I have to say, after all these years I am finally retired from this genre for good until someone makes an enjoyable, non-nightmare world to enjoy.

I would like to see exploring, community depth, personalizing your character avatar and creative gameplay mechanics that do no resort to violent mob hunting. Free Realms is onto a good start with some of their different options of gameplay but I think It could still use some more refinement.

Also a bright, light, wonderful, enchanted and colorful graphics style/ game environment is important to me too.

RL can be enough of a nightmare as is, I personally don't enjoy playing in worlds that are even worse. But to each their own.

It's as though recently I've had this sensitive epiphany. Violence, darkness, depressing things, evil and everything else in between is what makes life a drag and yet we're all sitting here paying huge money overtime to spend large amounts of time in worlds that are in fact almost more of a nightmare.

I hope we can all come to realize that we should live by things that really make us feel good and are full of real light. And have the content of the interior world of reality through technology embody these bright and loving ideas. I mean, nature and the natural earth is becoming minimized and a lot of what we create into reality today is based on our interior ideas.. Even our present state of the world today, Is in reality based off many ideas : housing, vehicle transportation, technology, media etc. These are merely figments of the imagination manifested into physical reality from a harmonized agreement through physical natural materials and imagination, whilst utiziling these materials to create it on the physical plane.

Your thoughts, feelings, ideas and comments are welcome.




                                                                          

Tried A Tale In The Desert? Check out my sig, otherwise. ;D

No thanks!

I enjoy dark worlds where good AND bad things can happen. Obviously there is room in todays market for all different types of games. As you pointed out, Freerealms is doing great, but I became bored with it after the first 30 minutes.

Its technically very difficult to advance story without conflict, i truly cannot imagine a setting where you could advance without violnce in this genre. Yes, games could focus on puzzles or sports but those are niches unlikely to become persistent worlds on the same level as rpgs. Even carebears had some sort of enemy i think.

Well I know of one non-violent MMO and it's called The Endless Forest. Also in Wizard 101 I don't believe mobs are actually killed. They call it defeated and since it is a card dueling system I imagine it's similar to something like Pokemon where people don't actually die if they are beat in a battle.

I can't say I ever saw killing mobs in an MMO as a nightmare or anything even close. I always saw it as a fight between good and evil and I wouldn't want my world to be taken over by evil creatures so I am fighting to keep it alive. Also I don't believe many MMOs are actually dark and depressing. The first and only one that comes to mind that is close to that thought would be Requiem: Bloodymare and I haven't found another game like that.

While I don't feel as absolutist as the OP, I think it would be refreshing if MMO's featured more than killing mobs as the main form of entertainment.  For me, I favor a balance of options including combat, puzzles, rp and non violent resolution depending on story, setting and game style.

You can still have conflict, drama, and suspense without having violence and murder.   The trick is, that this form of story telling is much more harder to impliment.  Given that non violent conflict resolution often requires thought, puzzle solving, diplomacy, rp, and even emotional components such would be far more difficult to program for MMO AI.

Still, I think if MMO's did offer a greater variety of ways that challenges and opponents could be bested, including non violent means, that would create a more solid and rewarding experience.

Interestingly, there is one non violent endeavor that is a mainstay of the role playing genre that is often overlooked or even ignored in most MMO's:  Exploration.  If devs created a world that was engaging, interesting, unique and more than just a pretty platform for wandering mobs, this would go a long way.

Originally posted by Caleveira

Its technically very difficult to advance story without conflict, i truly cannot imagine a setting where you could advance without violnce in this genre. Yes, games could focus on puzzles or sports but those are niches unlikely to become persistent worlds on the same level as rpgs. Even carebears had some sort of enemy i think.

You can still have a decent story without a nefarious antagonist. Such as Franklin The Turtle, Baby Looney Tunes etc

  I was also thinking trying a different take as one possibility as in no protagonist and antagonist. More so a player driven world. You could give the player very free tools, such as drawing palettes that allow you to translate what you've drawn into the gameworld, a more creative form of player crafting if you will. It is possible to implement this with today's technology, such as the Nintendo DS game Scribblenauts. Just one idea of many possibilities.

The players could have more freedom to shape the world, and a story doesn't always have to be about violence :)

 

Originally posted by NeverLand7

Originally posted by Caleveira

Its technically very difficult to advance story without conflict, i truly cannot imagine a setting where you could advance without violnce in this genre. Yes, games could focus on puzzles or sports but those are niches unlikely to become persistent worlds on the same level as rpgs. Even carebears had some sort of enemy i think.

You can still have a decent story without a nefarious antagonist. Such as Franklin The Turtle, Baby Looney Tunes etc

  I was also thinking trying a different take as one possibility as in no protagonist and antagonist. More so a player driven world. You could give the player very free tools, such as drawing palettes that allow you to translate what you've drawn into the gameworld, a more creative form of player crafting if you will. It is possible to implement this with today's technology, such as the Nintendo DS game Scribblenauts. Just one idea of many possibilities.

The players could have more freedom to shape the world, and a story doesn't always have to be about violence :)

 

Sounds like really the OP is describing Second Life. In SL you can pretty much do all these things, and it is completely a player driven world. But you wanna start throwing in the looney tunes n such...I doubt you are really aiming at adults. This would draw more children online...In a world controlled by adults that like such things. I don't think it would be such a great idea.

 sl or maybe entropia universe ,not sure about entropia universe

and dont relly on release date here it say 2003 but they got a brand new  engine in august 

wanted to try it but i couldnt install it it keep saying error on my comp

Originally posted by talismen351

Originally posted by NeverLand7

Originally posted by Caleveira

Its technically very difficult to advance story without conflict, i truly cannot imagine a setting where you could advance without violnce in this genre. Yes, games could focus on puzzles or sports but those are niches unlikely to become persistent worlds on the same level as rpgs. Even carebears had some sort of enemy i think.

You can still have a decent story without a nefarious antagonist. Such as Franklin The Turtle, Baby Looney Tunes etc

  I was also thinking trying a different take as one possibility as in no protagonist and antagonist. More so a player driven world. You could give the player very free tools, such as drawing palettes that allow you to translate what you've drawn into the gameworld, a more creative form of player crafting if you will. It is possible to implement this with today's technology, such as the Nintendo DS game Scribblenauts. Just one idea of many possibilities.

The players could have more freedom to shape the world, and a story doesn't always have to be about violence :)

 

 

Sounds like really the OP is describing Second Life. In SL you can pretty much do all these things, and it is completely a player driven world. But you wanna start throwing in the looney tunes n such...I doubt you are really aiming at adults. This would draw more children online...In a world controlled by adults that like such things. I don't think it would be such a great idea.

Not really talking about games like Second Life even though they incorporate some of those gameplay mechanics. More so games like Free Realms etc but without the violence, taking place in a bright, light, colorful, enchanted and possibly fantasy world. Such as Carebears, Franklin The Turtle and Baby Looney Tunes or even Peter Pans Neverland just minus the violence.

Bright, nice and lovely worlds

Originally posted by NeverLand7

Originally posted by Caleveira

Its technically very difficult to advance story without conflict, i truly cannot imagine a setting where you could advance without violnce in this genre. Yes, games could focus on puzzles or sports but those are niches unlikely to become persistent worlds on the same level as rpgs. Even carebears had some sort of enemy i think.

You can still have a decent story without a nefarious antagonist. Such as Franklin The Turtle, Baby Looney Tunes etc

  I was also thinking trying a different take as one possibility as in no protagonist and antagonist. More so a player driven world. You could give the player very free tools, such as drawing palettes that allow you to translate what you've drawn into the gameworld, a more creative form of player crafting if you will. It is possible to implement this with today's technology, such as the Nintendo DS game Scribblenauts. Just one idea of many possibilities.

The players could have more freedom to shape the world, and a story doesn't always have to be about violence :)

 

I can understand your point although i must say i dont personally relate to it. To me stories like the ones you mentioned are precisely one of the things gone wrong with contemporary society, they dont challenge kids. Look at the great classics like the brothers Grimm or Saint-Exuperys Le Petit Prince, back in my day Hemmingways The Old Man and the Sea was considered a book apropiate for children...
 

I would never make the mistake of giving my kids books without literary value and then complaint they dont like to read. i would be very receptive if we were talking quality works like Satrapis Persepolis (certainly not without a dark tone and suggested violence) but trying to abolish it completely from a game just leads to further decay into a Disneyfied society. Sure, senseless violence a la Mortal Kombat can be just as bad but MMOs rarely cross that line.

Aside from my personal gripe with political correctness, i think it would be a mistake to continue making MMOs that apeal to the very young. Yes, i do get anoyed by children loose on MMOs but my actual concern is playing this games is already challenging enough for an adult in terms of time management, they can prove disastrous for kids.

without combat and and all that it's more of a harvest moon similuation game than an MMO.

Originally posted by NeverLand7

Originally posted by talismen351

Originally posted by NeverLand7

Originally posted by Caleveira

Its technically very difficult to advance story without conflict, i truly cannot imagine a setting where you could advance without violnce in this genre. Yes, games could focus on puzzles or sports but those are niches unlikely to become persistent worlds on the same level as rpgs. Even carebears had some sort of enemy i think.

You can still have a decent story without a nefarious antagonist. Such as Franklin The Turtle, Baby Looney Tunes etc

  I was also thinking trying a different take as one possibility as in no protagonist and antagonist. More so a player driven world. You could give the player very free tools, such as drawing palettes that allow you to translate what you've drawn into the gameworld, a more creative form of player crafting if you will. It is possible to implement this with today's technology, such as the Nintendo DS game Scribblenauts. Just one idea of many possibilities.

The players could have more freedom to shape the world, and a story doesn't always have to be about violence :)

 

 

Sounds like really the OP is describing Second Life. In SL you can pretty much do all these things, and it is completely a player driven world. But you wanna start throwing in the looney tunes n such...I doubt you are really aiming at adults. This would draw more children online...In a world controlled by adults that like such things. I don't think it would be such a great idea.

 

Not really talking about games like Second Life even though they incorporate some of those gameplay mechanics. More so games like Free Realms etc but without the violence, taking place in a bright, light, colorful, enchanted and possibly fantasy world. Such as Carebears, Franklin The Turtle and Baby Looney Tunes or even Peter Pans Neverland just minus the violence.

Bright, nice and lovely worlds

And have you ever actually watched any of these shows? Every one of them have conflict and stories. Even in kiddie cartoons these elements are needed to keep interest. If you created a world all bright and colourfull with no conflict or storyline, you would end up with an empty colourfull world.

Originally posted by Caleveira

Originally posted by NeverLand7

Originally posted by Caleveira

Its technically very difficult to advance story without conflict, i truly cannot imagine a setting where you could advance without violnce in this genre. Yes, games could focus on puzzles or sports but those are niches unlikely to become persistent worlds on the same level as rpgs. Even carebears had some sort of enemy i think.

You can still have a decent story without a nefarious antagonist. Such as Franklin The Turtle, Baby Looney Tunes etc

  I was also thinking trying a different take as one possibility as in no protagonist and antagonist. More so a player driven world. You could give the player very free tools, such as drawing palettes that allow you to translate what you've drawn into the gameworld, a more creative form of player crafting if you will. It is possible to implement this with today's technology, such as the Nintendo DS game Scribblenauts. Just one idea of many possibilities.

The players could have more freedom to shape the world, and a story doesn't always have to be about violence :)

 

I can understand your point although i must say i dont personally relate to it. To me stories like the ones you mentioned are precisely one of the things gone wrong with contemporary society, they dont challenge kids. Look at the great classics like the brothers Grimm or Saint-Exuperys Le Petit Prince, back in my day Hemmingways The Old Man and the Sea was considered a book apropiate for children...
 

I would never make the mistake of giving my kids books without literary value and then complaint they dont like to read. i would be very receptive if we were talking quality works like Satrapis Persepolis (certainly not without a dark tone and suggested violence) but trying to abolish it completely from a game just leads to further decay into a Disneyfied society. Sure, senseless violence a la Mortal Kombat can be just as bad but MMOs rarely cross that line.

Aside from my personal gripe with political correctness, i think it would be a mistake to continue making MMOs that apeal to the very young. Yes, i do get anoyed by children loose on MMOs but my actual concern is playing this games is already challenging enough for an adult in terms of time management, they can prove disastrous for kids.

Well I personally don`t look at a spiritually mature world as childish ( Many would beg to differ ) but all that aside I think even if the game did attract a younger audience, if you had good text to read, creative artistic outlets in the game ( Such as one of the ones I mentioned earlier in this thread. ) amongst other things, It would probably be a better amount of time spent with your friends then just chatting on MSN.

I know we can`t all see eye to eye and that`s okay, that`s part of being a human being on the earth.
 

Originally posted by talismen351

 

And have you ever actually watched any of these shows? Every one of them have conflict and stories. Even in kiddie cartoons these elements are needed to keep interest. If you created a world all bright and colourfull with no conflict or storyline, you would end up with an empty colourfull world.

Yes I have and I`m not exactly saying a total 100% of removing conflict, although that would be nice :). What I am saying is we could create more spiritually evolved interior worlds with good dreams.

how about Fauna Sphere, Wizard 101, Cities XL, or best of all: a psychiatrist...

Originally posted by NeverLand7

Originally posted by Caleveira

Originally posted by NeverLand7

Originally posted by Caleveira

Its technically very difficult to advance story without conflict, i truly cannot imagine a setting where you could advance without violnce in this genre. Yes, games could focus on puzzles or sports but those are niches unlikely to become persistent worlds on the same level as rpgs. Even carebears had some sort of enemy i think.

You can still have a decent story without a nefarious antagonist. Such as Franklin The Turtle, Baby Looney Tunes etc

  I was also thinking trying a different take as one possibility as in no protagonist and antagonist. More so a player driven world. You could give the player very free tools, such as drawing palettes that allow you to translate what you've drawn into the gameworld, a more creative form of player crafting if you will. It is possible to implement this with today's technology, such as the Nintendo DS game Scribblenauts. Just one idea of many possibilities.

The players could have more freedom to shape the world, and a story doesn't always have to be about violence :)

 

I can understand your point although i must say i dont personally relate to it. To me stories like the ones you mentioned are precisely one of the things gone wrong with contemporary society, they dont challenge kids. Look at the great classics like the brothers Grimm or Saint-Exuperys Le Petit Prince, back in my day Hemmingways The Old Man and the Sea was considered a book apropiate for children...
 

I would never make the mistake of giving my kids books without literary value and then complaint they dont like to read. i would be very receptive if we were talking quality works like Satrapis Persepolis (certainly not without a dark tone and suggested violence) but trying to abolish it completely from a game just leads to further decay into a Disneyfied society. Sure, senseless violence a la Mortal Kombat can be just as bad but MMOs rarely cross that line.

Aside from my personal gripe with political correctness, i think it would be a mistake to continue making MMOs that apeal to the very young. Yes, i do get anoyed by children loose on MMOs but my actual concern is playing this games is already challenging enough for an adult in terms of time management, they can prove disastrous for kids.

 

Well I personally don`t look at a spiritually mature world as childish ( Many would beg to differ ) but all that aside I think even if the game did attract a younger audience, if you had good text to read, creative artistic outlets in the game ( Such as one of the ones I mentioned earlier in this thread. ) amongst other things, It would probably be a better amount of time spent with your friends then just chatting on MSN.

I know we can`t all see eye to eye and that`s okay, that`s part of being a human being on the earth.
 

Ok, i really think we are on a diferent page here, all the works i quoted are certainly included in what i would consider spiritually mature. If youre gonna take whatever Hasbros or Mattels marketing divissions churn out over acomplished artists then we absolutely have no common ground. Seriously i feel like im talking to Michael Jacksons ghost here, carebears and baby looney tunes and franklin the turtle are nothing more than animated ads intent on selling toys (actually i think franklin the turtle sells religion which is much worse) you cant call them spiritual. To me that would be authors like Hesse or Cortazar, musicians like Morrison or Stravinsky, painters like Dolci or Picasso. Man...

Originally posted by Caleveira

Originally posted by NeverLand7

Originally posted by Caleveira

Originally posted by NeverLand7

Originally posted by Caleveira

Its technically very difficult to advance story without conflict, i truly cannot imagine a setting where you could advance without violnce in this genre. Yes, games could focus on puzzles or sports but those are niches unlikely to become persistent worlds on the same level as rpgs. Even carebears had some sort of enemy i think.

You can still have a decent story without a nefarious antagonist. Such as Franklin The Turtle, Baby Looney Tunes etc

  I was also thinking trying a different take as one possibility as in no protagonist and antagonist. More so a player driven world. You could give the player very free tools, such as drawing palettes that allow you to translate what you've drawn into the gameworld, a more creative form of player crafting if you will. It is possible to implement this with today's technology, such as the Nintendo DS game Scribblenauts. Just one idea of many possibilities.

The players could have more freedom to shape the world, and a story doesn't always have to be about violence :)

 

I can understand your point although i must say i dont personally relate to it. To me stories like the ones you mentioned are precisely one of the things gone wrong with contemporary society, they dont challenge kids. Look at the great classics like the brothers Grimm or Saint-Exuperys Le Petit Prince, back in my day Hemmingways The Old Man and the Sea was considered a book apropiate for children...
 

I would never make the mistake of giving my kids books without literary value and then complaint they dont like to read. i would be very receptive if we were talking quality works like Satrapis Persepolis (certainly not without a dark tone and suggested violence) but trying to abolish it completely from a game just leads to further decay into a Disneyfied society. Sure, senseless violence a la Mortal Kombat can be just as bad but MMOs rarely cross that line.

Aside from my personal gripe with political correctness, i think it would be a mistake to continue making MMOs that apeal to the very young. Yes, i do get anoyed by children loose on MMOs but my actual concern is playing this games is already challenging enough for an adult in terms of time management, they can prove disastrous for kids.

 

Well I personally don`t look at a spiritually mature world as childish ( Many would beg to differ ) but all that aside I think even if the game did attract a younger audience, if you had good text to read, creative artistic outlets in the game ( Such as one of the ones I mentioned earlier in this thread. ) amongst other things, It would probably be a better amount of time spent with your friends then just chatting on MSN.

I know we can`t all see eye to eye and that`s okay, that`s part of being a human being on the earth.
 

 

Ok, i really think we are on a diferent page here, all the works i quoted are certainly included in what i would consider spiritually mature. If youre gonna take whatever Hasbros or Mattels marketing divissions churn out over acomplished artists then we absolutely have no common ground. Seriously i feel like im talking to Michael Jacksons ghost here, carebears and baby looney tunes and franklin the turtle are nothing more than animated ads intent on selling toys (actually i think franklin the turtle sells religion which is much worse) you cant call them spiritual. To me that would be authors like Hesse or Cortazar, musicians like Morrison or Stravinsky, painters like Dolci or Picasso. Man...

Now before I say anything, I would just like to say that I do not take sides and I would like to keep the human ambiguity as open as possible.

I believe that because we are subjective ambiguous human beings, I would like to keep things as open as possible.

At the same time It is very much so a paradox. Now I suppose we shouldn`t drift off and get into the depths of creation, life`s meaning, why the Universe was manifested etc So basically I understand we don`t see eye to eye and all I can do is respect the situation at hand, I`m not trying to change your ideas about what is better in regards to these media`s, I can`t eat for you.

Well I personally disagree and having watched those shows, I can say they are more than animated ads.

I`m not trying to discredit what you feel in regards to media etc is more perfect but as far as I am concerned everyone has defects just as a fire is surrounded by smoke. Nobody is ''perfect'' and if anyone thinks that someone is, It's because they fit their own subjective, ambiguous ideal on the basis of their own ideas of what is perfect.

We see two different things, and I`m not going to attack you for that and I hope you can respect me too.

 

Originally posted by NeverLand7

I have to say, after all these years I am finally retired from this genre for good until someone makes an enjoyable, non-nightmare world to enjoy.

I would like to see exploring, community depth, personalizing your character avatar and creative gameplay mechanics that do no resort to violent mob hunting. Free Realms is onto a good start with some of their different options of gameplay but I think It could still use some more refinement.

Also a bright, light, wonderful, enchanted and colorful graphics style/ game environment is important to me too.

RL can be enough of a nightmare as is, I personally don't enjoy playing in worlds that are even worse. But to each their own.

It's as though recently I've had this sensitive epiphany. Violence, darkness, depressing things, evil and everything else in between is what makes life a drag and yet we're all sitting here paying huge money overtime to spend large amounts of time in worlds that are in fact almost more of a nightmare.

I hope we can all come to realize that we should live by things that really make us feel good and are full of real light. And have the content of the interior world of reality through technology embody these bright and loving ideas. I mean, nature and the natural earth is becoming minimized and a lot of what we create into reality today is based on our interior ideas.. Even our present state of the world today, Is in reality based off many ideas : housing, vehicle transportation, technology, media etc. These are merely figments of the imagination manifested into physical reality from a harmonized agreement through physical natural materials and imagination, whilst utiziling these materials to create it on the physical plane.

Your thoughts, feelings, ideas and comments are welcome.



                                                                          

 

Nah I wouldn't be interested. To me it is about vanquishing evil. It's about adventure and excitement and in some ways being a kid again and with our sitcks as swords we would go into the woods and defeat trolls and dragons.

This is not to say that games shouldn't have more puzzles or perhaps non-violent gameplay, but the problem with puzzles is that once they are solved someone posts the answer and the content is bypassed.

I believe thye had an online version of myst and the sims and neither did well.

I play MMOS mainly because I like the whole Fantasy/Medieval theme and the main thing about that is the raw and brutal world, the mysticism etc... without it, it would be pointless for me, even stuff like Free Realms which is "borderline" what you explained bores me, I say borderline because it actually has some mobs but its alot more fluffy and nice, its fun for a bit but for me the simulation is everything, the conflict the intrigue, slaying dragons and going on epic adventures.

Originally posted by NeverLand7

I have to say, after all these years I am finally retired from this genre for good until someone makes an enjoyable, non-nightmare world to enjoy.

I would like to see exploring, community depth, personalizing your character avatar and creative gameplay mechanics that do not resort to violent mob hunting. Free Realms is onto a good start with some of their different options of gameplay but I think It could still use some more refinement.

Also a bright, light, wonderful, enchanted and colorful graphics style/ game environment is important to me too.

RL can be enough of a nightmare as is, I personally don't enjoy playing in worlds that are even worse. But to each their own.

It's as though recently I've had this sensitive epiphany. Violence, darkness, depressing things, evil and everything else in between is what makes life a drag and yet we're all sitting here paying huge money overtime to spend large amounts of time in worlds that are in fact almost more of a nightmare.

I hope we can all come to realize that we should live by things that really make us feel good and are full of real light. And have the content of the interior world of reality through technology embody these bright and loving ideas. I mean, nature and the natural earth is becoming minimized and a lot of what we create into reality today is based on our interior ideas.. Even our present state of the world today, Is in reality based off many ideas : housing, vehicle transportation, technology, media etc. These are merely figments of the imagination manifested into physical reality from a harmonized agreement through physical natural materials and imagination, whilst utiziling these materials to create it on the physical plane.

Your thoughts, feelings, ideas and comments are welcome.

I'd like see MMOs break away from the mob killing formula, and focus in other ways, like what you suggest.  Not so fond of the carebear theme, though.  I like dark and gritty, but wouldn't mind seeing the violence toned down to realistic levels, to make way for gameplay that's about something different.

A Tale in the Desert could be an amazing example, if it were a much bigger project, but as it is, it's kinda hard to get into.

I think Sovrath hits the nail with just being something of a kid again. I got to have something of a Tom Sawyer type early childhood myself (grew up on a small town in Mexicos Pacific) and those were really glorious years. Skipping school to try and build a boat, escaping from aggressive dogs, etc. The sad thing is kids this days will never know what that was like. And IMHO is worse for girls, i remeber how my baby sisters face would light up everytime i took her with my friends when we went climbing trees or rolling down steep streets with skateboards, shes only a year younger than me and it was well worth it getting yelled at for putting her in "danger" I can only imagine how many good pvpers we lost to brainwashing by strawberry shortcake and my little pony.

 OP, which games like this do you know of exist? I know of a few... but I'm curious as to if you've actually looked for those that are already available, aside from freerealms?

Originally posted by Lansid

 OP, which games like this do you know of exist? I know of a few... but I'm curious as to if you've actually looked for those that are already available, aside from freerealms?

Free Realms at the moment seems to be the closest thing to what I'm looking for. There's other games like ATITD, Heaven and Earth and ToonTown. I've also tried DOMO but It's too combat heavy.

The other games I've mentioned either their graphics style didn't appeal to me etc.

I'm curious as to what other games are currently out that you know of that you think I don't know about.

Please tell us about them. I've probably seen them but you never know.

 Ultima Online comes to mind, unless if they've changed the game. Um... there's The Endless Forest, which is innovative and unique.

There was also Sims Online, but there wasn't enough of a player base to support it. That's a start, anything wrong with those?