My fault for not quoting the person but thought it was a bit obvious I was talking about solareus.

The difference between a hater and him is that this guy/gal posts sarcastic comments on aion pics, bury of course and makes fun of almost all of them. Has the tendency to bash aion whenever he can (almost 8h+ a day?) in many threads and this is not something that happens one day only so it's pretty obvious.

Gameloading, we have not battled in a long time, but this is one battle I use scroll of escape /zip ...  and you obviously didnt play lineage 2 when ncsoft developed the "race track" for the gold sellers to have an out of area place to sell gold. And you are right, at least there was point in playing Lineage 2 , control keeps of land area... i wait, Aion does that too but now they float in an Abyss, better know to real gamers as an " Lack of content area"  . You knack for polished turds doesnt dissapoint.

Originally posted by solareus

could try ten ton hammer, Warcry , last i checked the Pc Gamer had an mmorpg discussion area, and CVG.

Since I asked you, I began my own search. I'm not adverse to doing my own research afterall. Here's what I found and what I think from a quick look through the websites.

The Good:

Gamespot.com

GameTrailers.com - I won't visit this site probably. I spent the last 15min trying to figure this website out and what I've learned is that they don't give any reviews or offer any opinions of their own. At least they didn't for the games I searched: WoW and WAR. However, they earned my Good list because they do a very good job of organizing informtion for each game. They have all the news and coverage out there (that I know of) for the games I searched, no matter how old the news was. mmorpg.com does a well enough job covering newly released information, so I don't see this website as necessary.

The Bad:

ONRPG.com

G4tv.com - although they give entertaining and wordy reviews, if you watch the AION review, you will see that they don't put any effort into actually playing the games, making their reviews worthless.

On the Fence:

IGN - They write good reviews, but they're flawed because they're written too soon. They cover a lot of games, and offer similar things as GameSpot. I guess it'd be a choice between the two, but IGN gives hasty reviews, so I side with GameSpot.

Do you know of any other websites and do you have any opinions of the ones I listed?

Originally posted by solareus

Gameloading, we have not battled in a long time, but this is one battle I use scroll of escape /zip ...  and you obviously didnt play lineage 2 when ncsoft developed the "race track" for the gold sellers to have an out of area place to sell gold. And you are right, at least there was point in playing Lineage 2 , control keeps of land area... i wait, Aion does that too but now they float in an Abyss, better know to real gamers as an " Lack of content area"  . You knack for polished turds doesnt dissapoint.

And why is it a lack of content area? Because it isn't filled with NPCs telling you to go kill XX for you?

g4tv needs to stick to console gaming and fps's. IGN is pretty good and not selling out . The hallmark of ratings for pc gaming is CVG , computer and video gaming, owned by Future Publishing, once that review is out then the real battle begins, this is just a warm up exercise here on mmorpg.com.

You're not new to mmorpg's so whyre you acting like it ?

"Level 32 Quest Blue Bow

There is a very easy Quest that gives a great level 32 bow, you go to like Agrorius Village in Elten (Help me out here guys I can't remember and I can't login to check), and there is a quest called "Hannah's (Something)", which tells you to talk to a guy within the Fire Temple instance and has a reward for some Green boots. After you go inside Fire Temple and talk to this guy, he tells you to walk outside and turn in the quest to a chick out there, she then tells you to kill the final boss of Fire Temple to get your blue bow!

If you want to do it one run, have your group help you get outside, takes like 5 min, then continue on to the final boss and you save yourself from having to endure that terrible instance again.

Those are some random things I've learned, I'm 36 and a half now, going to try and push 38 before I go to sleep. Good luck and happy grinding!"