Originally posted by Lowdos

The game lacks polish, so much so that I've felt the need to unsubscribe for the time being. Feels more like a Half Life mod than a proffessionally built MMO.

I don't mean to step on anyone's toes, but we're really sending out mix signals to devs by letting them think its ok to publish buggy, unpolished software.

The potential is there (that word again), but this game needs another good year in the oven to be worth my while as a paid member.

(PS- I do like the game)

Better to lack polish than content. Seems that is a choice devs gotta make these days..

Originally posted by nratnam

I didn't lie about any apsect. IN my comment i left i said the game had major lag/fps issues making unplayable at times and when i was in it would client crash after a while. The minimum i woul expect any game to do is actually run smoothly. Thats not a lot to ask.

It's on of lifes ittle miseries that no game runs perfectly for everyone. It's run perfectly for my laptop so far. Obviously for some reason your experience was different. I'm glad you got yourrefund I hope you find a game that runs more smoothly for you and that you enjoy.

Originally posted by parrotpholk

 As the line goes....screenshot or didnt happen. I have never heard of a MMO company doing this without first going through your CC company first.  Even MO people had to go through their CC company when they got refunds.

You know.. it might be that (very well justified) cynicism toward MMO companies that they're attempting to combat. What benefit would the OP gain from telling everyone "hey, if you want a refund they'll give your money back"?

From that, and other things I've noticed since I started playing, it seems to me that the folks behind it are actually trying to do what so many of us jaded gamers have been asking for: treating us like customers, and not like mere peons only good for handing over our money.

Thus far, in my time in game, they've been consistently communicative. GMs are actually active in-game, talk with the players directly, give updates, provide assistance, and do it with a respectful "tone" - as in, they don't talk as if "from on high". They even joke around! Imagine that!

I could go on with examples but I don't want this to turn into an Icarus Cheerleading post... Suffice to say, they may just be one of those rarities in the industry who actually *do* give a crap about their customers, and their reputation. Certainly, if the threads here for this game are any indication - especially by mmorpg.com standards - then they're doing something right; there's relatively little by way of negative feedback about the game around here.


 

Originally posted by Lowdos

The game lacks polish, so much so that I've felt the need to unsubscribe for the time being. Feels more like a Half Life mod than a proffessionally built MMO.

I don't mean to step on anyone's toes, but we're really sending out mix signals to devs by letting them think its ok to publish buggy, unpolished software.

The potential is there (that word again), but this game needs another good year in the oven to be worth my while as a paid member.

(PS- I do like the game)

By no means is anyone sending out mixed signals from what I've seen. No one - save for fanboys - denies the game has bugs.. people talk about them in-game, ask GMs directly (via the "Help" channel) about them.. the GMs typically will either provide a solution or ask them to please post a bug report about it. Once or twice, that I've seen personally, a GM ask people to check out a specific area that had been a problem spot to verify that it was fixed after a patch. The players seemed pretty psyched at being able to "help out" in that way.

There was an issue with the update yesterday where some dll was botched. People posted about it - calmly and informatively - on the official forums, and they had it resolved within about 30 minutes, keeping people updated via the forums *and* the launcher. 

As for lacking polish... I'll respectfully disagree. Are some aspects of it clunky? Sure. Are there bugs? Yep, and I've yet to see anyone (outside of the "fanboys" - unfortunately every MMO has them) deny that. But all in all, I've seen a notable amount of polish (that is, attention to detail above and beyond the level of "merely acceptable") in certain areas. Then again, that kind of thing might be subjective - what I see as polish, others might see as pointless. But it's more than I've seen from even some so-called AAA developers on their second or third release.

Point is... The players most definitely *are* pointing out the issues. The devs most definitely *are* listening and doing what they can to fix them as quickly as possible, while making other improvements, etc.

Originally posted by PC2009

When  a game is a mess, fanboys says = "the game is not for you" :  laughable.

I dislike being labelled as a 'fanboy' when I asked you a legitimate question. I even stated the reason for my question, after the question proper. Also, I never denied the presence of bugs - in fact, I confirmed it, and also acknowledged that they have been are are being worked on.

I see a lot of complaints about performance and graphics, and all I was asking was which kind of computer you used to run it, and whether or not you had messed around with the settings.

I do realize and understand that some people have problems with lag and performance, but what I'm not getting is what is the cause of it - Like I mentioned, I have a computer that is below minimum specs for the game, with the only saving grace being a decent graphics card, and I have very few issues running FE. Add to that that I'm playing from Europe, so I get added ping times, and I'm still able to play decently, and maybe you can understand why I wonder about the problems that people are reporting.

Like, is it maybe OS related? Or related to specific hardware? Or just settings? Or is it just a flawed client, and if so, why are there people like me who have no (or very few at least) problems running the game?

Originally posted by WSIMike

Originally posted by Lowdos

The game lacks polish, so much so that I've felt the need to unsubscribe for the time being. Feels more like a Half Life mod than a proffessionally built MMO.

I don't mean to step on anyone's toes, but we're really sending out mix signals to devs by letting them think its ok to publish buggy, unpolished software.

The potential is there (that word again), but this game needs another good year in the oven to be worth my while as a paid member.

(PS- I do like the game)

By no means is anyone sending out mixed signals from what I've seen. No one - save for fanboys - denies the game has bugs.. people talk about them in-game, ask GMs directly (via the "Help" channel) about them.. the GMs typically will either provide a solution or ask them to please post a bug report about it. Once or twice, that I've seen personally, a GM ask people to check out a specific area that had been a problem spot to verify that it was fixed after a patch. The players seemed pretty psyched at being able to "help out" in that way.

There was an issue with the update yesterday where some dll was botched. People posted about it - calmly and informatively - on the official forums, and they had it resolved within about 30 minutes, keeping people updated via the forums *and* the launcher. 

As for lacking polish... I'll respectfully disagree. Are some aspects of it clunky? Sure. Are there bugs? Yep, and I've yet to see anyone (outside of the "fanboys" - unfortunately every MMO has them) deny that. But all in all, I've seen a notable amount of polish (that is, attention to detail above and beyond the level of "merely acceptable") in certain areas. Then again, that kind of thing might be subjective - what I see as polish, others might see as pointless. But it's more than I've seen from even some so-called AAA developers on their second or third release.

Point is... The players most definitely *are* pointing out the issues. The devs most definitely *are* listening and doing what they can to fix them as quickly as possible, while making other improvements, etc.

 

These are exactly the reasons while I am gonna keep my sub for some time - I'm also seeing the bugs, they annoy me, but they get fixed, and the game gets optimized. So far 95% of my time ingame is happy gaming, 5% is frustration (lag, freeze, warping mob, instance not resetting etc.).  There were bad days (we all remember the first Sunday....lol), but bad things get ironed and plucked out one by one. This behaviour itself is telling me that these guys actually do work and will work for the money I'm sending them each month (or tri-monthly, as my sub plan is set up :)

DB

Originally posted by Bribarian

This is why MMOs need a free trial or a test server.

But I guess as long as suckers will run out and buy the game at launch they won't do this.

What an excellent idea!

And it should be extended to all consumer products. From food to hardware. Cars to clothes etc

Ah Sony released a new PsP, can i try before i buy?

Look there is a new restaurant, lets go and sample the food  for free. 

New LCD TVS have just been launched, I will test one for a few weeks, i am sure panasonic will give me a set for a trial.

New iTouch has been release and ofc Apple offer 5 day free trials on all handsets.

Go and buy a couple of CDs dont like the music, np just take it back within5 days for a full refund.

Get yourself down to Ferrari show room and test drive an F40 for a week, cost =free.

Ultimately nobody will sell anything anymore.

Originally posted by Bribarian

This is why MMOs need a free trial or a test server.

But I guess as long as suckers will run out and buy the game at launch they won't do this.

That's why there's open and closed beta people can "try it" although they should test it but anyways and would get an idea of how the game is.

If for X reason you lost the chance to try it in that days it's not the devs problem sorry.

All softs including games have bugs. But FE has enormous bugs and terrible lag. This game is simply unplayable for the moment. Unplayable = refund.

"some people have problems with lag and performance, "

not some people but EVERYONE: everyone had problems with lag with mob warping etc. (everyone : cf forums)

1 to 10 FPS in town: do you it's playable ? Mobs warping, lag and enormous atency between the clic on the skill and the attack do you think it's playable ? NO it is NOT.

Are you working for Icarus ? Don't worry it's over:, with this joke they won't have 50k subs. never. 

Payed twice for indy games: same results.

Roma Victor

Fallen Earth.

It's not a problem of taste but of poor execution. I don't even know if i could like the game because it's UN PLAY ABLE.

Originally posted by Bribarian

This is why MMOs need a free trial or a test server.

But I guess as long as suckers will run out and buy the game at launch they won't do this.

Its only been out for about three weeks now.

Come on people.... Use you're brains.

Originally posted by bloodaxes

Originally posted by Bribarian

This is why MMOs need a free trial or a test server.

But I guess as long as suckers will run out and buy the game at launch they won't do this.

 

That's why there's open and closed beta people can "try it" although they should test it but anyways and would get an idea of how the game is.

If for X reason you lost the chance to try it in that days it's not the devs problem sorry.

Beta is not for that, you are what is wrong with MMO's and betas.

Originally posted by PC2009

all softs including games have bugs. But FE has enormous bugs and terrible lag. This game is simply unplayable for the moment. Unplayable = refund.

It is completely playable for a good number of people, please, speak for yourself.

Originally posted by PC2009

all softs including games have bugs. But FE has enormous bugs and terrible lag. This game is simply unplayable for the moment. Unplayable = refund.

Like others have said. Most people get around fine. Sometimes it has to do with your system. Not every has the same experience as you.

Wish all trolls would only last for 3 days on this site :D

DB

 You know, I think its kind of funny that with each new game that comes out the system specs continue to increase and increase, and some players... myself included, that have these aging computers will have to upgrade some things just to stay current,  yet the second someone says the word Console and MMO together, people throw a complete fit.

If more MMOs were created for one single type of system the developers would be able to optimize the game much better, so as not to have to guess if you're running a processor from 2005 or a video card just under specs.  They would know what everyone is running and players wouldn't really be able to complain about performance issues on a machine that can't handle it.

Just a thought.

Originally posted by maskedweasel

 ...yet the second someone says the word Console and MMO together, people throw a complete fit.

Well, Smedley of SOE has said that all of their future MMO's will be made for both PC and the PS3. Not a console fan myself, but business-wise, it makes sense to develop for a platform where everyone is on equal terms.

I like my keyboard and mouse setup though, and I prefer PC gaming in general, so I'm happy to see that SOE is still taking this type of customer into account as well as the console crowd.

Originally posted by maskedweasel

 You know, I think its kind of funny that with each new game that comes out the system specs continue to increase and increase, and some players... myself included, that have these aging computers will have to upgrade some things just to stay current,  yet the second someone says the word Console and MMO together, people throw a complete fit.

 

If more MMOs were created for one single type of system the developers would be able to optimize the game much better, so as not to have to guess if you're running a processor from 2005 or a video card just under specs.  They would know what everyone is running and players wouldn't really be able to complain about performance issues on a machine that can't handle it.

 

Just a thought.

specs go up as technology increases. years ago we were limited to 1D/2D games. then someone came up with 2.5D games then figured out 3D and how to make 2D look 3D (sims1 anyone?)  naturally the computers/consoles at the time lacked the power. so naturally people had to upgrade their rig to make use of the newer tech.

people seem to forget computers/console technology is continuing to evolve the tech we have right now is actually long since discontinued. the development of faster.. better.. smaller devices or more powerful things are already advancing beyond what anyone today has.. it just hasnt left the development floor yet.

so saddly no developer can make a program/game for one system .. as they will have to factor in people with slower systems and faster ones

no one wants to pay 60 bucks plus 5-20bucks a month for a game that is set for a system from 1980s no matter how new the game is.. its not worth it honestly if you rig can run say AoC with everything on godly max...

so games are built with 2 sets in mind. the high end and the low end, tho they do optimize it as best they can :/

Originally posted by Deleted User

All softs including games have bugs. But FE has enormous bugs and terrible lag. This game is simply unplayable for the moment. Unplayable = refund.

Unplayable for YOU. That is a shame, it is performing very well for me.

"some people have problems with lag and performance, "

not some people but EVERYONE: everyone had problems with lag with mob warping etc. (everyone : cf forums)

I have had rather minor lag issues and very little warping; the warping I have experienced has had no effect on my gameplay at all. So I guess you would have to further refine your "everyone" statement to clarify the exact problems people have been having with lag and warping.

My biggest issue was when I first started playing and was getting disconnected every ten minutes.  I eventually figured out that I needed to update my sound card driver.

1 to 10 FPS in town: do you it's playable ? Mobs warping, lag and enormous atency between the clic on the skill and the attack do you think it's playable ? NO it is NOT.

I commonly get between 35 and 50 fps in Embry, Oilville, etc. In open areas, I typically get between 80 and 110 fps.

My attacks go off pretty much when I click them. I have experienced lag with merchants, however.

So yes, I consider the game to be highly playable.

Are you working for Icarus ? Don't worry it's over:, with this joke they won't have 50k subs. never. 

Payed twice for indy games: same results.

Roma Victor

Fallen Earth.

 

It's not a problem of taste but of poor execution. I don't even know if i could like the game because it's UN PLAY ABLE.

It's a shame your experience was negative. That does not make the game unplayable; it only makes it unplayable for you.

Mine, overall, has been great! The game atmosphere, storyline, missions, crafting... they are a breath of fresh air. Even when I'm not doing anything specific, I am still accomplishing goals.

Game performance has been very good for me, besides the initial CTDs from my old sound card driver.

 All that said, I certainly believe that if the purchaser meets the minimum requirements of the software and the software consistently fails to perform, they should get their money back.

For my part, with MMOs, I tend to be more lenient because they are live products and are constantly in a state of patching and tweaking.

So it is more likely that I will actually see a fix for my issue in the near future, as opposed to waiting on a developer for a single-player game, utility, or productivity suite to issue a patch, which normally takes considerably longer.

I'm guessing all of this "unplayable" nonsense must either be a bad attempt at trolling, or these people are trying to run the game on a 5+ year old computer. I'm personally playing the game at close to max settings on a 2+ year old machine (which, btw, wasn't even close to being top-end when I made it) and getting a very reasonable frame-rate everywhere I've been. Sure, it slows down a bit in towns and such, but for the most part, I haven't had any performance complaints.

Compared to games like EQ2, AoC, and Warhammer, this game gives a much more satisfying performance, at least in my experience.

Originally posted by Ichmen

Originally posted by maskedweasel

 You know, I think its kind of funny that with each new game that comes out the system specs continue to increase and increase, and some players... myself included, that have these aging computers will have to upgrade some things just to stay current,  yet the second someone says the word Console and MMO together, people throw a complete fit.

 

If more MMOs were created for one single type of system the developers would be able to optimize the game much better, so as not to have to guess if you're running a processor from 2005 or a video card just under specs.  They would know what everyone is running and players wouldn't really be able to complain about performance issues on a machine that can't handle it.

 

Just a thought.

 

 

specs go up as technology increases. years ago we were limited to 1D/2D games.

Name a single 1D game and I will say sorry!

Originally posted by majinant

Originally posted by Ichmen

Originally posted by maskedweasel

 You know, I think its kind of funny that with each new game that comes out the system specs continue to increase and increase, and some players... myself included, that have these aging computers will have to upgrade some things just to stay current,  yet the second someone says the word Console and MMO together, people throw a complete fit.

 

If more MMOs were created for one single type of system the developers would be able to optimize the game much better, so as not to have to guess if you're running a processor from 2005 or a video card just under specs.  They would know what everyone is running and players wouldn't really be able to complain about performance issues on a machine that can't handle it.

 

Just a thought.

 

 

specs go up as technology increases. years ago we were limited to 1D/2D games.

 

Name a single 1D game and I will say sorry!

Yeah, this has hit my eye too.... 1D is a line, nothing more :D

DB

Originally posted by DonnieBrasco

Originally posted by majinant

Originally posted by Ichmen

Originally posted by maskedweasel

 You know, I think its kind of funny that with each new game that comes out the system specs continue to increase and increase, and some players... myself included, that have these aging computers will have to upgrade some things just to stay current,  yet the second someone says the word Console and MMO together, people throw a complete fit.

 

If more MMOs were created for one single type of system the developers would be able to optimize the game much better, so as not to have to guess if you're running a processor from 2005 or a video card just under specs.  They would know what everyone is running and players wouldn't really be able to complain about performance issues on a machine that can't handle it.

 

Just a thought.

 

 

specs go up as technology increases. years ago we were limited to 1D/2D games.

 

Name a single 1D game and I will say sorry!

 

Yeah, this has hit my eye too.... 1D is a line, nothing more :D

DB

Damn it is difficult. I know a dot game , you watch a dot blink.... just kidding.

Originally posted by piotrsan

Originally posted by DonnieBrasco

Originally posted by majinant

Originally posted by Ichmen

Originally posted by maskedweasel

 You know, I think its kind of funny that with each new game that comes out the system specs continue to increase and increase, and some players... myself included, that have these aging computers will have to upgrade some things just to stay current,  yet the second someone says the word Console and MMO together, people throw a complete fit.

 

If more MMOs were created for one single type of system the developers would be able to optimize the game much better, so as not to have to guess if you're running a processor from 2005 or a video card just under specs.  They would know what everyone is running and players wouldn't really be able to complain about performance issues on a machine that can't handle it.

 

Just a thought.

 

 

specs go up as technology increases. years ago we were limited to 1D/2D games.

 

Name a single 1D game and I will say sorry!

 

Yeah, this has hit my eye too.... 1D is a line, nothing more :D

DB

Damn it is difficult. I know a dot game , you watch a dot blink.... just kidding.

A snake game, with no turns allowed? :DD

DB

Well, I retract my earlier statement because I'm still playing and enjoying myself - lack of polish non-withstanding. I'm willing to keep my account open for at least a couple more months to support the devs a little bit.

Originally posted by Lowdos

Well, I retract my earlier statement because I'm still playing and enjoying myself - lack of polish non-withstanding. I'm willing to keep my account open for at least a couple more months to support the devs a little bit.

Hey, excellent :) I never thought you'll actually do what I suggested to be a good idea :) Kudos, man (even if it wasn't me influencing...) 

DB